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Is it time to hire a dedicated QB Coach?

UNT90

By UNT90
in Mean Green Football

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UNT90 Newbie

UNT90

Posted
Posted (edited)

Interesting comment from a former coach not associated at all with UNT who saw Greer's lack of performance Thursday night. He described his mechanics as terrible and said our QB coach should be fired. Called him a back foot thrower.

Do we have a QB coach, or is that Canales's responsibility in a dual role?

Topic title was supposed to be QB coach. Could a mod please fix.

Thx.

Edited by UNT90
Ben Gooding Newbie

Ben Gooding

Posted
Posted (edited)

It's time to begin an offensive philosophy that fits to our guys skill set. A philosophy that dictates it's play calling by what the defense is showing. A philosophy that puts pressure on the opposing teams D rather than our own D. We will see what happens on Saturday.

Edited by Ben Gooding
UNT 90 Grad Grand Master

UNT 90 Grad

Posted
Posted

There are graduate assistance on all divison one football teams who also generally help with QBs, thgh technically this falls under Canales for UNT.

You sure about that "all" statement? How'd you do that bit of research? Are you saying our GA's don't help with the QBs? Just trying to understand your point and facts.
Mean Green 93-98 Grand Master

Mean Green 93-98

Posted
Posted

You can't just hire a "dedicated QB coach." NCAA rules only allow 9 assistant coaches and 2 GAs. If we wanted to have a dedicated QB coach, we would have to eliminate one of the other coaching positions.

To be honest, while I am a fan of Canales in other areas, I am not impressed with his QB development. Derek Thompson looked better when Dodge was working with the QBs than he did once Chico starting getting hold of him. We have brought QBs on campus with potential, but none of them seem to be realizing that potential.

  • Upvote 1
Mean_Green09 Newbie

Mean_Green09

Posted
Posted

But you can also have "volunteer" coaches. I was just thinking Seneca might be between gigs at this point.

Wallace is not a guy I want anywhere near our team. He won't put in the effort to make anyone better. He is a "me" first guy. We can find other QB gurus that are much much better.

TheRiojas_AD Newbie

TheRiojas_AD

Posted
Posted (edited)

There are graduate assistance on all divison one football teams who also generally help with QBs, thgh technically this falls under Canales for UNT.

Assistants? Or assistance? Do we need assistants or assistance? ;) also.... I doubt that about "all" D1 teams. Yes, Chico is the go to guy for QB's.. frankly, I'm ready to see him move on to other places.

Edited by TheRiojas_AD
NT6 Newbie

NT6

Posted
Posted

You can't just hire a "dedicated QB coach." NCAA rules only allow 9 assistant coaches and 2 GAs. If we wanted to have a dedicated QB coach, we would have to eliminate one of the other coaching positions.

To be honest, while I am a fan of Canales in other areas, I am not impressed with his QB development. Derek Thompson looked better when Dodge was working with the QBs than he did once Chico starting getting hold of him. We have brought QBs on campus with potential, but none of them seem to be realizing that potential.

How can you say this? Must have been a really impressive 6 minutes that Derek played in the 4th, vs. Ark. State, in the last game of the season, when Dodge was working with QB's, for you to say that. I mean, 95% of his playing career was spent with Canales. I think that speaks highly of Canales' ability as a QB coach, considering Derek is one of the most prolific (statistically) QB's in school history. He is one of the hardest working, knowledgable, and experienced QB coaches around.

While we are all arm-chair quarterbacking, lets consider:

1) if the fact that Greer throws off of his back foot, occasionally, warrants Canales' firing... Kingsbury should have been fired at A&M because Manziel threw off of his back foot nearly every time. Same can be said for Applewhite at Texas when Case McCoy was playing.

2) the idea that selecting and developing QB's is easy and Canales should be fired because we dont have a polished, experienced QB at the moment... Take a look at TEXAS, the premier (at least for a long time) program in a state with an abundance of QB talent, has ZERO capable QB's on the roster. Also, this season at least, I'd say that 25-35% of D1 football programs (SMU, Texas, UTEP, just to name a few in TX) are having the same problem at the QB position.

3) There is only so much that a QB can be coached on that will lead to him being successful. There are a handful of traits that a QB needs to posses that cannot be coached and are very tough to evaluate in HS QB's, and in practice, because the step up in game speed, among many other things, at the D1 level can cause QB's to react in different ways (hence Garrett Gilbert, one of the best HS QB's in Texas history).

Could go on and on. Bottom line- we dont run an up-tempo, spread offense that will attract elite level QB's, and even if we did, evaluating QB talent is an inexact science. I have seen our QB's up close, on multiple occasions, throughout the Spring and camp and it was pretty clear to me that Greer had the most potential of all, in practice anyway. Clearly, there are some factors that come into play during games, that cannot be simulated in practice, that Greer has not responded well to.

Whatever decision they make as the best option going forward, we should support. After all, what other options do we have for this season. Being negative and talking bad about our QB's and QB coach (when we dont really know what we are talking about) is counter productive and not indicative of the support we should have for this staff, considering the shit-hole that they brought this program out of.

  • Upvote 2
Ben Gooding Newbie

Ben Gooding

Posted
Posted

Derek Thompson developed well over the years, but he was still an average QB. He benefitted greatly from a good defense and great ST's. Biggest win for us last year was Rice, which was won by defense and ST's. Worse lost last year was at Tulane, which was lost by play calling and QB play. I agree though, DT did develop throughout his career but into an average, capable QB. Not a game changing threat like some act. I also really don't think ppl are asking for coaches' head on platters. Just frustrated and for good reason.

  • Upvote 1
  • Downvote 1
UNT90 Newbie

UNT90

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

How can you say this? Must have been a really impressive 6 minutes that Derek played in the 4th, vs. Ark. State, in the last game of the season, when Dodge was working with QB's, for you to say that. I mean, 95% of his playing career was spent with Canales. I think that speaks highly of Canales' ability as a QB coach, considering Derek is one of the most prolific (statistically) QB's in school history. He is one of the hardest working, knowledgable, and experienced QB coaches around.

While we are all arm-chair quarterbacking, lets consider:

1) if the fact that Greer throws off of his back foot, occasionally, warrants Canales' firing... Kingsbury should have been fired at A&M because Manziel threw off of his back foot nearly every time. Same can be said for Applewhite at Texas when Case McCoy was playing.

2) the idea that selecting and developing QB's is easy and Canales should be fired because we dont have a polished, experienced QB at the moment... Take a look at TEXAS, the premier (at least for a long time) program in a state with an abundance of QB talent, has ZERO capable QB's on the roster. Also, this season at least, I'd say that 25-35% of D1 football programs (SMU, Texas, UTEP, just to name a few in TX) are having the same problem at the QB position.

3) There is only so much that a QB can be coached on that will lead to him being successful. There are a handful of traits that a QB needs to posses that cannot be coached and are very tough to evaluate in HS QB's, and in practice, because the step up in game speed, among many other things, at the D1 level can cause QB's to react in different ways (hence Garrett Gilbert, one of the best HS QB's in Texas history).

Could go on and on. Bottom line- we dont run an up-tempo, spread offense that will attract elite level QB's, and even if we did, evaluating QB talent is an inexact science. I have seen our QB's up close, on multiple occasions, throughout the Spring and camp and it was pretty clear to me that Greer had the most potential of all, in practice anyway. Clearly, there are some factors that come into play during games, that cannot be simulated in practice, that Greer has not responded well to.

Whatever decision they make as the best option going forward, we should support. After all, what other options do we have for this season. Being negative and talking bad about our QB's and QB coach (when we dont really know what we are talking about) is counter productive and not indicative of the support we should have for this staff, considering the shit-hole that they brought this program out of.

I didn't read your entire diatribe, but 2 things.

First, not having an appropriate QB relative to recruiting position is one of the major reason Mac Brown got fired. You know, right after last season when UT had the same QB's they have now.

Second, Chico gets paid to produce offensively and recruits QBs for his offense. If we end up with no legitimate FBS QBs on this roster this year, that will be Chico's failure, and subsequently, Coach Mac's failure.

What bothers me, and this is a total perception deal, is that it doesn't appear QB recruiting is a priority to this staff and that they only want guys over 6'2". Manzel wouldn't have qualified (and wouldn't have played here because he improvised too much).

If there is no QB able to move this offense, it is Chico's and Mac's fault, and they would probably tell you that.

Edited by UNT90

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