If Hawaii calls it quits, could cause the Mountain West Fits

[VideoEagle]

Boise, Fresno, Nevada, and Utah St have all made more noise over the last decade than the top 4 teams remaining in CUSA. Like, considerably more. Marshall is ok but nowhere near where those top MWC teams have been lately. UNLV, SDSU, USU, UNM, CSU have rabid bball fanbases and storied programs. Having grown up attending WAC/MWC games at Fresno, and a few roadies, there's no comparison in attendance, atmosphere, and competition to what's left in CUSA. I will say that I'm much happier now than in the Sun Belt. Part of that is attributed to drivable games, but another part is the step up in prestige.

I'll say this much, how many times have you heard "North Texas" and "small school/program?". I just don't hear that out of the MWC schools because of the attention they've received and the # of players they've put in the NFL.

You mean the UNLV team to which DFW casual fans asked "Who?" just last January? I agree for those who grew up in the west all those teams are better known. But for fans who grew up in Texas, you can't seriously think Utah state is better know than Marshall or Southern Miss? And no one in the MWC has the Texas name recognition of Rice.

[pastorgrant]

You mean the UNLV team to which DFW casual fans asked "Who?" just last January? I agree for those who grew up in the west all those teams are better known. But for fans who grew up in Texas, you can't seriously think Utah state is better know than Marshall or Southern Miss? And no one in the MWC has the Texas name recognition of Rice.

That's how I see it too.

[Mean Green 93-98]

And no one in the MWC has the Texas name recognition of Rice.

I'm gonna have to say that as far as football, Air Force and Boise State have every bit as much name recognition in Texas as Rice, and probably more.

[GrandGreen]

If North Texas replaced Hawaii, the six teams in the east would be Utah State, Wyoming, Colorado State, Air Force, New Mexico and North Texas. All except us are in the Mountain Time Zone. In the other division, San Diego St., UNLV, Nevada, Fresno St., and San Jose St, are in the Pacific Time Zone while Boise is in the Mountain. We'd be looking at 9 o'clock starts for only a few games each year in football.

If they kept the same format North Texas would play two Eastern Division members at home and three Western members at home one year with a reversal the next year. None of the Eastern cities are more than a thousand miles from Denton. That's not Southland Conference close but flying makes it doable. It would also give some of our alumni who live in the West a chance to see the Mean Green that they would not get otherwise. We'd still see five of those teams at home each year. Travel would definitely cost more but trips to Huntington, Norfolk, Charlotte, Miami and Boca Raton aren't cheap either. And I do believe that the conference payout would be greater.

Other than fans having access to the game, where the football team plays conference games doesn't matter a lot because it is only 4 away games. However, the setup in CUSA is a lot better than the MWC. All your division teams are within driving distance and the furtherest is closer than the nearest in the MWC. So those trips to Charlotte or balanced by a lot of close games.

Again, If the MWC was a big leap in conferences, yes it might be worth it, but I don't think it is. I don't think the MWC would help you a bit in football recruiting, in fact it could hurt.

Again, I don't think any of the MWC are exactly marquee names other than Boise and they may or not be able to maintain their football program at the level it has been in the last decade.

[MDH]

You mean the UNLV team to which DFW casual fans asked "Who?" just last January? I agree for those who grew up in the west all those teams are better known. But for fans who grew up in Texas, you can't seriously think Utah state is better know than Marshall or Southern Miss? And no one in the MWC has the Texas name recognition of Rice.

USU, a mid to bottom tier team for recognition, you're comparing to Marshall and Southern Miss - CUSA's biggest names. Compare Boise, Fresno, AFA, SDSU against the recognizable CUSA names.

The only MWC school that would have brought fewer people to the HOD bowl would have been Hawaii, and maybe SJSU - we had a horrible opponent in that regard. A lot more people have heard of UNLV (thanks to Tark the shark) than FAU/FIU, if we're comparing bottom of the conference teams.

For football, Boise and Fresno are miles ahead of Rice within Texas for name recognition. Rice has yet to shake their reputation for being UT's whipping boy.

[DeepGreen]

What happens when Rice and So. Miss. join their pals in the AAC?

[UNTX]

What happens when Rice and So. Miss. join their pals in the AAC?

Ultimately Rice and S. Miss to the AAC may very we'll happen and USM is actively and opening campaigning for it. MWC could then look attractive to UTEP if it doesn't already. I'm doubtful those three schools will be in CUSA much longer.

Not advocating a move to the MWC now but should these dominos fall we need to have had discussions, and be prepared to market ourselves to them as a package deal along with UTEP and maybe UTSA. Otherwise we could be left in a CUSA that is truly nothing more than a SBC 2.0 with NO Texas rivals, and UTSA looking at us their rear view mirror.

[GrandGreen]

What happens when Rice and So. Miss. join their pals in the AAC?

Even with SMU in there, I think NT would have as good a chance as those two.

[Mean Green 93-98]

Ultimately Rice and S. Miss to the AAC may very we'll happen and USM is actively and opening campaigning for it. MWC could then look attractive to UTEP if it doesn't already. I'm doubtful those three schools will be in CUSA much longer.

Not advocating a move to the MWC now but should these dominos fall we need to have had discussions, and be prepared to market ourselves to them as a package deal along with UTEP and maybe UTSA. Otherwise we could be left in a CUSA that is truly nothing more than a SBC 2.0 with NO Texas rivals, and UTSA looking at us their rear view mirror.

Sometimes you need to anticipate possibilities, and jump before the dominos fall/ship sinks.

[untjim1995]

With the new playoff system there is zero difference between any of the G5 conferences, except for the TV contract. The MWC TV payout is larger than the CUSA payout, but not large enough to make up for having to pay west coasts teams that most fans can't travel to and will bring no one to Denton, the reduced media coverage when our late games won't end before the newscast, or increased travel costs for all sports.

I'm a huge fan of being in the MWC, but the reality is what Cerebus posted. The new system, especially when the P5 pulls away for good, will make the closer games a huge plus for our school. The close games in texas, Louisana, and Mississippi will be huge for us as the G5 will have to focus on regional conferences to lower expenses.

The MWC is a very good league, though, in both football and basketball. I'd love to be a part of it, but this new setup basically kills that idea off, IMO.

[Harry]

People equate going to the Mountain West as if it were what TCU did way back when but it is not...

To leave these Texas schools and budding rivalries for games with Nevada, UNLV (we saw their fan support first hand) and the like would be insane.

C-USA is is a down cycle right now but mark my words teams like La Tech and Southern Miss won't be down forever. I also think the Florida schools will get very good very quickly...

C-USA made good choices opting for ODU and Charlotte who may not be great programs today but they have all the pieces to be very competitive quickly..

C-USA is a perfect home for us right now. Give it a year or two... the rivalries are just starting to build!

[untjim1995]

What happens when Rice and So. Miss. join their pals in the AAC?

Rice only jonis the AAC if UH leaves. While possible, I just don't know where UH is gonna go. Texas isn't going to let them in the Big XII. The MWC won't be better right now for UH than the AAC is, so Rice moving in there is just not gonna happen. A duplication of the TV market in the same conference will be rare going forward. Same with SMU ever getting into the Big XII. TCU being there with all the alumni of Texas, OU, Tech, OSU, and Baylor aren't gonna give them a chance to move upward. So SMU stays in the AAC, meaning we stay in CUSA. Same goes for UTSA versus Texas State.

Only way USM ever gets an invite up to the AAC is fairly simple--the Big XII or the ACC will have to expand. UConn, Cincy, USF, and maybe UCF would represent possibliites for expansion to those conferences. If one of those teams leave the AAC,, their target(s) to replace any of them will be Northern Illinois, UTSA, one of the F_Us, or a school like USM or Marshall, both of whom are nationally-recognized names, but have absolutely no TV market to sell. I think Rice and Southern Miss will be with us in CUSA going forward, just as I see La Tech, Marshall, and Western Kentucky staying here, also for the long term.

[Mean Green 93-98]

C-USA is a perfect home for us right now.

I don't disagree with that. But is it a perfect home for us forever? If not, what is? And how do we get there? Typically, gradual steps up the ladder are how you get to the top of the roof, rather than by standing flatfooted and suddenly jumping.

[VideoEagle]

Boise, Fresno, Nevada, and Utah St have all made more noise over the last decade than the top 4 teams remaining in CUSA. Like, considerably more. Marshall is ok but nowhere near where those top MWC teams have been lately. UNLV, SDSU, USU, UNM, CSU have rabid bball fanbases and storied programs.

USU, a mid to bottom tier team for recognition, you're comparing to Marshall and Southern Miss - CUSA's biggest names. Compare Boise, Fresno, AFA, SDSU against the recognizable CUSA names.

Firstly, you are the one who suggested USU.

More importantly, in Texas, you simply wrong. Go to any Twin Peaks in DFW, Austin, San Antonio on a Saturday afternoon in October and ask how many people want to watch Rice (or any Texas school not in the Big 12) verse the number who what to watch Boise, Fresno or Air Force and you will get an overwhelming response for the Texas schools. For that matter, try asking how many can tell you what SDSU stands for or what conference Fresno is in to get an idea of the actual name recognition. See how many can tell if the school called "Nevada" is in Las Vegas or Reno and compare that to the number who know about Marshall.

I haven't looked in a while at the TV ratings for western schools in the DFW market, but as recently as two years ago the WAC and MWC showed up as a zero followed by a decimal point followed by another zero before a number between 1 and 9 showed up. Name a reporter at the DMN, FWST or ESPNDallas who regularly writes about any team in the MWC.

For someone who grew up in the west, those are bigger names. But they simply are not here in Texas and DFW where NT is located.

[MDH]

Firstly, you are the one who suggested USU.

More importantly, in Texas, you simply wrong. Go to any Twin Peaks in DFW, Austin, San Antonio on a Saturday afternoon in October and ask how many people want to watch Rice (or any Texas school not in the Big 12) verse the number who what to watch Boise, Fresno or Air Force and you will get an overwhelming response for the Texas schools. For that matter, try asking how many can tell you what SDSU stands for or what conference Fresno is in to get an idea of the actual name recognition. See how many can tell if the school called "Nevada" is in Las Vegas or Reno and compare that to the number who know about Marshall.

I haven't looked in a while at the TV ratings for western schools in the DFW market, but as recently as two years ago the WAC and MWC showed up as a zero followed by a decimal point followed by another zero before a number between 1 and 9 showed up. Name a reporter at the DMN, FWST or ESPNDallas who regularly writes about any team in the MWC.

For someone who grew up in the west, those are bigger names. But they simply are not here in Texas and DFW where NT is located.

We may have to agree to disagree on this. But I also think we're arguing over different terminology here. I brought up USU as a team that has made noise in the last decade. You brought up USM and Marshall are recognizable teams. Those two can be mutually exclusive.

You brought up what casual fan in DFW would tune in to UNLV. Casual fans watch a game primarily due to rankings (talent on the field), followed by any type of connection they might have to the school that is playing. Rice is a small school with a small alumni base and not a whole lot of success. People know Boise and Fresno. They likely remember Colt Brenan and the undefeated Hawaii Warriors (at least until UGA smacked them in the Sugar Bowl). They're familiar with the numerous times they have knocked off Power 5 schools since they do it on an annual basis! The MWC is weighed down by its bottom teams, its top teams are at least as good as AAC's top remaining teams.

Regarding TV ratings, the MWC made a poor decision to start their own network and ESPN has not aired hardly any of their games the last 5 years as a result.

I admit I have a west coast bias. But I can tell you that walking into a sports bar in SF, SD, LA, LV, Seattle, Denver, etc. that you will find many more fans familiar with MWC schools and their success than people in Texas and the history of UNT, Rice, UTEP football. Expand that across the country and it doesn't change much. Every sports fan on the west coast knows Fresno competes at the highest level of college football - I can't tell you how many times I have to remind people in DFW that UNT plays in FBS, no matter how much/little coverage we receive on ESPNDallas, DMN, etc.

Edited August 26, 2014 by MDH