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Andrew Grand Master

Andrew

Posted
Posted

The minimum wage argument is a moot point. No one forces them to play. It is 100% voluntary. In the event that universities and/or the NCAA starts to force these guys to play football then sure, pay them. Aside from that they are compensated very well for their volunteer work. I guess the next time I go box canned goods for the sake of volunteering I am going to ask to be compensated. Next time I donate blood I am going to ask for more than a sugar cookie. Next time I mow my 80-year-old neighbors yard I am going to ask her for compensation. Next time I stop on the side of the road to help someone change a tire I am going to be ask for compensation after I am done. Again, no one forces them to play. If they aren't happy with their compensation then don't play. Simple.

Preach

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Cr1028 Grand Master

Cr1028

Posted
Posted

The minimum wage argument is a moot point. No one forces them to play. It is 100% voluntary. In the event that universities and/or the NCAA starts to force these guys to play football then sure, pay them. Aside from that they are compensated very well for their volunteer work. I guess the next time I go box canned goods for the sake of volunteering I am going to ask to be compensated. Next time I donate blood I am going to ask for more than a sugar cookie. Next time I mow my 80-year-old neighbors yard I am going to ask her for compensation. Next time I stop on the side of the road to help someone change a tire I am going to be ask for compensation after I am done. Again, no one forces them to play. If they aren't happy with their compensation then don't play. Simple.

You are missing the point of the lawsuit. The NCAA is the only place players can play after high school, they cannot joint the NFL at that age and the NFL has no minor league. This means the NCAA has the exclusive rights to postsecondary talent and can limit there compensation in any way they see fit. Players are not compensated to the value of their talent and the NCAA and most of its member institutions reap huge profits as a result. A player like Jadeveon Clowney would have been a millionaire straight out of High School like Kobe, Lebron, Josh Hamilton, etc. if it were not for his barrier to entering an open market. South Carolina, bowl games, ESPN, and the NCAA were the beneficiary of his barrier to putting his talent on the market for all bidders.

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Cerebus Experienced

Cerebus

Posted
Posted

I can't believe people are constantly considering this to be a "greedy player" issue, especially since some of those players are our fellow alums.

I am not a person who rails against "corporations" much, in fact I am a big time free marker person. However this is a clear cut case of corporations such as the NCAA and ESPN and the P5 collaborating to make BILLIONS of dollars and keeping any of that from the players.

You want to rail against the greedy? It's not the players.

If we are really expecting no one to make money off of this, why are coaches, and AD's and television executives and AD's making millions?

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Christopher Walker Collaborator

Christopher Walker

Posted
Posted (edited)

The minimum wage argument is a moot point. No one forces them to play. It is 100% voluntary. In the event that universities and/or the NCAA starts to force these guys to play football then sure, pay them. Aside from that they are compensated very well for their volunteer work. I guess the next time I go box canned goods for the sake of volunteering I am going to ask to be compensated. Next time I donate blood I am going to ask for more than a sugar cookie. Next time I mow my 80-year-old neighbors yard I am going to ask her for compensation. Next time I stop on the side of the road to help someone change a tire I am going to be ask for compensation after I am done. Again, no one forces them to play. If they aren't happy with their compensation then don't play. Simple.

Except none of those volunteering opportunities you mention in turn generate billions in entertainment revenue annually.

That's a biiiiiiiiig difference.

Edited by Christopher Walker
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oldguystudent Newbie

oldguystudent

Posted
Posted (edited)

V7WhzTh.gif

I would like this delivered to my cubicle please. I think the endless spirally pattern would soothe the rage.

Edit: For the record, I only make fun of misspellings if said misspelling create a funny image in my head, usually of the very juvenile variety. I have a grave disdain for internet grammar nazis.

Edited by oldguystudent
  • Upvote 1
The Fake Lonnie Finch Newbie

The Fake Lonnie Finch

Posted
Posted

You are missing the point of the lawsuit. The NCAA is the only place players can play after high school, they cannot joint the NFL at that age and the NFL has no minor league. This means the NCAA has the exclusive rights to postsecondary talent and can limit there compensation in any way they see fit. Players are not compensated to the value of their talent and the NCAA and most of its member institutions reap huge profits as a result. A player like Jadeveon Clowney would have been a millionaire straight out of High School like Kobe, Lebron, Josh Hamilton, etc. if it were not for his barrier to entering an open market. South Carolina, bowl games, ESPN, and the NCAA were the beneficiary of his barrier to putting his talent on the market for all bidders.

This isn't true. There are semi-pro football leagues. There is the NAIA. There is Division III of the NCAA. They could easily go to any of those three.

Also - and, again - it is not an NCAA rule that players cannot compete for a place on an NFL roster for three years, it the NFL Players' Association Collection Bargaining Agreement rule.

It is NFL players - former college football players - who wanted, and got, this rule.

  • Upvote 6
The Fake Lonnie Finch Newbie

The Fake Lonnie Finch

Posted
Posted (edited)

This is something not many of you get, but even when in some cases kids are able to be on these teams and also have jobs, they're still making minimum wage. It's a wage that simply has not kept up with the times and they cannot live off of it, even when combined with scholarship.

I also empathize with the "I worked my tail off in school, so can they" crowd because over the last seven years (six of those in school), I worked between two to four jobs or gigs at a time. Right now I work ~70-80 hours a week between four gigs.

The difference here is that only one of those gigs was ever minimum wage and I took it simply out of a love for the people I worked with. The others ranged from $10-33/hour because I also took the time to be specialized in a couple of things that warrant that sort of pay. That's lucky. That's luxury. And I'm super grateful for and humbled by it.

Student athletes do not get that luxury during their collegiate careers. The things they have the time to specialize in are their sport; their finely crafted entertainment for those fans who would so quickly turn around and complain that their entertainers are being greedy. An entertainment role that doesn't necessarily prepare them for the stark reality of it not continuing past graduation. And man, I would especially be aghast if anyone started to question their work ethic...

They are also having things paid for - very expensive things: room, board, tuition, and books. Those are the things many, if not most of us were working for. They already have those expenses given to them.

The players' point about not having what their fellow non-athlete students have is a joke. After I paid for my rent, my groceries, my tuition, my book...as well as auto insurance, gas, utilities, clothing, etc. - I sometimes didn't have money for going out on dates, hanging out, etc. either.

Their argument that they are "being used" is silly. They are not required to play. And, in trade for their play, they got some major college expenses taken care of. I worked two jobs to get through - they practiced their sport. What's the difference?

Everybody is making sacrifices, athlete and nonathlete.

Also, as much of a struggle financially and timewise as it was for me from 1990-95, I can't imagine what it would be like today with the cost of college now being what it is.

Edited by The Fake Lonnie Finch
  • Upvote 1
GreenMachine Newbie

GreenMachine

Posted
Posted

This is something not many of you get, but even when in some cases kids are able to be on these teams and also have jobs, they're still making minimum wage. It's a wage that simply has not kept up with the times and they cannot live off of it, even when combined with scholarship.

I also empathize with the "I worked my tail off in school, so can they" crowd because over the last seven years (six of those in school), I worked between two to four jobs or gigs at a time. Right now I work ~70-80 hours a week between four gigs.

The difference here is that only one of those gigs was ever minimum wage and I took it simply out of a love for the people I worked with. The others ranged from $10-33/hour because I also took the time to be specialized in a couple of things that warrant that sort of pay. That's lucky. That's luxury. And I'm super grateful for and humbled by it.

Student athletes do not get that luxury during their collegiate careers. The things they have the time to specialize in are their sport; their finely crafted entertainment for those fans who would so quickly turn around and complain that their entertainers are being greedy. An entertainment role that doesn't necessarily prepare them for the stark reality of it not continuing past graduation. And man, I would especially be aghast if anyone started to question their work ethic...

Now of course, no side in this is truly altruistic. You'll still have the glorified Manziels of the college sporting world. But Conference USA and it's member schools are committed to bridging the gap appropriately and in the right altruistic manner, and I'm damned proud of a school and conference that's willing to do that.

My son is almost 17 years old and makes $12/hr. He found a skill that was needed in the workplace, worked to get a certification, and now makes several dollars more than minimum wage. He doesn't work very many hours and getting the certification took just a little time and effort. If he can do it, I am pretty sure that 18-22 year old young men can do it too.

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Christopher Walker Collaborator

Christopher Walker

Posted
Posted

Their argument that they are "being used" is silly. They are not required to play. And, in trade for their play, they got some major college expenses taken care of. I worked two jobs to get through - they practiced their sport. What's the difference?

The difference is that this is multi-billion dollar entertainment business we're talking about here. Maybe it's because I too am in the entertainment profession and consistently see my associates being ripped off, taken advantage of, and the like for the work they do and services they provide, but there are astounding differences there.

Cr1028 Grand Master

Cr1028

Posted
Posted

This isn't true. There are semi-pro football leagues. There is the NAIA. There is Division III of the NCAA. They could easily go to any of those three.

Also - and, again - it is not an NCAA rule that players cannot compete for a place on an NFL roster for three years, it the NFL Players' Association Collection Bargaining Agreement rule.

It is NFL players - former college football players - who wanted, and got, this rule.

Never heard of anyone making millions going semi-pro or being drafted as the top pick from D3 or NAIA.

Mean Green 93-98 Grand Master

Mean Green 93-98

Posted
Posted

As long as there isn't an increase in scholarships allowed pay the players what they want.

"What they want"? Who in the world gets paid "what they want"? No matter what people get paid, they always want more.

While SEC, Big 10, etc., schools could readily afford to pay their players nicely, you do know that schools like UNT literally have no possible way to compete with this? And you do know that donors, who generally like to feel that their contributions are going to a good cause, will likely drop their contributions if funds are no longer going toward scholarships of student-athletes but rather toward salaries of mercenary professional athletes?

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