Mutha-scratchin' Schedule Nerds

The Fake Lonnie Finch · August 8, 2014

So, what is Rick supposed to do, 90? Pretend that Texas A&M will come to the DFW area again, just for the sake of coming to it again? Texas...already playing OU in Dallas and every other year in Fort Worth? Baylor and Texas Tech? Already playing in Arlington and every other year in Fort Worth.

I mean, when does reality set in for you as it has for Rick?

We all know it sucks that for decades that school's administration let athletics rot. Rick has gotten the cart out of the ditch. Can you at least agree on that?

But, hell, as Boise State and Baylor have discovered, it doesn't matter what you have done on the field lately. The big "traditional power" schools are still going to call the dance - and, it's going to be an expensive dance.

So, I think Rick has taken the right approach. He got us a Big Ten home and home with Indiana. He got us regional home and homes with Tulsa and Houston. He got us some equally competitive home and homes with MAC schools. He's worked in some FCS games to help us develop and move towards bowl eligibility.

But, the man can't snap his fingers and undo decades worth of neglect. That takes hundreds of millions of dollars. T. Boone Pickens bought Oklahoma State competitiveness out in the boonies of Oklahoma. Unless we get a Mean Green T. Boone, you may as well stop your bitching and be happy that aren't still in the Southland with SFA and SHSU like it was when I was in school.

UNT90 · August 8, 2014

How about not scheduling yourself into a hole where you have two 5 game home seasons in the first 4 years of your new stadium? Regardless who you schedule?

RV clearly said on the podcast he would rather play these games in the road for the money. Don't believe me? Go back and hear it for yourself. He says he didn't want to schedule one at home because we wouldn't get paid for it.

That leads me to believe what is evident by what other schools with less to offer have accomplished: that RV hasn't even tried to get that marque game.

Effort is what I want, TFLF. Effort we aren't getting from this AD. We know it can be done. Hell, he got K. St. to freaking Fouts Field, after all.

And just stop using A&M and Texas. No one expects them to come to Denton.

And you know that.

NT03 · August 9, 2014

La. Tech AD @tmcclelland said today he is in discussions with an SEC school for a home & home contract. pic.twitter.com/PpZTILXMWU
— Jimmy Watson (@JimmyWatson6)
August 9, 2014

GOMG2013 · August 9, 2014

Yay! An SEC school...that can give them that program defining win. Hope it's not Kentucky, miss state, vandy, or Ole Miss.

A few years ago, UNT scheduled a Big 10 school. A 1 and 1 too. It was a sorry p5 team named Indiana. That team actually came to Apogee too. And in a brand new stadium in front of 21K, the UNT Mean Green were victorious. they whipped the Big 10...

And what did that translate into as far as hype or ticket sales?

My point?

Playing a weak P5 school does nothing. Hitting 6 and going to bowl games gets fans way more excited. Beating SMU will generate much more buzz than a 1 and 1 with Maryland, Arizona, iowa State, Kentucky, etc.

Beating ranked teams and going to bowls is what will get more fans on board. If it isn't Big 12 schools like, Baylor, TCU, Texas Tech, OK State, and K State then why bother.

UNT90 · August 9, 2014

Yay! An SEC school...that can give them that program defining win. Hope it's not Kentucky, miss state, vandy, or Ole Miss.x
A few years ago, UNT scheduled a Big 10 school. A 1 and 1 too. It was a sorry p5 team named Indiana. That team actually came to Apogee too. And in a brand new stadium in front of 21K, the UNT Mean Green were victorious. they whipped the Big 10...
And what did that translate into as far as hype or ticket sales?
My point?
Playing a weak P5 school does nothing. Hitting 6 and going to bowl games gets fans way more excited. Beating SMU will generate much more buzz than a 1 and 1 with Maryland, Arizona, iowa State, Kentucky, etc.
Beating ranked teams and going to bowls is what will get more fans on board. If it isn't Big 12 schools like, Baylor, TCU, Texas Tech, OK State, and K State then why bother.

Because the thought process of the current AD is part of the problem that led to this split.

Just kick our ass at your place, give us our money, and we will be just happy with that. No wonder they have zero respect for us.

And yes, ANY of those teams you named would be better than the crap we have played at home since 2011. If we have to pay as steep a price as we have, the prize needs to be better than Houston and a gawdawful Indiana.

UNT90 · August 9, 2014

https://twitter.com/jimmywatson6/status/497904521230962689

You.

You little instigator, you.

I love you.

greenminer · August 9, 2014

Yay! An SEC school...that can give them that program defining win. Hope it's not Kentucky, miss state, vandy, or Ole Miss.
A few years ago, UNT scheduled a Big 10 school. A 1 and 1 too. It was a sorry p5 team named Indiana. That team actually came to Apogee too. And in a brand new stadium in front of 21K, the UNT Mean Green were victorious. they whipped the Big 10...
And what did that translate into as far as hype or ticket sales?
My point?
Playing a weak P5 school does nothing. Hitting 6 and going to bowl games gets fans way more excited. Beating SMU will generate much more buzz than a 1 and 1 with Maryland, Arizona, iowa State, Kentucky, etc.
Beating ranked teams and going to bowls is what will get more fans on board. If it isn't Big 12 schools like, Baylor, TCU, Texas Tech, OK State, and K State then why bother.

No single topic of Mean Green excellence and pursuit has ever risen above the others as "the answer".

Getting the new stadium didn't bring in people.

Building Mean Green Village wasn't the answer in recruiting.

Beating Baylor didn't solve things.

Beating OSU basketball didn't solve things.

4 straight SBC crowns didn't make much more than a blip.

Beating IU wasn't the answer.

A 9 win CUSA season and bowl victory? TBD

Pointing out that beating IU didn't make Mean Green Nation 100% satisfied is a no brainer. The same scenario has happened before. I knew a win wouldn't do much before the game, and I certainly knew it after the season we had that year.

The problem is not about any single event, facility, or season. It's a matter of long-term habits and routines, like making terrible hires that see us through 3-win seasons - 10 years in a row. Or scheduling a never-ending rotation of body bag games that guarantee our fan base at least one embarrising 30 point beating on national TV every year for 5 years.

Do I claim to have the answer? No, but I believe it lies somewhere in having everything come together: a 6+ home game season in Apogee, a marquee win that validates the remaining 9+ win season, no inexplicable losses in front of big crowds, capped off with a bowl victory. The sad reality of our culture, given the 100 years of football we've watched, is that we need to weed out the bad decisions permanently and see 5 - 10 solid seasons before things will change for the better, for the long term, for the UNT90 whining to stop.

I don't know if that will ever happen. In the mean time, however, there are still some decisions being made by our AD that send up all kinds of red flags, and thus are not exempt from GMG.com discussions and UNT90 beatings. Right now, that red flag is loud and proud on scheduling decisions. Do you have a flag?

Edited August 9, 2014 by greenminer

UNT90 · August 9, 2014

No single topic of Mean Green excellence and pursuit has ever risen above the others as "the answer".

Getting the new stadium didn't bring in people.
Building Mean Green Village wasn't the answer in recruiting.
Beating Baylor didn't solve things.
Beating OSU basketball didn't solve things.
4 straight SBC crowns didn't make much more than a blip.
Beating IU wasn't the answer.
A 9 win CUSA season and bowl victory? TBD

Pointing out that beating IU didn't make Mean Green Nation 100% satisfied is a no brainer. The same scenario has happened before. I knew a win wouldn't do much before the game, and I certainly knew it after the season we had that year.

The problem is not about any single event, facility, or season. It's a matter of long-term habits and routines, like making terrible hires that see us through 3-win seasons - 10 years in a row. Or scheduling a never-ending rotation of body bag games that guarantee our fan base at least one embarrising 30 point beating on national TV every year for 5 years.

Do I claim to have the answer? No, but I believe it lies somewhere in having everything come together: a 6+ home game season in Apogee, a marquee win that validates the remaining 9+ win season, no inexplicable losses in front of big crowds, capped off with a bowl victory. The sad reality of our culture, given the 100 years of football we've watched, is that we need to weed out the bad decisions permanently and see 5 - 10 solid seasons before things will change for the better, for the long term, for the UNT90 whining to stop.

I don't know if that will ever happen. In the mean time, however, there are still some decisions being made by our AD that send up all kinds of red flags, and thus are not exempt from GMG.com discussions and UNT90 beatings. Right now, that red flag is loud and proud on scheduling decisions. Do you have a flag?

That is one of the best backhanded compliments I have ever received.

I think...

GOMG2013 · August 9, 2014

Pointing out that beating IU didn't make Mean Green Nation 100% satisfied is a no brainer. The same scenario has happened before. I knew a win wouldn't do much before the game, and I certainly knew it after the season we had that year.

I don't know if that will ever happen. In the mean time, however, there are still some decisions being made by our AD that send up all kinds of red flags, and thus are not exempt from GMG.com discussions and UNT90 beatings. Right now, that red flag is loud and proud on scheduling decisions. Do you have a flag?

I pointed out the Indiana game because of the posts about other schools being able to schedule a P5 school. Like RV can't do what other schools are doing. Like they are doing something impressive.

Would a home game against Maryland or Arizona look better than Nichols state? Yes. If only 22, 23k show up, then you lost money.

RV pretty much said we do the body bag games strictly for the money. We need the money. Read between the lines. Football is the biggest revenue generating sport. This is the biggest chance to make money for a whole athletic department. Scholarships and salaries depend on it.

RV and Mac thought the fans support would have a dramatic increase, but the consecutive losing has lost almost a decade of fans and lost some that were there. It's gonna take a while to get those fans back and get new ones. You can't count on fans that are looking at the match ups. They have to become die hard mean green fans no matter who comes to apogee.

With an average attendance of 20k for home games, we have left 10k seats empty. 10k x 6 home games = 60k fans. (50k for 5 games)

With a very conservative price of $15 per ticket, I am losing 900K per year due to the lack of fans. The body bag games guarantee the money will be there for the department. Only the fans can stop the need for body bag games. Expenses are only going to go up.

UNT90 · August 9, 2014

I pointed out the Indiana game because of the posts about other schools being able to schedule a P5 school. Like RV can't do what other schools are doing. Like they are doing something impressive.
Would a home game against Maryland or Arizona look better than Nichols state? Yes. If only 22, 23k show up, then you lost money.
RV pretty much said we do the body bag games strictly for the money. We need the money. Read between the lines. Football is the biggest revenue generating sport. This is the biggest chance to make money for a whole athletic department. Scholarships and salaries depend on it.
RV and Mac thought the fans support would have a dramatic increase, but the consecutive losing has lost almost a decade of fans and lost some that were there. It's gonna take a while to get those fans back and get new ones. You can't count on fans that are looking at the match ups. They have to become die hard mean green fans no matter who comes to apogee.
With an average attendance of 20k for home games, we have left 10k seats empty. 10k x 6 home games = 60k fans. (50k for 5 games)
With a very conservative price of $15 per ticket, I am losing 900K per year due to the lack of fans. The body bag games guarantee the money will be there for the department. Only the fans can stop the need for body bag games. Expenses are only going to go up.

Then RV should say this. He doesn't. And he doesn't because he knows he will be criticized for not marketing well enough to get a sellout with a winning team. Some of that is deserved.

You heard him talk about the stadium opener verse Houston. He expected a sellout just because there was a new stadium. If you have been here as long as RV had at the time and still don't understand the cultural problems at UNT, you must have had your head in the sand. Games at UNT don't sell themselves.

It's just always excuses and double talk. It's tiring.

UNT90 · August 9, 2014

One last time for those to lazy to click on the link. Below are the scheduled OOC games for next year:

09/12 - at SMU
09/26 - at Iowa
11/07 - at Tennessee

So, even if we do get the one and one with Tulsa that RV spoke of on the podcast, we still have 5 home games for the 2 time in 4 years. For those of you that think we will be able to get a one and one with Tulsa (which can't be returned until 2018) and still be able to move the Tennessee game (where exactly? Anyone care to answer that question?) even though it has already been moved at least once and then find ANOTHER team to come to Apogee, I have bad news for you. Santa and the tooth fairy don't exist. Politicians are crooked. And the easter bunny is only good for a Sunday meal.

Again, the link for any who care to actually educate themselves:

http://www.fbschedules.com/ncaa/conf-usa/north-texas-mean-green.php

Edited August 9, 2014 by UNT90

GOMG2013 · August 9, 2014

Then RV should say this. He doesn't. And he doesn't because he knows he will be criticized for not marketing well enough to get a sellout with a winning team. Some of that is deserved.
You heard him talk about the stadium opener verse Houston. He expected a sellout just because there was a new stadium. If you have been here as long as RV had at the time and still don't understand the cultural problems at UNT, you must have had your head in the sand. Games at UNT don't sell themselves.
It's just always excuses and double talk. It's tiring.

I agree. It seems as if they thought a brand new stadium and winning a few games would be enough. Maybe back in the day, or at other places where there is nothing to do. So many other options to get that winning fix and be part of a team.

GOMG2013 · August 9, 2014

One last time for those to lazy to click on the link. Below are the scheduled OOC games for next year:

09/12 - at SMU
09/26 - at Iowa
11/07 - at Tennessee
So, even if we do get the one and one with Tulsa that RV spoke of on the podcast, we still have 5 home games for the 2 time in 4 years. For those of you that think we will be able to get a one and one with Tulsa (which can't be returned until 2018) and still be able to move the Tennessee game (where exactly? Anyone care to answer that question?) even though it has already been moved at least once and then find ANOTHER team to come to Apogee, I have bad news for you. Santa and the tooth fairy don't exist. Politicians are crooked. And the easter bunny is only good for a Sunday meal.

Again, the link for any who care to actually educate themselves:

http://www.fbschedules.com/ncaa/conf-usa/north-texas-mean-green.php

Texas state would be better than Tulsa. Tulsa doesn't do much as far as hype.

I bet that money from the iowa game and Tennessee, has already been planned and spent.

emmitt01 · August 9, 2014

I pointed out the Indiana game because of the posts about other schools being able to schedule a P5 school. Like RV can't do what other schools are doing. Like they are doing something impressive.
Would a home game against Maryland or Arizona look better than Nichols state? Yes. If only 22, 23k show up, then you lost money.
RV pretty much said we do the body bag games strictly for the money. We need the money. Read between the lines. Football is the biggest revenue generating sport. This is the biggest chance to make money for a whole athletic department. Scholarships and salaries depend on it.
RV and Mac thought the fans support would have a dramatic increase, but the consecutive losing has lost almost a decade of fans and lost some that were there. It's gonna take a while to get those fans back and get new ones. You can't count on fans that are looking at the match ups. They have to become die hard mean green fans no matter who comes to apogee.
With an average attendance of 20k for home games, we have left 10k seats empty. 10k x 6 home games = 60k fans. (50k for 5 games)
With a very conservative price of $15 per ticket, I am losing 900K per year due to the lack of fans. The body bag games guarantee the money will be there for the department. Only the fans can stop the need for body bag games. Expenses are only going to go up.

See the bolded part, tell me again that RV understands this, and explain a 4th year for Dodge and Benford still having a job.

UNT90 · August 9, 2014

A little scheduling 101. Here are the future games already scheduled:

2015

09/12 - at SMU
09/26 - at Iowa
11/07 - at Tennessee

2016

09/03 - SMU
09/10 - at Florida
10/22 - at Army

2017

09/09 - at SMU
09/16 - at Iowa
11/18 - Army

2018

09/01 - SMU
09/08 - at Army

2019

09/07 - at SMU
09/14 - Army

2020

09/05 - SMU
10/10 - at Army

2021

09/11 - at SMU
10/09 - Army

Now, going under the theory that RV was truthful when he said that the AD puts a premium on 6 game home seasons, let's look at some of RV's comments. He said he is about to finalize a 1 and 1 (at least) with Tulsa. That would mean we would have to have them at home in 2015 to avoid A 4 GAME HOME SEASON and the earliest we could return the game (again, to avoid another 5 game home season) would be 2018. Ok, let's say that happens. First, we still have a 2015 season with 5 home games. It is clear that is inevitable.

What do you do about 2016 and 2017? Still need another home game there to make 6. Lets say RV schedules 2 more 1 and 1s, with the return games in 2019 and 2020. That would again assume that these mythical other teams would be willing to wait 3 years for a return game and would ALWAYS be willing to play at UNT for the 1st game of the series. Lets say that happens and we are good through 2018.

Guess what. We now have one home game spot to fill in both 2019 and 2020. Again, these mythical teams would again have to agree to play the first game of the 1 and 1 at UNT. with those return games coming in 2021 and 2022. That may be doable, right?

Problem is, this assumes that we will not schedule ANY MORE MONEY GAMES through 2022. If there was one thing RV was ultra clear about on the podcast is that we will play these away money games.

So that leaves 2 options. Multiple 5 game home seasons or buying home games against FCS competition. I'm talking at least 3 more to get this thing some more flexibility (2015, 2016, 2017). Keep in mind we bought games the last 3 years (2 FCS teams and Idaho) and STILL have no flexibility while also having a 5 game home season in 2012. Oh, and the game at Florida was added during that time period (further decreasing flexibility). Meanwhile, outside of 2011, we get zero value for the OOC games that are played at Apogee. Hell, we had one year where the only OOC game at Apogee was a freaking FCS school. If you think this excites alumni or students, you are just smoking crack, plain and simple.

The absolute best thing this says about RV is that he only knows one way to do things and won't consider any other avenue. And that is the best possible thing.

EDIT: Maybe now some can see why the Iowa contracts (and these games are all under contract, folks) are so frustrating to me. I honestly think RV could have got Iowa for a 1 and 1 but wanted the money.

Edited August 9, 2014 by UNT90