Derek Thompson...an elephant in the room?

GOMG2013 · November 5, 2013

Marshall no. ECU yes. If we faced ECU we would not be able to run the ball very well. Ultimately the game would come down to throwing the ball. I think we could hold the ECU offense to around 24 or 25 points, not sure if our offense could generate 4 TD's against their D without help from the D or special teams.

I cant get a handle on ECU, because they havent played a lot if good comp. On offense, they pass a lot. Not sure if they are better than Ohio or ball state, but at least we have seen something similar. Tulane slowed the offense down in regulation to 19 points.

ECU hasnt really faced a run heavy team, but it seems like they will make DT beat them. If we are predictable, they will shut the run down.

meangreener · November 5, 2013

I would not say he even manages the game well. A game manager doesn't have a TD/INT ratio like DT has. We have won numerous games bc of our special teams and defense. Has he improved from last season? Yes. Does he still make too many mistakes? Yes. Does he still have accuracy issues? Yes. You can say he's thrown for blah blah yards, and has "X" number of 300 yd games but if you actually watch the games you can see that there is room for improvement at the QB position.

He's also the sole reason we have the 3rd best BCS ranking win in Texas...

H-towngreen · November 5, 2013

So the kid is setting records and the staff doesn't trust him? The receiver lets the ball bounce off his hands and you "don't trust Derek". Get grip. He has put the team on his back a couple of times this year. Ball State anyone?

1) not sure what int you are referring to but if it's the Rice game it bounced off his hand bc it was a poorly thrown ball.

2) DT played well against Ball State. I certainly wouldn't say he carried us. We forced 5 turnovers and rushed for 231 yds. Zach Paul went 4-4 in fgs(which btw what a season this kid has had!)

Mean_Green09 · November 5, 2013

So the kid is setting records and the staff doesn't trust him? The receiver lets the ball bounce off his hands and you "don't trust Derek". Get grip. He has put the team on his back a couple of times this year. Ball State anyone? He is a spread offense QB that has figured out a way to fit within a conservative offensive style and clearly establish himself as a leader on the team.

#hatersgonnahate

#cantfixstupid

Nobody is hating. Nobody is saying he cant get it done. He has silenced the doubters that say he couldn't get the job done. So now he has set a level of expectation and that is what we are holding him to. He has proven that he can make good decisions and get the ball in the hands of our playmakers. He has proven he go and win games. So now we need to see that effort on a consistent basis. When the lights come on and the stage is brightest we need our QB and leader to be at his best.

LongJim · November 5, 2013

UNT is 6-3 and tied for first place in the division, apparently DESPITE DT's efforts. What a crock. If you want to beat the guy up for throwing INT's, fine, but the team has won 4 straight, DT has outgunned a couple of QB's considered "better" than him, and is setting or threatening school all-time records. At what point do you let the kid play without wringing your hands like a woman over what he "might" do? #kindasucksman.

Where was the criticism of WR last year when DT had jack spit to throw to? Oh yeah, there wasn't any.

meangreener · November 5, 2013

UNT is 6-3 and tied for first place in the division, apparently DESPITE DT's efforts. What a crock. If you want to beat the guy up for throwing INT's, fine, but the team has won 4 straight, DT has outgunned a couple of QB's considered "better" than him, and is setting or threatening school all-time records. At what point do you let the kid play without wringing your hands like a woman over what he "might" do? #kindasucksman.

Where was the criticism of WR last year when DT had jack spit to throw to? Oh yeah, there wasn't any.

Nobody is saying despite.

Sorry that we can't assume we're a flawless team and can sleepwalk through our last three games and easily win.

My bad.

Travis · November 5, 2013

He has been much better than I expected. I am glad he has.

But, I will say that you act like his turnovers haven't already hurt us. They have. We lost the Ohio game because of it. We lost the Tulane game because of it as well. Both of those TD's that were either a pick 6 or a turnover that quickly led to a touchdown were both deciding factors in the game.

Were there other reasons? sure. But, his picks were a major reason too. So we can't act like they haven't hurt us yet. They already have hurt us.

LongJim · November 5, 2013

Nobody is saying despite.
Sorry that we can't assume we're a flawless team and can sleepwalk through our last three games and easily win.
My bad.

Not going to address your straw man, sorry.

This is an internet message board. I'm giving an opinion as valid as yours. What drives me up the wall is calling a kid out when he's busting his ass and winning games. Somehow that's not good enough, because of what "might" happen. There's no "elephant in the room". To me, that's kind of insulting to ONE member of a TEAM. But, that's just me. Carry on. No apologies needed.

Mean_Green09 · November 5, 2013

So we hit 6 wins and we stop thinking about improving and getting better. If you were to ask the team, the coaches and probably Derek himself where could this team improve. I have no doubt they would say offensive efficiency and penalties.

I'm not trying to hate on our QB. So I think everybody who thinks this is a hate Derek party please exit the thread. This is about legit concerns that have come up in the past few games. If you don't think that the offensive output is a concern you should go check with our HC and OC. Canles even mentioned it being ugly on Thursday.

When you go out there and play balls to the walls and show us all what you got, well you have set the standard. You know what Derek has done this year? He has raised the standard of QB play. I've been holding him to high expectations after he showed me what type of player he can be. I expect a certain standard now from our QB when he steps on the field. We need him to deliver.

GOMG2013 · November 5, 2013

The thread isnt about bashing DT. Its pretty much putting a senario out there if we play against a team where they force DT to beat us.

Can he pull it off? Possibly in a cusa ship or bowl game. A situation where we are playing good competition.

I have the same questions, but its more about the playcalling and adjustments.

DT has shown he can win a game if you DARE, him to beat you. He is an average QB. He's not an improviser or playmaker. He is going to run the offense. He cannot overcome predictable playcalling and if a defense has your play figured out.

Edited November 5, 2013 by GOMG2013

forevereagle · November 5, 2013

Let's hope no one goes to DTs house like Matt Schaub!

A house that he rents, or owns?

Question, no info.

filmerj · November 5, 2013

DT is, what DT is. I know I will get minuses for this, but If you look at our football history (not including Dodge era, even though it may still apply due to Dunbar,) we've been primarily a run first type of program. It's not hard to break school QB records when this is the case. With that said DT has shown improvement and he's ended up being what we've needed. I'm okay with that. I wish he could eliminate the picks at a crucial times. His D really bailed him out against Rice after he threw that pick. I hope he took them out to dinner. I like DT, I don't question his want to win. You can't play football at a D1 program and not want to win. He's been through a lot. And he stepped up enough to be a good QB.

Edited November 5, 2013 by filmerj

Quoner · November 5, 2013

Is DT more of a TJ Yates last year in week 9 or more of a Matt Schaub during the 2010 bye week after eating Arby's?

Question, no info.

LongJim · November 5, 2013

When you throw picks on screen passes, there certainly is a problem with decision making. I also agree that the designed roll-outs (and even a couple due to pressure) have been very successful. Perhaps because they simplify the decision making process because there is only going to be one or two options? The play action deep pass has worked as well, perhaps for the same reason. Fake the handoff and hurl it deep, not a ton of reading the D to do. Also been glad to see him scramble a bit and use the read option, like on the goal line last week.

Thoughts?

I think I see where you're going--DT is a poor decision-maker, or more likely a mouth-breathing imbecile who must be spoon-fed and probably toileted by responsible adults.

MeanGreenTexan · November 5, 2013

DT is, what DT is. I know I will get minuses for this, but If you look at our football history (not including Dodge era, even though it may still apply due to Dunbar,) we've been primarily a run first type of program. It's not hard to break school QB records when this is the case. With that said DT has shown improvement and he's ended up being what we've needed. I'm okay with that. I wish he could eliminate the picks at a crucial times. His D really bailed him out against Rice after he threw that pick. I hope he took them out to dinner. I like DT, I don't question his want to win. You can't play football at a D1 program and not want to win. He's been through a lot. And he stepped up enough to be a good QB.

I still don't really pin that INT VS Rice on Derek. It may not have been the best ball thrown, but the ball hit the receiver's hands. There are some other horrible INT's to point to (like both of the ones he threw on the RB screens), but this one wasn't bad.

GOMG2013 · November 5, 2013

We have a run first offense. Its been that way for years. This year they tried to add a little more balance. Just a little more passing, to open up the run more.

DT is average, but the philosophy is what is keeping him average. We are a run first team, and best believe that is the way they practice. DT is not getting a lot of reps throwing the ball like prolific passing offense, but we are expecting those results if we ever need it.

We have been fortunate to get back into some games against some safe, prevent defenses by passing, but once they get settled, we end up making the mistake again.

We need to become a REAL balanced team, and not this fake balanced team if we really want to judge what our wrs and DT can do.

eulessismore · November 5, 2013

I tend to agree with the side that says he hasn't done that much to win us games of late. In part, because he has not needed to, in part because he has hurt us with the INT. As mentioned, you can easily look at Ohio and Tulane to see that. He was great in the 2nd half of the BSU game, that is certain. But his first halves haven't been very strong. But it hasn't been for the whole team. Chicken or egg? Were the team's slow starts due to the QB's slow starts? Or the gameplan? Both?

I tend to agree with 90 that the coaches don't fully trust him and prefer to run into the brick wall until it breaks. But when it doesn't break (Tulane) we have been in trouble if DT isn't on. When you throw picks on screen passes, there certainly is a problem with decision making. I also agree that the designed roll-outs (and even a couple due to pressure) have been very successful. Perhaps because they simplify the decision making process because there is only going to be one or two options? The play action deep pass has worked as well, perhaps for the same reason. Fake the handoff and hurl it deep, not a ton of reading the D to do. Also been glad to see him scramble a bit and use the read option, like on the goal line last week.

Thoughts?

Yep.

H-towngreen · November 5, 2013

I still don't really pin that INT VS Rice on Derek. It may not have been the best ball thrown, but the ball hit the receiver's hands. There are some other horrible INT's to point to (like both of the ones he threw on the RB screens), but this one wasn't bad.

It hit 1 outstretched hand, that was nowhere neat a catchable ball. This was a poor decesion and an even worse throw to top it off.

filmerj · November 5, 2013

I still don't really pin that INT VS Rice on Derek. It may not have been the best ball thrown, but the ball hit the receiver's hands. There are some other horrible INT's to point to (like both of the ones he threw on the RB screens), but this one wasn't bad.

Maybe, but I think he may have been better served running out of bounds or throwing it away.

Edited November 5, 2013 by filmerj

BillySee58 · November 5, 2013

I would not say he even manages the game well. A game manager doesn't have a TD/INT ratio like DT has. We have won numerous games bc of our special teams and defense. Has he improved from last season? Yes. Does he still make too many mistakes? Yes. Does he still have accuracy issues? Yes. You can say he's thrown for blah blah yards, and has "X" number of 300 yd games but if you actually watch the games you can see that there is room for improvement at the QB position.

Great way of putting it. So was greenminer's statement on the first page.

Am I the only one who wonders what our record would be if Berglund wasn't in the dog house and had been our starter all year? Maybe we lose the ball state game but I think we'd still have all of our other wins and would've won the Tulane game and maybe the Ohio game. All speculation with very little backing but that's what I feel. Those pick sixes cost us both games.

I don't know if we'd be better with another qb on our roster under center, but I know with things the way they our we have a chance to win CUSA. We might be in an even better situation, but the situation we're in right now is pretty good. Even if DT isn't the main reason we're in this position.

Cerebus · November 5, 2013

I am a DT supporter. However, that doesn't mean I turn a blind out to what he needs to work on. I tend to ignore stat comparisons, especially across eras, but the one true stat for a QB in any era is TD-INT ratio. And that is what he needs to improve on. Sure, there are some INT's that are just unlucky bounces (That late Rice int wasn't one, that was a bad decision, and I bet DT knows it was), but there are also lucky bounces that turn into TD's.

DT is a GOOD quarterback. He does everything he can within this offense, but he does need to cut back on interceptions.

Senior Year*: 12TD 11INT (1.1 to 1 ratio)

Entire Career*: 38TD 32INT (1.2 to 1)

Scott Hall was a GREAT quarterback:

Senior Year: 14TD - 4INT (3.5 to 1)

Entire Career: 50TD - 26TD (1.9 to 1)

That doesn't take away from the good season DT is having, let's remember, there have been five QB's who have led North Texas to a bowl, and he is one of them.

BillySee58 · November 5, 2013

No hate for Derek. We all support him and are proud of the wins he has gotten us. As a critical football fan it's not hard to see that there is as much room for improvement at our qb position, the most important position in football, as there is at any position on our entire team. Doesn't mean he's bad as he is. We just have a solid team.

CMJ · November 5, 2013

Has DT made some questionable things? Sure.

To say he's the main reason for the Tune and Ohio losses is silly though. Nobody blames all the personal fouls the defense was called for in those games (Tulane especially) or the fact that they got blown off the field in the initial stages. I'm not saying the defense is to blame either btw -- just not sure why we need to be contemplating if we'd have fewer losses if our backup was in.

We win as a team and lose as a team. No one deserves to be singled out IMHO.

Mo Green · November 5, 2013

He throws the ball HIGH, some are picked off but remember he makes up for this by being a slow runner (note: still had a +25 yr. running TD in a game).

Just putting in more useless facts.

BillySee58 · November 5, 2013

Has DT made some questionable things? Sure.

To say he's the main reason for the Tune and Ohio losses is silly though. Nobody blames all the personal fouls the defense was called for in those games (Tulane especially) or the fact that they got blown off the field in the initial stages. I'm not saying the defense is to blame either btw -- just not sure why we need to be contemplating if we'd have fewer losses if our backup was in.

We win as a team and lose as a team. No one deserves to be singled out IMHO.

People say qbs get too much blame for losses and too much praise for wins. They're the most important position and there's a reason why their success is so directly correlated with the team's.

The defense only gave up 10 points against Tulane. DT gave up 7 on the pick six. Also, no one blames the personal fouls because they were bogus calls and a sign of assertion from a lights-out defense. You're right that we shouldn't single him out, but that's a big let down for the team. He's also helped us win 6 games through 9 so there's no need to complain. That's why no one really has.

Our receivers, running backs, o-line, defense, and special teams have been top-notch and as good as you could ask for. DT hasn't been as good as you can ask for but he's been good enough. That's why he's an "elephant in the room" and not a guy who we're calling for his replacement.