HS coach has bullying complaint filed against him after 91-0 win

[EagleGreen]

As a baseball coach, when we are really beating the hell out of a team, I have the kids not play as risky as they would (not steal bases, etc.). But, we do not lay down. I'm not sure what happened with this game but it was likely NOT bullying. It was more likely a huge mismatch with an agressive coach on the good team and a pisspoor coach on the bad team. Oh, and really urban pussy parents.

Edited October 23, 2013 by EagleGreen

[greenminer]

I would think having opposing players fall down to keep from scoring would be a ton more humiliating than getting beat 91-0.

Agree lol, but I was just thinking about what would prevent a bullying complaint.

I've read the formal complaint. It does the human race no favors.

[UNTFan23]

[Army of Dad]

Some of our first stringers are still in but we have a running clock now so there's that. Edited October 23, 2013 by Army of Dad

[KRAM1]

The problem with youth sports up through high school is spelled P-A-R-E-N-T-S!

Always had more challenges refereeing youth soccer up through HS with parents...usually ignorant of the rules and acting like complete idiots...just like the parent who filed this complaint!

Could not under the laws of the game toss a spectator, but I could toss the coach and the coach is responsible for the actions of his parents on a soccer pitch. So, told a bunch of coaches to control his/her parents or I was going to toss him/her. Usually worked...usually! And many times the coach said "thanks".. Gave them the excuse to nail the parent...which was usually the same idiot parent who caused most of the problems...always one of THOSE GUYS around!

Heard the complaint in the Aledo football fame thing was filed by the Dad...not the Mom. Interesting.

[JesseMartin]

An odd idea that may seem counterintuitive would be to find a way to empower kids to ask their parents not to come if they are a problem. As much as you want a large crowd, if the parents are problems to either the team or their kids then there's a delicate balance whereby they'll still let their children compete but know to stay away until they can control themselves. When I had grown enough to give my opinion without being thrown down a flight of stairs, I asked my parents not to come to any of my school events (sports included) because they were always too critical, even when they didn't know what they were talking about. They conceded, and I was able to grow a lot more without worrying about what they would say after watching or if I was doing something they may take issue with.

[ntmeangreen11]

Pilot Point, Celina, & Aubrey all learned from the master about move ins, coaches kids etc.

Wrong.

[SSP]

Wrong.

Wrong and also RIGHT.

Aubrey learned because all their male athletes we're transferring to Celina or Pilot Point.

Celina has mastered this for at least 2 decades. Not to mention I remember many of track meets where all of Celina's athletes were balding. They obviously had a fabulous coach (who is also a family friend), but the Boosters were crazy and knew exactly what they were doing.

Everybody wants to be a part of a winning program. But it should also be mentioned that this goes both ways. there have been a lot of athletes that have transferred out of successful programs to less successful schools so that they can actually play. Because of that there have been a lot of athletes that have earned themselves D 1 scholarships because they transferred to a school where they would get a higher amount of PT and actually get noticed.

Edited October 25, 2013 by SSP

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

It appears Aledo did what it could to stop scoring... I remember Univ. of Houston scoring 100 a few ago against Tulsa ... and the criticism he received...... He stated he played every kid he had, and had run basic plays, but would not tell his bench kids to not try ( I agree) .. He also stated the other team did agree to play and wasn't trying much....

H.S. is a bit different, they don't get to chose their district foes... but I have no problem with what happened .... My only suggestion is for the UIL to allow the coach that is 50 points down to end the game if he choses.

Edited October 25, 2013 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[GreenMachine]

It appears Aledo did what it could to stop scoring... I remember Univ. of Houston scoring 100 a few ago against Tulsa ... and the criticism he received...... He stated he played every kid he had, and had run basic plays, but would not tell his bench kids to not try ( I agree) .. He also stated the other team did agree to play and wasn't trying much....

H.S. is a bit different, they don't get to chose their district foes... but I have no problem with what happened .... My only suggestion is for the UIL to allow the coach that is 50 points down to end the game if he choses.

[GreenMachine]

It appears Aledo did what it could to stop scoring... I remember Univ. of Houston scoring 100 a few ago against Tulsa ... and the criticism he received...... He stated he played every kid he had, and had run basic plays, but would not tell his bench kids to not try ( I agree) .. He also stated the other team did agree to play and wasn't trying much....

H.S. is a bit different, they don't get to chose their district foes... but I have no problem with what happened .... My only suggestion is for the UIL to allow the coach that is 50 points down to end the game if he choses.

In the real world we can't just quit if we are losing. What does this teach our kids? Every single day there are winners and losers, that will never change.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

In the real world we can't just quit if we are losing. What does this teach our kids? Every single day there are winners and losers, that will never change.

.

---Six man football has a 45 point rule if at halftime or later ... so how is that different just because there is 11 on the field in H.S....?? . .... Once it gets that one sided (50 points ahead and tired players ) I think it is better to just call it a game because of the risk of injuries... Even high school baseball has "run rules" to end the game..... why not 11 man football ...? .. how is that different..?. I don't see that as quitting.... never heard of a team coming from behind when they were 50 points down... they are defeated and as you pointed out ... they lost ... the others are the winners. .

Not suggesting this for college or NFL...

.

[UNTFan23]

[FirefightnRick]

Why do you always wait a day after the last post to want threads to die that your not interested in?

Rick

[UNTFan23]

Why do you always wait a day after the last post to want threads to die that your not interested in?

Rick

I don't read the board every day. From the start this whole thing has been a waste of resources. If you want to complain about how some schools have an unfair advantage to how they use the rules to their advantage, start another thread.

Edited November 4, 2013 by UNTFan23

[FirefightnRick]

I don't read the board every day. From the start this whole thing has been a waste of resources. If you want to complain about how some schools have an unfair advantage to how they use the rules to their advantage, start another thread.

But then there would be two threads and we know you couldn't handle that. If you don't like the subject matter why read it? Just like the practice issues. You don't care, and you wouldn't even attend if they were open, but you have to comment on it.

If you don't like it don't read it. Or better yet, use the ignore button.

Rick

[JesseMartin]

But then there would be two threads and we know you couldn't handle that. If you don't like the subject matter why read it? Just like the practice issues. You don't care, and you wouldn't even attend if they were open, but you have to comment on it.

If you don't like it don't read it. Or better yet, use the ignore button.

Rick

This has been posted so many times in both jest and seriousness that I can hardly tell when someone means it as one or the other anymore.

[UNTFan23]

But then there would be two threads and we know you couldn't handle that. If you don't like the subject matter why read it? Just like the practice issues. You don't care, and you wouldn't even attend if they were open, but you have to comment on it.

If you don't like it don't read it. Or better yet, use the ignore button.

Rick

The bullying complaint and complaining about how schools like Aledo are abusing the system are two very different topic. Yes, Aledo's beatdown of numerous schools is what lead to the complaint with WHHS but the two topics are mutually exclusive and can be discussed as such.

[FirefightnRick]

The bullying complaint and complaining about how schools like Aledo are abusing the system are two very different topic. Yes, Aledo's beatdown of numerous schools is what lead to the complaint with WHHS but the two topics are mutually exclusive and can be discussed as such.

Feel free to start a separate one yourself then and I'll jump in when I can.

Rick

Edited November 5, 2013 by FirefightnRick

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

May I suggest nearly fresh cow-patties at 3 paces to solve this.

[GreenBat]

Wondering if Jerry Jones going to file a Bullying complaint against the Saints and head coach Sean Payton? Aledo only had 19 first downs while piling up 542 yard. New Orleans had 40 first downs with 625 yard.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

This has been building up steam for a month now since Aledo ran the score up on Arlington Heights 84-7.

What is completely being missed in all of this is the fact that Aledo has been skirting the rules like so many other programs for years..(Southlake Carroll, Brownwood etc), and it's been ignored and everyone in Tarrant and Parker counties know this is true about Aledo.

It's just my opinion, and I don't agree with it and could be completely off base, but I think the bullying accusation was a last desperate attempt by a fed up parent to shoot up a big enough flare for the UIL to finally step in and investigate Aledo's football program.

It doesn't matter one bit what Buchanon does to keep the score down because he's annually fielding an All Star football team, chocked full of kids coming here from all over the place, including from out of state. Jonathon Gray from Crowley, two brothers one being a QB from Mississippi, and now their stud WR who transferred in from L.D. Bell and countless others.

What needs to happen to Aledo is what happened to Brock Bergland's school, Valor Christian.

They were recruiting players and told and warned not to do so and continued to skirt the rules until the CHSAA board finally stepped in and banned them from competition.

http://www.denverpost.com/search/ci_19471426#ixzz1kG5vjAZq

Finally, a decision was made....

"Valor Christian kicked out of football league, forced to go independent."

http://blogs.denverpost.com/preps/2012/01/19/valor-christian-kicked-out-of-football-league-forced-to-go-independent/4540/#disqus_thread

I don't have the answer to the solution of course. But there certainly is a problem when one school is continued to be allowed to skirt the rules and everyone knows it's going on. Folks didn't think Southlake was getting away with anything either. Complaints and tip-offs were ignored by UIL officials until finally WFAA channel 8 out of Dallas investigated and find out that Southlake was a week away from actually starting a QB who was banned from any state competition out of Oklahoma, plus his parents were still living there. When approached at the mail box getting his mail in front of his mansion and asked why he still lived there when his son was playing in Texas the guy hit the reporter with a sack of sugar from the grocery store.

Rick

..

---Brownwood recruiting... that is total BS.... I was a student and graduated there when we won our first championship... every kid on that team was home grown....I knew every kid in my class and had for years... The only thing close to recruiting was hiring some coaches by the head coach who had talented sons ( Southall for example, two sons became Baylor QBs, and they had coached together before and I think related somehow... married sisters or cousins?).... Cleburne made a crazy claim once ( and lost their case) about one kid who had started ninth grade at a small 6-man school in the county but it was common for several good students from that school ( after a having a drivers license) to attend BHS which played in AAAA and offered a much better education. The subject offerings were not very good at the tiny school. (might offer chemistry once every three years). One in my HS class also transfered from that tiny school (a girl, and now a medical doctor at John Hopkins, also her brother who went to Air Force Academy and did not do athletics)...

Just because Bwd won a lot did not mean they cheated at all..... That is total BS ...... don't make claims that are not true. There have been several Bwd kids that made the NFL including one in the class before me that was taken first in AFL draft (L.Elkins, Baylor, Oilers) ) and every one ( except the older Southall son ) was born in Bwd. The kid that Cleburne complained about..... he still lives in Brown county and owns the family ranchland. Even Graham Harrell who did not attend BHS was born there, but his family now lives in Bwd again (his father had been BHS valedictorian and QB ). CBS made a false claim about Brownwood football (in a TV bit on Texas football ) once and it cost them over $100,000 in law suit which the coach (Wood) then donated to charity. That claim did apply to another Texas HS and the film clip shown supposedly was Wood but it was not him as they stated it was..... CBS also had to apologize to him in person on their morning show... Wood and Southall both were elected as President of Texas HS Coaches Assoc... Southall is the only assistant coach ever elected to that position..

-Ever heard of Max Emfinger and his recruiting organization (played at Baylor and BHS)? ... I have known him from 4th grade on ...when he changed elem. schools. (born in Bwd, both of us). I knew Carmichael (Tech QB) before he even attended pre- school and Elledge (Tech QB, my HS class) since 7th grade, his mother was a long-time BISD teacher. Your claim is extremely bogus. Another Bwd QB went to Air Force and his father was a long time accountant in Bwd. He died before graduation, car wreak.

--There was later one other odd situation involving a kid from El Paso... I think he may have lived with grandparents in Bwd and I think his father was military and had been assigned abroad and he stayed in USA to finish his HS education.. ( that is not recruiting )

I have no idea what Southlake has done.. I do know of a few kids in Midland that lived in apt. or rental houses moved and changed districts at times before starting HS... It looked odd but seemed to be entirely parent decisions, not actual recruiting.... At least one later played at UNT.... they thought it would help their kid get scholarships to play in a winning program...

.

.

Edited November 18, 2013 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[FirefightnRick]

..

---Brownwood recruiting... that is total BS.... I was a student and graduated there when we won our first championship... every kid on that team was home grown....I knew every kid in my class and had for years... The only thing close to recruiting was hiring some coaches by the head coach who had talented sons ( Southall for example, two sons became Baylor QBs, and they had coached together before and I think related somehow... married sisters or cousins?).... Cleburne made a crazy claim once ( and lost their case) about one kid who had started ninth grade at a small 6-man school in the county but it was common for several good students from that school ( after a having a drivers license) to attend BHS which played in AAAA and offered a much better education. The subject offerings were not very good at the tiny school. (might offer chemistry once every three years). One in my HS class also transfered from that tiny school (a girl, and now a medical doctor at John Hopkins, also her brother who went to Air Force Academy and did not do athletics)...

Just because Bwd won a lot did not mean they cheated at all..... That is total BS ...... don't make claims that are not true. There have been several Bwd kids that made the NFL including one in the class before me that was taken first in AFL draft (L.Elkins, Baylor, Oilers) ) and every one ( except the older Southall son ) was born in Bwd. The kid that Cleburne complained about..... he still lives in Brown county and owns the family ranchland. Even Graham Harrell who did not attend BHS was born there, but his family now lives in Bwd again (his father had been BHS valedictorian and QB ). CBS made a false claim about Brownwood football (in a TV bit on Texas football ) once and it cost them over $100,000 in law suit which the coach (Wood) then donated to charity. That claim did apply to another Texas HS and the film clip shown supposedly was Wood but it was not him as they stated it was..... CBS also had to apologize to him in person on their morning show... Wood and Southall both were elected as President of Texas HS Coaches Assoc... Southall is the only assistant coach ever elected to that position..

-Ever heard of Max Emfinger and his recruiting organization (played at Baylor and BHS)? ... I have known him from 4th grade on ...when he changed elem. schools. (born in Bwd, both of us). I knew Carmichael (Tech QB) before he even attended pre- school and Elledge (Tech QB, my HS class) since 7th grade, his mother was a long-time BISD teacher. Your claim is extremely bogus.

--There was later one other odd situation involving a kid from El Paso... I think he may have lived with grandparents in Bwd and I think his father was military and had been assigned abroad and he stayed in USA to finish his HS education.. ( that is not recruiting )

I have no idea what Southlake has done.. I do know of a few kids in Midland that lived in apt. or rental houses moved and changed districts at times before starting HS... It looked odd but seemed to be entirely parent decisions, not actual recruiting.... At least one later played at UNT.... they thought it would help their kid get scholarships to play in a winning program...

.

.

Were you high a lot in High School to the point to where you probably never noticed that every kid that was fast and expected to attend Early ISD ended up in Brownwood ISD?

The stories are so abundant and have been share and discussed by so many avid high school football fans for decades that there should be a movie a but it. Gordon Wood was the guest speaker at my senior football banquet and even hinted at it with some self deprecating humor during his speech.

Please stick to something you know about like math discussion etc.

Rick

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

,

Were you high a lot in High School to the point to where you probably never noticed that every kid that was fast and expected to attend Early ISD ended up in Brownwood ISD?

The stories are so abundant and have been share and discussed by so many avid high school football fans for decades that there should be a movie a but it. Gordon Wood was the guest speaker at my senior football banquet and even hinted at it with some self deprecating humor during his speech.

Please stick to something you know about like math discussion etc.

Rick

Name them.... We won state in track my senior year, second my junior year, and every kid on that team were long term Bwd people.... I was considered slow in Bwd and the year I lived in Abilene I was one the fastest four kids in town in town (city track meet) ... We won both relays my senior year at BHS ...... with Harris** (sat behind me in 10th grade math, McCollough (I think), Emfinger, and Daniels... Everyone one of them went to elem school in Bwd. The only kid I can remember went to Bwd from Early did so after Wood was gone, he was the son of a cousin of mine that taught choir in BISD. Brownwood had no baseball program then and so every athletic kid ran track and did not divide up the talent... The year we won state, every game we had the smaller team ... but good luck catching them... and having Lawrence Elkins as a receiver( future College all-American, twice , his (parents even grew up in Bwd) that made things easy ... no one could cover him.... I did not run track in HS because to make the team I would almost had to qualify for the state meet, it was insane how much speed was there..

My family came to Brown co. in the 1870's and know who the locals were and there were not any kids showing up from other schools... Not having a baseball program helped , (see the movie Rookie, he was from Brownwood not Big Lake as it said, knew his father) The second thing was the kids...... several would get summer jobs at the brick plant shoving brick carts into kilns all summer or at the rock crusher shoveling rock... As some said ... football was easy after a summer of that...muscles hard as rocks.... Our fullback's family owned a dairy and he lifted milk cans etc all the time.... and could out-lift some of those kids who just lifted weights. He was crazy fast for a short distance, in ten yards he was would have three yards on me off the blocks, just what a back needed to do....... You just don't know what was happening.... there was no need to recruit in that era. A lot of hard-working fast kids..... who did not sit around all summer and watch TV. They had learned that football could get them scholarships and an education.

If Wood winked about it ... it was all about some the coaches he hired ... and nothing else.... I would rather not name some assistant coaches other than Southall that provided some really good players later... Nothing illegal there.

** Ted Harris,,,, black kid could not attend any SWC school or even Howard Payne (race) at that time ...Died recently in Cleburne, a coach. His younger brother played for Univ. of Houston and the Washington Redskins ... even faster than Ted was. [ they had lived in Bwd all their lives ]

....

Maybe you should stick to something you know ... Name those kids you mentioned... you can't ..... they don't exist... My cousin that left Early for Bwd because his Mom taught there played in the late 80's... now a lawyer in Bwd. He was big, not fast... they won nothing. .

The first year Wood appeared in Bwd, Bwd was expected to finish 5th in a 6 team district... We finished 13-1, lost to Temple, but won state. The speed and Elkins just destroyed people including Killeen and Emory Ballard at San Angelo..... 34-6... Every player had been in Bwd for years. .

____

If he recruited for that first team ... he was terrible.... one kid weighed 180 (Ronnie Moore, later of TAMU) Elkins was second largest at about 170.. the rest small (160ish avg.) and fast, and determined. Got Lucky at the state level... a team from Baytown whose line weighed about 220 had lost in the semis.... defeated Port Lavaca easily by 20-30 points. About five went on play D-I football.

.

Edited November 18, 2013 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

Another point during 60's and I think most if not all of the 70's, any kid than changed schools had to sit out a year before he could play at his new school. That rule cost Si Southall a year of eligibility (soph. year). It also hurt a long term Bwd kid in my class that had gone to school Bwd for 11.5 years moved to the family ranch in a neighboring county that spring semester and in the fall returned and was ineligible for his senior year [ he weighed over 200 lbs. ...that just wasn't right but that was the UIL of the time ]

As bad or worse was kid at Abilene Cooper had enrolled at Cooper for his junior year, withdrew two weeks later when his father in the air-force was transferred to Guam or somewhere in South Pacific where there was no high school.. He came back the next year, did his "junior year" and played two games into his senior year before they remembered his two week junior enrollment earlier (he received no grades). The UIL considered those two weeks a year and Cooper forfeited those games and he had to quit....could not play..

The point is..... recruiting by coaches in the era would have been very tough... had to do it when student was in junior high**.. Prior to 1952 when the present set-up was started .... lots of crazy things did go on. Wood won no championships in that era and only showed up in Bwd in 1960 with a team that had gone 8-2 the previous year losing out to Emory Bellard then in Breckenridge.. (most of that talent was gone except Elkins).

I guess you already knew that since you know so much and I know nothing about athletics, rules. etc... .

**In junior high I was considered fast... later I wasn't ... I had a Sept. birthday (one of oldest in class) and they caught up with me and toss in the classes below and above me. Recruiting at that point is a real crap-shot... and unlikely success... I have seen a lot great junior high athletes that never played in HS...