Thanks RV

[meangreener]

Not to make this a football discussion on the basketball board, but how does a coach who is 29 games UNDER .500 when he is hired have "real success elsewhere?"

Because McCarney turned around a dead program and built a winner. Good overall records don't mean jack shit in football, ask Wade Phillips. ISU was, literally, irrelevant for 20 years, until Mac came around. He really just had one bad year and resigned because of it, they wouldn't have fired him if he didn't resign. He'd probably still be at Iowa State. Nice try, though.

Did you really want Franchione, Mr. 77-0? We couldn't really get anyone much better with history than McCarney. Don't be dense. Franchione can recruit, but that's about it.

Edited March 9, 2013 by meangreener

[emmitt01]

" He got us the stadium..."

Did he?

Yes, he was the AD at the time...but was it him or was it the students (Flyer, etc) and RV kept out of it and let it happen?

[meangreener]

" He got us the stadium..."

Did he?

Yes, he was the AD at the time...but was it him or was it the students (Flyer, etc) and RV kept out of it and let it happen?

True. Either way, it will be credited to him.

[UNTexas]

I have to state the obvious, he ran a good team into the ground.

[Cooley]

I think the Karen Aston hire was just as bad as Dodge or Benford. Don't care about whatever success she had here in 1 year. You just can't have your new coach leave you after 1 year.

Did RV bother to ask this question in the interview? Karen, you spent some time at UT and often speak fondly of the university. If the position became available, would you be interested? Or, Karen, we are signing you to a 5 year contract. Will this be problem for you?

[GL2Greatness]

I think the Karen Aston hire was just as bad as Dodge or Benford. Don't care about whatever success she had here in 1 year. You just can't have your new coach leave you after 1 year.

Did RV bother to ask this question in the interview? Karen, you spent some time at UT and often speak fondly of the university. If the position became available, would you be interested? Or, Karen, we are signing you to a 5 year contract. Will this be problem for you?

he did specifically ask her about that and UT (and possibly one other team) were the only other jobs she was interested in and at the time UT had coach G that looked to be a very solid hire and sure to stay at UT for at least the next few years

and at the end of the season coach G had yet another very very poor season, decided she was not up to the pressure of UT womens BB and she resigned from the job and coach Ashtons dream job was suddenly and unexpectedly immediately open and since she had already made very clear in her interview that UT was specifically a job she was interested in and would leave for RV expected that she would at least interview for the job

[greenminer]

I think the Karen Aston hire was just as bad as Dodge or Benford. Don't care about whatever success she had here in 1 year. You just can't have your new coach leave you after 1 year.

Did RV bother to ask this question in the interview? Karen, you spent some time at UT and often speak fondly of the university. If the position became available, would you be interested? Or, Karen, we are signing you to a 5 year contract. Will this be problem for you?

As one who has worked countless jobs in less than a year, I wouldn't understand anyone holding my leaving for better positions against the people who decided to hire me.

It's a reality that is always there, no matter the salaries or significance of term.

[meangreener]

I think the Karen Aston hire was just as bad as Dodge or Benford. Don't care about whatever success she had here in 1 year. You just can't have your new coach leave you after 1 year.

Did RV bother to ask this question in the interview? Karen, you spent some time at UT and often speak fondly of the university. If the position became available, would you be interested? Or, Karen, we are signing you to a 5 year contract. Will this be problem for you?

I have no problem with the Aston hire. Especially because directly after he went and got a great coach from an ACC team.

[KRAM1]

I think it is really funny how some folks here give ZERO credit to RV for the great new Apogee Stadium. If you were even part way or somewhat connected to UNT in some way you would know how much and for how many years RV was working on that stadium. It takes a lot of different folks and a good bit of luck as well to make something like this happen. To discount any part of the situation or anyone who had a hand in its development just reeks of a personal agenda and a complete lack of understanding and knowledge about how this whole thing took place. Apogee sits as UNT's stadium due the the hard work of many people...all of whom every fan of the Mean Green Nation owe a good bit of gratitude and thanks.

[meangreener]

I think it is really funny how some folks here give ZERO credit to RV for the great new Apogee Stadium. If you were even part way or somewhat connected to UNT in some way you would know how much and for how many years RV was working on that stadium. It takes a lot of different folks and a good bit of luck as well to make something like this happen. To discount any part of the situation or anyone who had a hand in its development just reeks of a personal agenda and a complete lack of understanding and knowledge about how this whole thing took place. Apogee sits as UNT's stadium due the the hard work of many people...all of whom every fan of the Mean Green Nation owe a good bit of gratitude and thanks.

I agree. But what's the point in wasting money on a new stadium when you can't get any fans cos you keep botching hires?

[GRN-WHT]

I think it is really funny how some folks here give ZERO credit to RV for the great new Apogee Stadium. If you were even part way or somewhat connected to UNT in some way you would know how much and for how many years RV was working on that stadium. It takes a lot of different folks and a good bit of luck as well to make something like this happen. To discount any part of the situation or anyone who had a hand in its development just reeks of a personal agenda and a complete lack of understanding and knowledge about how this whole thing took place. Apogee sits as UNT's stadium due the the hard work of many people...all of whom every fan of the Mean Green Nation owe a good bit of gratitude and thanks.

I don't disagree, but I ask what the future holds for us with RV as AD. Where we stand now, what more is there left for him to do other than hire coaches? New stadium, BB facility, Pit upgrades, CUSA, baseball, we've started the process of finally catching up with similar schools in all areas other than coaching. If all there is left to do is manage coaching staffs, I don't want him around anymore.

[emmitt01]

I don't disagree, but I ask what the future holds for us with RV as AD. Where we stand now, what more is there left for him to do other than hire coaches? New stadium, BB facility, Pit upgrades, CUSA, baseball, we've started the process of finally catching up with similar schools in all areas other than coaching. If all there is left to do is manage coaching staffs, I don't want him around anymore.

The future holds staffers with no pressure to excel, hiring with no pressure to get it right because there is a long line of ready apologists, and middle of the pack success in CUSA. Other than that we're golden.

[DeepGreen]

RV does not know how to recognize up and coming coaching talent. He thinks bringing in former HC's or Assistants from "name" programs will suffice the UNT faithful. Stevens, Dodge, McCarney(I'm giving him one more chance), Benford, Pettersen(juries still out on him), to name a few. Heck, in retrospect, how would things be had Chico been given the football HC job, or Danny Kaspar been given an interview by the University he played basketball for?

[emmitt01]

You know I had this long post that showed the success of our athletic program accross the board, with ranked teams and several conference championships the last couple of years. But I deleted it because I realize you people just want blood and don't care about reality.

GMG has just totally defeated me. I think I will just stick to following recruing and be quiet on most else. Congrats, you win.

I heart tennis and swimming too. Keeps the bills paid.

[Greendylan]

You know I had this long post that showed the success of our athletic program accross the board, with ranked teams and several conference championships the last couple of years. But I deleted it because I realize you people just want blood and don't care about reality.

GMG has just totally defeated me. I think I will just stick to following recruing and be quiet on most else. Congrats, you win.

Don't get me wrong, I do take pride in our successes in sports like soccer, etc. But . . . how many Bubas Cups have we won since joining the Sun Belt?

[MeanGreenTexan]

I think judging Rick must be a weighted process.

You must consider all of the facilities (yes, he deserves credit for Apogee, and yes, I'm aware of Flyer's efforts and grassroots movements to influence the student vote). Rick's certainly in the black here. But this is only a part of his job.

If all of the coaching hires were weighted the same, Rick would be in the black here as well. He's made some fantastic hires in the olympic sports. But there are 3 sports that will weigh a little more than the others (baseball will join this group when it's up and running): FB, MBB, WBB.

Football should probably be weighted at 40% of all coaching hires, that's how important it is, and Dodge was a failure. McCarney is muddling, but he's got his guys in here now. This should be his last shot. Anything less than 5 wins this year is unacceptable and he will be a failure too. We'll know the answer to this in 9 months. But so far, Rick's FB hires are not good overall. Didn't he extend Dickey once before firing him? At least Dickey was winning... Rick's in the red here.

Women's basketball - 10% weight - has been a failure for a while. Slinker was not good and Stephens was downright horrible. It looks like we have some good players here now, and a coach with skins, but Peterson definitely grades an "I" right now. Rick's in the Red here.

Men's b-ball - 20% weight - Benford can maybe turn it around?? The only glimmer of hope I have in this is how Jordan Williams' play improved during the year. He and his staff must be doing at least one thing right. The rest is a freaking let-down of epic proportions. Rick gets credit for hiring and extending JJ more times than hiring Benford, but if Benford is left to continue deconstructing what JJ built, his bad hire will weigh more than JJ's extensions. Rick's in the black here (for now).

That leaves 30% of the weight to be carried by the likes of Golf, Soccer, Swimming/Diving, Track, Softball, Volleyball, & Tennis. Rick's definitely in the black here.

He has a balanced ledger in coaching hires. But if both McCarney and Benford fail, he'll be in the red here.

Lastly, there's the task of raising funds.

It appears that Rick has made some new friends recently since we're supposedly extremely close to announcing baseball, we're upgrading the Pit and all kinds of other things thanks to donors. Mean Green club memberships are up, right? Season ticket sales are up across the board right? Rick's in the black here.

I think, overall, Rick is doing a good job for us, and as some of you mentioned, he cares for UNT. His mistakes are glaring though because they affect the 3 big sports.

[Mean Green Matt]

I have no problem with the Aston hire. Especially because directly after he went and got a great coach from an ACC team.

Who would that be?

[meangreener]

Who would that be?

Peterson? From Wake Forest?

[Greendylan]

Let's consider what transpired with the Southern Miss football program this past season. First, I should point out that not only are they our future conference mates, but they are also quite historically similar to UNT as an institution. In other words, they are our slightly smaller peer.

So, after one disastrous season, they recognized that they had made a mistake in hiring Ellis Johnson, and they announced his dismissal three days after their season ended. Even though they were on the hook for a 2.1 million dollar buyout, they made the only sensible choice: to not let a very successful program be destroyed by incompetence just to save short term money. Additionally, they didn't even have a clause in his contract that subtracted future coaching salaries from the buyout. We do have such a stipulation for Benford, and the buyout isn't nearly as expensive.

If we are truly much less financially solvent than Southern Miss, then we need to really take a long look in the mirror and decide if it is even possible for us to succeed in major division one athletics.

If we do have the financial ability but not the will to make a change, then we need to question the leadership of our athletic program.

[UNTstormchaser]

Let's consider what transpired with the Southern Miss football program this past season. First, I should point out that not only are they our future conference mates, but they are also quite historically similar to UNT as an institution. In other words, they are our slightly smaller peer.

So, after one disastrous season, they recognized that they had made a mistake in hiring Ellis Johnson, and they announced his dismissal three days after their season ended. Even though they were on the hook for a 2.1 million dollar buyout, they made the only sensible choice: to not let a very successful program be destroyed by incompetence just to save short term money. Additionally, they didn't even have a clause in his contract that subtracted future coaching salaries from the buyout. We do have such a stipulation for Benford, and the buyout isn't nearly as expensive.

If we are truly much less financially solvent than Southern Miss, then we need to really take a long look in the mirror and decide if it is even possible for us to succeed in major division one athletics.

If we do have the financial ability but not the will to make a change, then we need to question the leadership of our athletic program.

Well said. For me personally, my opinion on RV hinges entirely on him retaining/firing Benford. If he retains Benford I'll be all over the "Fire RV" bandwagon, unless Benford somehow turns it around of course. But if Benford is fired, I'll be remaining in the pro-RV camp for the time being.

[emmitt01]

I think it is really funny how some folks here give ZERO credit to RV for the great new Apogee Stadium. If you were even part way or somewhat connected to UNT in some way you would know how much and for how many years RV was working on that stadium. It takes a lot of different folks and a good bit of luck as well to make something like this happen. To discount any part of the situation or anyone who had a hand in its development just reeks of a personal agenda and a complete lack of understanding and knowledge about how this whole thing took place. Apogee sits as UNT's stadium due the the hard work of many people...all of whom every fan of the Mean Green Nation owe a good bit of gratitude and thanks.

Would this be similar to he and his staff seeking out and finding the Apogee company? Are we to credit them for every thing that falls in their laps? Are we to assume that the failed attempt by RV to personally lead a campaign to get a student fee passed just a few years prior was the result of, what, bad timing? You seem to be a big fan of convenient coincidence lately.

I wonder, will Barack Obama go down in your memory as the guy who killed Bin Laden? Will you credit him because he happened to be the figurehead at the time or will you insist on crediting the SEAL team alone?

[flyonthewall]

We are so insolvent that a group of donors led by Ernie Kuehne started and completed a basketball practice facility dedicated only to basketball. A new digital scoreboard was installed in front of the scorers table, and a new sound system and a center hung scoreboard has been ordered for the pit. When you add all of those things up, it does not come close to the 3 million that was donated. What do you think the balance is going to be used for? Lets see, donated to "basketball enhancehment fund". The problem is, no one except 15 people who scream on this board want to see Benford fired. So strap it up and get ready for next season, With Tony Benford as your head coach. I will be there sitting at every home game I can attend. I thought I was part of the solution, by doing everything in my power to give coaches and players tools to succeed. By attending every game I can home or road. But because I support Coach Benford, then I guess I am part of the problem. While you are dogging the best athletic director we have every had, why don't you start with Ernie and put on this board that he is the stupidest donor we have every had, because he supports Coach Benford and thinks he did a good job with what he had to work with this year. Call him out and say how stupid he was to write his SECOND million dollar check to support your university.

This is a team sport. In the university setting the team is Coaches, players, fans, donors, university support system. We are finally getting people around here that are supporting financially the way it needs to be supported. They are not on your side right now, and that is why Benford will be here.

Edited March 11, 2013 by flyonthewall

[UNTstormchaser]

Would this be similar to he and his staff seeking out and finding the Apogee company? Are we to credit them for every thing that falls in their laps? Are we to assume that the failed attempt by RV to personally lead a campaign to get a student fee passed just a few years prior was the result of, what, bad timing? You seem to be a big fan of convenient coincidence lately.

I wonder, will Barack Obama go down in your memory as the guy who killed Bin Laden? Will you credit him because he happened to be the figurehead at the time or will you insist on crediting the SEAL team alone?

I don't understand your point. Or your analogy. RV deserves a ton of credit for Apogee. HE'S THE FREAKING ATHLETIC DIRECTOR. Anything that happens, good or bad, he is more accountable for than anyone else, save for situations when a donor or donors step up a huge amount of money for something that would not have happened otherwise. I don't think Apogee falls into that category considering the amount of money the students contributed.

I personally credit Bush, Obama, the SEAL team, and everyone else involved, for the Bin Laden killing. Obama was commander in chief at the time, top dog. Bush was top dog in the hunt for 7 years. He deserves a lot of credit as well. The SEAL team carried out the mission. They deserve an incredible amount of credit.

No big action is the result of one entity. It takes a team. If this is the point you're trying to get across, then I apologize for challenging your point with your point, and I also prod you to clarify your point a little better my friend. If not, then well, my challenge stands.

[UNTstormchaser]

We are so insolvent that a group of donors led by Ernie Kuehne started and completed a basketball practice facility dedicated only to basketball. A new digital scoreboard was installed in front of the scorers table, and a new sound system and a center hung scoreboard has been ordered for the pit. When you add all of those things up, it does not come close to the 3 million that was donated. What do you think the balance is going to be used for? Lets see, donated to "basketball enhancehment fund". The problem is, no one except 15 people who scream on this board want to see Benford fired. So strap it up and get ready for next season, With Tony Benford as your head coach. I will be there sitting at every home game I can attend. I thought I was part of the solution, by doing everything in my power to give coaches and players tools to succeed. By attending every game I can home or road. But because I support Coach Benford, then I guess I am part of the problem. While you are dogging the best athletic director we have every had, why don't you start with Ernie and put on this board that he is the stupidest donor we have every had, because he supports Coach Benford and thinks he did a good job with what he had to work with this year. Call him out and say how stupid he was to write his SECOND million dollar check to support your university.

This is a team sport. In the university setting the team is Coaches, players, fans, donors, university support system. We are finally getting people around here that are supporting financially the way it needs to be supported. They are not on your side right now, and that is why Benford will be here.

I've got a couple problems with this.

You imply that by disliking Benford, that one doesn't support the basketball team. Bullshit. I support UNT, I bleed green, but I will not waste two hours of my busy academic life to watch a joke of a team. A good job with what he had to work with? What the hell are you high on, meth??? Because I can be sober, drunk, or stoned, or some combination of the last two, and still know that Benford failed MISERABLY. Injuries, save for Walton, occurred far too late to be used as an excuse. Inheriting the most talented team in school history is not an excuse to suck. It shouldn't take half a brain to realize that.

You also imply that by disliking Benford, one doesn't support RV. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I'm very anti-Benford and very pro-RV. False argument on your part.

You also imply that by disliking Benford, one doesn't appreciate the amazing financial contributions of our donors. Also completely untrue. I'll forever appreciate those contributions and hope that I can one day do the same. But, if I recall...those donations were made before the trainwreck of a season was completely realized. Something tells me that Ernie still supporting Benford has a lot to do with the fact that he made a 7 figure contribution to the Benford led team, and not much to do with Benford's success. Which is fine, everyone should be able to completely understand that. I'd have a hard time dogging on someone who is benefiting from my recent multi-million dollar donation too. Hell, I'd have a hard time dogging on someone who is benifiting from my five dollar donation, because that would imply poor judgment initially on my part (regardless of whether it actually was poor or not), and it's human nature to resist that feeling.

Finally, there are a lot more people wanting Benford gone than "15 people on this board". There are more people on this board who want Benford gone than there are people from Texas on this board. And trust me...this place isn't a great representative population of the student body; I learned that when I initially joined the board last summer expecting the demographics to reflect the current student body, which led to a collective opening of my poophole on multiple occasions. That's nothing negative about this board, not at all, just a fact that it doesn't represent the student body at all. And let me tell you, any student who is a fan of the basketball team wants Benford to get the hell away from our fine university as quickly as possible before we're subjected to basketball seasons that rival the football seasons of the 2005-2010 timeframe.

The donors, RV, athletic dept., university officials, etc., can deny that Benford is a worthless head coach all they want, but it doesn't change the fact that he is indeed a worthless head coach. Perhaps I'll be fiending enough for basketball by the time next season starts that I'll get sucked into the "We won't suck again!!" hype and go to a couple games. But, if the season started today, I'd have a hard time motivating myself to even check the scores, let alone go to a game.

[GRN-WHT]

We are so insolvent that a group of donors led by Ernie Kuehne started and completed a basketball practice facility dedicated only to basketball. A new digital scoreboard was installed in front of the scorers table, and a new sound system and a center hung scoreboard has been ordered for the pit. When you add all of those things up, it does not come close to the 3 million that was donated. What do you think the balance is going to be used for? Lets see, donated to "basketball enhancehment fund". The problem is, no one except 15 people who scream on this board want to see Benford fired. So strap it up and get ready for next season, With Tony Benford as your head coach. I will be there sitting at every home game I can attend. I thought I was part of the solution, by doing everything in my power to give coaches and players tools to succeed. By attending every game I can home or road. But because I support Coach Benford, then I guess I am part of the problem. While you are dogging the best athletic director we have every had, why don't you start with Ernie and put on this board that he is the stupidest donor we have every had, because he supports Coach Benford and thinks he did a good job with what he had to work with this year. Call him out and say how stupid he was to write his SECOND million dollar check to support your university.

This is a team sport. In the university setting the team is Coaches, players, fans, donors, university support system. We are finally getting people around here that are supporting financially the way it needs to be supported. They are not on your side right now, and that is why Benford will be here.

If he thinks Benford did a good job with what he had this year, then surely he thinks JJ is John Wooden.