Do you agree with UNT Banning Alcohol at Greek Events?

[Eagle1855]

And, the folks who told you who made the decision were?

The same people who have been trying to get rid of the greek system for over 10 years.

I assume they are also banning alcohol at the events of all other University-affiliated clubs, as well? You know, in the interest of fairness. Otherwise, this might be considered a discriminatory knee-jerk reaction.

[Eagle1855]

Whether you guys realize it or not, Fraternities and Sororities at UNT have ALWAYS been held to higher standards than the rest of the general student population. A minor, isloated incident with a member of such an organization always becomes a much bigger deal than with an unaffiliated student.

I'd post all the positives they bring to the table, but this has all already been done ad naseum and you either agree with it or you don't. What I will say, since this is a football post, is that MANY of the "big" schools everyone clamours to be like with respects to athletics and athletic support ALL have very strong greek systems. Every single school in the SEC. Most of the Big XII. A lot of CUSA. And part of that is because it's been proven greek letter members are more likely to get involved in their university as students and also because they are more likely to stay involved as an alumni.

Boo hoo, they don't always go into the stadium. So what? They show up. And that's more than I can say for a lot of people, especially since this football team (that I love) has put a subpar product on the field for over a decade.

[Cougar King]

Please, enlighten us with your vast knowledge of UNT

Where do you want me to start?

[UNTexas]

Where do you want me to start?

Start with your infatuation that won't let you go away? Please and thank you.

Additionally, let it be known you are my favorite troll ever. Mom, meatloaf.

[GrayEagle]

I may be way off base but why would a university spend millions building fraternity/sorority rows when they are trying to get rid of them? They have another four and a half million dollars in their short-term budget to add more sorority houses.

[foutsrouts]

Where do you want me to start?

Why don't you start with the time period after you received your NT rejection letter.

[Mean Green 93-98]

I may be way off base but why would a university spend millions building fraternity/sorority rows when they are trying to get rid of them? They have another four and a half million dollars in their short-term budget to add more sorority houses.

Which houses have they paid to build? I am aware that they furnished the lots at nominal cost, but have they actually contributed toward the construction of any of the fraternity or sorority houses?

[Eagle1855]

I may be way off base but why would a university spend millions building fraternity/sorority rows when they are trying to get rid of them? They have another four and a half million dollars in their short-term budget to add more sorority houses.

Well I know that the fraternities finance their own, as I was a member of a house corporation established to build our fraternity house.

I don't know what arrangement the University has with sororities, but I as I recall, they had to pay for a large portion of their "row" as well.

And it doesn't matter if people believe it, there are indeed people in those offices that believe college campuses are better off without the Greek system, regardless of all evidence that suggests otherwise. I suspect it's largely personal. But I have no factual basis for which to make that claim. Only my own opinion based on my own experiences and interactions.

Edited February 18, 2013 by Eagle1855

[JesseMartin]

Start with your infatuation that won't let you go away? Please and thank you.

Additionally, let it be known you are my favorite troll ever. Mom, meatloaf.

Dammit, every time you guys post that in response to him, it makes me want to watch Wedding Crashers.

I may be way off base but why would a university spend millions building fraternity/sorority rows when they are trying to get rid of them? They have another four and a half million dollars in their short-term budget to add more sorority houses.

Well I know that the fraternities finance their own, as I was a member of a house corporation established to build our fraternity house.

I don't know what arrangement the University has with sororities, but I as I recall, they had to pay for a large portion of their "row" as well.

And it doesn't matter if people believe it, there are indeed people in those offices that believe college campuses are better off without the Greek system, regardless of all evidence that suggests otherwise. I suspect it's largely personal. But I have no factual basis for which to make that claim. Only my own opinion based on my own experiences and interactions.

I never saw the contracts, but if memory serves correctly, I believe that since they are on University land, UNT has options if any given organization gets kicked off campus, including transferring the structure and any remaining debt to another organization, purchasing it at market value for housing or other purposes, or if it's more cost effective, razing the structure and building something completely new. I believe some or all of the buildings used by religious organizations fall under the same rules. Basically, the structure is owned by either the group or the University and the rights to the structure are based upon retaining a pre-determined set of standards agreed upon by both parties prior to the building and/or occupation of the structure in question.

So on one hand, UNT could stand to gain something if a bunch of Greek or religious organizations were booted if the market value of the structure was considerably low at the time, though if it had been damaged to the point of needing extensive repairs, or actually appreciated in value, it would actually be worse for UNT to try to take over the rights to the structure.

On the other hand, you have to remember that many of the decision-makers were Greeks as well, years ago, and expect the system to perform at a higher level than all of us who are GDIs. A few decades ago, many of our Greeks were the execs of honors societies. Some of them were TA's and most excelled academically. The race for best GPA was almost always considerably higher than the overall GPA of other groups and the student population as a whole. As this is rarely seen nowadays, with a few still-impressive exceptions, I can see how the admin would make the connection between alcohol and other behavioral infractions and the reduced level of performance in the Greek system as a whole. Chances are, they want to weed out the individuals and groups that are bringing the Greek system down.

Again, there are certainly individuals and chapters in any given period of time who are still excelling in every area of their collegiate life, but it seems that the desire is to make that more of a standard of excellence rather than an oddity. I agree that Greeks should be the leaders of the campus and should be those who are envied for their prowess in grades, service, and overall involvement. But the desire to be the big dog on campus is nothing compared to actually having the credentials in every area to prove it.

To simplify it, as Sophocles wrote: "Show me a man who rules his household well, and I'll show you a man fit to rule a kingdom."

[MeanGreenWithEnvy]

Build houses on university land, play by university rules.

The university can ban alcohol at Greek functions and it's not going to do a damned thing to curb binge drinking or Greeks partying. The activity will simply move off-campus to a less controlled environment.

I'm not a fan of the university telling adults that they can't smoke on university property and I'm not a fan of the university telling Greeks they can't have alcohol at their parties. That's a little too nanny-ish for my tastes. We've got plenty of problems figuring out how to better educate our students and how to deal with declining state support for higher education while growing as a university without delving into micromanaging young adults' behavior outside of the classroom.

[GrayEagle]

Which houses have they paid to build? I am aware that they furnished the lots at nominal cost, but have they actually contributed toward the construction of any of the fraternity or sorority houses?

I'm not sure but $4.5 million would buy a lot of land and I believe that the university already owns that land. Either the university builds the fraternity/sorority house and leases it or the sorority pays it off after a down payment. I don't know of any chapter that can afford to purchase the land and house and loans would be hard to come by because the tenants are transient.

[Mean Green 93-98]

I'm not sure but $4.5 million would buy a lot of land and I believe that the university already owns that land. Either the university builds the fraternity/sorority house and leases it or the sorority pays it off after a down payment. I don't know of any chapter that can afford to purchase the land and house and loans would be hard to come by because the tenants are transient.

I lived in one of the houses on fraternity row, and I am confident that the university didn't pay a cent toward the house itself.

As far as the credit, I know that several of our local chapter's alumni signed off on the loan. I would imagine that's along the lines of what the other fraternities and sororities who have built since have done.

[UNTexas]

I'm not sure but $4.5 million would buy a lot of land and I believe that the university already owns that land. Either the university builds the fraternity/sorority house and leases it or the sorority pays it off after a down payment. I don't know of any chapter that can afford to purchase the land and house and loans would be hard to come by because the tenants are transient.

Dead wrong. The university didn't spend one cent on my fraternity's house. The fraternity owns the house.

[GreenBat]

Dead wrong. The university didn't spend one cent on my fraternity's house. The fraternity owns the house.

Does the fraternity you are member of own the land the house is sitting on?

[Mean Green Matt]

Does the fraternity you are member of own the land the house is sitting on?

If I remember right the university leases the land the houses sit on to the fraternity for $1/year as incentive to keep the fraternities under the jurisdiction of the NTPD. I could easily be remembering wrong though.

Edited February 19, 2013 by Mean Green Matt

[GrayEagle]

Dead wrong. The university didn't spend one cent on my fraternity's house. The fraternity owns the house.

You may very well be right but why would there be four and a half million dollars in the budget for 'sorority housing'? Any ideas?

[Mean Green Matt]

You may very well be right but why would there be four and a half million dollars in the budget for 'sorority housing'? Any ideas?

The University builds and owns the sorority housing I believe and then the sororities rent from the university. All sorority houses (at least for now) are connected with the exception of Chi Omega who are off campus.

[Cougar King]

Why don't you start with the time period after you received your NT rejection letter.

Are you f***ing retarded? I used to go there (and may come back to Denton for my Masters), so I obviously never gotten a rejection letter. Before I defected from UNT, my screename was Eagle Green.

Edited February 19, 2013 by Cougar King

[meangreener]

Are you f***ing retarded? I used to go there (and may come back to Denton for my Masters), so I obviously never gotten a rejection letter. Before I defected from UNT, my screename was Eagle Green.

So Cougar High couldn't get the job done academically and then you're coming back? Awesome, you'll be one of those people; the people that have no friends wearing other school gear on campus.

[Cougar King]

So Cougar High couldn't get the job done academically and then you're coming back? Awesome, you'll be one of those people; the people that have no friends wearing other school gear on campus.

I was actually pretty popular when I was at UNT. I had a way with words (which is proven on here too, considering that I can get just about any of you to respond to me) I also still keep in touch with a few friends/ex-roommates that are still UNT students. I'm also planning on making a trip to Denton this spring to do the Fry Street crawl. Similar to what I did when I went to San Marcos this past fall to visit my buddy at Texas State.

I SHOULD wear my UH gear when I make my return to Denton (whether it be when I visit in the spring or Grad school) but I'm probably not because I don't disrespect the school who's giving/gave me an education.

Edited February 21, 2013 by Cougar King

[PlummMeanGreen]

Are you f***ing retarded? I used to go there (and may come back to Denton for my Masters), so I obviously never gotten a rejection letter. Before I defected from UNT, my screename was Eagle Green

Masters of what ? Debators? By the way, CK, your next very important eye exam is this FRIDAY, 12 Noon ! !

(Report to Lenscrafters, Brazos Mall, Lake Jackson, TX--couldn't find one closer since all near the UH campus & beyond are (for whatever reasons) booked for the next 6 months non-stop). What's goin' on over there in Cougar Country anyhow?

[golfingomez]

soooooo... why is this still in the football forum?

[North Texas Shep]

I vote for UNT to ban the Greek system.

[North Texas Shep]

I make a joke ^^^ and get -3! Ha! you guys are sensitive.

[GrandGreen]

Drinking alcoholic beverages is a big dilemma for all universities. They can't really support or condone it, but at the same time they understand it is a part of most student's college experience. Banning beer at frats, yet allowing a big tail gating scene is a hard stand to defend. However, so is allowing 18 years old to fight your wars and denying the right to drink.

Back near the "stone ages" when I was a student, Denton was completely dry. Obviously didn't stop anyone from drinking. Being the closest bars were all about the same distance, Dallas, Fort Worth, Johnny's B-59 over the border in Oklahoma, and Muenster: I still wonder how my friends and I ever survived the trip to and especially back from these places. I think it is actually a lot safer now than in those days.