Boise staying in MWC

PlummMeanGreen · December 31, 2012

I have a hard time believing MWC is terribly interested in Tulsa, SMU, or Houston at this point.

They will take back SDSU unless they think they can lure BYU back.

I don't see any of them brining enough dollars to the table to make the travel worth the time and cost.

The question is will the rest of nBE stay together. I feel pretty confident that Memphis, Cincy, UConn, and Temple want to be together and want to add schools that help basketball because all four make too much off basketball to add just anyone. I see them pushing to look at schools like UMass, ODU, Charlotte, UAB and maybe Tulsa.

I'm not sure that what Memphis, Cincy, UConn, and Temple want is compatible with what Houston and SMU and maybe Tulane want.

The 2 Texas schools see TCU's Bowl Buster & B12 entry success and I think they see the Horned Frogs removing themselves from the rest of the Texas pack as a reason that was able to transpire---of course, one of several reasons for TCU's fortunes. IMHO, that reasoning and big time investments helped TCU get into the Big 12 albeit unfortunately for Frogdom I don't see UT and OU as long term keepers in the B12.

Only time I wanted UNT to even consider the MWC is if 2 or 3 or 4 other Texas or Oklahoma based schools formed most of what would have been a new "East Division" in the MWC; otherwise, stick with the more regional CUSA of which that is probably the real future of any of the Group of 5's eventual budget successes truth be told.

SMU and UH want into MWC for the reasons TCU did and (for the life of me) I'd wager to insure 2 other Houston and DFW based schools would not get surprise invites. (It's the NCAA among our Group of 5, folks, and anything is possible at this point to gain a supposed inside edge over others; Casepoint: Tulane and all 500 of their fans to the Big East if that sticks).

AND......... I would bet my New Year's Eve gig pay check on that reasoning from SMU and UH as a prime reason they'd want in the MWC; of course, probably not at the top of their list, but pretty darn close to it.

GMG!

Edited December 31, 2012 by PlummMeanGreen

Green Mean · December 31, 2012

Realistically, SMU and Houston could very well head to the MWC if they want to get another pesence in Texas. And it makes me crazy to think UTSA could very well be in the MWC and nowhere is there NT in those discussions or rumors.

Harry · December 31, 2012

It will be interesting to see if Houston and SMU stand pat or head out west. They should go back to C-USA but they won't because they don't want to deliver the "we went back to where we came from message"...to their fans bases...

The value of SMU and Houston in the Big East just went way down.

I think we will be ok whatever happens but my preference would be for SMU and Houston to stay in the Big East as opposed to heading out West. Heading out west is a biatch as they recall from the WAC -- also, don't know that Wyoming and CSU etc want another couple of TCU's to join and win the championship every year with Tejas recruits...

If they do head out west they could bring some with them but not too many because there would be too many mouths to feed given the money.. If they head out west does Big East backfill or become more concentric.

Worst case would be if they start their own conference because SMU would put a permanent UNT ban in the bylaws!!!

PlummMeanGreen · December 31, 2012

It will be interesting to see if Houston and SMU stand pat or head out west. They should go back to C-USA but they won't because they don't want to deliver the "we went back to where we came from message"...to their fans bases...

The value of SMU and Houston in the Big East just went way down.

I think we will be ok whatever happens but my preference would be for SMU and Houston to stay in the Big East as opposed to heading out West. Heading out west is a biatch as they recall from the WAC -- also, don't know that Wyoming and CSU etc want another couple of TCU's to join and win the championship every year with Tejas recruits...

If they do head out west they could bring some with them but not too many because there would be too many mouths to feed given the money.. If they head out west does Big East backfill or become more concentric.

Worst case would be if they start their own conference because SMU would put a permanent UNT ban in the bylaws!!!

And Northern Illinois in the Orange Bowl as a bowl buster as proof of your saying, Harry..... "I think we will be ok whatever happens."

As many have said for decades now: North Texas just merely needs to take care of North Texas (and all the good stuff will eventually happen).

Hellsbells folks! It's not that we haven't been there before in our history because there are some who cannot say that they have.

(I still defer to the rainbow colored signature below as a huge part of our past football legacy at North Texas)

GMG!

Edited December 31, 2012 by PlummMeanGreen

cdizzle86 · December 31, 2012

Realistically, SMU and Houston could very well head to the MWC if they want to get another pesence in Texas. And it makes me crazy to think UTSA could very well be in the MWC and nowhere is there NT in those discussions or rumors.

I'm not completely convinced the MWC would be a good move for North Texas. Obviously it wouldn't be horrible considering the competition, but distance and time zones would make it really hard for our smaller fan base.

Edited December 31, 2012 by cdizzle86

shaft · December 31, 2012

The value of ...Big East just went way down.

Corrected. SMU & Houston have very little to do with the discussion.

The MWC is looking at BYU, SDSU, UTEP in that order, then looking at SMU, Houston, and Tulsa.

The MWC and CUSA commssioners just need their members to hold tight, because the Big East is going to come calling. But if they can't get anyone to jump. SDSU will come back to the MWC, ECU & Tulane will ge the option to rethink their move. And Navy will say no thanks.

Now would be a good time for the ACC or Big 12 to make a move and but the the Big East out of its misery.

Edited December 31, 2012 by shaft

NT03 · December 31, 2012

To me , It will be most interesting to see where Tulane winds up after all the dust settles

NorthTexan95 · December 31, 2012

I wouldn't be surprised if the NBE survives as just an eastern league. Even if SMU and Houston go west but NBE may survive by pulling a few more CUSA teams. Personally, I wish the NBE would die but until it's official I won't hold my breath.

Tulane ... who kicked all this off ... could wind up in the Sun Belt. That would be a bummer for them.

Rudy · December 31, 2012

@JFowlerCBS: A MWC source says Texas schools have recently expressed interest in joining league. UTEP, Rice, Houston, UTSA could be in that mix.

That hurts.

Arkstfan · December 31, 2012

I don't doubt that Houston and SMU may well see MWC as more appealing than the nBE that is emerging, that doesn't mean MWC finds them appealing.

Look at the Gang of Five google map. With Boise back they essentially have become perfectly defended against anyone other than Pac-12 or Big XII. SDSU even remaining in nBE isn't sufficient lure to get a raid going. MWC has no need to do what Bankowsky did going to 14 whether it was for raw numbers or to appease widely spread out schools.

I suspect that MWC right now is likely thinking that UTEP makes sense and may look that way but where is the motivation for MWC to go after Houston, SMU, or Tulsa?

Pac-12 isn't going to add Hawaii or any Cali schools. Of the remaining MWC no one makes an even halfway decent fit other than UNLV and New Mexico. The Big XII might some day look at BYU but BYU is indy. The Big XII needs to deal with the WVU island, no MWC helps that.

If MWC ventures into the eastern 2/3rds of Texas or into Oklahoma, it becomes less stable. The distance will always have those schools looking for options. Hoping for Big XII (which isn't completely implausible for Houston) or a damaged ACC or something new forming with "peer" institutions within the region.

I don't think the added dollars offset the risk of losing them down the line or worse, losing some and being stuck with the rest.

Arkstfan · December 31, 2012

@JFowlerCBS: A MWC source says Texas schools have recently expressed interest in joining league. UTEP, Rice, Houston, UTSA could be in that mix.

Those schools have expressed interest. Doesn't mean the feeling is mutual.

10Eagle10 · January 1, 2013

For some reason, I keep getting the feeling that SMU will be the 12th member of the MWC. They're gonna follow in the footsteps of rival, TCU, in what they delusionally hope will lead them to their promised land (the Big 12)

I think San Diego State stays in the Big East with Connecticut, Cincinnati, Temple, South Florida, Central Florida, Houston, and Memphis. Tulane and ECU will still join in 2014; Navy will probably still join in 2015. That leaves one opening for their desired 12. the Big East is desperate, of course several CUSA teams are desperate too. Maybe New Mexico State finally gets their lifeline out of their dire situation. You gotta think their AD/president is working the phones with some conference out there...I can see BYU ending their football independence in 2015 and joining with Navy. Their Olympic sports will stay in the WCC and the Cougs will join the BE in football only. In this carousel we call realignment, the next two moves are here: 1) who is #12 in the MWC? (11 is a weird number) and 2) who is the new #12 in the future BE?

Contrary to an earlier post, I do not think the ACC or Big12 will toss a lifeline suddenly to UConn or Cincy. They haven't yet. What has suddenly changed with Boise State leaving that will force their (ACC/Big12) hand? Nothing. The Big 12 is in a good situation right now. At least the powers that be believe that, AND the money is good. Same with the ACC. They are just waiting to see if B1G/SEC are done. The power conferences are 3. B1G, SEC, PAC. Delany always starts the big moves...Penn State in the early 90s led to the SEC moves (SC and Arkansas) which led to the SWC/big8 merger, Big East moves (Miami, VaTech, etc) which eventually led to the ACC moves (Miami, VaTech, BC); the Nebraska move led to the next big wave by the PAC (Utah, Colorado), the SEC (A&M, Mizzou), Big East (too numerous), ACC (Pitt/Cuse/ND/Louisville), and the Big12 (WV, TCU). See Maryland for this current wave.The trickle down always follows from there. Hence, my two aforementioned moves. If there are to be BIG moves, look to Delany and the B1G

shaft · January 1, 2013

Let's just stop any talk of NMSU to the Big East.

The Big 12 is waiting to see how the Maryland $20 million dollar exit plays out. If ACC teams can get out of the mega payout Florida State and a buddy (Clemson, Miami, Virgina Tech) will jump to the Big 12. The ACC backfills with UConn & Cincy (but they may make the move earlier to control the damage).

The Big East is in a world of hurt. If they could get BYU, they would have done it already. No Boise, No BYU in the Big East.

If the Big East can't find another Western buddy for SDSU quick, the Azteks have an out to avoid exit fees.

If CUSA and the MWC can hold off the Big East the Big East will crack. SDSU won't join. SMU & Houston could both go to the MWC. Everyone else ends up back in CUSA.

Mean Green Matt · January 1, 2013

@JFowlerCBS: A MWC source says Texas schools have recently expressed interest in joining league. UTEP, Rice, Houston, UTSA could be in that mix.

Anyone think RV has even contacted the MWC?

GrayEagle · January 1, 2013

I'd bet a wrinkled $100 bill that Bankowsky added ODU and Charlotte to appease East Carolina. And where is ECU in 2014? Right where we knew that they'd be if they had the chance.

Let me say that I believe that long term both Old Dominion and Charlotte will be good, maybe even great, franchises. But, why did BB rush to judgment when seemingly everyone knew that ECU wouldn't be there for their future travel mates?

If he were trying to appease Marshall, I think that he should have picked up the phone and called Ohio or Toledo.

What's been done in the aftermath of the defectors is to make it difficult for any to return to CUSA. I doubt that any would want to unless and until Cincinnati and Connecticut move to other conferences. It could be very difficult to replace Cincy and UConn and without them there would be little reason to keep the group together.

Edited January 1, 2013 by GrayEagle

Aquila_Viridis · January 1, 2013

I don't expect anything but disappointment from the world of North Texas athletics anymore, so however it shapes up, it will probably be bad. I wish some people who could make a difference would take interest. Instead we still seem to have a bunch of clowns flailing around. I send about a thousand bucks a year down there. I can't really do more than that. I don't even know why I do it anymore. It's really hard to justify.

eulessismore · January 1, 2013

I don't expect anything but disappointment from the world of North Texas athletics anymore, so however it shapes up, it will probably be bad. I wish some people who could make a difference would take interest. Instead we still seem to have a bunch of clowns flailing around. I send about a thousand bucks a year down there. I can't really do more than that. I don't even know why I do it anymore. It's really hard to justify.

I plan on following womens' tennis. Maybe it was the call from the Easter European lady thanking me for being In the MGC. Hell, I've done a lot more for several people this year without a word of thanks. Hell, I may have saved someone's life; it was worth it though, not to see someone step in front of a train. No thanks for it, though. Makes me wonder.

Wag Tag · January 1, 2013

Corrected. SMU & Houston have very little to do with the discussion.
The MWC is looking at BYU, SDSU, UTEP in that order, then looking at SMU, Houston, and Tulsa.

The MWC and CUSA commssioners just need their members to hold tight, because the Big East is going to come calling. But if they can't get anyone to jump. SDSU will come back to the MWC, ECU & Tulane will ge the option to rethink their move. And Navy will say no thanks.

Now would be a good time for the ACC or Big 12 to make a move and but the the Big East out of its misery.

You r dead on. Whether the Big Easy Conf adds from Conf USA or Conf USA adds from Big Easy Conf UNT will be in a better situation. The key for us is regional competition. The d back recruit that just committed nailed it . He said he liked the facilities, the coaching and the regional conference games!

Dont want to loose UTEP or Tulsa , but we get Memphis and Tulane I would be OK with it.

Arkstfan · January 1, 2013

I may be reading them wrong but I don't believe SMU or Houston or Tulsa will have the opportunity to go to the MWC.

MWC has schools that saw up close and personal how bad it can be to have 16 teams. They listened to the TV experts who told them how big was going to be great. The scheduling was a mess and they soon discovered that taking the best 8 of the 16 would produce a TV contract that split 8 ways produced more money than the bigger one split 16 ways.

Boise left for Big East because of the promises that having so many great TV markets was going to produce great wealth and then saw the estimates after Louisville and Rutgers left. They were going to make about a million more but football was going to be in one conference in the East and South and every other sport was going to play 100% of its road conference contests in California, easily devouring the new money plus some more.

SMU, Houston, Tulsa? I'll wager that MWC has thrown those into the mix with the TV people and I doubt that the money justifies playing those out of region schools.

Also remember, the MWC schools also have very fresh memories of the TCU situation. When Utah left for the Pac-12, TCU the far outlier wanted out and because they had become conditioned to traveling like Marco Polo, they didn't hesitate to join the Big East.

TCU with great rosters rolled in and beat on them and got out of town as fast as possible. MWC as it stands today is impervious to being raided unless its the Pac-12 and right now no one has the full picture to be considered by Pac-12.

Anyone they add in Texas is a threat to be considered by other existing leagues or to get frustrated one day and strike out on their own to start something new.

Arkstfan · January 1, 2013

I'd bet a wrinkled $100 bill that Bankowsky added ODU and Charlotte to appease East Carolina. And where is ECU in 2014? Right where we knew that they'd be if they had the chance.

Let me say that I believe that long term both Old Dominion and Charlotte will be good, maybe even great, franchises. But, why did BB rush to judgment when seemingly everyone knew that ECU wouldn't be there for their future travel mates?

If he were trying to appease Marshall, I think that he should have picked up the phone and called Ohio or Toledo.

What's been done in the aftermath of the defectors is to make it difficult for any to return to CUSA. I doubt that any would want to unless and until Cincinnati and Connecticut move to other conferences. It could be very difficult to replace Cincy and UConn and without them there would be little reason to keep the group together.

Per someone who ought to know, the C-USA sequence went like this.

Ready to add UNT and only UNT but ECU and Marshall balked so FIU added to give eastern balance. Then Thompson informs Bankowsky he is about to put the WAC out of business and makes the same call to Benson and asks them to consider adding WAC teams to mitigate the damage. CUSA agrees to add UTSA and La.Tech. Sun Belt tells Benson we've been down the Idaho/NMSU path before... pass. Adding two more western schools gets ECU and Marshall upset so Charlotte and ODU become part of the mix.

Then Tulane and ECU leave and MTSU and FAU come into the mix, FAU because they help alleviate the travel to FIU and because Marshall wants them.

Harry · January 1, 2013

I may be reading them wrong but I don't believe SMU or Houston or Tulsa will have the opportunity to go to the MWC.

MWC has schools that saw up close and personal how bad it can be to have 16 teams. They listened to the TV experts who told them how big was going to be great. The scheduling was a mess and they soon discovered that taking the best 8 of the 16 would produce a TV contract that split 8 ways produced more money than the bigger one split 16 ways.

Boise left for Big East because of the promises that having so many great TV markets was going to produce great wealth and then saw the estimates after Louisville and Rutgers left. They were going to make about a million more but football was going to be in one conference in the East and South and every other sport was going to play 100% of its road conference contests in California, easily devouring the new money plus some more.

SMU, Houston, Tulsa? I'll wager that MWC has thrown those into the mix with the TV people and I doubt that the money justifies playing those out of region schools.

Also remember, the MWC schools also have very fresh memories of the TCU situation. When Utah left for the Pac-12, TCU the far outlier wanted out and because they had become conditioned to traveling like Marco Polo, they didn't hesitate to join the Big East.

TCU with great rosters rolled in and beat on them and got out of town as fast as possible. MWC as it stands today is impervious to being raided unless its the Pac-12 and right now no one has the full picture to be considered by Pac-12.

Anyone they add in Texas is a threat to be considered by other existing leagues or to get frustrated one day and strike out on their own to start something new.

I'm going to agree with you on this, the last thing that the Mountain West wants is a couple of Texas teams that will win all of their championships and dominate like TCU did. And Houston and SMU do not want to head way out west for games that don't finish until after bedtime. I am guessing they will either start a new conference or stick with the Beast.

Arkstfan · January 1, 2013

I'm going to agree with you on this, the last thing that the Mountain West wants is a couple of Texas teams that will win all of their championships and dominate like TCU did. And Houston and SMU do not want to head way out west for games that don't finish until after bedtime. I am guessing they will either start a new conference or stick with the Beast.

The bonus for UH and SMU is no urgency at this point. They can compete for the BCS berth next year and then slip away whenever it suits them.

Wag Tag · January 1, 2013

The bonus for UH and SMU is no urgency at this point. They can compete for the BCS berth next year and then slip away whenever it suits them.

Exit fee structure may be an issue.

Can't even imagine the nightmare to start a new conference. How could ESPN predict revenue? I think it is b East or MWC for SMU and Houston. Either way for SMU and Houston they will not have regional competition and will have different time zones with these conferences.

Arkstfan · January 1, 2013

There is going to be more urgency than people think... Lets not forget that the real doomsday clock is the ACC v Maryland court case. That will settle or go to discovery well before the UH/SMU BCS parade. They have some time, but lets not forget that if the ACC does die, UH and SMU have no real great geographical landing spot and no nBE and a potential full MWC if they wait.

The one that might get left at the altar in all of this is ECU. As petty as it sounds, their insistence of having more eastern CUSA squads and the move up of Charlotte and ODU and then their defection, ECU more than likely has rubbed many members the wrong way in all of this. If there was no ODU and UNCC to worry about, then many of the old members could slide right back into place. Presidents will remember that.

I don't buy the floodgate theory, it was cooked up by columnists who couldn't score well enough on the LSAT to get in law school.

Maryland did the math. Even with a $50 million buyout, the Big 10 made better financial sense. Now they are being prudent and trying to knock the number down but their move isn't contingent on winning the case. They already know the move is profitable.

Before the new buyout was adopted the Big XII and SEC purportedly had talks with ACC schools (supposedly SEC talked to VPI, NC State, UVA, UNC and the Big XII talked to Clemson and Florida State).

With a lower buyout in place the trigger didn't get pulled.

Maryland successfully suing to get a number that is lower than $50 million but likely higher than it was when those deals didn't happen isn't going to open the floodgates.

Right now the Big XII and SEC are locked into long-term deals and CBS basically rebuffed the SEC's request to bump the fees for adding TAMU and Mizzou.

Arkstfan · January 1, 2013

Laxtonto here's the rub.

Remember why WAC 16 broke up? Teams had to give up annual games against teams they wanted to play. Those games were essential to driving attendance and driving donations.

Let the SEC go to 16 and put an end to the Third Saturday in October, the Deep South's Oldest rivalry, and LSU-Florida and watch hell break loose.

Before Mizzou was selected to join, reports came out that Auburn had volunteered to go to the east division and the Bama fans blew up the internet and talk radio because it would have forced Bama to give up the Tennessee game to keep the Iron Bowl or vice versa and neither was acceptable.