The problem isn't heart or Benford

NT03 · December 22, 2012

We are actually only shooting 3% lower than the highest rated Belt team , WKU

WKU is ranked #161 in the country @ 43.7%

You could probably count on 1 hand the # of college coaches who would consider their team as " good shooting "

Heck , most NBA teams are poor shooting. It's becoming a lost art

NT03 · December 22, 2012

Hopefully the coaches and players are both learning from the past few weeks and are ready to start working together instead pulling in opposite directions. It takes a little give and take from both sides sometimes.

Bingo

GreenEggs&Ham™ · December 22, 2012

And UNT has a lack of people on the football team that can run into the endzone with the football in their hands. C'mon guys, puting the ball in in the basket is the most basic fundamental of the game of basketball. If UNT can't do that on the court, Benford cannot be blamed during his 1st season. There is no coaching around that. My suggestion is that UNT recruit outside the state of Texas for talent. It just doen't exist in large enough numbers down there to fill the roster.

I may go to the WKU game and watch UNT get there asses handed to them and watch first hand what you are seeing. Should be a floor mopping session for WKU and another embarassing day at work for me at my WKU alum dominated workplace.

island eagle · December 22, 2012

Bottom line....the worst shooting team I've ever seen at North Texas. You can blame the coach, but they had plenty of open looks against Lehigh and failed to either make them or try to make them. Lehigh made them with ease from the same locations with approximately the same amount of defensive pressure. It the players can't put it in the basket, no coaching scheme on earth will fix that at this level. The other teams quickly learn to crowd the inside and ignore our outside game....because we have none.

GreenMachine · December 23, 2012

What? It cannot be the players fault that they are not hitting their shots, can it? Surely it must be Coach Benford's fault. These guys were all such pinpoint shooters last year and all. Just how does a coach unt each a guy to shoot?

Getting old Kram, very old.

Edited December 23, 2012 by GreenMachine

KRAM1 · December 23, 2012

Getting old Kram, very old.

What? you calling me old? ...... old, huh, and, so is the stuff others are spouting here...just being the counter weight. The idea that this is all on Benford is inane. And, several of the NBA personnel on hand the other night seemed to agree. So, seems to be a split decision. You go your way and I'll go mine on this issue...OK?

Opinion board and all that.

CMJ · December 23, 2012

Yeah, it's so much better to point the finger at kids than a guy who is paid good money to get the best out of them. It's not like we've had an off night here or there that you can just throw up your hands and say the kids were missing (which happens to everybody). Our shooting has been horrendous basically all season.

Edited December 23, 2012 by CMJ

KRAM1 · December 23, 2012

Yeah, it's so much better to point the finger at kids than a guy who is paid good money to get the best out of them.

Nope..always good to point the finger at those responsible rather than making excuses for them because they are "kids", and then placing the blame on someone else. This "they are just kids" stuff is pretty lame. Even for someone who wants to place the blame every where else except on the ones actually responsible for executing what the coach is asking them to do. But, they are just kids.....

Look, I have said that it appears Benford is making a few rookie mistakes, but the idea that te way this team is playing is all on him is simply wrong. No one gets a pass here. Time for everyone associated with that team to get this figured out. They have the ability to do so...remains to be seen if they will.

Edited December 23, 2012 by KRAM1

CMJ · December 23, 2012

Nope..always good to point the finger at those responsible rather than making excuses for them because they are "kids", and then placing the blame on someone else. This "they are just kids" stuff is pretty lame. Even for someone who wants to place the blame every where else except on the ones actually responsible for executing what the coach is asking them to do. But, they are just kids.....
Look, I have said that it appears Benford is making a few rookie mistakes, but the idea that te way this team is playing is all on him is simply wrong. No one gets a pass here. Time for everyone associated with that team to get this figured out. They have the ability to do so...remains to be seen if they will.

I suppose no coach should ever be fired unless they're involved in some sort of scandal.

KRAM1 · December 23, 2012

I suppose no coach should ever be fired unless they're involved in some sort of scandal.

Not at this point and not for what is going on with UNT's men's team at the moment. Way way way too early. Not even close.

Unless, of course, there is that scandal thing you mention.

Problem is all the preseason hype that, yes, most of us clearly bought hook line and sinker. Looks to be a tad over sold...and maybe, just maybe some of these guys were reading too many of their own press clippings. These "kids" as you seem to want to refer to them as, may just not have had the maturity to handle it nor the maturity to work with a new coach who wishes to actually install an NCAA level playing strategy. So, nope...way too early. That's part of the problem...way too any folks calling for the guys head because they bought te hype hook line and sinker. BTW, not saying that I was not one who bought it..as I certainly did.

MeanMag · December 23, 2012

Not at this point and not for what is going on with UNT's men's team at the moment. Way way way too early. Not even close.
Unless, of course, there is that scandal thing you mention.
Problem is all the preseason hype that, yes, most of us clearly bought hook line and sinker. Looks to be a tad over sold...and maybe, just maybe some of these guys were reading too many of their own press clippings. These "kids" as you seem to want to refer to them as, may just not have had the maturity to handle it nor the maturity to work with a new coach who wishes to actually install an NCAA level playing strategy. So, nope...way too early. That's part of the problem...way too any folks calling for the guys head because they bought te hype hook line and sinker. BTW, not saying that I was not one who bought it..as I certainly did.

I don't think Benford should be fired at this point. He's figuring his shit out like the rest of the team.

The problem I have is if a NBA scout can watch a game for 10 minutes and say, "Benford doesn't know how to use Mitchell.", It makes me wonder who else Benford doesn't know how to use.

Getting Tony "touches" is not the same as getting him touches in his spot. I've seen him get "touches" at the top of the arch, and I'm going to bet that's not exactly where we'd want him to touch it on a possession. Does anyone on the team have a "spot" for that matter? Does anyone have an area where they are 50-80% effective that isn't at the free-throw line? Well, I haven't seen it. Is it because no one has their "spot"? (most players have at least a couple) They aren't getting to it (their spot) in the game? Or is it that Benford hasn't figured out where people are best and where to get them touches? Or is it that he pulls them before they get it going from one of their spots? The closest I've seen is Roger on his fade-away that has been fairly consistent. Alzee on his dribble drive that usually falls or draws a foul.

How about some more dribble penetration from some guards to get Tony some space, or someone else to a spot.

Hell if I know, I just would have thought that someone would have figured out something that works by now, especially a coach. You know, like Odufuwa/Trameil down low? Or Tristan on the top of the arc. Walton or Tyler Hall from deep. Josh white dribbling into the trees, or his floater at the top of the key that seemingly showed up every game. I hope they figure it out real soon, because I'll still make it to games, but it'd be a hell of a lot more fun to watch a competitive one than a boring one.

Like most people here, I don't mind watching a loss in basketball, but it really bugs me when we aren't even in the game.

Edited December 23, 2012 by MeanMag

greenminer · December 23, 2012

Let's all get some sleep. Tomorrow I'll start a new thread about where the blame lies, and we will solve this riddle by end-of-day.

CMJ · December 23, 2012

Not at this point and not for what is going on with UNT's men's team at the moment. Way way way too early. Not even close.
Unless, of course, there is that scandal thing you mention.
Problem is all the preseason hype that, yes, most of us clearly bought hook line and sinker. Looks to be a tad over sold...and maybe, just maybe some of these guys were reading too many of their own press clippings. These "kids" as you seem to want to refer to them as, may just not have had the maturity to handle it nor the maturity to work with a new coach who wishes to actually install an NCAA level playing strategy. So, nope...way too early. That's part of the problem...way too any folks calling for the guys head because they bought te hype hook line and sinker. BTW, not saying that I was not one who bought it..as I certainly did.

I am not quite advocating for Benford to be fired - but your argument that the players just need to hit their shots, coaches are putting them in position but their kids aren't listening, etc can be used against every underperforming team ever. I don't think you were ever onboard with firing Dodge either for that matter.

mean green d · December 25, 2012

I am not quite advocating for Benford to be fired - but your argument that the players just need to hit their shots, coaches are putting them in position but their kids aren't listening, etc can be used against every underperforming team ever. I don't think you were ever onboard with firing Dodge either for that matter.

It could be as simple as the coach trying to install a new offensive system with the parts that just aren't meshing.

He may just have to recruit his style of ballplayer to fit the system he is installing. Unfortunately, that may not be

the answer you want to hear because of the expectations. This system may not be the best for the type of player that was

hear when he arrived, but I do see it as an offensive system that is more team oriented. Johnnie's style revolved more along

isolation, whereas this seems to revolve on rotating the basketball with its many facets to get an open shot. Both can be effective with the talent it has on hand. It may take a class or two until we see the type of team ball you were hoping for.

GMG

dahbeed · December 25, 2012

1. Change of coaches and scheme can most certainly affect shooting percentages. When Ray took over for McDummy last year our percentages went up in every category. 2. You will shoot your best percentage of the year against us at Diddle Arena. It has a great shooters background. 3. Shooting is a lost art due to emphasis on the dunk and the 'dribble drive' offense trickling down to the lower levels. 4. If your team can install a press we're in big trouble. Caden Dickerson is out. TJ Price has been out for 4 games now. Jamal Crook broke his foot against Murray. Kevin Kaspar tried to play against Louieville but couldn't go. That's the top 2 point gods and top 2 shooting guards out. 5. Some of our fans are complaining about us looking 'rough' against Murray, and VCU, on the road and Louieville in Nashville. 6. I've never seen a UNT team play poorly in Diddle and don't expect it now. 7. Scandals don't necessarily get coaches fired. See McDummy in his parking garage escapades. One year of losing doesn't get them fired. Continued losing does get them fired.

UNT90 · December 25, 2012

2. You will shoot your best percentage of the year against us at Diddle Arena. It has a great shooters background.

Not to mention it's like a second home court to us...

Edited December 25, 2012 by UNT90

Green P1 · December 25, 2012

6. I've never seen a UNT team play poorly in Diddle

Well get ready to buddy.

emmitt01 · December 25, 2012

I don't think Benford should be fired at this point. He's figuring his shit out like the rest of the team.

The problem I have is if a NBA scout can watch a game for 10 minutes and say, "Benford doesn't know how to use Mitchell.", It makes me wonder who else Benford doesn't know how to use.

Getting Tony "touches" is not the same as getting him touches in his spot. I've seen him get "touches" at the top of the arch, and I'm going to bet that's not exactly where we'd want him to touch it on a possession. Does anyone on the team have a "spot" for that matter? Does anyone have an area where they are 50-80% effective that isn't at the free-throw line? Well, I haven't seen it. Is it because no one has their "spot"? (most players have at least a couple) They aren't getting to it (their spot) in the game? Or is it that Benford hasn't figured out where people are best and where to get them touches? Or is it that he pulls them before they get it going from one of their spots? The closest I've seen is Roger on his fade-away that has been fairly consistent. Alzee on his dribble drive that usually falls or draws a foul.

How about some more dribble penetration from some guards to get Tony some space, or someone else to a spot.

Hell if I know, I just would have thought that someone would have figured out something that works by now, especially a coach. You know, like Odufuwa/Trameil down low? Or Tristan on the top of the arc. Walton or Tyler Hall from deep. Josh white dribbling into the trees, or his floater at the top of the key that seemingly showed up every game. I hope they figure it out real soon, because I'll still make it to games, but it'd be a hell of a lot more fun to watch a competitive one than a boring one.

Like most people here, I don't mind watching a loss in basketball, but it really bugs me when we aren't even in the game.

Agree completely. This "they're just not listening" crap is ludicrous. There is a little thing called adaptation that good coaches do...you meld your system to the players you have. Anyone remember a guy named Cam Newton? The Carolina offense was tailored to suit his strengths and make him successful. When Dallas heads to Washington on Sunday you'll see RGIII run an offense that caters to his strengths. I'm fairly certain I never saw Shanahan putting his former QB's in a zone read offense or rolling them out of the pocket consistently...now why in the world could that be?

Of course the other option is we could blame the kids and allow the coach to be stubborn with this "my way or the highway" nonsense. That level of ego has served us so well around here in the past...just ask Dodge when you see him next in the athletic center or at practice.

Edited December 25, 2012 by emmitt01