Big East Catholic schools breaking away?

[Harry]

In what could be the first step towards the collapse of the Big East football/basketball structure, officials of the 7 non-football playing Big East basketball schools held a meeting in New York on Sunday to discuss breaking off on their own. According to sources familiar with the talks, the conference included not only athletic directors, but Presidents and Big East commissioner Mike Aresco as well.

A time frame of six months was set up to make a decision whether to break off on their own or continue to stay within the frame work of a conference whose configuration has changed steadily over the last several months. That time frame may be predicated on the nature of a new television football/basketball contract the Big East is currently trying to put together.

The group of 7 schools includes: Marquette, St. John’s, Providence, Georgetown, Villanova, DePaul and Seton Hall. Those schools are concerned about the defection of the core of the Big East basketball conference–Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Louisville and Notre Dame as well as the expansion of the conference in football to 12 teams and the inclusion of schools such as Central Florida, Memphis, SMU, Houston and Temple in basketball.

Read more: http://ajerseyguy.com/?p=4188

[H-towngreen]

Wow....never saw this coming

[island eagle]

As I've said before, the Big East is in danger of becoming the Big Least. A number of their members are re-considering their options.

[letsgiveacheer]

If those schools do leave to form the Katholic Konference, then this will not bode well for C-USA or whatever is left of it. I suspect the Big East will continue to cherry pick whatever they want from the existing CUSA.

[adman]

If those schools do leave to form the Katholic Konference, then this will not bode well for C-USA or whatever is left of it. I suspect the Big East will continue to cherry pick whatever they want from the existing CUSA.

I think it is just the opposite. The basketball schools taking off will kill the conference as a whole. Whatever TV negotiations are going on right now will be affected by this news. (Of course this report could be a tactic to increase the TV deal. "Hey, we'll stay if you bump the dough.")

This news makes it less and less attractive for the Houston's of the world to leave. No AQ status. Higher travel costs. Elite teams leaving. Less money than promised.

News like this is good for CUSA.

Ive said it before. The Big East and the ACC will both die sooner rather than later.

[GrayEagle]

This is a real can of worms. If they break off they take the NCAA basketball money because Cincinnati and Connecticut will be the only long-term members of the Big East. The TV deal would have to be renegotiated unless the two leagues formed a consortium continuing the contract as one entity.

This had been rumored for a long time but kept together in hopes that eventually Notre Dame might include football as well. When they took their basketball to the ACC that was the crowning blow. Two different schedules working within one "conference" doesn't seem very workable. This could be the final death-knell of the BEast.

[Harry]

If those schools do leave to form the Katholic Konference, then this will not bode well for C-USA or whatever is left of it. I suspect the Big East will continue to cherry pick whatever they want from the existing CUSA.

I understand why you would say this however -- this would no longer be the Big East and would have to reform a new conference. My understanding is that reforming a new conference could be VERY problematic due to the rules and the current environment. I will dig deeper into the details on this and let you know what I find out.

[Mean Green 93-98]

These schools may have power to dissolve the BE and take the name with them for a new no-football conference.

[letsgiveacheer]

I understand why you would say this however -- this would no longer be the Big East and would have to reform a new conference. My understanding is that reforming a new conference could be VERY problematic due to the rules and the current environment. I will dig deeper into the details on this and let you know what I find out.

Thanks for the note and I'll agree, if the basketball schools retain the name Big East Conference and kick the others out, its a different fox hunt altogether.

[outoftown]

These schools may have power to dissolve the BE and take the name with them for a new no-football conference.

Am not so sure about this. I get to thinking that dissolving might be a messy process if you want to take the name and money with you... after all these schools were part of the majorities that invited the new schools. I would gather that even if they can take the name with em, they would owe the new schools something. And what that exactly is might have to be fought out in court.

[outoftown]

These schools may have power to dissolve the BE and take the name with them for a new no-football conference.

Also i get to thinking, that if they can do this in the BE, couldn't the 'old' schools in CUSA do the same?

[Harry]

- The Big East basketball schools can dissolve and reform the conference as the "Big East"...they apparently have the votes to do it. They also would be allowed to keep their NCAA tourney credits that they earned. They also keep the important "continuity of membership" clause in place meaning that they have 6 schools which have been together for 6 years and that allows them the auto bid to the NCAA Tourney (not 100% sure about the number 6 on both counts but its close to that). They would have to distribute all of the funds in the bank account as part of the dissolution. The sticking point would be keeping the name "Big East" but they could throw some extra bucks at the football schools from the dissolution of funds to accomplish that. Once they reform they could add other basketball only teams like Creighton, St. Louis, Xavier etc...

- People think that losing Syracuse, Pitt, Notre Dame, Rutgers, Louisville etc is what broke the Big East basketball schools backs. That was a part of it, but the biggest thing was when the Big East lost their auto BCS bowl bid. That was a killer because the basketball only schools could stomach the new adds and the devaluing so long as the big check was still rolling in. That BCS autobid was worth millions to them and helped them to look past the weaker basketball additions and geographical challenges.

- The Big East Football Schools would have to reform a new conference or join an existing one. This is where it gets tricky. Reforming a new conference would require negotiation new bowl deals which is not too big a hurdle because most of the bowl agreements run out in 2013. They also would have to negotiate with the BCS to be included in the group of 5 again - which shouldn't be that big a deal either. The bigger issue is the "continuity of membership" on the basketball side of the fence...which is required for the auto bid to the NCAA tourney. There is no way they will meet that and to my understanding the NCAA will not allow for waivers on that. I also think another viable possibility is that the reformed Big East would invite Cincy, UConn to continue to participate in basketball as well further devaluing the new all sports conference in terms of TV money.

- So if the "Acme" all sports conference is formed after the Big East dissolves and reforms it would have a lot of hurdles to get over not withstanding the biggest issue being the devaluation of the TV money. I find it VERY hard to imagine that they would be able to negotiate TV money significantly better than what the C-USA and Mountain West offer. At that point, I see no way that Boise and SDSU stay -- it's just not worth it anymore and they would likely return to the Mountain West, perhaps with BYU joining the fray.

- Why would Houston, SMU ,Tulane want to travel all over the country in the Big East as opposed to a more regional conference map in C-USA? Their pride could get in the way and that is why I can envision a scenario where Craig Thompson and the Mountain West make a power play for those schools and perhaps a few others in Texas or possibly gulp even in Florida (UCF, USF). It would allow those school to not have to return to a conference that they already left which would be easier to sell to their fanbase. OR you could see these schools return to C-USA...which would make a lot more sense geographically speaking. I know this, Banowsky has open spots for those schools to return and is in dialogue with their decision makers about that possibility.

Timeline -- July 1 2013 is the deadline because that is when many of the new schools enter the Big East so it should happen well before that. It may not happen right away, because the basketball only schools have a lot of legal work to do to allow for the dissolution.

[outoftown]

Harry you seem to be pretty up to date with all those things: If CUSA wanted to make space to take former members back: what would it cost CUSA to get rid of ODU and charlotte before they even enter?

[Harry]

Harry you seem to be pretty up to date with all those things: If CUSA wanted to make space to take former members back: what would it cost CUSA to get rid of ODU and charlotte before they even enter?

I don't think they would do that... remember, EVERYTHING is being driven by TV contracts and TV Markets right now.

I think they see both as good additions based on that premise. And it would probably cost them a lot of money.

There is plenty of space in C-USA for all of the departed teams to rejoin. Heck it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility to have an 18 team conference with East and West divisions. It actually would make a lot of sense and be quite attractive to the networks.

The interesting thing is that CUSA is making their moves based on TV Markets and geographical rivalries or the potential of rivalries. Mountain West is more about established name programs with geography. What could throw a wrench into all of this is if the networks moved in another direction, perhaps looking for "actual subscribers" as opposed to TV sets...The Mountain West tried the subscriber theory with their network and it failed miserably. That said, things can change.

I see what you going at though ---- if C-USA were able to remove some of the "move-ups' would it make it easier for the departed schools to return? Probably. If I am a departed school and I had to move back, I would just simply explain that the promises of money and participating teams we received when we made the decision to move changed...it's really that simple. There is no shame on changing your mind when there's a bait and switch is there? All of the talk about distancing themselves from lessor teams, conferences etc was all talk -- the initial moves were mainly driven from money.

[emmitt01]

I think that, once the "cartel of five", decided to relegate the Big East to the kids' table that all of these dominoes were inevitably going to fall.

Just like the WAC, the Big East is in survival mode and won't pull it off.