Setting the record straight on Mac's recruiting

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

McNulty was injured

FirefightnRick · November 25, 2012

I'll trust the coach who offered them a scholly over Emmitt

Would that include the same coach who evaluated, recruited then offered Osborn a scholly to come here and play QB?

Awesome!

Rick

Edited November 25, 2012 by FirefightnRick

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

How'd that work for you with Todd?

I'm sorry, I'm confused. Are we talking about Dodge or Mac? The coach with no college experience or the coach with decades of college experience?

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

Would that be the same coach who evaluated, recruited then offered Osborn a scholly to come here and play QB?

Awesome!

Rick

OMG!!! The coach gave out a scholarship to someone who didn't start at his position!!! What a failure!!! That's a joke of an argument brah. Awesome!

emmitt01 · November 25, 2012

I'm sorry, I'm confused. Are we talking about Dodge or Mac? The coach with no college experience or the coach with decades of college experience?

No, we're talking about your lame attempt to take a shot at me personally, veiled within a "he's a coach...you're not" inference. And we're talking about how this "he knows more about football than a layman" argument has been employed by you, and others, since Dodge was here. So, in a way, we're talking about both men.

But, just to be clear, I have never been a college head coach. There, I said it. Likewise, I've never been an airline pilot...but if my flight starts to nose dive I'm gonna doubt the skill of the captain.

GoMeanGreen1999 · November 25, 2012

McNulty was injured

What was his injury?

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

No, we're talking about your lame attempt to take a shot at me personally, veiled within a "he's a coach...you're not" inference. And we're talking about how this "he knows more about football than a layman" argument has been employed by you, and others, since Dodge was here. So, in a way, we're talking about both men.

No, just more so pointing out that there is a huge difference between Dodge and Mac. So you're comparison is a pretty bad one. S if you want to lump together a coach that has decades of experience and a coach who had none then go for it.

Big Green · November 25, 2012

Alabama, K-State, do NOT rely heavily on JUCOS...that just isn't true.

Alabama has at least one Juco player that starts (Jesse Williams, #54) who will go in the first round in the NFL draft and there may be more as do other SEC schools. And yes, K-State does rely heavily on Juco players.

It seems like our most talented players come from either Juco or transfer, not HS.

Edited November 25, 2012 by Big Green

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

What was his injury?

Don't recall for sure. Want to say it was a ankle or wrist.

emmitt01 · November 25, 2012

No, just more so pointing out that there is a huge difference between Dodge and Mac. So you're comparison is a pretty bad one. S if you want to lump together a coach that has decades of experience and a coach who had none then go for it.

"Your"- As in YOU possess it

"You're"- As in YOU ARE

Carry on

FirefightnRick · November 25, 2012

OMG!!! The coach gave out a scholarship to someone who didn't start at his position!!! What a failure!!! That's a joke of an argument brah. Awesome!

Really? That's a joke of an argument when the same coach( more than likely, but I don't know for sure which coach it was exactly) used his same evaluation skills to bring in a second JUCO QB that everyone here is laying our entire future on his shoulders without seeing him play a single down of football?

Excuse me for being skeptical.

Rick

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

"Your"- As in YOU possess it
"You're"- As in YOU ARE

Carry on

Auto correct on an iPad. Carry on

FirefightnRick · November 25, 2012

No, just more so pointing out that there is a huge difference between Dodge and Mac.

Actually as head college football coaches, one has a .139 winning percentage and the other has a .397 winning percentage.

So if your into coaches with Best losing records you would be correct...there is a huge difference between Dodge and McCarney.

Rick

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

Really? That's a joke of an argument when the same coach( more than likely, but I don't know for sure which coach it was exactly) used his same evaluation skills to bring in a second JUCO QB that everyone here is laying our entire future on his shoulders without seeing him play a single down of football?

Excuse me for being skeptical.

Rick

If you want to judge coaches by players who don't make an impact as opposed to those that do, almost all would be considered failures.

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

Actually as head college football coaches, one has a .139 winning percentage and the other has a .397 winning percentage.

So if your into coaches with Best losing records you would be correct...there is a huge difference between Dodge and McCarney.

Rick

I give up. You and emmitt are right. I give up on Mac. I'm on board with y'all. What's the next step in the process? Get Mac fired and replace him with the next up and coming coordinator?

FirefightnRick · November 25, 2012

If you want to judge coaches by players who don't make an impact as opposed to those that do, almost all would be considered failures.

Ok, how about players that simply get in a game now and then? Would that in your opinion be fair to judge them on?

Rick

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

Ok, how about players that simply get in a game now and then? Would that in your opinion be fair to judge them on?

Rick

I'm on your side now. I agree with you. We haven't seem more wins these past few seasons. No improvement in the team. What are we gunning for here. What's our angle. Let me know what I need to do. I'm on board.

MDH · November 25, 2012

My biggest complaint has to do with QB recruiting. When we didn't land one last year you'd think there'd be a huge emphasis on getting one this year. I'm sorry, but Dajon Williams is not enough. He isn't a pure passing QB and many are already thinking he's going to be moved to another position. We're in the f'ing motherland of pass first QBs and have nothing on our roster to show for it. I'm tired of watching almost every other Belt, WAC & MAC school with a better QB.

If Brock gets hurt or isn't the real deal, we're so screwed and not just for next year. We've got to land a true QB. Hell, ULL landed 2 top 100 or 150 (position ranking) QBs last year if I remember correctly? I believe one or both were even from Texas.

Edited November 25, 2012 by MDH

shaft · November 25, 2012

Likewise, I've never been an airline pilot...but if my flight starts to nose dive I'm gonna doubt the skill of the captain.

Maybe that's the difference, I don't see this seaso as a nose dive, just a failure to takeoff.

Dodge destroyed this program. He didn't get D1 players, he didn't coach them up. We were a bottom 10 program.

Now Mac is starting over. He's already done more than Dodge ever did against stiffer competition.

9 wins in two seasons vs. 8 wins over the last four seasons.

SilverEagle · November 25, 2012

Hey lookit - EVERYONE is disappointed about this season. And yes, typically when you are having a down year you look to recruiting (or lack thereof) as a possible culprit. So it's a fairly normal thing to think about when you are scratching your head after a 4-8 season. What I am trying to say here is it's just not the case here in this situation with Mac...yet.

Another valid concern is why have we consistently gone so conservative in games. When you look at the pick six DT threw at the very beginning of the 2nd half I think you see the reason why.

Mac and his staff really recruit well in this upcoming class but it will likely not make a huge impact in the upcoming season because he likes to sign mainly high school recruits who he typically redshirts. He has some VERY key transfers coming in next season that we know of (Berglund at QB, Terrell at WR and Pegram at RB). The transfers could/should help immediately.

My primary concern with this team/program right now is defensive line. We have 6 guys who are redshirting on the d-line (Jerrian Roberts, Dutton Watson, Sir Calvin Wallace, Brad Horton, Dylan McDorman, Malik Dilonga). These are the guys who really have a chance to step up and make an impact next season. If Mac, or Skladany or Mike Nelson have any question about whether or not they can they better look long and hard at trying to infuse a Juco here or there. Not a lot mind you, but with Cantly and Obi graduating you need to fill some gaps.

To think that a freshman they recruit in this upcoming class could help immediately in the defensive line is a stretch. I know of very few who have here in the time I have been following the program. GMG

Harry, I too hope that this group turns out to be real contributors. Because Mac's first DT class didn't turn out so well. One didn't stay on the team more than a month before he left, and the other one (Thompson) was switched to OL. That left us with a net gain of 0 for that year for our DL future depth chart. Plus, I heard earlier in the year that Sir Calvin Wallace showed up to fall camp in terrible shape and pretty unmotivated. And a big deal was made of him "rededicating himself". Meanwhile one of our best DL's this year is an undersized Ryan Boutwell (originally recruited to play DE), who finally went down for a couple of weeks due to some sort of arm or shoulder injury( probably from having to go up against guys much bigger than himself for too long) toward the middle of the year.

Not a very impressive record so far for a coach that is supposedly known as a defensive line guru.

risinggreen · November 25, 2012

Ok...you have me on K-State, I am telling you, that is the exception. The teams that are good year in and year out are not building their rosters through JUCOS. The good teams TRADITIONALLY build through HS recruiting. That was my point

Yeah, but if we're not desperate for wins than who is? I'm all for bringing in a REASONABLE number of QUALITY JUCO'S at positions of need. The question is, can we attract quality JUCO'S, and is our conservative coach willing to even give it a try? Probably not.

GrandGreen · November 25, 2012

Not entirely sure how a game that NT should have won, but turned into a lost as the coach went ultra conservative morphed into a recruiting debate. Other than one poster opined that McCarney went into an offensive shell because he couldn't trust his team particularly his QB. I don't think that is the case, I just think McCarney is going to nurse a lead and today it backfired on him.

I agree with Harry that McCarney didn't go with the quick fix with JUCOS; but disagree that there is a lot of evidence that recruiting is improving. It is interesting to me that the people that defend the recruiting and think all is well continue to point to the "fact" that you really can't tell how recruiting is going until 3 or 5 years down the road. Therefore, either praise or damnation of the recruiting is meaningless, yet woe to anyone who indicates that recruiting is not going well.

I will state based on what little we as fans can see of recruiting, I am far from impressed with NT's progress. Not that NT is worse or hasn't improved to some degree but with the much ballyhooed better facilities, much better paid staff, and new conference; thus far there has not been any really discernible uptick in recruiting. Again no one can really tell for at several years, so I am hopeful after a couple of very successful CUSA campaigns that someone can point backward and say I told you so those early McCarney classes were the foundation of the upturn in NT football.

shaft · November 25, 2012

For the folks complaining about the lack of progress how do you explain more wins in the last two seasons than the previous four?

H-towngreen · November 25, 2012

For the folks complaining about the lack of progress how do you explain more wins in the last two seasons than the previous four?

Because Coach Mac is terrible and needs to go. We have seen no progress. I don't want to hear excuses like how we have 65 players who are freshman or sophomores or how we only had 6 seniors on scholarship. I'm tired of you and your excuses "oh, we won more games these last few seasons then the previous four".

Give me good reason why I shouldn't be on the emmitt and FFR "Fire Coach Mac" bandwagon!!

buff64 · November 25, 2012

Yeah, but if we're not desperate for wins than who is? I'm all for bringing in a REASONABLE number of QUALITY JUCO'S at positions of need. The question is, can we attract quality JUCO'S, and is our conservative coach willing to even give it a try? Probably not.

Coach, built Iowa St.'s football program into a contender by recruiting a large number of Jucos.