Setting the record straight on Mac's recruiting

Hunter Green · November 26, 2012

The question I have is not how / if he will recruit, but rather, do you play to win games? As someone stated in another post, I'd rather have Thompson throw interceptions trying to win the game, rather than us hunkering down trying not to lose. Let's go down swinging with what we have instead of wimping out and losing anyway. I mean, $hite! We're a 4 win team for crying out loud. Go for it!

UNT90 · November 26, 2012

I wish I had all the answers like so many of our experts. It just must be easy to recruit big time HS recruits to UNT right now given the record over the last few years. Our experts seem to think so. So, I am just scratching my head trying to figure out why Coach Mac and Company just load up on 4 and 5 star guys. This level of HS recruit just must be begging to sign with UNT right now. Simply amazing....

Complete Bulsh, Kram.

ULM gets it done. Kent St. Gets it done.

So sick of F'n excuses. If you can't recruit CUSA talent to UNT, you shouldn't be a coach in ANY of our athletic programs.

The inferiority complex is complete crap and nothing but an excuse.

aztecskin · November 26, 2012

I don't know what it means but DT threw 14 INTs this season. That is the most since 2009. I don't have any confidence in him, either.

I wonder what this team would have looked like under Canales. The offense is already much different-looking. There is a lot less shotgun and much less read-option. If DM is dictating the offense to MC then this explains the preference in QBs. If BO is really that terrible, or if the decision is to give playing preference to non-Juco guys, then this also explains it.

We will see next season when Andrew and Brock are options. The offense HAS to get better. 20.9ppg in the highest ppg season in FBS history is . . . subpar.

UNT90 · November 26, 2012

I don't know what it means but DT threw 14 INTs this season. That is the most since 2009. I don't have any confidence in him, either.

I wonder what this team would have looked like under Canales. The offense is already much different-looking. There is a lot less shotgun and much less read-option. If DM is dictating the offense to MC then this explains the preference in QBs. If BO is really that terrible, or if the decision is to give playing preference to non-Juco guys, then this also explains it.

We will see next season when Andrew and Brock are options. The offense HAS to get better. 20.9ppg in the highest ppg season in FBS history is . . . subpar.

Wow. No confidence in DT, yet you think McNulty is a FBS QB? You are setting yourslef up for a MAJOR disappointment if you are counting on McNulty for anything that doesn't involve the defensive backfield.

TheColonyEagle · November 26, 2012

And to set the record straight, I'm not calling for Mac to be fired. I'm simply skeptical of the future from what I've seen so far.

I think that's a good point. There seem to be two extremes here. I don't see anyone calling for Mac to be fired. But on the other side, for a coach to come in here and do the sales job he's doing, (And he is one sliver tongued SOB) and constantly talk about his skins and the coaches he's been under and the national championship team and the SEC etc., he puts himself out there to be scrutinized. ESPECIALLY after a performance like last Saturday. Then people start looking back and saying, "I hear ya Mac but let's just look at that record." Then you realize the numbers don't lie. And I'll add....if you think fans and alumni are getting a little weary of his talk....how long before recruits and players stop listening?

And I think the reason this seems to be hightened right now is because of the current college football lanscape. Chairs are shifting and our window is closing FAST. This program has EVERYTHING it needs to be successful. facilities, increasing support (in the middle of a piss poor product on the field BTW), and location. All that's left is wins and that lays solely on the feet of Dan MacCarney.

As for next season, we better hope Brock Berglund works out. If he does....I think we'll contend for CUSA. I truly believe Mac (and Chico) want a running QB. I think a running QB changes the dynamic of this team. But again.....like usual.....I'm hoping without any facts.

The only facts I have to give me any reference to this coach is his past W/L record. And it ain't great. My HOPE is he'll turn this thing around and turn it around in a hurry. (Like next year)

As others have pointed out. Programs with lesser support, lesser facilities, lesser money, lesser opportunity, lower recruit access have figured it out.

No excuse for us not to figure it out.

A LOT RIDING ON 2013.

Roadruner · November 26, 2012

Looking a Head – Did we paint ourselves into a corner

Everything is being evaluated – although it is hard to imagine Mc Carney changing course on a Conservative Offensive plan he has used throughout his career.

Does UNT need to open up its Offense a little? Does it have the personnel to do so?

Does a run against 9 in the box defenses- Run on first & second down approach that features tight ends really work in today’s spread Offenses featured in almost every High School in Texas – will this attract the recruits we need? All questions that need to be addressed by the Coaching Staff & AD.

Looking at the records – Last two at UNT 5 & 7 and 4 & 8. Record at Iowa:

Mc Carney stepped down as head coach after a 4–8 season in 2006.

Mc Carney finished with a 56–85 all time record.

We have lots of things to evaluate for a successful Football Future – This year and Next.

Hoping we get it all right this time – we need to win next year.

Edited November 26, 2012 by Roadruner

FroggyStyle · November 26, 2012

Once you guys actually start trying to win recruiting battles against us, Houston, SMU and Tech, you guys will start getting somewhere. If you notice the thing we four have in common, is the fact that most of our recruits have multiple BCS offers. We all have something to prove and aren't afraid to go toe to toe with the SEC and others for recruits. UNT needs to show that they have something to prove too and stop only going after guys with no other offers or a bunch of FCS offers.

And yes, I know we're a BCS school now, but of course we weren't that way before this year. We still have something to prove and will always have something to prove but before anybody respected us, we were out there earning and fighting for it.

Edited November 26, 2012 by FroggyStyle

Mean Green 93-98 · November 26, 2012

Once you guys actually start trying to win recruiting battles against us, Houston, SMU and Tech, you guys will start getting somewhere. If you notice the thing we four have in common, is the fact that most of our recruits have multiple BCS offers. We all have something to prove and aren't afraid to go toe to toe with the SEC and others for recruits. UNT needs to show that they have something to prove too and stop only going after guys with no other offers or a bunch of FCS offers.

And yes, I know we're a BCS school now, but of course we weren't that way before this year. We still have something to prove and will always have something to prove but before anybody respected us, we were out there earning and fighting for it.

Oh, we go after them . . . and don't get any of them. Then we go after the guys with no other offers. As bad a time as we had under Todd Dodge, at least he actually won some of those recruiting battles.

FirefightnRick · November 26, 2012

Once you guys actually start trying to win recruiting battles against us, Houston, SMU and Tech, you guys will start getting somewhere. If you notice the thing we four have in common, is the fact that most of our recruits have multiple BCS offers. We all have something to prove and aren't afraid to go toe to toe with the SEC and others for recruits. UNT needs to show that they have something to prove too and stop only going after guys with no other offers or a bunch of FCS offers.

And yes, I know we're a BCS school now, but of course we weren't that way before this year. We still have something to prove and will always have something to prove but before anybody respected us, we were out there earning and fighting for it.

Thank you.

BTW, how about a word concerning the youth movement Patterson had to deal with this year,.... R'S Freshman QB being inserted in the 5th game of the year,... 16 freshmen having to play significant time...etc..and most importantly.....NO EXCUSES.

Rick

UNTFan23 · November 26, 2012

FroggyStyle · November 26, 2012

Thank you.

BTW, how about a word concerning the youth movement Patterson had to deal with this year,.... R'S Freshman QB being inserted in the 5th game of the year,... 16 freshmen having to play significant time...etc..and most importantly.....NO EXCUSES.

Rick

The guys have exceeded expectations and done a spectacular job. Its unfortunate that Casey went out in such a way but I like what Trevon is doing under center. If Casey comes back in the Spring, it will be an interesting battle for the starting spot. Hopefully CGP stays and continues building us up and I can't wait for our bowl game. The Dallas Skyline glowed purple the night we beat SMU. We have truly arrived and can officially call ourselves DFW's college team.

You guys in Denton can have a bright future if you play your cards right. 2013 will answer a lot of questions about where this is heading. WIth conference re-alignment going on right now, this is UNT's last chance to get it right before history repeats itself reminiscent to the SWC debacle.

foutsrouts · November 27, 2012

The guys have exceeded expectations and done a spectacular job. Its unfortunate that Casey went out in such a way but I like what Trevon is doing under center. If Casey comes back in the Spring, it will be an interesting battle for the starting spot. Hopefully CGP stays and continues building us up and I can't wait for our bowl game. The Dallas Skyline glowed purple the night we beat SMU. We have truly arrived and can officially call ourselves DFW's college team.

Not true. You are and will always be Fort Worth's team at best. I'm not denying your recent success, but at the end of the day you will still only be TCU. DFW as a whole barely even has a football team these days with the perpetual "suckiness" of the Cowboys. Somehow I don't think you will be filling that void should that "suckiness" continue.

Green Dozer · November 27, 2012

Not true. You are and will always be Fort Worth's team at best. I'm not denying your recent success, but at the end of the day you will still only be TCU. DFW as a whole barely even has a football team these days with the perpetual "suckiness" of the Cowboys. Somehow I don't think you will be filling that void should that "suckiness" continue.

Lots of folks wearing Frog gear that have no TCU ties in the Metroplex. People like a winner. Will never approach Cowboys level, but they are ahead of us and SMU as for as getting the casual fan to follow them. Even met a couple at the PAris Coffee Shop, near TCU that are TCU season ticket holders. Guess where they met and went to school? North Texas

PlummMeanGreen · November 27, 2012

As I recall a hand full of us last Summer suggested Coach Mac might have a 2'nd year let-down in Denton with wins/losses.

Its happened before in Denton for another coach who our present HFC emulates with even a photo of that coach on

his office wall.

Recruiting? If we are not recruiting 3 or 4 star recruits we need to make darn sure those we are recruiting have

FBS level speed and for linemen some quicker than hell feet with growth potential in the weight room. Texas

has more kids who play Texas HS football than any state in the USA. That is a plus for a coaching staff

who can evaluate talent and I believe that is what Coach Mac is shooting for as he will probably continue to

tweak his staff.

Recruiting Gems: UNT has a most diversified ethnic student body & have since the school first integrated traditional caucasian colleges

in the South and Southwest in the mid 1950's. Denton has more co-eds than any university town in Texas combining co-eds from UNT and TWU and

say what you say, that is a plus among Texas HS football players when they visit a college town and.........what the heck, Rand-McNally just named

Denton, Texas, American, the most fun small city in the USA. (Not sure a city of close to 120,000 should be called a "small city" though).

NT academically is no Harvard but neither are most other school in the Lone Star State (including a handful who think they are)

but what we do have is the most comprehensive university with its more graduate and undergraduate programs than any school this side of Austin, Texas.

And with all that happenign at a campus that most of us older alums all but need maps to get around where new mega-million facilities abound.

So we really do have selling points at UNT for those who do the selling and anyone who takes a walking tour of our campus who is affiliated with

UNT can see and feel the synergy themselves. At some point, the benefits of UNT, Denton & Denton Country's growth will be seen by all once

the winning begins again and we all know that that cycle will return.

GMG!

PS: From a handful of you, thanks for the PM's. My DJ business is going strong as I've been booked 14 of the last 18 Saturdays.

www.soundworksdeejay.com

Edited November 27, 2012 by PlummMeanGreen

foutsrouts · November 27, 2012

Lots of folks wearing Frog gear that have no TCU ties in the Metroplex. People like a winner. Will never approach Cowboys level, but they are ahead of us and SMU as for as getting the casual fan to follow them. Even met a couple at the PAris Coffee Shop, near TCU that are TCU season ticket holders. Guess where they met and went to school? North Texas

Sure, I agree that Ft Worth is definitely behind them big these days, but I don't see a HUGE buzz about them in other areas of North Texas. Shear numbers and strong loyalties are likely to keep the Horns and Aggs up at the top of the DFW college football heap for the foreseeable future. SMU doesn't even register on the meter, and unfortunately we seem to be heading that direction ourselves. Time to win.

UNT90 · November 27, 2012

Not true. You are and will always be Fort Worth's team at best.

Hell, I'd kill to be Denton's team right now.

Fort Worth will be bigger than Dallas population wise by the next census. I see people every Friday wearing purple, and their only connection to TCU is going to a game every now and then. TCU has done a great job of making Fort Worth love them, not just TCU grads.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · November 27, 2012

Look, you have to repect TCU for what it did once Texas dumped it and it got left behind politically in favor of Texas Tech and Baylor.

But...

...in the Big 12, TCU is what it is - middle of the pack. And, it will stay that way as long as the competition is tougher. If TCU is lucky, it becomes just another Texas Tech in the FBS, winning enough to get to bowl games every year, occasionally winning a game or two along the way that it shouldn't.

Who cares?

cl_1_2008 · November 27, 2012

Look, you have to repect TCU for what it did once Texas dumped it and it got left behind politically in favor of Texas Tech and Baylor.

But...

...in the Big 12, TCU is what it is - middle of the pack. And, it will stay that way as long as the competition is tougher. If TCU is lucky, it becomes just another Texas Tech in the FBS, winning enough to get to bowl games every year, occasionally winning a game or two along the way that it shouldn't.

Who cares?

Really? Middle of the pack? I completely disagree with this. They were middle of the pack this year, but they are extremely young, and their best player got suspended. Their football program is already AT LEAST on par with Texas Tech, if they haven't surpassed them. Now that they're in the Big 12, they're only going to get better.

UNT90 · November 27, 2012

Really? Middle of the pack? I completely disagree with this. They were middle of the pack this year, but they are extremely young, and their best player got suspended. Their football program is already AT LEAST on par with Texas Tech, if they haven't surpassed them. Now that they're in the Big 12, they're only going to get better.

You are correct. TCU has a great advantage over the UT's and OU's. Small, private school with a better education. Fort Worth is an easy city to sell to recruits. TCU was 8-4 this year with a win over UT and is as young as we are.

Their future is very bright in the Big 12.

Did I mention they are one of the few teams left in the Big 12 that actually play defense?

houstonmeangreen · November 27, 2012

I wish I had all the answers like so many of our experts. It just must be easy to recruit big time HS recruits to UNT right now given the record over the last few years. Our experts seem to think so. So, I am just scratching my head trying to figure out why Coach Mac and Company just load up on 4 and 5 star guys. This level of HS recruit just must be begging to sign with UNT right now. Simply amazing....

Well, we will see next year...if we lose to UTSA, I think that says it all as far as MAC's progress...that is when I would give him the boot...after that game, b/c I would now know he was the guy...move on...UTSA make for a great comparison.

Stop camparing Mac to Dodge...Dodge was a no go in my opinion from the start.

Edited November 27, 2012 by houstonmeangreen

The Fake Lonnie Finch · November 27, 2012

You are correct. TCU has a great advantage over the UT's and OU's. Small, private school with a better education. Fort Worth is an easy city to sell to recruits. TCU was 8-4 this year with a win over UT and is as young as we are.

Their future is very bright in the Big 12.

Did I mention they are one of the few teams left in the Big 12 that actually play defense?

Tech beat them. And, Iowa State. The screwed around past powerhouse Kansas.

They'll be perpetually mediocre in football and atrocious in basketball.

As I said, you have to give them credit for dominating the crappy conferences they were in before. It allowed them to don the veneer of worthy entry into a better conference. They're a great example of making lemonade out of lemons.

tylermeangreen · November 27, 2012

Well, we will see next year...if we lose to UTSA, I think that says it all as far as MAC's progress...that is when I would give him the boot...after that game, b/c I would now know he was the guy...move on...UTSA make for a great comparison.

Stop camparing Mac to Dodge...Dodge was a no go in my opinion from the start.

Well, seems to me you are now two-for-two based on your many postings I have read during and since the Dodge years - you now feel obligated to rip not only Dodge but also McCarney.

You and several others on this board have the same approach and attitude - Emmitt; Mo Green; "Rick" ; there are others - Jeez, it gets old!

Believe me, in my book you are starting to lose your credibility/objectivity - no, let me amend that - you HAVE lost your credibility/objectivity - given this posting, along with your past "the sky is falling" postings. Remember the old story about "Chicken Little"?

McCarney has had two friggin' years to turn around this team - a team that was LOUSY in the year or two to prior Dodge, much less the futility of the Dodge-years. I don't know whether McCarney will turn it around next year or not. But, might I add, neither do you.

Should the AD follow your advice and tell McCarney to "move on" maybe you will then feel motivated to offer your services re: the selection of the next coach at UNT.

I really would like to see us get someone of whom you and the rest of this board's naysayers approve and will not be ambushing after two years.

Jeez!

FirefightnRick · November 27, 2012

Well, seems to me you are now two-for-two based on your many postings I have read during and since the Dodge years - you now feel obligated to rip not only Dodge but also McCarney.

You and several others on this board have the same approach and attitude - Emmitt; Mo Green; "Rick" ; there are others - Jeez, it gets old!

Believe me, in my book you are starting to lose your credibility/objectivity - no, let me amend that - you HAVE lost your credibility/objectivity - given this posting, along with your past "the sky is falling" postings. Remember the old story about "Chicken Little"?

McCarney has had two friggin' years to turn around this team - a team that was LOUSY in the year or two to prior Dodge, much less the futility of the Dodge-years. I don't know whether McCarney will turn it around next year or not. But, might I add, neither do you.

Should the AD follow your advice and tell McCarney to "move on" maybe you will then feel motivated to offer your services re: the selection of the next coach at UNT.

I really would like to see us get someone of whom you and the rest of this board's naysayers approve and will not be ambushing after two years.

Jeez!

So people can't be pissed about an 8th straight year of losing, and if in our 9th we lose to the RoadCokers we're suppose to remain happy about it?

Can you drop your expectations any lower?

Rick

hickoryhouse · November 28, 2012

shaft, no one is disputing he has better records.

I think where every one disagrees is at what height should the bar be set?

I'm pretty skeptical about getting to win 7+ games with Coach Mac. His recruiting, while addressing the JUCO problem, has not really been light years above anything we've seen before.

If you're okay with this consistency at 4 - 6 wins, then we'll just have to agree to disagree. I thought we were all hoping to build something that meant 7+ wins every season.

I am reading this late, but don't have the patience to get to the end of the thread before commenting....

What was the timeline given for DM success when TD was fired? how long did we think that it would take? anyone willing to do that research on the board? I would feel very comfortable saying that most people thought, similar to how we thought after DD, that it would take a few years to dig us out of this hole that has been dug for us. DM has done great compared to the filfth that we have been watching for the previous 5... no no no ... 6 or 7 years?!?!?!?!?!?

I don't give him a pass on in game decisions nor do I give him a pass on not addressing key personnel issues but the man has done more with what many deemed "scraps" or a bare cupboard than were immediatly thought.

This time last year we had high hopes and bright outlooks. i still do. I see a coach who doesn't look like a fake, who holds himself up as a real D1 coach with real tallent and real skins. He even has a Nation Championship ring to show for it if I am not mistaken.

Take yourselves back to three years ago... take yourselves back to that great win at Ball St............ Ball St.... what an amazing win that was! what a horrible level our program was at. how low was it then, how deep did we get, how hard is it going to be to climb back? patience is a virtue that few posess (sp), do we have it as a fan base? can we take ourselves back to where we were?

i think that we have made progress, we have an actual S&C coach now... a staff with actuall skins on the wall and the facilities to back up the faith that we have in them.

UNT90 is right, next year is the measuring stick, it is the test. Next year we get most of the way past the recruiting hole left to us, we have years to sell the new stadium and years to implement the new DM system. He deserves 3 years before a cross is built with his name on it.