If we play usta in the Alamo City

Monkeypox · November 9, 2012

SMU will never have a rivalry with us. They don't give a damn about North Texas. A rivalry is based on geography, a competition for the same goals, and history. Not just WISHING it so.

CurveItAround · November 9, 2012

...A rivalry is based on geography, a competition for the same goals, and history...

Just for grins, which of your three required components do you feel we don't satisfy with SMU?

Monkeypox · November 9, 2012

...A rivalry is based on geography, a competition for the same goals, and history...

Just for grins, which of your three required components do you feel we don't satisfy with SMU?

History and competition for the same goals. We have no historical rivalry with SMU, no matter how much people here want to make it the case. They actually don't care about us at all, and that's fine. I can't seem to care much about SMU, either. They're not in the same conference that we're in, nor have they been. History doesn't mean "We've played each other a bunch because we're in the same state." It means that you played each other a bunch in games people cared about.

The move to a more regional conference should help us develop a natural rivalry over time... OVER TIME.

Edited November 9, 2012 by Monkeypox

TheWestie · November 9, 2012

Most exciting thing about road trip game to San Antonio?

Czech Stop kolaches in West.

Someone better let them in on how much dinero they can make by having some kind of UNT stuff that weekend.

Green P1 · November 9, 2012

I can't wait for our first roadie in the Alamo City. I will be planning some historically significant fun.

CurveItAround · November 9, 2012

Fair enough. It seems to me there is plenty of dislike on our side towards them. Maybe one day they can develop an intense dislike for us too.

SMU/TCU

Louisville/Kentucky

South Carolina/Clemson

Florida/Florida St

Texas/OU (pre Big XII-II)

Many, many more, but off the top of my head these are a few rivalries that do not/did not involve conferenc foes (although some were once or are now)

I think you just start out scheduling a series and hope that eventually some bad blood develops. Of course, we will have to start being more competitive than we have in the past.

I can already tell that it won't take long for me to dislike LaTech and their arrogant messageboard fans, so we got that working for us.

Edited November 10, 2012 by CurveItAround

ForneyGreen · November 9, 2012

It's not that uncommon to have a rival that is not in the same conference so it could work. SMU would be at the top of the list for me too in terms of who I would rather see us beat.

Add'l TX schools

TxSt --------28-6-3
UH ----------7-7
TTech ------4-4
TCU --------2-16
Texas ------1-8
Tx A&M ----0-7

I fixed the Texas record for ya - I'm counting 1988 as a win for UNT :-)

I think all of Tulsa, UTSA, and La Tech will be natural rivals for UNT. I know some folks from Tulsa, and they are really looking forward to forming a rivalry with UNT. They've wanted us in CUSA for a long time.

Mean Green 93-98 · November 9, 2012

SMU will never have a rivalry with us. They don't give a damn about North Texas.

The first sentence may be true, the last sentence not so much. There are plenty of SMU fans who passionately hate UNT. And there are actually some I've known who root for UNT on the side. The main reason SMU wasn't crazy about playing us is because they've always felt they had a certain level of separation from us. If we were to start playing them--and beating them--that separation could gradually erode.

I think the two schools' disparate level of success the past 3-4 years and SMU's impending move to the Big East may have granted them a certain level of comfort. But if we were to start beating them (Woody Wilson, where are you?), I guarantee a rivalry would spring up between UNT and SMU, whether or not they wanted one.

Monkeypox · November 10, 2012

The first sentence may be true, the last sentence not so much. There are plenty of SMU fans who passionately hate UNT. And there are actually some I've known who root for UNT on the side. The main reason SMU wasn't crazy about playing us is because they've always felt they had a certain level of separation from us. If we were to start playing them--and beating them--that separation could gradually erode.

I think the two schools' disparate level of success the past 3-4 years and SMU's impending move to the Big East may have granted them a certain level of comfort. But if we were to start beating them (Woody Wilson, where are you?), I guarantee a rivalry would spring up between UNT and SMU, whether or not they wanted one.

There are also plenty of fans who don't feel anything at all about UNT, like most of the country. Just because you know a few people who love or hate UNT, or because a handful have had message board wars when they so desperately needed attention, doesn't mean that's reality. SMU doesn't think about us at all, unless we try and make them. They have a historical, long-standing rival with TCU. They have some older rivalries with the other old SWC conference mates. There is no situation outside of us being in the same conference with them and playing in important games that will make them a rival. And even then, we'd still be #2 to TCU. That's just how it is.

If you're going to wish for a rival, at least make it between some schools who 1) Don't already have one and 2) Have a potential for playing meaningful games with us.

If we were to start beating them, they'd stop scheduling us. It wouldn't form a rivalry.

FroggyStyle · November 10, 2012

UTSA fans think we are arrogant (I am very arrogant), talk down (yep), and trying to keep them down. That is pretty much a rivalry right there. Don't think of it as Rival = Equals. It is more WANT THEM TO LOSE SO BADLY.

1. There is no reason for UNT to be "arrogant".

2. UNT is not trying to keep anybody down.

3. You have absolutely no idea what a rivalry is.

Mean Green 93-98 · November 10, 2012

There are also plenty of fans who don't feel anything at all about UNT, like most of the country. Just because you know a few people who love or hate UNT, or because a handful have had message board wars when they so desperately needed attention, doesn't mean that's reality.

I don't think you're quite aware of what SMU's reality is. Do they obsess over UNT? For the most part, no. But being just down the road from UNT, they are very aware of what UNT is doing, unlike the rest of the country. And yes, there are plenty of SMU fans who absolutely loathe UNT. That's reality.

They have a historical, long-standing rival with TCU. They have some older rivalries with the other old SWC conference mates. There is no situation outside of us being in the same conference with them and playing in important games that will make them a rival. And even then, we'd still be #2 to TCU. That's just how it is.

If you're going to wish for a rival, at least make it between some schools who 1) Don't already have one and 2) Have a potential for playing meaningful games with us.

I'm not saying any rivalry that we would have with them would ever surpass their rivalry with TCU. But since when is a team limited to one rival? Does Georgia not have a rivalry with any SEC teams because they already have a rivalry with Georgia Tech? Every team on Notre Dame's schedule is a huge rivalry. Plenty of teams are that way--we're just not one of them. Not yet, anyway.

As far as "meaningful"--it's college football; every game is meaningful. Throw in the geographical closeness, the awareness each school has with the other, the fact that their alumni work together, etc. . . . I guarantee you, it was a VERY meaningful game to SMU when they played us in 2007, and had to avenge the previous season's loss. Our basketball game with UTA is a meaningful one every year . . . I might even be so bold as to call it a rivalry game . . . why? We are not in the same conference with them. One basketball win or loss is not as significant as in football. But we share geographical proximity, and each team has beaten the other.

If we were to start beating them, they'd stop scheduling us. It wouldn't form a rivalry.

We've already got them scheduled for 4 seasons. And I don't think they'd quit scheduling us if we started beating them . . . they'd make sure they beat us last, and then maybe quit scheduling us.

Edited November 10, 2012 by Mean Green 93-98

Green Mean · November 10, 2012

1. There is no reason for UNT to be "arrogant".
2. UNT is not trying to keep anybody down.
3. You have absolutely no idea what a rivalry is.

This. And for that matter my opinion is that nobody should be arrogant and keep anybody down.

And as someone else said in this thread that you can't and shouldn't force a rivalry. A great college rivalry takes a lot of time to develop so let's just go with the flow and see what happens over time. For the time being we can just take advantage of the nice teams that are close to us and people have actually heard. UTSA is an obvious attraction since that gives you a reason to make a weekend or long weekend out of it. SA caters to every types of people with it's tourist attractions.

GL2Greatness · November 10, 2012

1. There is no reason for UNT to be "arrogant".
2. UNT is not trying to keep anybody down.
3. You have absolutely no idea what a rivalry is.

actually there are plenty of fans on this forum that would love to avoid games with UTSA and TxState until they "pay their dues" which seems to mean suck for a decade and a half in crappy conferences that you are begging other conferences to get out of as fast as you can so you can start bad mouthing them as well

I gagree with points 1 and 3 though

shaft · November 10, 2012

Logo and branding does not make a rival.

So Michigan and Delware don't hate each other?

aztecskin · November 11, 2012

1. There is no reason for UNT to be "arrogant".
2. UNT is not trying to keep anybody down.
3. You have absolutely no idea what a rivalry is.

1. Lists are fun

2. "UNT" as an institution of learning or sport isn't trying to keep anyone down. I was referring to the feeling among UTSAers about this board in particular.

3. The above has been perceived as arrogance. Also my own particular vocalized disdain for UTSA's Convocation Center has been characterized as such.

4. Sure I know what a rivalry is.

We can debate the boundaries of the word, sure. If we take the definitions offered in this thread our rival should either be a Sun Belt opponent or a Texas school yet we have neither.

I've been a North Texas fan for about six years now. I can't think of any other schools that I can squeeze into any definition of rival than SMU. I don't even hate 'em. I just know that they are mildly aware of us and have taken even the smallest of jabs at us. TCU? I guess. They are too good to care about. We can't compete for the same goals.

This is why UTSA intrigues me. Two big city schools, DFW v SA, new program v old program, big mouthed fans of new squad v annoyed fans of long-suffering squad, 30-ranked income vs 51st ranked income, big market vs small market, etc.

After re-thinking things, I think I'd really like to get Rice back for that 77-point game, though.

UNT90 · November 11, 2012

I think either weekend around the first week of November is better. Then the Mean Green fans can join me at Wurstfest!!

Yep, would much rather stay in New Braunsfels and drive in for the game then stay in the wildly overrated city of San Antonio.

And UTSA is not our rival. Let's try and have an ounce of self-respect, shall we?

Cerebus · November 11, 2012

Regional rivalries develop because the fans of the teams work together, know each other, etc... It would be nice to develop an in state OOC rival in addition to conference foes with teams that have alumni in the area.

UTEP probably has more alumni in DFW than any other school in CUSA... except of us of course. Yet they seem to be forgotten when it comes to rival talk. I know its a long drive to EP (but its a short/cheap flight), but I think a lot of fans are going to be surprised at how many Miner fans show up at Apogee/the Super Pit.

Mean Green 93-98 · November 11, 2012

Yep, would much rather stay in New Braunsfels and drive in for the game then stay in the wildly overrated city of San Antonio.

And UTSA is not our rival. Let's try and have an ounce of self-respect, shall we?

Sorry, bud. Meant to give you a +1, but hit the wrong arrow. If a couple of you would be so kind . . .

meangreener · November 11, 2012

Yep, would much rather stay in New Braunsfels and drive in for the game then stay in the wildly overrated city of San Antonio.

And UTSA is not our rival. Let's try and have an ounce of self-respect, shall we?

San Antonio is such a joke of a city. It's the Riverwalk...and that's it...gets old after one time.

Edited November 11, 2012 by meangreener

Green Mean · November 11, 2012

San Antonio is such a joke of a city. It's the Riverwalk...and that's it...gets old after one time.

I think it's a decent weekend trip. I tend to always say the same thing as you but every time I've gone there for a weekend or what not I always find a way to enjoy myself and have a great time.

Eastwood Eagle · November 12, 2012

San Antonio is such a joke of a city. It's the Riverwalk...and that's it...gets old after one time.

False.

UNT 90 Grad · November 12, 2012

San Antonio is such a joke of a city. It's the Riverwalk...and that's it...gets old after one time.

You obviously haven't been to the basement at the Alamo then.

shaft · November 12, 2012

I hope we play UTSA during Fiesta and Tulane during Mardi Gras, but we won't.

UNT is taking over SMU's CUSA schedule, and UTSA is taking over Houston's so we will play UTSA in mid-October.

And our every other year trips to El Paso, Houston, San Antonio, Tulsa, New Orleans, and eventually Ruston will all be better than any Big West or Sun Belt trips we made over the last twenty years. (Except for maybe Lafayette, because I love me some fried turkey.)

Edited November 12, 2012 by shaft

UNTexas · November 12, 2012

The rivalry banter is silly. Arguing with trolls like FroggyStyle is silly as well.

I am just looking forward to road trip weekends next football season to Houston, San Antonio, Tulsa, El Paso, ect... The beer will flow like wine.

The San Antonio trip is going to be great. I am really happy we will get to go down there to play. Stay downtown, eat to much, drink to much, and watch football. It will be really fun. Especially if they give me free KFC! Genius!

SilverEagle · November 12, 2012

North Texas has had few, if any, rivalries in it's athletic history.

During the 40's it was mainly East Texas State. (now A&M commerce).

http://texashistory....ast texas state

In the early 50's we seemed to have a rivalry with Midwestern State in WF. And we had a trophy attached.

http://texashistory....hits/?q=rivalry

http://texashistory..../166/?q=rivalry

nothing was mentioned about a rivalry in any of the Yuccas after 53.

The closest thing to a rivalry that we had in the 60's was Tulsa. And that was only for a couple of games that had MVC championship implications. If you search the word "rivalry" in the decade of the 60's on the Explore UNT yearbook site, you get no hits.

http://texashistory....ns/UNTY/browse/

In the 70's we tried to start a rivalry with SMU, but that pretty much went away after Hayden Fry left.

In the 80's our main rival was ULM and sometimes Texas State.

In the 90's it was pretty much Texas State. ULM moved up to D-1 and what little rivalry there was between us pretty much went away.

In the 2000's our main rivalries have been with NMSU, Ark St. and MUTS, but the word Rivalry, with those schools has mainly been tied to conference championship games.

A rivalry, or two or three, would really energize our fan base. Having the games in a destination town helps as well. I would rather have renewed our past history with Texas State, but UTSA will do for a big rivalry.

Names for a trophy? Something having to do with the fact that both towns are located on I-35 and/or the fact that our respective mascots are birds of prey.

Tulsa would be my second choice. Believe it or not, Tulsa is a really cool city.

Edited November 12, 2012 by SilverEagle