Global Warming/Climate Change

[GTWT]

Rick,

Did you read the analysis in PolitFact?

[FirefightnRick]

Rick,

Did you read the analysis in PolitFact?

Yes. I also watched his confirmation hearing.

Rick

[meangreenacct]

Rick,

Did you read the analysis in PolitFact?

Reading and comprehending are unfortunately not synonymous though. Just because someone lays out several possible scenarios in a book, does not mean they are advocating that scenario...especially when they go on to say those solutions are not palatable...

[FirefightnRick]

Reading and comprehending are unfortunately not synonymous though. Just because someone lays out several possible scenarios in a book, does not mean they are advocating that scenario...especially when they go on to say those solutions are not palatable...

I can't see why that would ever be considered a solution. That's just me. But considering how radical his boss' views are on abortion, in which he voted three separate times for legislation that would legalize a form of infanticide, I think Holdren fits the bill and certainly believed in such a concept. Of course he denies it now, I wouldn't expect anything else.?

Rick

Edited August 16, 2012 by FirefightnRick

[yyz28]

Government, and the people who make up both government & the governed, are empowered by many things. Government is empowered by an income stream, by an effective military, and by information, including scientific information.

So the answer is 'yes.' Your argument isn't with the science, it's with the effects the science will have on government decisions that effect you & your finances. I'm sorry, Scott, but it's irrational to reject reality because you don't like what it will mean for you.

Oh, and Legend500 raises an interesting point, Scott. When he asks for citations, he's asking where do you get your information. There are scientists, a relatively few scientists, who agree with some of what you say, but I get the sense that those are not your sources. Who do you read on the subject of anthropogenic climate change?

No. My argument is with the science. That is exactly WHY I have a problem with the government action on the science. You accept as reality the premise of Man-Made global warming. I don't. As a result of our individual beliefs, we have differing opinions on government action or lack thereof.

If it makes you feel better to classify folks who disagree with your conclusions as irrational, I guess that's your right, but rather close minded.

This is a forum, not a thesis. I don't always have every article, book, website or forum I've read at my finger tips. ...though for this thread, I've posted images, links, etc for some things. Others, anyone can find if they want to use google. Frankly, I don't have the time or inclination to provide a bibliography in every thread I post in.

...and some things don't need a reference. Asking for a source that the major organizations on the spearhead of the Enviornmental movement are Obama/Dem backers? Really?

Great Thread!!

[GTWT]

No. My argument is with the science. That is exactly WHY I have a problem with the government action on the science. You accept as reality the premise of Man-Made global warming. I don't. As a result of our individual beliefs, we have differing opinions on government action or lack thereof.

If it makes you feel better to classify folks who disagree with your conclusions as irrational, I guess that's your right, but rather close minded.

This is a forum, not a thesis. I don't always have every article, book, website or forum I've read at my finger tips. ...though for this thread, I've posted images, links, etc for some things. Others, anyone can find if they want to use google. Frankly, I don't have the time or inclination to provide a bibliography in every thread I post in.

...and some things don't need a reference. Asking for a source that the major organizations on the spearhead of the Enviornmental movement are Obama/Dem backers? Really?

Great Thread!!

Scott, you seem like a reasonable & intelligent person. You make a good argument. I do suggest that you should read beyond Rush & 'WattsUpWithThat?'. Read the summaries of the IPCC reports (e.g., http://www.ipcc.ch/p...esis_report.htm ), read the statements from the AAAS, the Royal Society, & the dozens of other national academies (links can be found at http://en.wikipedia...._climate_change ).

Scientists aren't always right. In fact, science progresses, in part, by positing hypotheses that are subsequently proven wrong. But science has been shown to be our best tool for arriving at an understanding of reality. Good luck & thank God we're in cUSA.

Edited August 16, 2012 by GTWT

[yyz28]

Scott, you seem like a reasonable & intelligent person. You make a good argument. I do suggest that you should read beyond Rush & 'WattsUpWithThat?'. Read the summaries of the IPCC reports (e.g., http://www.ipcc.ch/p...esis_report.htm ), read the statements from the AAAS, the Royal Society, & the dozens of other national academies (links can be found at http://en.wikipedia...._climate_change ).

Scientists aren't always right. In fact, science progresses, in part, by positing hypotheses that are subsequently proven wrong. But science has been shown to be our best tool for arriving at an understanding of reality. Good luck & thank God we're in cUSA.

I have read both of those sources and more. ...and read may sources that give doubt that arnen't Rush Limbaugh or What's up with That?. ...in fact, until I was googling for some images on long-term climate pictures like the one I posted (which I didn't get from WUWT) I wasn't even aware of the site.

...and yes, our arrival in CUSA is a great first step. If we make it to the Big XII, all climate change will end, and then entire planet will be one giant Utopia. GO MEAN GREEN!

[UNTstormchaser]

I'm retiring from the thread folks. The argument seems dead. Peace out, go Mean Green!

Oh, and to the mention of the Big 12....I think UNT getting in the Big 12 might be a sign of the end times. We better watch ourselves carefully if we ever get in there....

[FirefightnRick]

Damn its cold. people freezing to death, ships frozen in ice having to be rescued by U.S. Coast guard. Did Al Gore start another book tour or something? LOL!

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20140104/DAB3UT982.html

Rick

[GrayEagle]

Damn its cold. people freezing to death, ships frozen in ice having to be rescued by U.S. Coast guard. Did Al Gore start another book tour or something? LOL!

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20140104/DAB3UT982.html

Rick

That's because we've overspent and have now successfully stopped global warming. I wish we could be as successful in creating jobs, balancing the budget, etc.

I give up! Bring back global warming.

[FirefightnRick]

Rick

[gksmith]

Creative. There was a whole series of Calven and Hobbs cartoons that had the same theme...spending a lot of time creating many snowmen. Funny.

Edited February 14, 2014 by gksmith

[FirefightnRick]

"Historic Ice Storm Immobilizes Ground, Air Travel in the South"

http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/ice-storm-begins-to-unfold-in/23186487

..."The event could be the worst ice storm for parts of the South in more than 10 years."...

Rick

[FirefightnRick]

Panicked Shoppers Fight Over Food Amid Snowpocalypse

http://www.infowars.com/panicked-shoppers-fight-over-food-amid-snowpocalypse/

Rick

[MeanGreenTexan]

Panicked Shoppers Fight Over Food Amid Snowpocalypse

http://www.infowars.com/panicked-shoppers-fight-over-food-amid-snowpocalypse/

Rick

Rick, I don't think these ebbs & flows of weather counteract the gradual changes seen at a higher level.

Yes it's cold in the U.S. right now, but I have a friend in Germany who says their winter was unusually warm this year and they've had much less snow than they normally do. Are we to assume that means the world is going to melt in 5 years?

[GTWT]

Hi Rick,

I'd really like to understand why you believe climate change science is a hoax. Is it because you are in posession of better data? Or better analyses?

Skepticism is good. There's nothing wrong with keeping an open mind & refusing to buy unproven conclusions. But your doubt should be tentative & you should be willing to consider that maybe the other guy is right. Otherwise you're basing your arguments on ideology - not science.

Keep green!

[BeanCounterGrad'03]

Hi Rick,

I'd really like to understand why you believe climate change science is a hoax. Is it because you are in posession of better data? Or better analyses?

Skepticism is good. There's nothing wrong with keeping an open mind & refusing to buy unproven conclusions. But your doubt should be tentative & you should be willing to consider that maybe the other guy is right. Otherwise you're basing your arguments on ideology - not science.

Keep green!

Bullseye!

[FirefightnRick]

Hi Rick,

I'd really like to understand why you believe climate change science is a hoax. Is it because you are in posession of better data? Or better analyses?

Skepticism is good. There's nothing wrong with keeping an open mind & refusing to buy unproven conclusions. But your doubt should be tentative & you should be willing to consider that maybe the other guy is right. Otherwise you're basing your arguments on ideology - not science.

Keep green!

Wait, is it simply called "Climate Change" now? What has happened to "Man-Made Global Warming", or "Man-Made Climate Change"? Because I totally and 100 percent agree that the climate changes. No arguement from me on that at all.

Rick

[meangreendork]

Rick, I don't think these ebbs & flows of weather counteract the gradual changes seen at a higher level.

Yes it's cold in the U.S. right now, but I have a friend in Germany who says their winter was unusually warm this year and they've had much less snow than they normally do. Are we to assume that means the world is going to melt in 5 years?

There's a bit of a misunderstanding - the rise in temp changes isn't really about all of us needing to buy swim trunks and tshirts because it's 100F outside all the time. The rise in temp changes is more an issue since it's linked to shifting climate patterns and more erratic and less predictable weather. That's a problem for any number of reasons, but for me, I'd be worried about what that'll do to food production. Sudden, long freezes, lack of rainfall or sudden flooding can do some real damage to our ability to produce food.

And for me, I look at man-made climate change the same way I look at a legal firearm. It's best for us to control what we're doing in case we are a serious problem rather than find out the hard way that not only did we mess up, but we also did a crap job in preparing for the consequences. You know - have and not need vs. need and not have.

[ChristopherRyanWilkes]

Wait, is it simply called "Climate Change" now? What has happened to "Man-Made Global Warming", or "Man-Made Climate Change"? Because I totally and 100 percent agree that the climate changes. No arguement from me on that at all.

Rick

You're arguing semantics now. It's just science man, nothing to argue here. Liberals aren't just making it up for some agenda, it's based on peer-reviewed research done by the guys we pay to research this type of stuff. People much smarter than I am, I will say that.

[Army of Dad]

You're arguing semantics now. It's just science man, nothing to argue here. Liberals aren't just making it up for some agenda, it's based on peer-reviewed research done by the guys we pay to research this type of stuff. People much smarter than I am, I will say that.

Oh like the now infamous 'hockey stick' graph? Good peer reviewed research right there.

[ChristopherRyanWilkes]

Oh like the now infamous 'hockey stick' graph? Good peer reviewed research right there.

Hey, if you want to argue the science or validity of a scientific argument, there's plenty of degree programs in climatology and the like. Until someone on the board reveals they have a PhD in climatology or any science for that matter, i'm not exactly taking it as an expert opinion. I just don't think the "it's cold this winter so global warming isn't real" argument is going to go very far with the scientific community.

[ChristopherRyanWilkes]

I'm extremely ignorant on the science of this thing, that's why I listen to the dudes in the lab coats. The general consensus with them is this thing is happening. The real question is what do we do about it?

[FirefightnRick]

You're arguing semantics now. It's just science man, nothing to argue here. Liberals aren't just making it up for some agenda, it's based on peer-reviewed research done by the guys we pay to research this type of stuff. People much smarter than I am, I will say that.

Your kidding, right? Do you understand the wealth liberals like Al Gore and green energy contractors have ammassed with your money based on made-up research?

Rick

Edited February 13, 2014 by FirefightnRick

[ChristopherRyanWilkes]

Your kidding, right? Do you understand the wealth liberals like Al Gore and green energy contractors have ammassed with your money based on made-up research?

Rick

No I don't understand, show me the numbers please. I want empirical proof that this is just a scam by the libs to make money and not just your opinion. The argument here is that someone in a completely unrelated field is going to tell someone who has dedicated their entire career to researching something that they are wrong because and they just wanted to sell some hybrids. There is a global convention of scientist who have come together on this issue, it's not just the United States. Can science be wrong? Of course. Scientist will always be wrong and continue to refine their research. But the beauty of science is it can be proven, and dissected, and looked at empirically, unlike the biases many of us hold with our political affiliation.