FSU to BIG 12 hurt UNT?

[mgfan]

http://dev.chuckoliver.net/2012/05/fsu-to-the-big-12-it-is-inevitable/

Conference realingment is not close to being done. If FSU leaves the ACC for the BIg 12, as the article suggest, then we will probably see the

trickle down effect of conference realignment. THe ACC would raid the BE and then the BE would raid CUSA. I could see the BE taking ECU and

or Marshall(?). This in turn would casue CUSA to raid the SB and making our future conference weaker.

What do y'all think, are we safe or in a few years will we be in the "New SB"?

[GreenMachine]

We aren't safe for several more years.

[NTSUEagle]

Who cares about what FSU does? Would you RATHER be New Mexico State right now? Be thankful for where we are now (thanks to RV), and don't get your panties in a bunch over something we have no control over.

[mgfan]

I am not getting my "panties" in a bunch. I am just speculating about the future. I believe you do have to care about what every school does at

the FBS level because sooner or later it will affect us. You can't just sit idly by while the college football world shifts around you. That is how you

become NMSU.

Plus it is the offseason and there is very little to talk about.

Edited May 20, 2012 by mgfan

[MDH]

BE won't necessarily take from CUSA. There is a legitimate threat of the BE losing Boise and therefore SDSU if they don't get some help with their olympic sports. I think if the BE bolsters their western division by inviting Fresno (much larger market than ECU and Marshall) and Airforce (ditto on market) this will help. The 4 can then park all their oly sports together in some crappy conference without a threat of the level of play being that much diminished because they will at least have each other.

[DeepGreen]

With the developing four, 16 team conferences, it really won't matter to UNT, CUSA, the BE, or others. We will not be one of the 64 "elite" teams that the networks are pushing to control. I'm convinced the Big 12 and SEC began that process last week.

[Maduro]

as long as they don't invite ULM then who cares?

[golfingomez]

i think if FSU goes Big 12, with or without Clemson, then the ACC raids the Big East and the big east then becomes the WAC, a sinking ship that everyone wants to get off of

[Texas Stranger]

I am not getting my "panties" in a bunch. I am just speculating about the future. I believe you do have to care about what every school does at

the FBS level because sooner or later it will affect us. You can't just sit idly by while the college football world shifts around you. That is how you

become NMSU.

Plus it is the offseason and there is very little to talk about.

NMSU didn't get where they are now by sittling idly by. They and Idaho were both were very proactive in reaching their current predicament.

[GrayEagle]

The question was...'will FSU to the Big 12 hurt UNT?' and I'd say that the answer is yes. The Big 12 will take two; more than likely both from the ACC. And as long as there's someone from CUSA willing to go to the Big East we'll be at risk. We'll still be better off than we were but CUSA can be diluted.

[DeepGreen]

The question was...'will FSU to the Big 12 hurt UNT?' and I'd say that the answer is yes. The Big 12 will take two; more than likely both from the ACC. And as long as there's someone from CUSA willing to go to the Big East we'll be at risk. We'll still be better off than we were but CUSA can be diluted.

Absolutely. East Carolina and Southern Miss. are already standing in the Big East line, ready to "move up". And should that happen, CUSA would really be weakened. UTEP and Tulsa would leave CUSA for the MWC faster than a rat on a sinking ship.

Edited May 21, 2012 by DeepGreen

[All About UNT]

Absolutely. East Carolina and Southern Miss. are already standing in the Big East line, ready to "move us". And should that happen, CUSA would really be weakened. UTEP and Tulsa would leave CUSA for the MWC faster than a rat on a sinking ship.

Thus presenting the question.......could we and one more go with them?

[PlummMeanGreen]

It's Really Too Long.....I Advise That You Don't Read It.

As I surfed the web in the direction of the ACC the last few days, I read that if the ACC lost 2 schools that they may not even expand, but who the hell knows anymore?

The FSU president just days ago was blowing smoke about all the advantages of staying in the ACC, ie, better academics

and I suppose one damn lie after another. I tell you what folks, our entire country starting with Washington D.C (and on on both sides of the aisle) have made

lying a new art form and for all the powers that be in the NCAA....seemedly a new non-contact sport. It is a sad statement about our society; about how far down this

country has gone but you can start with the home but that's another show......................................... (and end of sermon).

I don't know if non-market teams move up as quickly as some say especially if the geography doesn't fit.

OK, North Texas, we are in this huge metro market and never-mind we're only about 25 years behind where we should be,

but in spite of that just look how quickly some of the Florida schools have leap-frogged from total non-existance & now to the Big East.

Look at even how UTSA has come from nothing football-wise and are now are a full-fledged CUSA member. Yes, UNT chose the

100 year plan to get here but it it what it is and that was yesterday and yesterday's gone. Yet for the schools in Florida who zoomed

upward it seemed to happen with consistent winning teams and their having real major college attendance numbers. Hmmmmm?

GET MY DRIFT, CONGREGATION:::::Please........ we don't need anymore preaching to all the parishioners and banging the congregation on the head about their need to tithe when

they are already tithing,ie............. (attending games). Maybe the preacher and his entire staff need to get out of their offices more than ever now and into the commumity where all the non-tithers are

if they want new tithers? (And here I am a back-slid Methodist using Baptist who are oft' preached at about tithing as an illustration for what most on this board know the reason why).

Moral of Story: We don't need to sit around on our collective North Texas butts as we've done forever and go............. "duh.....just look at what's happened

around us and before our very eyes?" Granted, our leaders got us a new stadium of which the alternative of not getting one would have been catostrophic--

we had to have Apogee Stadium or we were going to basically be out of the NCAA FBS football business with dropping down a level or dropping football as our only other choices

Nevertheless, a sincere thanks to our students who voted for the referendum and our UNT leaders for Apogee Stadium.

The timing of Apogee Stadium was spot on plus we really did get one helluva' stadium for the price from what a few experts on construction costs have said in their quotes about Apogee.

Then we got us a real NCAA FBS level HFC with major conference (Big12) experience so there we go.....2 huge longtime obstacles out of the way, but IMO our leaders must now

go outside the usual box and put a new marketing plan together with its main goal of getting many more new fans and faces out to reach our 32,000 (SRO) Mean Green fans from the

almost 7 million population in the North Texas Metroplex.

Never understood why that has been such a problem but I have a few ideas why, but for certain the attendance things needs to soon be a problem of our past

if we are going to compete in CUSA. Can you imagine a Road-Runner going Beep! Beep! right past the University of North Texas football program in 2 or 3 years?

Some of you predicted something like that could happen even as far back as a year or 2 and you stated such on this very message board. I was one who

who said "no way" could that happen, but I don't doubt that possibility any more. And just look at the role models UCF and USF have been for start-ups?

What We Have and .............Don't Have:

(1) We have Apogee Stadium: A stadium that is as good as it gets according to the Cowboys ex Super Scout Gil Brandt

(2) We have a true NCAA FBS Head Football Coach in Dan McCarney. We saw in one year what could be the beginning of something special.

(3) Marketing? That is, marketing aimed to get many more new fans & new faces out on Game Day. Is Parents Weekend doing the job anymore?

And all the other traditional set in stone Game Day promos we've have for years? Apparently not.....try something new for a change to complement

all those traditional Game Day promos.

And to do that a new, vibrant marketing plan to fill Apogee every game with people we've never ever seen before

because now that we will be in CUSA in another year, we really have no choice on this subject of

dramatically improving our per game attendance numbers. Others for damn sure will show us how its done starting with

one school over in San Antonio, Texas.

GMG!

PS: Thanks for the red number, O wise (most transparent) ingenious and most profound one with your posts. Here's a pacifier for ya'. You know, as in to the one who

revised one of my words saying that I now, uh, "hate'" kids? (not that what I like or dislike should really be of concern to you)

Edited May 21, 2012 by PlummMeanGreen

[shaft]

Pssst. The ACC went to 14 to buffer against losing teams to either the SEC or Big 12.

So no it won't effect UNT or CUSA.

[Eagle1855]

Pssst. The ACC went to 14 to buffer against losing teams to either the SEC or Big 12.

So no it won't effect UNT or CUSA.

Agreed.

And further, who cares? In the last decade, no one has hurt UNT more than UNT. We need to handle our business, regardless of league. Then let the rest play itself out. That's what UH did. That's what Boise has done. TCU, too. The latter perhaps being the best example.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

--- Don't worry about what we can't control.... worry about taking care of business and winning games... We finally are going to be in a conference that will generate more interest and I think will produce more fans and Texas media attention.... which helps recruiting and recognition.

--- I would like to see us keep at least one area non-conf game on the schedule also.... such as Houston, TxTech, Baylor, Oklahoma St, Tx State, TCU, or even NMSU but not a team that we have about zero chance of looking good in [ being a body bag team ]. I don't think being on the wrong end of a lopsided score helps us at all except maybe at the bank.

---Playing a regional games will help us get more media attention and we need that now. SMU might too but I don't just want us to fill their stands and help them after all the disrespect they have shown us (and about everyone else in the region). Let them rot with their near empty stadium ...

Edited May 21, 2012 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[PlummMeanGreen]

Agreed.

And further, who cares? In the last decade, no one has hurt UNT more than UNT. We need to handle our business, regardless of league. Then let the rest play itself out. That's what UH did. That's what Boise has done. TCU, too. The latter perhaps being the best example.

This! And in 3 inch headlines to boot!

GMG

[GrandGreen]

Agreed.

And further, who cares? In the last decade, no one has hurt UNT more than UNT. We need to handle our business, regardless of league. Then let the rest play itself out. That's what UH did. That's what Boise has done. TCU, too. The latter perhaps being the best example.

I care, and actually NT has done more in the last decade than ever before. Sure NT has to get better but to suggest that losing key teams from CUSA won't hurt NT is false. One of NT biggest problems has always been conference affiliation, on the outside looking into Texas.

NT entry into CUSA is a big step for the program, not close to as big as it would have been years ago when NT was a finalist, but still a step in the right direction. Losing one or more of the CUSA current heavyweights: Tulsa, ECU or USM would substantially reduce that progress. Any team CUSA loses is going to be replaced by a move up or Belt team, and although NT will still be in a more regional conference, the separation over any other league diminishes and CUSA could fall way behind the MWC.

Winning big certainly got Boise moved up, but that step was not all that great and playing across the nation may not turn out well. Houston has been up and down on the football field, but they like NT have the market advantage. TCU is the one that really progressed going to the B12. If NT can post double digit wins for 5 or more years, then they could move up based on winning but not many teams can do that.

[PlummMeanGreen]

I care, and actually NT has done more in the last decade than ever before. Sure NT has to get better but to suggest that losing key teams from CUSA won't hurt NT is false. One of NT biggest problems has always been conference affiliation, on the outside looking into Texas.

NT entry into CUSA is a big step for the program, not close to as big as it would have been years ago when NT was a finalist, but still a step in the right direction. Losing one or more of the CUSA current heavyweights: Tulsa, ECU or USM would substantially reduce that progress. Any team CUSA loses is going to be replaced by a move up or Belt team, and although NT will still be in a more regional conference, the separation over any other league diminishes and CUSA could fall way behind the MWC.

Winning big certainly got Boise moved up, but that step was not all that great and playing across the nation may not turn out well. Houston has been up and down on the football field, but they like NT have the market advantage. TCU is the one that really progressed going to the B12. If NT can post double digit wins for 5 or more years, then they could move up based on winning but not many teams can do that.

I think he may have been talking more about our W/L records in football the last umpteen years more than anything else. And like it or not, it will always be football that is the engine that drives our Mean Green train.

And................building Apogee Stadium was not a choice, it was a must and as Coach McCarney even said and I will liberally paraphrase him............"it really should have been built years ago" and that statement by Coach Mac many of us Old Gun Alums would say is one enormous understatement.

Things look good for our future, though, that is if we don't Texas 2 step it backwards like has been our tradition after we've made previous gains.

GMG!

Edited May 21, 2012 by PlummMeanGreen

[Eagle1855]

I think he may have been talking more about our W/L records in football the last umpteen years more than anything else. And like it or not, it will always be football that is the engine that drives our Mean Green train.

I was. Because in the end, this is all that matters.

[GrandGreen]

I was. Because in the end, this is all that matters.

Well I wonder what happened to the Troy invite, if recent football results is all that matters. For that matter, why were Tulsa and USM not invited to the BE?

Winning football has never been as big a factor, as many think. Support and resources are and that is most directly tied to winning. But if it was only winning, NT would have been in CUSA for years, as at the time that decision was made: NT had a good football program and UTEP historically has been one of the worse in the nation.

Boise is the poster boy for what winning can do, but for most it is a combination of factors. I doubt Houston or SMU would be in the BE is they were located far from population centers.

Of all factors, winning football is a big one; but I think this latest round of realignment clearly points to geography and potential as being bigger.

Edited May 21, 2012 by GrandGreen

[Mark Gommesen]

With the developing four, 16 team conferences, it really won't matter to UNT, CUSA, the BE, or others. We will not be one of the 64 "elite" teams that the networks are pushing to control. I'm convinced the Big 12 and SEC began that process last week.

I wouldn't not be surprised to see a stop the SEC/BIG12/PAC12/B1G alliance. An informal alliance of the Big East, ACC, C-USA, MWC,MAC, and the SBC would be a powerful voting alliance within the NCAA. It is not in best interest for the ACC to weaken the BE. The collapse of the BE would only strengthen the SEC/BIG12/PAC12/B1G cartel. A smarter move would be a scheduling and TV broadcast alliance between the two conferences. BE/ACC are still the dominant force in college basketball and could use this as a leverage with TV networks. Edited May 21, 2012 by Mark Gommesen

[DeepGreen]

I wouldn't not be surprised to see a stop the SEC/BIG12/PAC12/B1G alliance. An informal alliance of the Big East, ACC, C-USA, MWC,MAC, and the SB would be a powerful voting alliance within the NCAA.

Has the NCAA had any input whatsoever regarding these crazy conference changes, traditional rivalries now in the toilet, and even cross-country conference games. Could it be the NCAA has no say-so in these conference matters because they are on the payroll of the power conferences and the TV networks that are driving these changes. There, I said. Conspiracy? Maybe. Money has a way of buying people off. Just sayin'.

[oldschoollefty]

--- Don't worry about what we can't control.... worry about taking care of business and winning games... We finally are going to be in a conference that will generate more interest and I think will produce more fans and Texas media attention.... which helps recruiting and recognition.

--- I would like to see us keep at least one area non-conf game on the schedule also.... such as Houston, TxTech, Baylor, Oklahoma St, Tx State, TCU, or even NMSU but not a team that we have about zero chance of looking good in [ being a body bag team ]. I don't think being on the wrong end of a lopsided score helps us at all except maybe at the bank.

---Playing a regional games will help us get more media attention and we need that now. SMU might too but I don't just want us to fill their stands and help them after all the disrespect they have shown us (and about everyone else in the region). Let them rot with their near empty stadium ...

I agree up to a point, but my thought on this is, filling their stands with green and outnumbering the pink polo wearers in their own house sends many more positive messages than simply ignoring them. First, we get a well deserved reputation for travelling well. Second, we get the pure pleasure of outshouting them in Ford Stadium AND beating the ears off of June's little Ponies on the field. The SMUt faithful that delights in looking down their collective noses at us, and have done their best in keeping our program out of better conference affiliations in the past, need a vocal reminder who the new bully on the block is, and how they need to get used to looking up at us in terms of athletic superiority.

[Mark Gommesen]

Why would a C-USA even consider the BE if it loses two more major teams to the ACC?

1. BE still has not negotiated a new television contract. If the BE was two lose two more major teams like Louisville , Rutgers or UConn. it would leave a huge hole to fill. With all due respect to our C-USA friends including ECU and Marshall, there are no C-USA teams that could fill the gap in terms of replacing TV money. Combined with all the network cash that the BIG12 and ACC have already taken off the table, BE will not be the money cow it was in the past.

2. With the elimination of the AQ, getting to national championship playoff bowl will depend on the level of competition in the conference. BE will not be a power conference.

3. The Basketball only schools will gain influence in the conference. They revolted last year to kill a media deal. If they leave the conference or demand a larger portion of the TV revenues. (and they will.) The all sports and football only schools will lose revenue share.

4. The conference is without a permanent commissioner. Many members are openly unhappy with the conference. BE is the most unstable conference in the country.