Pudge retiring in Arlington

NT03 · April 19, 2012

ESPN

Where do u rank him all time ( catchers) ?

Rudy · April 19, 2012

A close 2nd behind Johnny Bench.

I wish they would let him suit up for one last game. I'd call off work for that!

Coffee and TV · April 19, 2012

Most likely a juicer, so I'm not quite sure where I'd rank him.

Green P1 · April 19, 2012

Totes a juicer.... but still absolute greatness.

UNT90 · April 20, 2012

He was a juicer when everyone was a juicer, so just throw out the home runs.

Best defensive catcher I ever saw. Strongest arm on a catcher I ever saw. Developed into a solid run producer before the steroids hit his viens. First ballot Hall of Famer (unless the writer balk on the steroid issue),

Overall, I don't know, but by far the best in Ranger history.

oldguystudent · April 20, 2012

Between the strike and the steroids, I kinda' wonder if anyone from the nineties will get into the hall. The writers consider that a dark, dark era.

UNT90 · April 20, 2012

Between the strike and the steroids, I kinda' wonder if anyone from the nineties will get into the hall. The writers consider that a dark, dark era.

I think the "good guys" who didn't appear before congress get in.

Pudge is so far on the outter edge of the steriod crowd, I bet a lot of reporters don't even equate Pudge with the drug.

Plus, everyone (writers included) love Pudge. Huge human element in getting into the Baseball HOF.

Now, Bonds on the other hand...

untgirl04 · April 20, 2012

I'd agree 2nd behind Johnny Bench.

If he juiced, I don't think it was heavily. He hit home runs, but he was more effective as a doubles guy (572 2B to 311 HR). That's just good ball placement.

He was a phenomenal defensive catcher (even though Nolan Ryan didn't like him). That guy could pick more runners off first base than anyone else I've ever seen. He's 6th all time in throwing out runners on base (45.52%) He had 10 consecutive AL gold gloves, and a total of 13 in his career.

Additionally, he was classy (at least when he left the Rangers). I remember him taking out a full page add in the Ft Worth Star Telegram thanking the fans for their support and what they meant to his family.

Coffee and TV · April 20, 2012

Just because a guy didn't hit a lot of home runs doesn't mean he didn't juice. Steroids have a lot to do with overall endurance and conditioning. They have to do with bouncing back from minor injuries more quickly, and overall muscle increase. They don't necessarily make fly ball outs into home runs. With most hitters in that era I'd shave about 100 points off their slugging percentage, and then decide if they're worthy or not. Pudge? Dunno. Bagwell? Nope. Bonds? Nope. Clemens? Not a chance. Griffey? Absolutely.

Edited April 20, 2012 by Coffee and TV

Rudy · April 20, 2012

It sucks that Griffey's body just broke down. He was always classy, and had the SWEETEST swing I think I've ever seen. There is no doubt that if he had remained healthy, he'd be the home run king.

MeanGreenTexan · April 20, 2012

Just because a guy didn't hit a lot of home runs doesn't mean he didn't juice. Steroids have a lot to do with overall endurance and conditioning. They have to do with bouncing back from minor injuries more quickly, and overall muscle increase. They don't necessarily make fly ball outs into home runs. With most hitters in that era I'd shave about 100 points off their slugging percentage, and then decide if they're worthy or not. Pudge? Dunno. Bagwell? Nope. Bonds? Nope. Clemens? Not a chance. Griffey? Absolutely.

I think Griffey's last 8 injury-riddled years of his career proves that he was not a juicer.

He's the best player I've ever seen with my own eyes.

untgirl04 · April 20, 2012

Just because a guy didn't hit a lot of home runs doesn't mean he didn't juice. Steroids have a lot to do with overall endurance and conditioning. They have to do with bouncing back from minor injuries more quickly, and overall muscle increase. They don't necessarily makers fly ball outs into home runs. With most hitters in that era I'd shave about 100 points off their slugging percentage, and then decide if they're worthy or not. Pudge? Dunno. Bagwell? Nope. Bonds? Nope. Clemens? Not a chance. Griffey? Absolutely.

I'm not insinuating that Pudge's HR numbers mean he didn't juice. He entered the majors so young that I think that had more to do with his health than drug use. I think the steroids started in 2004 or so after he started getting injured. But he had 10 consecutive Gold Gloves before that.

Cooperstown is not just about batting numbers. I think Pudge belongs in the HOF because of his defense.