Yu Darvish

Rudy · January 20, 2012

I can't believe this board would rather talk politics and protestors than Yu Darvish.

For those living under a rock, The Rangers signed Yu Darvish yesterday. This is a hyuge move and I hope he lives up to his expectiations.

Discuss...

meangreen · January 20, 2012

I love it. Yu-mania has already hit me.

bstnsportsfan3 · January 20, 2012

As both a red sox and ranger fan....the boston part of me thinks of dice k and how much of a failure he was...while the ranger fan in me wants to think this guy is the ace pitcher the team needed.

UNT90 · January 20, 2012

As both a red sox and ranger fan....the boston part of me thinks of dice k and how much of a failure he was...while the ranger fan in me wants to think this guy is the ace pitcher the team needed.

Yep. I'll be more than happy if Yu goes something like 14-8 next year.

Green P1 · January 20, 2012

I'm thrilled he's here and I'm thrilled CJ is gone.

Now onto Prince.

forevereagle · January 20, 2012

I'm thrilled he's here and I'm thrilled CJ is gone.

Yeah, but can Yu win a knife fight or fly the team plane if the pilot is incapacitated?

Green P1 · January 20, 2012

Yeah, but can Yu win a knife fight or fly the team plane if the pilot is incapacitated?

I'll bet their Ninja skills are comparable.

Coffee and TV · January 20, 2012

$110 million for a guy who has never pitched in the major leagues. Unless he wins 20 games, I don't see how this isn't a bust. And full disclosure, I'm a Padres fan, but I'm not anti-Rangers in any way. I just don't see the value in this move.

And yes, they should shoot for Prince if the money's there. The fact that he hasn't been nailed down yet while Pujols got a 10 year deal is exactly what's wrong with baseball these days.

Edited January 20, 2012 by Coffee and TV

Green Mean · January 20, 2012

$110 million for a guy who has never pitched in the major leagues. Unless he wins 20 games, I don't see how this isn't a bust. And full disclosure, I'm a Padres fan, but I'm not anti-Rangers in any way. I just don't see the value in this move.

And yes, they should shoot for Prince if the money's there. The fact that he hasn't been nailed down yet while Pujols got a 10 year deal is exactly what's wrong with baseball these days.

You're right that it is a risk but I think it was a risk worth taking. By all accounts his stuff and makeup is unlike the typical Japanese pitcher and the fact that he's young is the draw. I'm not including the posting fee because that is just how that system works. In my mind you'll have a guy for the next 6 years who could very well be a true ace. If it fails then it fails...but what if he becomes a decent pitcher that can win 12-14 or 15 games a year? At 10 million a year its still a good price.

I personally was a fan of CJ despite his douchery. But I think he is a lot closer to reaching his ceiling and with the depth of the rotation and farm system I think they were ok with CJ going walking even knowing he'd have a good shot at going to Anaheim. And make no mistake that his post season failures is what the Rangers go this route and I still think it is for the better since Darvish's upside is sky high.

I'm pretty confident Prince will be a Ranger. It's evident no one is willing to give him 8-10 years and when push comes to shove Texas is far more appealing than Seattle, Washington, Toronto, or the Cubs. The money is there. Top 4 or 5 market...new TV money kicking in a couple of years, 3 million fans and will be even much high this season...the money is there. The great thing about the front office is they don't toot their horn and they do all their business low key. I love it.

And I will say this...even if the Rangers had not gone after Darvish or didn't do a darn thing this off season I still believe Texas was the better team and the true team to beat. They have a great staff but they spent over 300 million on two guys each over 30. Hypothetically Darvish and Fielder EASILY trumps Wilson and Pujols even this season.

Coffee and TV · January 20, 2012

You're right that it is a risk but I think it was a risk worth taking. By all accounts his stuff and makeup is unlike the typical Japanese pitcher and the fact that he's young is the draw. I'm not including the posting fee because that is just how that system works. In my mind you'll have a guy for the next 6 years who could very well be a true ace. If it fails then it fails...but what if he becomes a decent pitcher that can win 12-14 or 15 games a year? At 10 million a year its still a good price.

See I don't know how you can just dismiss the $50mil part. Sure the contract itself ain't bad for a decent pitcher, but throw in that posting fee and its just outrageous.

I personally was a fan of CJ despite his douchery. But I think he is a lot closer to reaching his ceiling and with the depth of the rotation and farm system I think they were ok with CJ going walking even knowing he'd have a good shot at going to Anaheim. And make no mistake that his post season failures is what the Rangers go this route and I still think it is for the better since Darvish's upside is sky high.

I'm not a believer in 'clutch', I think its personally wayyyy overrated. Having said that, why could CJ win in the playoffs? Why did he just absolutely collapse in October?

Green Mean · January 20, 2012

See I don't know how you can just dismiss the $50mil part. Sure the contract itself ain't bad for a decent pitcher, but throw in that posting fee and its just outrageous.

I'm not a believer in 'clutch', I think its personally wayyyy overrated. Having said that, why could CJ win in the playoffs? Why did he just absolutely collapse in October?

I'm dismissing it because it's not a part of payroll and wouldn't be incorporated to a luxury tax.

I'm a big believer in clutch to be honest. In the biggest stage CJ repeatedly failed to deliver. It's crazy but the Rangers have finally created standards. Texas has gotten past moral victories and baby steps....they've become one of the 2000 pound gorillas in the room now. A pitcher can go 3-17 during the regular season for the Yankees but if he constantly delivers in the post season and leads your team...that is all that matters. In CJ's case it was the opposite. I'm not dismissing what he's meant to the rotation the past two seasons...but he wasn't the next level pitcher Texas needed. He's in a perfect situation in Anaheim...the 3rd or 4th pitcher in an all star starting rotation and I think he will absolutely thrive in that role. I think he failed because by all accounts mentally he over thought way too much and gave the hitters too much credit. At times he can be mentally tough in the regular season but when you over think your stuff and don't trust it you'll get rocked by the likes of Kelly Shoppach and NICK EFFING EFFING PUNTO!

The fact that we're even talking about the Rangers and them spending money and possibly more money in January is amazing.

mattmartin817 · January 20, 2012

The Posting fee doesn't worry me at all, it's being paid out at a rate of 8.6 million for every year of Darvish's initial contract, so we aren't just paying out 50 mil right now. And the new several billion dollar tv deal makes that all a little easier to stomach. Yu will be good, I think it's wrong people keep bringing up the Daisuke thing, he is a completely different pitcher than Daisuke. Yu goes after hitters, pounds the strike zone, Daisuke nibbles around the plate and doesn't go after hitters. There's some major differences in their game and make up. As for signing Fielder, FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY I HOPE JD AND THE RANGERS FO CAN MAKE THAT HAPPEN!!! The guy is a beast, plays pretty much every game every season, and he will rake in the ballpark. Baseball season needs to hurry up and get here. Go Rangers.

Eagle-96 · January 20, 2012

Yu is in a better position to succeed then those that came before him from Japan. Yu will be slotted as 2-3 in the rotation which should releive some of the pressure to be an Ace. Yu will have the best pitching coach in the majors in Mike Maddux. He will have hall of famer Nolan Ryan to consult with. He will have one of the best fielding pitchers in history in Greg Maddux. He will also have 3 teammates on the team that have piched in NPB and MLB with Lewis, Uehara, and Tateyama. Having someone who speaks his language and knows the ins and outs of both leagues is going to be vital. Yu also has fewer innings on his arm then most pitchers that have come across. The real test wll be October. If he can perform well in the post season and the Rangers can win the World Series then CJ will be forgotten in short order.

Edited January 20, 2012 by Eagle-96

KRAM1 · January 20, 2012

I just hope the guy isn't the typical "Asian Pitcher" bust. I'll go with Nolan's knowledge and experience in that area until or if I see different in actual game performance. Reports say this guy is "different", but aren't they all? And, pitchers are handled so much differently in Japan (much more rest and much more throwing between games than in the US Bigs) that I do see some risk here...but, again...if Nolan likes it...I like it...FOR NOW! I am also glad to see the Rangers go after some pitching. They need it if they want to be competitive again this year fro the Crown.

Don't want to see Fielder in a Ranger uniform. Can't see it for the money...I think the Rangers lose Hamilton if the get Fielder...maybe not this year, but Hamilton is probably gone if Fielder arrives. I'll take Hamilton.

Just me. and...I am also not unhappy at all the CJ has moved along...good for him...not worth the $$$ to re-sign him. He'll be on the DL soon enough.

mattmartin817 · January 20, 2012

I just hope the guy isn't the typical "Asian Pitcher" bust. I'll go with Nolan's knowledge and experience in that area until or if I see different in actual game performance. Reports say this guy is "different", but aren't they all? And, pitchers are handled so much differently in Japan (much more rest and much more throwing between games than in the US Bigs) that I do see some risk here...but, again...if Nolan likes it...I like it...FOR NOW! I am also glad to see the Rangers go after some pitching. They need it if they want to be competitive again this year fro the Crown.

Don't want to see Fielder in a Ranger uniform. Can't see it for the money...I think the Rangers lose Hamilton if the get Fielder...maybe not this year, but Hamilton is probably gone if Fielder arrives. I'll take Hamilton.

Just me. and...I am also not unhappy at all the CJ has moved along...good for him...not worth the $$$ to re-sign him. He'll be on the DL soon enough.

While I would hate to see Hamilton go, Fielder would be the better option. Hamilton is going to go down hill soon, and when that starts it's going to be bad and it's probably going to be a steep drop off. His body just can't take the punishment. Plus you have to look at the amount of games Fielder plays over how many Hamilton plays, Fielder misses about 6 games a season, Hamilton misses entire months with injuries. Unless Hamilton is ready to make the move to first base, I say sign Fielder. Also I think it would be a nice middle finger to the angels if we signed him, and I'm always in favor of that.

Quoner · January 20, 2012

I just hope the guy isn't the typical "Asian Pitcher" bust.

He's built different and has better stuff (and is half-Iranian..uh-oh), but that's not why I'm optimistic. I'm optimistic because what has proven to be one of best scouting staffs in baseball tailed this guy for years and they know everything about him. CJ is not gone because he is clutch or unclutch -- it is because he didn't fit with his teammates for a number of reasons and there was a better option on the market. All of those trades and signings for Asian relief pitchers were also leading to this moment. They know better than anyone else who's ever brought in a Japanese pitcher what they are getting.

Don't want to see Fielder in a Ranger uniform. Can't see it for the money...I think the Rangers lose Hamilton if the get Fielder...maybe not this year, but Hamilton is probably gone if Fielder arrives. I'll take Hamilton.

You would take a guy in the back half of his career for a huge contract with a history of injury problems over a young slugger who never gets hurt? If you don't sign Fielder this summer, there is no attractive bat like him on the market for years because teams are locking up their young guys until they are 30/31 now. There can be a trade or whatever, but grabbing him now makes a lot of sense. Hamilton wants Werth money and if Fielder comes down, he is a much better investment to keep a heavy bat in this line up for years to come. Also, if we don't do it, I won't be mad (because of the turst thing), but I will be disappointed.

I love Josh and he will be forever a Ranger hero in my mind, but a big contract for him will hurt for years. Plus, he's going accountabilibuddyless now, so who knows what lies in store for him? Hard living takes a toll and that bell could ring at any point in the next few years.

Just me. and...I am also not unhappy at all the CJ has moved along...good for him...not worth the $$$ to re-sign him. He'll be on the DL soon enough.

I'm glad CJ is gone, too, and he could very well get hurt like one Angels pitcher seems to every other year, but conditioning and durability were never really big concerns with him.

Finally, I miss baseball talk with you fellas.

Rudy · January 20, 2012

$110 million for a guy who has never pitched in the major leagues. Unless he wins 20 games, I don't see how this isn't a bust. And full disclosure, I'm a Padres fan, but I'm not anti-Rangers in any way. I just don't see the value in this move.

The Rangers had scouts in Japan watching this guy for several seasons. They know what they are getting.

While I would hate to see Hamilton go, Fielder would be the better option. Hamilton is going to go down hill soon, and when that starts it's going to be bad and it's probably going to be a steep drop off. His body just can't take the punishment.

Have you seen Prince's body? I think it's a toss up who goes downhill first and fastest. At least Hamilton takes care of his body now. The human body can do suprising things to heal itself.

That being said, I'd be thrilled if we can get Fielder for the right price.

TheTastyGreek · January 20, 2012

Have you seen Prince's body?

He definitely doesn't have they typical "Asian Pitcher" bust. That's for sure.

UNT90 · January 20, 2012

The Rangers had scouts in Japan watching this guy for several seasons. They know what they are getting.

Have you seen Prince's body? I think it's a toss up who goes downhill first and fastest. At least Hamilton takes care of his body now. The human body can do suprising things to heal itself.

That being said, I'd be thrilled if we can get Fielder for the right price.

I think this is why Fielder us still on the market. He is in terrible shape, but, oddly enough, never goes on the DL. His luck could run out real soon.

The only reason I like the Yu signing is because the amount of time this proven scouting staff has put in for his evaluation. As far as being a Douche, we may have just traded a California douche for a Japanese douche. Let's hope douches made in Japan come with more mental toughness than their California cousins.

Edited January 20, 2012 by UNT90

Coffee and TV · January 20, 2012

Have you seen Prince's body?

Billy Beane thought he was too fat to play too. Since then his OPS is over .900 and he dropped something like 50lbs by going vegan. I'd take a chance on Fielder for 5 years any day over a "31" year old Pujols.

Monkeypox · January 20, 2012

ON HAMILTON/FIELDER: Josh Hamilton's already incapable of giving you more than 130 games a season. I think his talent will hold up, but they've already had to diminish his overall value by moving him from CF, and likely will only further do so.

I don't worry a whole lot about Prince Fielder's body, because he's actually pretty athletic for his size and it's more of a body type, IMO, than him just being a fat tub. That said, Big Papi is 36 and built like a dump truck, but he's still managed to be successful into his mid-to-late 30s, outside of one down year. People act like Cecil dropped off a cliff at a certain age, but, when you look back, Cecil's numbers were inconsistent and he was a mostly hollow power threat for his career anyway. In short, he never approached Prince's numbers to begin with, so he didn't really have that far to fall to be less than valuable.

NOW, the reality is with both Prince and Josh, it comes down to value for the Rangers. It's unlikely that either one of them, in the Rangers mind, will give you a good price/performance ratio over the long-term.

ON YU/CJ: The Rangers looked at CJ and said "He's 31, not an ace, and going to command a lot of dollars." In the end, it wasn't JUST that CJ performed poorly in the playoffs. It's that, if you're going to spend the money, at least spend it on a guy who COULD be an ace for you. CJ didn't go to LAAAAA to anchor the staff. He went there to be the #3 guy.

So that's how they see Darvish. They see a guy who's younger, has a better physique and mechanics than most of his predecessors, and is a relentless worker. A guy with the STUFF and poise to potentially be an ace. That's the gamble the Rangers are taking. CJ wasn't going to be an ace. Yu could be.

Compared to Matsuzaka, he's bigger, has a better repertoire, and likely won't gain 20 lbs of pure fat before he ever shows up on our shores.

I try not to compare NPB numbers, if only for the fact that, even BEFORE they changed balls in 2011, hitting has always been behind pitching in that league. And particularly as you start looking at the last 5 years or so, offensive numbers have been on a pretty steady decline there. And that's really where the concerns come from. You watch the scouting videos and you see a lot of swings and misses out of the zone. The stuff is filthy, but your top half of MLB hitters aren't going to swing at them at all. It comes down to the SCOUTING belief that he can cut down on his repertoire and command his pitches within the strike zone.

MeanGreenTexan · January 20, 2012

He definitely doesn't have they typical "Asian Pitcher" bust. That's for sure.

Wait, which Prince are you talking about? This guy looks pretty "Asian Pitcher" to me:

Green Mean · January 20, 2012

I don't think it is far out of line to think Texas can't sign both Fielder and Hamilton. Look the money is there and the time is truly now. The window is wide open...I think Hamilton does so much other than offense when he's in the game. With the amount of depth the team has there's no reason why they can't take it easy on Hamilton for multiple years. We're big market and we have a really wide and open window right now. Go for it.

UNT90 · January 20, 2012

ON HAMILTON/FIELDER: Josh Hamilton's already incapable of giving you more than 130 games a season. I think his talent will hold up, but they've already had to diminish his overall value by moving him from CF, and likely will only further do so.

I don't worry a whole lot about Prince Fielder's body, because he's actually pretty athletic for his size and it's more of a body type, IMO, than him just being a fat tub. That said, Big Papi is 36 and built like a dump truck, but he's still managed to be successful into his mid-to-late 30s, outside of one down year. People act like Cecil dropped off a cliff at a certain age, but, when you look back, Cecil's numbers were inconsistent and he was a mostly hollow power threat for his career anyway. In short, he never approached Prince's numbers to begin with, so he didn't really have that far to fall to be less than valuable.

NOW, the reality is with both Prince and Josh, it comes down to value for the Rangers. It's unlikely that either one of them, in the Rangers mind, will give you a good price/performance ratio over the long-term.

ON YU/CJ: The Rangers looked at CJ and said "He's 31, not an ace, and going to command a lot of dollars." In the end, it wasn't JUST that CJ performed poorly in the playoffs. It's that, if you're going to spend the money, at least spend it on a guy who COULD be an ace for you. CJ didn't go to LAAAAA to anchor the staff. He went there to be the #3 guy.

So that's how they see Darvish. They see a guy who's younger, has a better physique and mechanics than most of his predecessors, and is a relentless worker. A guy with the STUFF and poise to potentially be an ace. That's the gamble the Rangers are taking. CJ wasn't going to be an ace. Yu could be.

Compared to Matsuzaka, he's bigger, has a better repertoire, and likely won't gain 20 lbs of pure fat before he ever shows up on our shores.

I try not to compare NPB numbers, if only for the fact that, even BEFORE they changed balls in 2011, hitting has always been behind pitching in that league. And particularly as you start looking at the last 5 years or so, offensive numbers have been on a pretty steady decline there. And that's really where the concerns come from. You watch the scouting videos and you see a lot of swings and misses out of the zone. The stuff is filthy, but your top half of MLB hitters aren't going to swing at them at all. It comes down to the SCOUTING belief that he can cut down on his repertoire and command his pitches within the strike zone.

Good thoughts on Yu.

The Rangers are essentially risking a known for an unknown which they feel has far greater potential than the known they gave up.

CJ going to the Angels says loads about him as a competitor, in my opinion. Can't handle being a #1? Go to a team where you can be a #3 with far less pressure.

KRAM1 · January 20, 2012

I don't think it is far out of line to think Texas can't sign both Fielder and Hamilton. Look the money is there and the time is truly now. The window is wide open...I think Hamilton does so much other than offense when he's in the game. With the amount of depth the team has there's no reason why they can't take it easy on Hamilton for multiple years. We're big market and we have a really wide and open window right now. Go for it.

Just asking here as I am not as big a pro baseball fan as many here...If Fielder is so good and "the money is there"...why is he still on the market after all these weeks/months? Oh, and why is Pujols signed sealed and delivered to the Angels? They could have signed Fielder for that kind of money. I have no dog in this hunt as, like I said, don't care that much about pro baseball, but I would like to hear more from what our baseball "experts" think.

Edited January 20, 2012 by KRAM1