How to make a GRAND ENTRANCE

[adman]

It's part of getting the Music Education students ready to have their own high school bands one day.

So band directors like me can have a Top 10 Marching Band in the area. Sorry, you're 'college entertainment' isn't worth me losing educational time at my GB rehearsal. I never felt like I was settling in the GB, and niether does anybody in the ensemble.

So what if, rather than getting Music Ed students ready to have their own HS bands one day, we get them ready to have their own top ten college band?

[EagleMBA]

Silver, this one brings back childhood memories and it is damned emotional when you are there. The drum major is a showman ala the Ohio State dude. I saw my first Notre Dame game about 1954 and the band has the same entrance and effect on the crowd today as it did back then.

[NT03]

Kinda off topic , but the espn 30 for 30 about the Baltimore Colts marching band is pretty good

Does Texas Southern have a good marching band ? If so , I hope they travel and preform for us

Edited January 4, 2012 by NT03

[SilverEagle]

I don't know what they do to celebrate themselves.

How about this. They do what suits them, and whatever is in the best interest of the University and the promotion of spirit is not considered important.

The Green Brigade is a class, an ensemble credit hour. I learned a lot about marching band, and how to run one. The GB will never be what you want it to be, because that's not what it was designed to be. It's not designed to do that. Our 'thing' is playing really loudly, and with musical precision, not use marching styles that are literally 100 year old. We're set up and run like a high school band so that the future band directors of Texas know how to run one.

So, the North Texas football games are little more than lab time for the Green Brigade?

I've suspected this for a long time. Because my main criticism of the Green Brigade has always been that they did not take full responsibility for promoting spirit at North Texas games. And this has been my observation ever since Dr. Winslow took over the program. And it's been that way ever since.

Back in 1990, I was asked by the University (and I don't know how I was selected) to participate in a focus group to discuss the future of North Texas football. It was clear that the leader of the focus group (Dr. Peter Lane) wanted to know if the alumni would support a move back to D-1 football. After giving direct feed-back about that question, I took the opportunity (much to the annoyance of Dr. Lane) to give them my feedback on what concerned me about the whole program.

I told them that from what I've observed, North Texas just contracts to put on a football game. I said that a group of students and alumni show up. A football team shows up. A group of cheerleaders show up. And a band shows up. But I told them that it appears there there is no observable connection between any of the groups. They just all showed up at the prescribed time and did their own thing......especially the GREEN BRIGADE. I said that it appeared to me that the Green Brigade did not see it's role/job as the promoter of spirit at football games. Dr. Lane didn't want to talk about that and cut off the discussion as soon as possible.

Not surprisingly I haven't been invited back to any focus groups at North Texas.

And just as unsurprising, there is resistance to discussing PAGENTRY AT NORTH TEXAS GAMES.

Something that most D-1 programs take for granted.

Edited January 4, 2012 by SilverEagle

[SilverEagle]

Silver, this one brings back childhood memories and it is damned emotional when you are there. The drum major is a showman ala the Ohio State dude. I saw my first Notre Dame game about 1954 and the band has the same entrance and effect on the crowd today as it did back then.

I will have to grudgingly admit that this is some pretty good pageantry (I hate ND). One thing that they did that North Texas used to do (in the pre-Winslow days) was salute their opponents by playing their opponents fight song in pre-game. I noticed that Ohio State does the same thing.

Very classy

[SHOSS]

Really a -5? Really?

None of this crap means anything when it is attached to a bad football program and nobody shows up for the games. I feel terrible for everybody that does any kind of pre-game dog and pony show right now at Apogee... I'm there 30 minutes before kick just about every game...BUT NOBODY ELSE IS... it has to be completely deflating for the football team to come out all fired up and see an empty stadium... but hey, the band is there... maybe even wearing uniforms... wow.

wanting all this stupid crap above and beyond what the band is currently doing is just silly. I don't come to watch the band, but I completely acknowledge how good they are. Give me good players and a good ensemble over stupid looking uniforms and quasi-military marching around any day of the week and twice on Saturdays. btw, has anybody ever noticed that we STILL, for the last 30 years or so had the best drumline in the world...period end stop? anybody? but, you guys have to harp on the fact that they aren't wearing clown outfits...

look, we all want to have what ohio state and wisconsin have... of course we'd want 100 years of awesome tradition and 100k fans at every game. I can tell you this much though...when I have gone to those Ohio State games, I come away remembering the game and the roar of the crowd, not those stupid band and drum major outfits...

Give me a break, -5...

[SilverEagle]

Really a -5? Really?

None of this crap means anything when it is attached to a bad football program and nobody shows up for the games. I feel terrible for everybody that does any kind of pre-game dog and pony show right now at Apogee... I'm there 30 minutes before kick just about every game...BUT NOBODY ELSE IS... it has to be completely deflating for the football team to come out all fired up and see an empty stadium... but hey, the band is there... maybe even wearing uniforms... wow.

wanting all this stupid crap above and beyond what the band is currently doing is just silly. I don't come to watch the band, but I completely acknowledge how good they are. Give me good players and a good ensemble over stupid looking uniforms and quasi-military marching around any day of the week and twice on Saturdays. btw, has anybody ever noticed that we STILL, for the last 30 years or so had the best drumline in the world...period end stop? anybody? but, you guys have to harp on the fact that they aren't wearing clown outfits...

look, we all want to have what ohio state and wisconsin have... of course we'd want 100 years of awesome tradition and 100k fans at every game. I can tell you this much though...when I have gone to those Ohio State games, I come away remembering the game and the roar of the crowd, not those stupid band and drum major outfits...

Give me a break, -5...

If none of that was meaningful to you when you went to Ohio State games then this thread is not meant for you. And I don't understand why you are still posing on the subject. But the vast majority of fans (derived from the word fanatic) want and need the show.

You know, North Texas is approaching 100 years of having organized football (1914 was the first year), and I think that our school, alumni, students and sports teams deserve to have even half of the pageantry and traditions that the schools we have been discussing in this thread take for granted.

It's time for our only tradition, apathy, to go away. And it's time for our great musical organization to stop treating North Texas football games as lab time for future High School band directors.

[Green Mean]

I don't have a dog in this fight either way but I do think nice uniforms would look cool tho wearing those things in during the early season home games when its 90+ degrees isn't pretty. I'm not sure that khakis is the solution either but surely there are ways to look great, unformed and in sync regardless of game day weather/temperature etc.

That said I think it's usually split...there are some who absolutely love the marching band and what it means to college athletics and yet there are many that don't really care about it and it's just a stop gap between the game action.

[SilverEagle]

Silver, this one brings back childhood memories and it is damned emotional when you are there. The drum major is a showman ala the Ohio State dude. I saw my first Notre Dame game about 1954 and the band has the same entrance and effect on the crowd today as it did back then.

EagleMBA, your leading sentence makes my point. Sorry I didn't catch it, but I was blinded by my dislike for ND.

There is no reason why the same memories, make that STRONG MEMORIES, can't be created at Apogee by a crowd that gets pumped up by a "Band-without-musical-peer" that only needs to add PAGEANTRY to it's repertoire.

And BTW, all spirit (?) groups have to do their part in this as well.

[UNTGuy5]

I hate threads like this.

I start typing arguements, then I get frustrated and have to stop.

I think I'm just going to say this:

The band is loud, and they sound awesome. You're welcome.

People should stop complaining about the good things that are here, and start realizing that complaining about the best marching band in the nation makes you look silly.

I loved my time in the GB. Though we don't have all the pomp and circumstance that other bands have, other bands don't play as awesome as we do.

Let me preface by saying I agree that you guys sound loud and the musical talent of the band is second to none. However, the casual football fan can't tell a difference between how loud and awesome the Green Brigade sound and how loud and awesome most any other college band sounds. And generally, they don't care how precisely the music is played, so long as it's loud.

The fans don't go to a band concert and football game just so happens to be played at the same time and place. The pageantry of the band, and their performance in pre-game, in the stands, and at halftime, is part of what makes game-day, game-day.

That being said, some extra pageantry and spirit would only seem to further your lead as the best band in the country. And, it would help make game-day a more enjoyable experience for the fans that are there for the football game, and not the band concert.

[UNTLifer]

I love the Green Brigade, have since I was a youngster and remember great marching routines and one where they looked like and acted out a working typewriter. The drumline was always awesome and performed for the crowd, and the Talons were one of the coolest groups in the stands with these big cowbells. Scrappy drove around the track in a lime green go cart, etc... I also think the band should always be in uniform. Sorry, but t-shirts and khaki's looks bad.

Now, regarding the heat, etc... why can't a uniform be made out of a tech material like Nikes' Dri-Fit or Addidas Clima Cool? With the technology of today, having band members march around in the heat in wool suits, or whatever they are made of, is ridiculous. Bring back the spats!

kaleb, don't let a few comments from a very few on here discourage you. You guys always sound awesome, but I do agree that games being considered lab time for teaching high school kids ridiculous. And, if it is to be used as a training exercise, then strive to learn and eventually teach the HS kids some routines that would far exceed anything done before.

[EagleMBA]

EagleMBA, your leading sentence makes my point. Sorry I didn't catch it, but I was blinded by my dislike for ND.

There is no reason why the same memories, make that STRONG MEMORIES, can't be created at Apogee by a crowd that gets pumped up by a "Band-without-musical-peer" that only needs to add PAGEANTRY to it's repertoire.

And BTW, all spirit (?) groups have to do their part in this as well.

Silver, I understand your distaste for the Irish. If I hadn't grown up five miles from the stadium and if my uncle hadn't been an usher so he could slip me some comp tickets I might have attached to someone else. I wanted to add in that post that the whole area is solidly behind Notre Dame. We're talking South Bend, Mishawaka, Elkhart, and some lower Michigan towns like Niles. You can hardly go anywhere without seeing some reference to Notre Dame, and gameday is as sacred as Sunday.

Having said that, I am green to the bone and casually keep up with ND as my second choice now.

[kalebschumann]

I love the Green Brigade, have since I was a youngster and remember great marching routines and one where they looked like and acted out a working typewriter. The drumline was always awesome and performed for the crowd, and the Talons were one of the coolest groups in the stands with these big cowbells. Scrappy drove around the track in a lime green go cart, etc... I also think the band should always be in uniform. Sorry, but t-shirts and khaki's looks bad.

Now, regarding the heat, etc... why can't a uniform be made out of a tech material like Nikes' Dri-Fit or Addidas Clima Cool? With the technology of today, having band members march around in the heat in wool suits, or whatever they are made of, is ridiculous. Bring back the spats!

kaleb, don't let a few comments from a very few on here discourage you. You guys always sound awesome, but I do agree that games being considered lab time for teaching high school kids ridiculous. And, if it is to be used as a training exercise, then strive to learn and eventually teach the HS kids some routines that would far exceed anything done before.

Don't worry. I'm not discouraged. I also think the band should be in uniform for every game, and I do agree that shorts, black socks, and black socks look tacky. But there aren't always enough unfiforms for the band. The "show bands" are always in uniform because the athletic departments are able to completely subsidize the athletic bands.

[DeepGreen]

Don't worry. I'm not discouraged. I also think the band should be in uniform for every game, and I do agree that shorts, black socks, and black socks look tacky. But there aren't always enough unfiforms for the band. The "show bands" are always in uniform because the athletic departments are able to completely subsidize the athletic bands.

I call bullsh!t on this! Let me get this straight, the Green Brigade is a OJT/Laboratory for future high school band directors, run by the school of music? Am I correct so far? Then shouldn't the lack of uniforms be the responsibility of, and subsidized by the Music Department? Surely they have the money for enough uniforms for the GB. How do other universities fund their bands? School of Music or Athletic Departments? In my opinion, the department that funds it, runs it. And if our School of Music is running the band then they are doing a piss poor job.

Edited January 5, 2012 by DeepGreen

[SilverEagle]

The Uniform issue is not so important to me. The bands that I used in my initial post are all in a cooler part of the United States, so they wear the same unis all year long. The reality for us is that something lighter and cooler needs to be worn in September. I've seen the Longwhorn Band in polos and shorts, the Aggie Band always wears khaki. And I think I've seen some other Texas bands in shorts and polos.

My only mention of uni's had to do with Ohio St's uni's which they've worn (I assume because of TRADITION) for decades. The North Texas uni's of the 60's looked very much like them, including the spats,(except ours had a half-cape with NT on it), and I just feel that we should have kept the same style to continue the tradition.....you know, that thing that is so sorely lacking at our University.

The North Texas band of the 60's also (like all the bands in the initial post)starting their performance with a fanfare. They didn't attempt a grand entrance, because Fouts did not lend itself to such a thing. APOGEE DOES.

[Green to the Bone]

Full-length raccoon coats, straw hats, letter sweaters, triangular pennants on little sticks, mandatory freshman beanies, impromtu crooning, either a capella or with a ukelele, and GB gripes. The very best of college traditions.

[Stan R]

Does this mean we will need a Band recruiting section of the board? Do we need to start tracking Tuba player's 40 times? awesome.

[Green to the Bone]

Does this mean we will need a Band recruiting section of the board? Do we need to start tracking Tuba player's 40 times? awesome.

Shako stickers.

[Quoner]

This will need a baseball style scouting system.

70 grade embouchure.

70 grade rhythm

60 grade endurance

80 grade musicality

60 grade marching (can be developed thanks to higher rhythm tool)

60 grade sight-reading (can be developed)

80 grade character/loyalty

Do you have any idea how well a left-handed euphonium player with these kind of reports projects by his senior year!?

Edited January 5, 2012 by Quoner

[untjim1995]

The fact is that a good amount of attendants to North Texas home games come just to wait for the halftime performance and then leave. That is what happens when your school and town have decided for decades to put the main emphasis on using music and arts as the university's window instead of athletics. The Green Brigade is probably awesome--I have never had even one reason to believe otherwise, but I also believe that a band's sole purpose at an athletic event is to play the fight song, the alma mater, and other songs that get the crowd going, which also incorporates the halftime performance.

I have never had a reason to ever care about what the band wore or their halftime performance because, get this, I got to a football stadium to watch the football game. The band being there is secondary to that, in my opinion. Same with going to the Super Pit for a hoops game. As a matter of fact, I like the direction the basketball pep band has gone versus when I was in school because they appear to have a lot of fun at games. Now, if there is a big marching performance between UNT and SMU at Apogee someday, I'll want our band to kill theirs--which wouldn't be hard, I'm sure. But I believe we are the only school in this state that has put more into music and arts instead of our athletic programs, so maybe that is why the rest of the state looks at us as if we are some kind of pariah when it comes to being conference members with us. Sure, alums of other schools like their band (A&M, Rice, Texas, and Tech all come to mind), but they really like their football teams much more. That's not how it is here in Denton.

I love listening to the bands at the big schools play their fight songs and seeing them dot their i's or whatever the other traditions are, but its because they have great teams or great history at the highest levels of college athletics--we don't. I can promise you that no band uniform, no marching performance, and no other non-football related activity will ever change the fact that until we decide that North Texas Football must be a winner and play better-known competition that other fans care about, the attendance at SBC games and games against Texas Southern will continue to stay about the same--and we call can see how well other conferences think about our school as a potential conference mate. Winning halftime with a performance that would make the Music Department proud is awesome, but we will continue to get to play teams that surround that terrific halftime performance from towns like Troy and Mobile Alabama, Murfreesboro, TN, Jonesboro, AR, and Monroe, LA for decades to come if we don't continue trying to get our team to be relevant in major college football circles. Not trying to hurt the music folks feelings here, but if this was about our band, we would be in the Big XII right now, based on what others tell me how good our Green Brigade is compared to other bands. But having a poorly supported football team gets you the Sun Belt and apparently very little hope of ever getting to move upward, which in the end, costs the entire university and city millions of dollars in opportunities lost.

[SilverEagle]

Do we even have a drum major?

I believe we currently have three.

The Green Brigade of my youth (60's) used to have just one, and he dressed just like the Ohio St., Wisconsin, and Michigan band drum majors.

Here is an image from 1965.

http://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth61034/m1/60/?q=band

Interesting shot of the press box in it's original configuration in that photo.

Here is an image of a band member of the same year with his cape attached. Trombone player in the large pic on the left.

http://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth61034/m1/143/?q=band