My honest, objective, opinion

emmitt01 · November 3, 2011

As I look at the conference realignment landscape I am not filled with the unabashed optimism that some here are. I'm not as excited every time I see SMU get one step closer to AQ status. I don't buy that their absence will automatically entitle us to their table scraps. Would it make sense to pick up North Texas so that your league teams could come into the DFW market consistently? Yes. Could schools still recruit DFW WITHOUT having to have a DFW school? Of course. Do I place our chances to landing in CUSA any better than 50/50? Nope. Sooooo, here's what I would propose if I had Dr. Rawlins' and RV's ear. The MWC is soon to snatch Utah St and SJSU from the WAC to replace Boise and Air Force. This will greatly decrease the stubborn attitudes of schools like La Tech. Sure, La Tech will hold onto the dream of CUSA until the bitter end...but I'd be speaking to them through back channels in the meantime so that they're an easy get when reality sets in for them. I'd be reaching out to UTSA and Texas St as well. I know, I know, being with upstarts like them is a fate worse than death...or something like that. But a SBC with divisions where we could play more Louisiana and Texas schools is not any worse than where we sit now, in fact it's better. And you could argue that UTSA will fall off after the first season "honeymoon" is over...but I think being in a league with more local teams would help them to have some staying power.

Green Mean · November 3, 2011

Staying in the SBC is the last case scenario. Although there are openings in CUSA and in the MWC and those openings are there to be filled in and taken over. That is the most important think we need to be focusing on. Now if we lose out in the end then we can think about how to make the SBC better.

Coffee and TV · November 3, 2011

Staying in the SBC is the last case scenario. Although there are openings in CUSA and in the MWC and those openings are there to be filled in and taken over. That is the most important think we need to be focusing on. Now if we lose out in the end then we can think about how to make the SBC better.

Technically while we're the lowest rung of FBS football, the Sun Belt is the most stable conference of the the last half decade. I dunno, I don't think it would be that bad.

NM Green · November 3, 2011

SMU was a big hurdle and for 25 years we have yet to carve out our own identity and circumvent them. Further they railed against us at every turn. Now that hurdle is gone. It is off to the BE where they will do okay but again I look at what programs are doing and think this is our chance. While everyone has grown from being in a regional league (exception TCU), we have never had that luxury at the top tier of football. You might even argue that even more people knew us in the Southland as North Texas State. While everyone is choosing to go outward we have a great chance of going regional to grow our program. Now this by no way means we turn down an invite to the MWC because the company there is good. But those other programs are about to feel what we have been feeling the last 25 years since following UNT. Not having some close identity rich rivals can slow your growth. TCU is about to do just fine if Texas allows them to become the good but not great stepsister program ala TAMU. SMU is going to have Houston as a rival and the other programs are okay for them to battle with, but the Big East is not one of the premier leagues. It will do just fine and they will get their dough. But we will do just fine and build our base and identity again - finally.

I don't mind that scenario regarding La La Arkie State, UTSA and Texas State, but by making a leap to CUSA or MWC when offered we will stay one step ahead of the startups. That is not because I like going SMU on them, but our time has come to play with stronger foes and UTEP, Tulsa, Rice, New Mexico, Colorado State, UNLV, SDSU, Southern Miss...Those programs have been doing it awhile in fball and hoops and so have we. That is the company we should seek.

GMG

TIgreen01 · November 3, 2011

I agree with your assessment of the realignment landscape. I don't buy that conferences will add us solely to gain the DFW market. We may hail from DFW, but we're so far down the pecking order that I can't believe that our presence gains any more TV revenue for CUSA or MWC---which is what they REALLY want. If ESPN/Fox/etc tells CUSA and/or the MWC that adding us will help stave off some of the lost revenue from the departures of TCU/SMU in their next contract, then we're in. If not, then we're not.

Any idea how much our presence adds to the Sun Belt TV deal?

UNTflyer · November 3, 2011

If MWC is going to kill the WAC by taking Utah State and SJSU, we can get LA Tech and New Mexico State. And consider, would UTEP be willing to come to the Belt if they can get conference games in Las Cruces and a Texas rivalry in Dallas?

We don't need UTSA yet. We have a lot of options left before needing to consider calling up an FCS program.

untbowler · November 3, 2011

kill the WAC, we add UTSA, TSU, La Tech, NMSU. UTA goes back to Southland

CUSA grabs FAU, FIU, and WKU

UALR goes to Summit or Horizon

West Division:

UNT, NMSU, La Tech, UTSA, TSU, ULL

East Division

USA, ULM, ASU, MTSU, Troy, ???

PlummMeanGreen · November 3, 2011

I agree with most everything Emmitt or the rest of you post most the time and yes, the SBC is more stable at this time as well, but which last place teams of the SBC and CUSA this Fall would have drawn more at Apogee (with no bad weather, of course): FAU or Tulane?

I need to do more R and D on this, but I believe what would be left of CUSA schools still have far more alums living in DFW and within an hour of Apogee Stadium than most all the SBC schools. Trips to Rice (Houston) and Tulane (New Orleans) every other year makes CUSA enticing to many of you I've spoken or PM'ed and that is w/o Houston and SMU. Folks, none of this re-alignment business is over with even now. Some of these schools going east may in time have buyer's remorse, especially if the NCAA changes its whole bowl format and is more inclusive of non AQ leagues.

Yet all this happening now really reeks to most of us. I wish the Big Boys would get control of their emotions and damn pocketbooks and ESPN just start televising children programming instead of ram-rodding the entire freakin' NCAA and who which conferences should be add to their memberships--deserving or non-deserving.

I feel sorry for schools like Marshall, East Carolina and Southern Miss who put up big attendance numbers & have played by the rules yet now being treated like crap during this ESPN-dominated NCAA re-alignment era.

GMG!

Edited November 3, 2011 by PlummMeanGreen

ntmeangreen11 · November 3, 2011

I think we're in a really, really good position. If any of you listened to the podcast last night, Brett Vito said CUSA officials have been to our games occasionally over the past few years and especially this year.

That's why these last three games are very important, we need to win atleast 2 of them and have over 20k for both WKU and MTSU. You bet your sweet ass CUSA officials will be at those two games. I keep hearing that the alliance will prevent the MWC/CUSA from adding teams, but that doesn't make sense to me. If CUSA doesn't add us and a Florida school and whoever else they want to for the third spot, they'll lose significant TV contract dollars, and they'll owe ESPN for breaching the championship game contract. I don't expect them to move quickly, but the good news is this is happening when he have a new stadium, have an athletic budget that will increase to atleast middle of the pack in the new CUSA and have a lot of excitement around the basketball program. Another thing is, if CUSA chooses to stay at 9, or if they want to do the alliance, they'll have such a huge landscape it will kill the non football sports in travel. It just doesn't make sense, trust me, RV has had this goal to get in to CUSA for a long time, I feel pretty confident it will happen. I want us, one of FIU/FAU, and either Temple, UTSA, or MT to get the invite. I've read that CUSA minus UH/SMU/UCF plus UNT/FAU/MT would be about equal in terms of football strength, and to a certain extent, that's true, but I think two years down the road that will not be the case at all. FAU will be getting a new coach, and the current CUSA schools will vault to the top over the next couple of seasons.

Green Mean · November 3, 2011

Technically while we're the lowest rung of FBS football, the Sun Belt is the most stable conference of the the last half decade. I dunno, I don't think it would be that bad.

Stable I will definitely agree with you but if you want stability from the non aq conferences I think the MAC is probably the most stable out of all. I think the MAC is an underrated conference.

NM Green · November 3, 2011

I like FAU over FIU because of their commitment. They will begin to re-emerge and they already have good baseball. You add in two new school with brand new stadiums and large alumni bases in recruiting hotbeds and you will do okay. The goal from here on out should be big alumni bases and commitment to athletics in regards to facilities, program development and performance and location location location.

Thank goodness for the students and for Apogee!

GMG

El Paso Eagle · November 3, 2011

If MWC is going to kill the WAC by taking Utah State and SJSU, we can get LA Tech and New Mexico State. And consider, would UTEP be willing to come to the Belt if they can get conference games in Las Cruces and a Texas rivalry in Dallas?

We don't need UTSA yet. We have a lot of options left before needing to consider calling up an FCS program.

I think, IMO, UTEP would try almost anything to stay out of the same conference as NMSU.

Wag Tag · November 3, 2011

CUSA is going to walk away from Florida and DFW so they can be strong in Memphis and Birmingham !! Not going to happen. Do we bring the DFW market like SMU did....yes. You will never have a presence n a market if u r not n it !! CUSA west .. UNT , UTEP, RICE, TULSA, La TECH, Memphis..revenue is from TV and filling the stadiums!!!! Create regional competition were fans can travel to the games and save on travel expense ! We could send our band to all of these locations. <_<

KRAM1 · November 3, 2011

Who is to say that will all the realignment "stuff" going on that the Sun Belt doesn't come out of all this with a few new faces that would add some pizazz and status to the conference that it doesn't have now? The chips are no where near through falling and as some have mentioned here, some decent schools seem to be left holding the bag in all this. It would not be the end of the world to have a reconstituted Sun Belt Conference that adds some teams (maybe loses a few as well) and moves up the food chain a bit.

It's something it seems no one here has even mentioned. I cannot imagine that the Sun Belt office folks are just sitting around thinking that none of this realignment crap has any effect on them...not to mention the conference athletic departments.

Some you you folks give our administration little to no credit for anything always pointing what YOU think are their failures while never even seemingly opening your eyes to all the positive that has taken place both on and off the field of play at UNT. To think that both the Sun Belt and UNT are just sitting idly by twitching their thumbs is just nuts. This is not even to mention the other AD's around the league.

These are strange and interesting times in college athletics these days. I'd like to believe that "our guys and gals" are on top of all this as much as anyone. The idea that the Sun Belt could emerge stronger and better is definitely not out of the realm of possibility. In my humble opinion, that is.....

GrayEagle · November 3, 2011

I agree with your assessment of the realignment landscape. I don't buy that conferences will add us solely to gain the DFW market. We may hail from DFW, but we're so far down the pecking order that I can't believe that our presence gains any more TV revenue for CUSA or MWC---which is what they REALLY want. If ESPN/Fox/etc tells CUSA and/or the MWC that adding us will help stave off some of the lost revenue from the departures of TCU/SMU in their next contract, then we're in. If not, then we're not.

Any idea how much our presence adds to the Sun Belt TV deal?

The first thing that sports networks look at is the TV homes served. It allows them to sell to advertisers; the more viewers, the more buyers, the better their rate. There is no single university that can deliver the DFW market because it is so large and diverse. North Texas has more than 200,000 living alumni. Approximately half are located in the Metroplex. The Mountain West and CUSA can garner a better TV package if they have large student and alumni bases in major markets. If we are competitive we can garner many more viewers than the only team in a small/medium market. Ten percent of the Dallas-Fort Worth market is greater than the entire Nashville market (and there are about fifty markets smaller than Nashville). Believe me, we will add presence to the DFW market.

As to to your question about our helping the Sun Belt TV package...probably very little, if at all. The reason is Cox and Charter do not broadcast into this area. There is a little revenue generated by those few games that are picked up by Channel 21 and broadcast into the area. It's also possible that ESPN3 generates some income from our presence. We should definitely be more advantageous for CUSA and the MWC.

TIgreen01 · November 3, 2011

The first thing that sports networks look at is the TV homes served. It allows them to sell to advertisers; the more viewers, the more buyers, the better their rate. There is no single university that can deliver the DFW market because it is so large and diverse. North Texas has more than 200,000 living alumni. Approximately half are located in the Metroplex. The Mountain West and CUSA can garner a better TV package if they have large student and alumni bases in major markets. If we are competitive we can garner many more viewers than the only team in a small/medium market. Ten percent of the Dallas-Fort Worth market is greater than the entire Nashville market (and there are about fifty markets smaller than Nashville). Believe me, we will add presence to the DFW market.

As to to your question about our helping the Sun Belt TV package...probably very little, if at all. The reason is Cox and Charter do not broadcast into this area. There is a little revenue generated by those few games that are picked up by Channel 21 and broadcast into the area. It's also possible that ESPN3 generates some income from our presence. We should definitely be more advantageous for CUSA and the MWC.

Ok, good response. So you're saying that b/c CUSA has their TV deal with Fox Net, we are more likely to have our games broadcast in DFW and we'll have a larger potential for Fox to gain advertisers, than even, say SMU, based on #'s of living alumni in the area? If this is true, wouldn't the TV networks have been clamoring for us to get a shot at a better league long ago? Also, why did our presence in DFW not drive a better TV deal (ie--with a network that broadcasts in DFW) for the Sun Belt?

Edited November 3, 2011 by TIgreen01

PlummMeanGreen · November 3, 2011

The first thing that sports networks look at is the TV homes served. It allows them to sell to advertisers; the more viewers, the more buyers, the better their rate. There is no single university that can deliver the DFW market because it is so large and diverse. North Texas has more than 200,000 living alumni. Approximately half are located in the Metroplex. The Mountain West and CUSA can garner a better TV package if they have large student and alumni bases in major markets. If we are competitive we can garner many more viewers than the only team in a small/medium market. Ten percent of the Dallas-Fort Worth market is greater than the entire Nashville market (and there are about fifty markets smaller than Nashville). Believe me, we will add presence to the DFW market.

As to to your question about our helping the Sun Belt TV package...probably very little, if at all. The reason is Cox and Charter do not broadcast into this area. There is a little revenue generated by those few games that are picked up by Channel 21 and broadcast into the area. It's also possible that ESPN3 generates some income from our presence. We should definitely be more advantageous for CUSA and the MWC.

A double amen!

:thumbsu:

GMG!

Edited November 3, 2011 by PlummMeanGreen

UNTflyer · November 3, 2011

I still don't understand everyone's fascination with UTSA. Attendance is bad enough playing schools called Louisiana-Lafayette, Louisiana-Monroe, Arkansas-Little Rock, and Florida International. It makes the whole league sound like Division III.

And I really don't understand the call to invite Louisiana-Lafayette to CUSA with us. We want our next conference to be an upgrade.

And if we stay in the Belt, for God's sake let's try to expand with the two closest WAC teams (NMSU and LA Tech) that don't sound like a glorified community college.

Harry · November 3, 2011

I still don't understand everyone's fascination with UTSA. Attendance is bad enough playing schools called Louisiana-Lafayette, Louisiana-Monroe, Arkansas-Little Rock, and Florida International. It makes the whole league sound like Division III.

And I really don't understand the call to invite Louisiana-Lafayette to CUSA with us. We want our next conference to be an upgrade.

And if we stay in the Belt, for God's sake let's try to expand with the two closest WAC teams (NMSU and LA Tech) that don't sound like a glorified community college.

My interest is San Antonio. I love that town. So does my wife and that means I get to go on away trips with my family. I also think they will bring fans to Apogee.

SilverEagle · November 3, 2011

My interest is San Antonio. I love that town. So does my wife and that means I get to go on away trips with my family. I also think they will bring fans to Apogee.

San Marcos is also a great out of town trip. And their fans have always come to Denton in very large numbers....and that was in our 1-AA days. They are also on the Amtrak line, so groups of D/FW NT fans could get there pretty stress free.

I really don't understand the dismissive attitude toward Tx St. and LaLa.

Green Mean · November 4, 2011

I really don't understand the dismissive attitude toward Tx St. and LaLa.

Our constant affection and discussion of SMU must have been a big influence on us.

Green Oracle · November 4, 2011

Win, win, win. Increase attendence. Get a baseball team. Win, win, win.

Cowtown · November 4, 2011

They were the only team that showed up in the 1AA days. I always enjoyed our bouts w the bobcats.

4 hour tailgate train to San Marcos...man, I could go for that.

Schedule them non conf just to make it happen.

San Marcos is also a great out of town trip. And their fans have always come to Denton in very large numbers....and that was in our 1-AA days. They are also on the Amtrak line, so groups of D/FW NT fans could get there pretty stress free.

I really don't understand the dismissive attitude toward Tx St. and LaLa.

greenminer · November 4, 2011

Would love to see at least a 1-1 deal with Texas State, just to get a feel for the travel and fan response.

LaLa is the one road trip I would take a bullet for; I hear so many good things year after year about the food/tailgating, etc. If we ever get out of the Belt, I would miss LaLa. I'm probably on my own in that regard.

Edited November 4, 2011 by greenminer

UNTflyer · November 4, 2011

I really don't understand the dismissive attitude toward Tx St. and LaLa.

Getting visitors to fill our stadium is not as important getting local residents and students to fill it.

Get the city of Denton and the campus behind this team, and I could care less if we play some community college from Alaska. But to suggest that we have to invite UTSA or SWTSU-SM in order to get a decent crowd says a lot about our expectations.