Steps that should be taken behind the scenes

UNT90 · September 19, 2011

Because we are all closet College A.D.s and head coaches, here is my list:

1) First and foremost, line up funding for stadium expansion. Be able to show that we can expand Apogee to 50K in one year if called upon.

2) Try to forge a partnership with ANY big 6 school in Texas a big 6 conference (ya, I know, good freaking luck). Let them know we will do ANYTHING that is asked to get a seat at the table. ANYTHING. See Texas Tech if you need an example..

3) Pray. Long and hard.

UNTBill · September 20, 2011

Because we are all closet College A.D.s and head coaches, here is my list:

1) First and foremost, line up funding for stadium expansion. Be able to show that we can expand Apogee to 50K in one year if called upon.

2) Try to forge a partnership with ANY big 6 school in Texas a big 6 conference (ya, I know, good freaking luck). Let them know we will do ANYTHING that is asked to get a seat at the table. ANYTHING. See Texas Tech if you need an example..

3) Pray. Long and hard.

I'll leave #'s 1 & 2 in the capable hands of others, but you can count on me to do my part with #3.

Go Mean Green

Green Mean · September 20, 2011

We have a great deal to offer. Huge public university in the state of Texas, new football stadium that can be expanded to 50K very quickly, etc. The thing that is killing is us the fact that we have been really really really bad in football the past 6+ years. the only other downside would be not having baseball yet but I think if a conference gave us that offer contingent on us getting baseball I am willing to bet that we would have baseball the following school year.

But yes if we have the funds necessary to expand to 50K immediately then we need to show that. And lots of praying will be required.

NM Green · September 20, 2011

With Dallas Baptist University and Cal State something getting invitations to the WAC today, how on earth is La Tech and NMSU not jumping to an improving Belt? We may be headed to a modified WAC during this realignment mess, but I say let's go get a couple of stable programs to stabilize the Belt. If FIU, Troy or MTSU get poached we can curtail the bleeding. Of course I hope we land in the MWC or new Big 12 but the WAC is moving and shaking in a strange way and the Belt is really quiet.

GMG

UNT90 · September 20, 2011

Unfortunately, the Belt is a conference teams are looking to leave right now, not join. La. Tech would rather stay in a pathetic WAC than slum it in the Belt. Ain't saying it's right, just saying perception is reality.

Huge mountain we are facing.

GrayEagle · September 20, 2011

I really believe that #3 should be #1 but all are important.

I do hope that there was some sort of contingent plan for financing should the need arise to expand the stadium to 50,000 but the Apogee naming rights should help soften public awareness. What bothers me is all of these expenses on the threshold of possible runaway inflation.

The only university that I see that could possibly help us is Texas A&M. I have some good friends who are Aggies but I'm afraid that they don't pull enough weight. I'm not sure that we've ever tried to make friends with anyone other than UT-Austin and if they go to the Pac-16 they couldn't anyway.

If Todd Dodge had been able to put together four winning seasons we'd be in an enviable position right now but if "ifs and buts" were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry Christmas.

mgfan · September 20, 2011

I find it hard to believe that La. Tech would rather stay in the WAC then join the SB. Not that the sunbelt is amazing but good gosh look at the WAC next year. It is not improving, but doing the exact opposite. I would rather stay the same then decline like the WAC.

Rudy · September 20, 2011

With Dallas Baptist University and Cal State something getting invitations to the WAC today,

Wait....WHAT?! I just got back from the gym. Did I miss something today?

Personally, I say hold all of the bc$ athletic directors hostage and force them to sign a document saying they will not form the superconferences, and give all of the "mid-majors" a chance to become a big boy.

But due to my profession, I will not endorse such action.

publicly.

Mean Green 93-98 · September 20, 2011

Unfortunately, the Belt is a conference teams are looking to leave right now, not join. La. Tech would rather stay in a pathetic WAC than slum it in the Belt. Ain't saying it's right, just saying perception is reality.

Huge mountain we are facing.

The big stumbling block with LaTech is ULM. If ULM were out of the picture, I think they'd jump off the sinking WAC ship quickly. Holding their noses, yes, but I believe they would take a ULM-less Belt over the present WAC.

NM Green · September 20, 2011

I was listening to the Ticket online today and they said Dallas Baptist was invited to the WAC along with Cal State something. It was on the ticket ticker.

Texas State

UTSA

Dallas Baptist

Cal State

UTA

I respect some of those programs above but if you believe that the new WAC is anywhere near the SBC you are smoking something!

GMG

ColoradoEagle · September 20, 2011

The thing that is killing is us the fact that we have been really really really bad in football the past 6+ years.

It doesn't help, but what kills us is lack of attendance. I was shocked that we didn't sell out the Houston game. Until we can get to the point where 31k fans fight for tickets every week, prompting the expansion to 50k, our large alumni base doesn't mean much.

We have 7100 show up to watch us play Tech last year, and then 3500 a week later for Rice. We need both football and basketball to be impossible tickets to get.

I think we'll get there, but like RV said on the podcast a few weeks ago, we need people to show up to watch North Texas unconditionally.

Edited September 20, 2011 by ColoradoEagle

GrandGreen · September 20, 2011

I find it hard to believe that La. Tech would rather stay in the WAC then join the SB. Not that the sunbelt is amazing but good gosh look at the WAC next year. It is not improving, but doing the exact opposite. I would rather stay the same then decline like the WAC.

Why does anyone care what La Tech does? They have stated over and over again their opinion of Belt membership and it is not like they would elevate the Belt with their presence.

As far as the three suggestions, funding of the next step of the stadium is a lot less concern than establishing the need for it. As far as finding a sponsor among the big six schools, no amount of begging or influence NT can muster is going to accomplish that. It is obvious ever school is out for itself, and the only way a NT or any other school get to move up in the football world is for them to get their program to a level that other schools want to be associated with it.

NT is the best shape they have ever been even with a losing football team. In the current environment you have the OU and UT's scrambling for a better position and the lesser AQ schools such as Iowa State,Kansas, Tech, and Baylor looking not to move up but to hang on. It is my belief that the NT administration is doing whatever they can to move NT up but there are limits. Even the power teams are finding it difficult to make the right moves.

untjim1995 · September 20, 2011

At this point, its probably just too late to even do anything more to get consideration. The new facilities, especially the stadium, are awesome for non-AQ schools, probably better than some AQ schools. But the 64-80 schools that are going to break off here have more tradition, $$$, fan support, and name recognition nationally than we have. Sure, we have enrollment and alumni advantages, but they were never taken advantage of. Academically, we are a Tier 3 school with a woefully small endowment, so no big conference who cares about academics is going to take us on that accord. Our athletic accomplishments for 30+ years is amazingly slim (1-3 in NO Bowls, 0-3 in NCAA Tournament as 15 seeds with all being blowouts, never won a playoff game in the old 1-aa). Neither of these has made us attractive to other conferences.

I love our alma mater--it gave me my start in life and will always be a special place to me. But we just got started too late in this game to really be surprised at where we will be playing in the few decades. If the NCAA were a consortium of music and arts schools, we would be a powerhouse--we would be Duke in basketball or Alabama in football. Its what the university and the community wanted forever, probably still do for the most part. If we are at the new FCS-type level again after this is all said and done, I don't know what the support for the football and basketball teams will look like, but I know that they will always be ours. I know that we never supported the school that well during the SLC days, but maybe we will keep up this current level of support if our new conference mates are better known that our old Southland/SBC bunkmates.

oldguystudent · September 20, 2011

Cal St. Bakersfield and Dallas Baptist have accepted bids as members of the WAC in baseball only. Bakersfield has been a D1 independent since 2007 and is still looking for a conference as the Big West has repeatedly rebuffed inquiries. They are still without a conference for basketball.

Dallas Baptist is also a D1 independent who has had amazing success in baseball.

The WAC, losing Fresno St, Hawaii, and Nevada would otherwise be down to 4 teams in baseball.

What I've been wondering about the WAC is if they're going to end up as the new Big West. They're taking in piece meal members in individual sports, and that (as we at UNT know all to well) hasn't worked out very well historically. My prediction is that they stop sponsoring football altogether withing 5 years.

greenjoe · September 20, 2011

We gotta win. Plain and simple. Winning gets us noticed. Losing makes us a punchline. Winning will solve attendance problems and get us more home games and therefore lessen the need for money games.

Many are quick to criticize the Sun Belt. The Sun Belt is our home conference and we have not been doing well in what some have described as a weak conference.

We need to talk up the Sun Belt and win there. The rest will take care of itself.

GO MEAN GREEN

jazzer88 · September 20, 2011

It doesn't help, but what kills us is lack of attendance. I was shocked that we didn't sell out the Houston game. Until we can get to the point where 31k fans fight for tickets every week, prompting the expansion to 50k, our large alumni base doesn't mean much.

We have 7100 show up to watch us play Tech last year, and then 3500 a week later for Rice. We need both football and basketball to be impossible tickets to get.

I think we'll get there, but like RV said on the podcast a few weeks ago, we need people to show up to watch North Texas unconditionally.

I couldn't agree more. We didn't sell out the OPENING of a new stadium (I was shocked as well). Consistent and active fans mean everything. Potentially consistent and active fans doesn't mean much.

GrandGreen · September 20, 2011

At this point, its probably just too late to even do anything more to get consideration. The new facilities, especially the stadium, are awesome for non-AQ schools, probably better than some AQ schools. But the 64-80 schools that are going to break off here have more tradition, $$$, fan support, and name recognition nationally than we have. Sure, we have enrollment and alumni advantages, but they were never taken advantage of. Academically, we are a Tier 3 school with a woefully small endowment, so no big conference who cares about academics is going to take us on that accord. Our athletic accomplishments for 30+ years is amazingly slim (1-3 in NO Bowls, 0-3 in NCAA Tournament as 15 seeds with all being blowouts, never won a playoff game in the old 1-aa). Neither of these has made us attractive to other conferences.

I love our alma mater--it gave me my start in life and will always be a special place to me. But we just got started too late in this game to really be surprised at where we will be playing in the few decades. If the NCAA were a consortium of music and arts schools, we would be a powerhouse--we would be Duke in basketball or Alabama in football. Its what the university and the community wanted forever, probably still do for the most part. If we are at the new FCS-type level again after this is all said and done, I don't know what the support for the football and basketball teams will look like, but I know that they will always be ours. I know that we never supported the school that well during the SLC days, but maybe we will keep up this current level of support if our new conference mates are better known that our old Southland/SBC bunkmates.

The sky is falling, what makes you think that any schools are going to break off? The forming of so called super conferences doesn't change any one's position but those that may be in AQ conferences and are left out. The Belt is still the Belt and it is still in the FB division. There are no tier 3 schools anymore, and I find your statement that no conference who cares about academics would have NT is way off the mark. Unless, NT is trying to join the Ivy League, I doubt academics are a negative.

TIgreen01 · September 20, 2011

Step 1) Punch an Aggie.

Step 2) Take a deep breath.

Step 3) Realize that our plot in the grand scheme of college football is not changing. We are already an outsider. Schools like Baylor, Iowa St, etc are about to join us.

- After all of the dust settles, what really changes is that there are fewer big money schools, and more on the outside looking in. I can't see the 4 conferences breaking off into a new division. I just think they are going to end up renegotiating their TV contracts and making more money. Maybe they rewrite the BCS rules a bit and now allow the 4 new superconferences 2 auto-bids, instead of one. That still leaves 2 open for non-AQ conferences. Maybe this leads to playoffs down the road, but right off the bat? Not likely. I'm going to treat the rumor of these conferences "breaking off into a new division" as pure rumor being floated by the schools most likely to be harmed in all of this shuffling (Baylor, etc) until proven otherwise.

- We have, before us, the same challenges that we had before all this started...but we have a new stadium, the most glorious tailgating grounds in the state, a committment to a quality coaching staff and athletic department. I still think we're on the uptick. Unless our administration suddenly pulls a 180, we're going to be fine....and in 5 years, we'll be better off than we are now. Mark it down.

Edited September 20, 2011 by TIgreen01

untjim1995 · September 20, 2011

The sky is falling, what makes you think that any schools are going to break off? The forming of so called super conferences doesn't change any one's position but those that may be in AQ conferences and are left out. The Belt is still the Belt and it is still in the FB division. There are no tier 3 schools anymore, and I find your statement that no conference who cares about academics would have NT is way off the mark. Unless, NT is trying to join the Ivy League, I doubt academics are a negative.

We see things differently, which is just fine, but I don't see how you can watch all of this stuff going on with conference affiliation and think we are going to be ok. These superconferences aren't doing this because it is just the cool thing to do. The money and control they will have is huge. The NCAA knows it, too, which is why they aren't stopping anything. They want to keep their NCAA Tournament, which pays 95% of their bills, so they aren't going to take the chance of seeing a new affiliation of universities get created if they can stop it. ESPN, Fox, and CBS have billions on the line here. They know who brings the ratings week in and week out--it ain't the Sun Belt or CUSA.

As far as academics, there are lots of folks in the Pac-7095 that don't want Tech or Okie State, but they know they are tag alongs with UT and OU. You may well remember that issue that the Big Ten had with Texas when they were considering admission last year--the so-called "Tech Problem". That was all about Tech's academic ranking as the #160 school in the USNWR, which is piss poor by AQ standards, absolutely unacceptable to the research-driven B1G. OSU's not much better. The ACC, Pac, and B1G alll have fairly strong academic standards to follow. Only the SEC has fairly relaxed standards on this--and Tech would still be last in the USNWR rankings if they joined the SEC. Now realize Tech ranks higher than the other Texas FBS public universities on that list. This is what I was talking about. You can debate if that is fair or not, but it gets followed fairly closely by the conferences when they are looking at expansion. Tech ain't going to the Pac-whatever if Texas doesn't go--they are an accessory.

GrandGreen · September 20, 2011

We see things differently, which is just fine, but I don't see how you can watch all of this stuff going on with conference affiliation and think we are going to be ok. These superconferences aren't doing this because it is just the cool thing to do. The money and control they will have is huge. The NCAA knows it, too, which is why they aren't stopping anything. They want to keep their NCAA Tournament, which pays 95% of their bills, so they aren't going to take the chance of seeing a new affiliation of universities get created if they can stop it. ESPN, Fox, and CBS have billions on the line here. They know who brings the ratings week in and week out--it ain't the Sun Belt or CUSA.

As far as academics, there are lots of folks in the Pac-7095 that don't want Tech or Okie State, but they know they are tag alongs with UT and OU. You may well remember that issue that the Big Ten had with Texas when they were considering admission last year--the so-called "Tech Problem". That was all about Tech's academic ranking as the #160 school in the USNWR, which is piss poor by AQ standards, absolutely unacceptable to the research-driven B1G. OSU's not much better. The ACC, Pac, and B1G alll have fairly strong academic standards to follow. Only the SEC has fairly relaxed standards on this--and Tech would still be last in the USNWR rankings if they joined the SEC. Now realize Tech ranks higher than the other Texas FBS public universities on that list. This is what I was talking about. You can debate if that is fair or not, but it gets followed fairly closely by the conferences when they are looking at expansion. Tech ain't going to the Pac-whatever if Texas doesn't go--they are an accessory.

Didn't say everything would be ok, way to early for that. I did say I don't think they will break off into a separate classification. Frankly, did not contemplate NT being a candidate for either the Big Ten or PAC but even there, I wonder who rates schools academically. Does the college administration go by what one magazine US News and Reports decides? Frankly neither of those conferences would have any interest in NT no matter what the academics were.

Again, I don't see were NT ends up any worse than they currently are, is NT to be cast into the WAC? It is possible I guess that SMU and Houston get more separation than they currently have but also possible that Baylor, Tech and others lose ground. Tech may go to the Pac and that goes opposite to your academic concern. They have raised their published admission standards but little else elevates Tech above NT on the academic side.

All of this is a money grab and don't fall behind conference shuffle. Academics are often cited as an issue, but are quickly trumped by other factors.

foutsrouts · September 20, 2011

Too bad we can't just wave a magic wand and quadruple our endowment, because I have no doubt that university presidents and other decision makers snicker when they see it. Hard to believe that even both FU's have us beat in that area, when we were founded around 75 years before they were founded in the mid-60's. We just need to start winning.