Baylor suing the SEC

Hunter Green · September 7, 2011

ESPN is reporting that Baylor University is suing the SEC for accepting aTm into the SEC. I'm sure Baylor has figured out that it will be the odd man out if all of the re-alignment speculation comes to fruition. If OU, OSU, Texas Tech and Texas alll bolt the big 12, that leaves a lot of schools scrambling to find a home. With all that in mind, it makes me wish that Dr. Rollins, Rick, and Coach Mac to take the lead in proposing a re-vamped Southwest Conference, or (insert new name). I know this has been talked about ad-nauseum, but the schools left out of the mix; NT, smu, Baylor, Tulsa, Iowa St, Houston, Ark. St, La. La., UTSA, UTEP, La. Tech and Tx. State could form a viable, regional conference that, IMHO, be an attractive venue that could keep the "Big 12" afloat.

Thoughts?

UNTMike81 · September 7, 2011

Good for Baylor!!! I'd like UNT to be in BCS Texas league, we're not and that's a shame. However, to brake up a conference that is in BCS that features enough Texas school's to allow our superior Texas HS talent to stay at in State school is a must!!! The NCAA with SMU death penalty and others have been trying to change Texas HS recruiting for years. Currently if any school deserves the death penalty it's Miami, will they get death penalty, NO!!!

I have no love loss for UT, but I'm really irked at A&M. A&M has a long way to go to become a "UT" and running away from them and causing the break up of the BigXII is a childish way of trying to get better. A&M will get their butt's kicked in the SEC, same as Arkansas!!

Edited September 7, 2011 by UNTMike81

ColoradoEagle · September 7, 2011

The rumors are that they already stood down from this. In other news...

cdizzle86 · September 7, 2011

Good for Baylor!!! I'd like UNT to be in BCS Texas league, we're not and that's a shame. However, to brake up a conference that is in BCS that features enough Texas school's to allow our superior Texas HS talent to stay at in State school is a must!!! The NCAA with SMU death penalty and others have been trying to change Texas HS recruiting for years. Currently if any school deserves the death penalty it's Miami, will they get death penalty, NO!!!

I have no love loss for UT, but I'm really irked at A&M. A&M has a long way to go to become a "UT" and running away from them and causing the break up of the BigXII is a childish way of trying to get better. A&M will get their butt's kicked in the SEC, same as Arkansas!!

Can't say I agree with any of this. If you want to point the finger at anyone, you should be pointing at Texas because of their greed. The Big 12 use to be a fair conference, but the LHN has quickly turned that around. A&M is just doing what's best for their university and I applaud them for standing up to Texas and leaving the Big 12. Texas needs to be brought back to reality.

Green Mean · September 7, 2011

Baylor is desperate. No need to sue the SEC.

Eagle1855 · September 7, 2011

I think the issue is they, along with several other schools in the Big 12, refused to sign waivers saying they wouldn't sue, not that they were going to sue. In that instance, I don't blame them.

Last year, the TV contract was up. A&M knew the LHN was to become a reality and they knew the terms of the new TV deal and they agreed to all of them, making a commitment to remain in the Big 12. A&M is the one that is going back on their word, not the rest of the instituions. They've managed to make Baylor look like the bad guys, but who could blame Baylor? Baylor made commitments to coaching staff based on expected money from the Big 12's new deals... without the Big 12, they stand to put themselves in a really tight spot. As I understand it, Baylor receives no state funding for athletics or academics.

Everyone knows Baylor is getting left out in the cold if all these schools split. In that sense, they're essentially asking Baylor to sign off on its own execution. In this situation, Baylor is doing the exact same thing A&M is doing: protecting their best interests. And yet somehow they're the villain? Come on.

Also, all this poor A&M stuff about the LHN is fetid tripe. A&M knew about the network and had the opportunity to be a part of it. They said no. OU is considering their own network as well. This is the direction of college football, for better or worse, and ESPN chose UT to start it.

Edited September 7, 2011 by Eagle1855

Quoner · September 7, 2011

Man, so all it takes to get clout is to go 18-125 in your conference? Maybe we do belong in the Big 12.

UNT90 · September 7, 2011

ESPN is reporting that Baylor University is suing the SEC for accepting aTm into the SEC. I'm sure Baylor has figured out that it will be the odd man out if all of the re-alignment speculation comes to fruition. If OU, OSU, Texas Tech and Texas alll bolt the big 12, that leaves a lot of schools scrambling to find a home. With all that in mind, it makes me wish that Dr. Rollins, Rick, and Coach Mac to take the lead in proposing a re-vamped Southwest Conference, or (insert new name). I know this has been talked about ad-nauseum, but the schools left out of the mix; NT, smu, Baylor, Tulsa, Iowa St, Houston, Ark. St, La. La., UTSA, UTEP, La. Tech and Tx. State could form a viable, regional conference that, IMHO, be an attractive venue that could keep the "Big 12" afloat.

Thoughts?

My thought is that there is no way in hell that Baylor, SMU, Iowa St. Houston or La Tech would even want to consider the idea of something like this.

We all know the reasons why.

UNTflyer · September 7, 2011

This is really our best shot - when Texas, Tech, OU, and OSU leave we should form an alliance with Houston, Tulsa, and SMU to get the Big 12 to at least 9.

We all need to hang together or we will surely hang separately.

Green Mean · September 7, 2011

My thought is that there is no way in hell that Baylor, SMU, Iowa St. Houston or La Tech would even want to consider the idea of something like this.

We all know the reasons why.

Very true...tho they may just be SOL and won't have any other choice. But if I am Baylor, Iowa State etc why not form somewhat of a super conference with the MWC? There's been talk of them making them a BCS conference and even though they don't have Utah, BYU, or TCU anymore...Baylor, ISU, BSU, Nevada etc would all be more than formidable schools that the BCS would consider including them. Its conferences like the MAC, SBC, and even CUSA to a degree that have to worry the most I think.

UNTflyer · September 7, 2011

I know this has been talked about ad-nauseum, but the schools left out of the mix; NT, smu, Baylor, Tulsa, Iowa St, Houston, Ark. St, La. La., UTSA, UTEP, La. Tech and Tx. State could form a viable, regional conference that, IMHO, be an attractive venue that could keep the "Big 12" afloat.

Thoughts?

We don't need FCS teams.

cdizzle86 · September 7, 2011

This is really our best shot - when Texas, Tech, OU, and OSU leave we should form an alliance with Houston, Tulsa, and SMU to get the Big 12 to at least 9.

We all need to hang together or we will surely hang separately.

If they leave you can almost guarantee that the leftovers will find new homes as well.

Shof · September 7, 2011

Good for Baylor!!! I'd like UNT to be in BCS Texas league, we're not and that's a shame. However, to brake up a conference that is in BCS that features enough Texas school's to allow our superior Texas HS talent to stay at in State school is a must!!! The NCAA with SMU death penalty and others have been trying to change Texas HS recruiting for years. Currently if any school deserves the death penalty it's Miami, will they get death penalty, NO!!!

I have no love loss for UT, but I'm really irked at A&M. A&M has a long way to go to become a "UT" and running away from them and causing the break up of the BigXII is a childish way of trying to get better. A&M will get their butt's kicked in the SEC, same as Arkansas!!

Now some more info from aTm regarding the issue:

President R. Bowen Loftin, Texas A&M University Statement Regarding Conference Situation

“We are certainly pleased with the action taken last night by the presidents and chancellors of the Southeastern Conference to unanimously accept Texas A&M as the league’s 13th member. However, this acceptance is conditional, and we are disappointed in the threats made by one of the Big 12 member institutions to coerce Texas A&M into staying in Big 12 Conference. These actions go against the commitment that was made by this university and the Big 12 on Sept. 2. We are working diligently to resolve any and all issues as outlined by the SEC.”

Also heard the SEC might sue the Big 12 for "misrepresentation", etc etc.

Do you remember the scene from Animal House - - "FOOD FIGHT!!!" :rolleyes:

Eagle1855 · September 7, 2011

This is really our best shot - when Texas, Tech, OU, and OSU leave we should form an alliance with Houston, Tulsa, and SMU to get the Big 12 to at least 9.

We all need to hang together or we will surely hang separately.

Unfortunately, when it comes to college athletics, The State of Texas has historically shown absolutely zero resolution or solidarity with any of its institutions. It's a childish, every-man-for-himself free-for-all.

At least the sorry lot of cheaters in the SEC seems stand by one another when it comes to taking on outsiders (I can talk about my mom, but if you do, we'll go to blows).

Hunter Green · September 7, 2011

This is really our best shot - when Texas, Tech, OU, and OSU leave we should form an alliance with Houston, Tulsa, and SMU to get the Big 12 to at least 9.

We all need to hang together or we will surely hang separately.

My thoughts exactly. Together, we stand a chance. Individually, no f'ing way.

LongJim · September 7, 2011

Can't say I agree with any of this. If you want to point the finger at anyone, you should be pointing at Texas because of their greed. The Big 12 use to be a fair conference, but the LHN has quickly turned that around. A&M is just doing what's best for their university and I applaud them for standing up to Texas and leaving the Big 12. Texas needs to be brought back to reality.

Hopefully the Ags won't have a problem with Alabama, Kentucky, Florida, and other SEC schools not sharing the money they make from their exclusive Tier 3 rights with them. The SEC is in no way, shape, or form a "fair" conference. The Ags need $, and they will make more money in the SEC when they cash in for their Tier 3 rights. It's a good move for the Aggies financially. The LHN might be a convenient catalyst for their exit, but that's all it is. Good luck to aTm.

SEC

University of Alabama $8,444,674.00

University of Kentucky $7,743,327.00

University of Florida $7,450,000.00

Louisiana State University $7,012,730.00

University of Tennessee $6,293,621.00

University of Georgia $6,231,392.00

Auburn University $4,637,605.00

University of South Carolina $1,829,000.00

University of Mississippi $1,658,650.00

University of Arkansas $950,000.00

Mississippi State University $0.00

Vanderbilt University N/A

Overall schools reporting Tier 3 income:

1 University of North Carolina $11,171,458.00

2 University of Alabama $8,444,674.00

3 University of Kentucky $7,743,327.00

4 University of Florida $7,450,000.00

5 University of Kansas $7,276,988.00

6 Louisiana State University $7,012,730.00

7 Oklahoma State University $6,395,000.00

8 University of Tennessee $6,293,621.00

9 Oregon State University $6,267,671.00

10 University of Georgia $6,231,392.00

11 University of Wisconsin $5,547,740.00

12 Auburn University $4,637,605.00

13 University of Nebraska $4,393,529.00

14 University of Missouri $4,081,549.00

15 Virginia Tech $3,769,583.00

16 Kansas State University $3,263,941.00

17 Iowa State University $2,608,896.00

18 North Carolina State University $2,470,750.00

19 Penn State University $2,362,500.00

20 Ohio State University $2,329,462.00

21 University of South Carolina $1,829,000.00

22 University of Connecticut $1,749,796.00

23 University of Louisville $1,675,000.00

24 University of Mississippi $1,658,650.00

25 University of Iowa $1,500,000.00

26 Georgia Tech $1,254,876.00

27 University of Washington $1,248,599.00

28 University of Illinois $1,175,065.00

29 University of Cincinnati $1,000,000.00

30 University of Arkansas $950,000.00

31 Clemson University $920,000.00

32 Michigan State University $660,025.00

33 University of South Florida $588,298.00

34 Washington State University $562,098.00

35 West Virginia University $404,284.00

36 Florida State University $349,869.00

37 University of Texas $338,171.00

38 University of Minnesota $324,000.00

39 University of Oklahoma $317,361.00

40 University of Colorado $155,528.00

41 University of Oregon $108,452.00

Hunter Green · September 7, 2011

My thoughts exactly. Together, we stand a chance. Individually, no f'ing way.

Which is why we should include Ark. St, La. Tech and La. La. in the mix to make 12.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · September 7, 2011

As someone with a law degree, my thoughts are the case will be thrown out. Texas A&M is under no obligation to look out for Baylor.

Baylor may claim tortious interference, but it's not likely the claim will stand. First, Texas A&M doesn't have a contract with Baylor. A&M's legal tie was with the Big 12. Baylor cannot sue on behalf of the Big 12.

Second, there must be some damages proven in order for Baylor to proceed. Courts don't generally let you go in and theorize about what damages might occur.

Even though Baylor could argue they could be forced into a lesser conference, a judge could just as easily say, it's a free market and Baylor needs to exhaust any and all efforts to join a conference that doesn't pay them less than their Big 12 share.

But, the reality of it is, Baylor would have to sue everybody leaving the Big 12 if they are going to sue A&M. OU is also leaving. Oklahoma State will leave. Texas Tech will leave. Kansas, Kansas State, and Missouri will leave. Texas...they be rocketed to moon to play with themselves, which will make them - and, everyone back on Earth - happy.

Iowa State and Baylor are going to be the only two stragglers without homes. That's really no one's fault but their own for not winning more and - unfortunately, in this day and age - not trying to capitalize on their "brand."

You can't make the public like your product. This is the lesson of many a beverage maker who have tried to sue Coke and/or Pepsi over grocery and convenience store shelf space. The court isn't going to force stores to put equal amounts of any given product on its shelves. It lets the free market decide what is in demand.

NEWSFLASH - Baylor and Iowa State football aren't in demand. Neither are their basketball programs, which is what will save Kansas and Missouri.

Look, this is all messy and ugly. But, it wasn't a marriage made in heaven to start. Texas always rubbed the Big 8 schools wrong. And, Baylor and Tech were begged in by politicians.

Here is where I go on my "other sports" rant. It doesn't matter that Baylor has a good baseball team, or women's basketball team, or golf team, or tennis team. It doesn't matter. Those programs don't make money. No one cares.

They let Dallas Baptist into Division I baseball. Anybody can field Division I squads in almost all other sports except football.

Football and men's basketball make the money. Baylor has no pull there. They are sucking hind tit for a reason.

TCU should be laughing long and heartily at Baylor right now. A private school can be successful (USC, Miami, TCU, Notre Dame, etc.). Baylor just didn't push hard enough. They were content to suck at football and be showered with BCS money all the while.

Baylor has easily filched off more than they have provided the Big 12.

Edited September 7, 2011 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

Eagle1855 · September 7, 2011

The issue is not that Baylor is suing anyone, it's that Baylor is refusing to waive any right it may have to do so. The SEC wants a signed waiver from every Big 12 institution. And from everything I've read, Baylor isn't the only institution that isn't going to sign such a waiver.

El Paso Eagle · September 7, 2011

We don't need FCS teams.

Flyer - with all of your hate for UTSA and Texas State - do you beleive thet should not be trying to better themselves? Would you prefer to see UNT make no effort to improve our situation?

LongJim · September 7, 2011

As someone with a law degree, my thoughts are the case will be thrown out. Texas A&M is under no obligation to look out for Baylor.

Baylor may claim tortious interference, but it's not likely the claim will stand. First, Texas A&M doesn't have a contract with Baylor. A&M's legal tie was with the Big 12. Baylor cannot sue on behalf of the Big 12.

Baylor doesn't have to claim anything. They only have to say "We retain the right to explore legal avenues at any time. We currently have no plans to do so." Then, be quiet. They have no reason to do anything further.

Beebe and the Board of Directors only speak for the conference. They can't unilaterally waive a member's legal rights. Your HOA can't waive your right to sue a neighbor when his tree falls on your car.

adman · September 7, 2011

You can't negotiate from any position other than one of power. Suing or the threat of suit gives Baylor some power in this game.. This very well may be Baylor twisting ATM and the SEC's arm simply to get Baylor in as #14 in the SEC. It is really the only play Baylor has. Baylor doesn't care about keeping the Big12 together they just don't want to be left alone when Ou and Osu go west and the kansas schools go east.

What "super conference" wants a small, private, baptist college not located in a major media market.? Granted they have some great Olympic programs and football is on the rise but their lack of alumni relative to large state schools, and the fact that Ann Richards and Bob Bulloch are both dead, will probably keep Baylor on the sidelines this time around.

Threat of a long expensive lawsuit is their only play.

Eagle1855 · September 7, 2011

Flyer - with all of your hate for UTSA and Texas State - do you beleive thet should not be trying to better themselves? Would you prefer to see UNT make no effort to improve our situation?

The ironic part of all of this is that our reason for not wanting to include FCS teams in our conference is the same reason other AQ instiutions give for not wanting us in their conference: they're not on our level, and therefore we've no reason to associate with them, and if they do improve, they may pass us by.

Edited September 7, 2011 by Eagle1855

chomp · September 7, 2011

I like that Baylor is couching this as fighting to preserve Texas football tradition and its rivalries. You know, preserving TX rivalries, just like the way that Baylor fought hard to get TCU, SMU, and Houston into the Big 12 when the SWC broke up.

MeanGreenTexan · September 7, 2011

Flyer - with all of your hate for UTSA and Texas State - do you beleive thet should not be trying to better themselves? Would you prefer to see UNT make no effort to improve our situation?

The difference is:

UNT is a BCS school.

TXSt & UTSA are FCS schools.

We're already bringing up a non-bcs football program in S. Alabama. However, S. Alabama is already in our conference. Why would the Sun Belt, or anyone other than the crumbling WAC consider bringing up an FCS school with all of this volatility right now?