"People will stop laughing at North Texas, and one day start respe

UNTMike81 · August 24, 2011

My topic Title came off UNT Flyer's tag line quote from Coach Mac.

"People will stop laughing at North Texas, and one day start respecting North Texas."

-Dan McCarney

Coach...People don't laugh about UNT's Men's Basket Ball team. They already respect us, won't play us, or know if they do we'll give them on heck of a good basketball game.

Go Mean Green...JJ, staff, and team!!!

Edited August 24, 2011 by UNTMike81

Quoner · August 24, 2011

Dr. Seuss · August 25, 2011

They already respect us, won't play us, or know if they do we'll give them on heck of a good basketball game.????

I dont think the Kansas game was a good game

UNTMike81 · August 25, 2011

Ok...point taken. Kansas, I knew someone would hit me with that gut shot. I liked the game. We played an elite basketball power who's record at was 62 or 66-0 at home when we played them. Not only did we lose, so had 60 plus other big 6 power conference team's across the US. I'd say at lease UNT was in good company. Was Kansas a bad loss, in some respects yes, but did we need to play the game, yes. Ask Oklahoma St., Texas Tech., LSU, and others if we're a quality opponent and did they enjoy the experience. Pat Knight sure knows who we are and was honest in his comments about playing us in Tech's second game of the year in 2010.

Is UNT men's BB a household name, not yet. That's much better than "people will stop laughing at North Texas". When JJ arrived at UNT our men's BB deserved to be "laughed at" and I don't think to many folks would be able to honestly argue the point. Today, that's an entirely different issue.

I my mind with a little luck and a lot of hard work on the team's part, March Madness will be the time a lot of long time UNT basketball fans will revel in the media's new found recognition of UNT men's BB. Plus a lot of UNT students and Alumi's who only casually root for UNT athletics will be shocked at how much the ESPN commentators and other will be praising the talent and hard work of JJ, staff, and team.

As you can tell I'm a JJ homer, and am very glad RV once again gave JJ a needed raise and contract extension!!!

I'm grateful Apogee bought naming right to our new FB stadium, so some of that money can be used to support UNT BB. Past that I expect UNT BB attendance to increase significantly this year, and will probably explode after new year's provide the AD promotes the games, JJ, and our team properly!!!

Quoner · August 25, 2011

Why stop at calling out football for not being good yet? Why not just start firing shots across all of our programs? Look, I love the basketball too, but you know it's not a zero sum game and that being good in football would help us be better at basketball, right?

UNTMike81 · August 25, 2011

Why stop at calling out football for not being good yet? Why not just start firing shots across all of our programs? Look, I love the basketball too, but you know it's not a zero sum game and that being good in football would help us be better at basketball, right?

Quoner...I'm not taking a shot at UNT Football. I've been a fan of our FB program for many years and am confident coach Mac. will bring our program new found respect as soon as humanly possible. However, I saw the quote Coach Mac made regarding UNT. Coach Mac's quote didn't seem to be directed a just his FB team. Maybe I'm taking quote out of context, but the idea that UNT is being "laughed at" is in my mind off the mark. Is UNT music school laughed at for being considered the best or at least in the top 2 music school's in the US, is our golf team laughed at, how about our women's soccer team. If coach Mac wants to make motivational quotes that fine. I don't have one thing against coach Mac.. Am I duty bound to point out what JJ, his staff, and players have done now for the better part of almost 10 years, YES!!!

I read an interview Vito did with Josh White and Josh was a little put off that after his senior season that a lot of BB followers were already looking ahead, because it was rumored or known that Mr. Tony Mitchell was coming to UNT. Point is we all look ahead, so in a since I take exception to coach Mac's quote out of respect for what players like Josh White, D. Johnson, TT, and George O. and others have built before our incoming recruits arrive at UNT.

I think coach Mac's comments are misplaced, but because I don't know the context in which he said them then I could be way out of bounds or off the mark too. If coach Mac. made his quote as motivational tool I can understand that logic too. I just noticed quote and thought it was odd. For that matter ton's of fans took every statement coach Dickey ever made and if his comments could be construed negatively then believe me they were. I just saw coach Mac's. quote under a BB post and take exception to it regarding other UNT sports namely men's BB.

Edited August 27, 2011 by UNTMike81

Green Mean · August 25, 2011

Our basketball program is decent but we'll only get respected even more when we play close and beat the upper upper echelon teams. On top of that we practically have to win our conference every year and by a very wide margin. Only then will be able to reach that 'next level' in CBB. Beating the likes of Tech and LSU is great and all but they're not that great other than they have a brand. People laughing at North Texas is no surprise and its probably even warranted. We're on our way up but we have a looooonnnggg way to go to reach a respected status locally, regionally and eventually on the national level. Not sure what the point of the thread is but cheers nonetheless.

risinggreen · August 26, 2011

Quoner...I'm not taking a shot at UNT Football. I've been a fan of our FB program for many years and am confident coach Mac. will bring our program new found respect as soon as humanly possible. However, I saw the quote Coach Mac made regarding UNT. Coach Mac's quote didn't seem to be directed a just his FB team. Maybe I'm taking quote out of context, but the idea that UNT is being "laughed at" is in my mind off the mark. Is UNT music school laughed at for being considered the best or at least in the top 2 music school's in the US, is our golf team laughed at, how about our women's soccer team. If coach Mac wants to make motivational quotes that fine. I don't have one thing against coach Mac.. Am I duty bound to point out what JJ, his staff, and players have done now for the better part of almost 10 years, YES!!!

I read an interview Vito did with Josh White and Josh was a little put off that after his senior season that a lot of BB followers were already looking ahead, because it was rumored or known that Mr. Tony Mitchell was coming to UNT. Point is we all look ahead, so in a since I take exception to coach Mac's quote out of respect for what players like Josh White, D. Johnson, TT, and George O. and others have built before our incoming recruits arrive at UNT.

I think coach Mac's comments are misplaced, but because I don't know the context in which he said them then I could be way out of bounds or of the mark too. If coach Mac. made his quote as motivational tool I can understand that logic too. I just noticed quote and thought it was odd. For that matter ton's of fans took every statement coach Dickey ever made and if his comments could be construed negatively then believe me they were. I just saw coach Mac's. quote under a BB post and take exception to it regarding other UNT sports namely men's BB.

Yes, a couple of his quotes have kinda stuck in my craw (?) as being a bit belittling, but he just got here so I'm willing to cut him some slack. Hope his team can quickly change some perceptions including apparently his own.

GrandGreen · August 26, 2011

NT gets little respect in football due to the horrible record in the last six years and little historical success. If you have listened to McCarney, he is very complementary to the other NT programs and wants to get football up to the better programs level.

JJ has done a great job with the basketball program bringing it up from the ashes of Trilli who made Dodge look like a great coach. I guess I am in the minority but I though the basketball team really had a disappointing season last year. Yes, they got twenty wins with a very easy oc schedule and rallied in the Belt tournament, but playing .500 in the Belt with the team they had was very disappointing even with the injuries they suffered.

CMJ · August 27, 2011

It was slightly disappointing to me too, but I guess I can't think of a season where we beat Tech at home, destroy LSU, and are less than a minute away from the Big Dance as a failure. Can a disappointing season also be successful? That's how I perceived it.

UNTMike81 · August 27, 2011

It was slightly disappointing to me too, but I guess I can't think of a season where we beat Tech at home, destroy LSU, and are less than a minute away from the Big Dance as a failure. Can a disappointing season also be successful? That's how I perceived it.

Amen...CMJ!!! The injuries on our team were a nail in our coffin. I know we had some mistakes in the SBC Championship game with less than 2 minutes to go, but the ref's also cost us the game. Even with our mistakes if the ref's had called a reasonable game especial at the end we'd have done dancing. Only reason I really didn't mind not going dancing was our injuries. Because of injuries we didn't have a chance of advancing very far if at all at the dance had we won SBC championship. Now that our team is reloading UNT should have another great year. With Tony Mitchell's arrival at the end of 2011 we won't be going .500 in SBC play this year.

Watch out Boy's and Girl's our upcoming men's BB season is going to be special. If not, then I'll be disappointed. JJ and everyone involved to this point has given me no reason to believe I'll be disappointed in 2011-2012.

Go Mean Green basketball!!!

MeanGreenTexan · August 27, 2011

Amen...CMJ!!! The injuries on our team were a nail in our coffin. I know we had some mistakes in the SBC Championship game with less than 2 minutes to go, but the ref's also cost us the game. Even with our mistakes if the ref's had called a reasonable game especial at the end we'd have done dancing. Only reason I really didn't mind not going dancing was our injuries. Because of injuries we didn't have a chance of advancing very far if at all at the dance had we won SBC championship. Now that our team is reloading UNT should have another great year. With Tony Mitchell's arrival at the end of 2011 we won't be going .500 in SBC play this year.

Watch out Boy's and Girl's our upcoming men's BB season is going to be special. If not, then I'll be disappointed. JJ and everyone involved to this point has given me no reason to believe I'll be disappointed in 2011-2012.

Go Mean Green basketball!!!

It sounds like you have all your eggs in the basket of Tony Mitchell and a great class of Freshmen.

Temper your expectations. The class that just graduated was a class that will go down in Mean Green lore for years and years. I believe this freshman class will do the same, but they are still freshmen. This year may be a slight drop-off from last year. If it is, it shouldn't be a reason for disappointment.

I suppose it really depends on Franklin's waiver, the level of Mitchell's play, the ability of our fab freshmen to progress & gel throughout the year, and finally, our returning players' continued improvements (I'm looking at you Holmen!). That's alot of question marks. If all of these things go well, we should be able to make some noise, if not win, the SBC. If they don't, we may very well go .500 in conference and make an early exit in the conf. tourney.

GrandGreen · August 27, 2011

It sounds like you have all your eggs in the basket of Tony Mitchell and a great class of Freshmen.
Temper your expectations. The class that just graduated was a class that will go down in Mean Green lore for years and years. I believe this freshman class will do the same, but they are still freshmen. This year may be a slight drop-off from last year. If it is, it shouldn't be a reason for disappointment.
I suppose it really depends on Franklin's waiver, the level of Mitchell's play, the ability of our fab freshmen to progress & gel throughout the year, and finally, our returning players' continued improvements (I'm looking at you Holmen!). That's alot of question marks. If all of these things go well, we should be able to make some noise, if not win, the SBC. If they don't, we may very well go .500 in conference and make an early exit in the conf. tourney.

NT is returning one starter and only three other lettermen, so it is obvious the season is going to depend a large extent on the newcomers. It doesn't take long for good players to make their presence known. I will be highly disappointed with a .500 conference season with all this talent coming in. Thompson, Odufuwa, and White were no doubt good players but while I hope they are remembered for their contributions, I hope they are not remembered for representing the pinnacle of NT basketball. Ratings are not everything but Thompson is the only Rival 3 star high school player that JJ has ever recruited. This years class has three plus the five star Mitchell. So on paper there is no comparison of the recruiting classes.

The Belt has been a mediocre basketball conference the last couple of years and frankly I can't believe that FAU, Denver, ASU even with veteran ball clubs should be potentially better than what NT can put on the court. It will take a few games but by conference I really think that NT should be among the best of the Belt and if the newcomers are as good as advertised could actually dominate.

UNT90 · August 28, 2011

Lots of freshmen playing. I understamd the excitement with the talent coming in, but it is going to take some time for that talent to gel. My expectations are for a .500 conference record with a late push as the team learns to play together. Will it be enought of a push to win the conference tournament? Only time will tell.

UNTMike81 · August 29, 2011

I expect our team to gel based on JJ coaching abilities. In the past JJ's teams have done well or out preformed expectations because JJ pulled in better recruits than UNT was know for having, or JJ and staff were able to take lesser recruits on paper and make them better basketball players than expected. Seems to me JJ and staff have done this by designing a system that enhanced our team performance by allowing our players skill sets to be realized. Add to that JJ has always stressed UNT needed to play as a team.

Now that JJ has been able to recruit much better talent from top to bottom I expect him to push the team to gel, and play as a team with urgency. Not to mentioned running a system that plays to the strengths of our new freshmen class.

Yes I expect our team to be much improved with Tony Michell's arrival. Mr. Mitchell hasn't played in a year, then invited to represent the USA in U19 ball on the world stage, and basically out rebounds and plays better defense any one at the tournament!!! USA U19 coach's said because Mr. Mitchell hadn't played competitively in over a year that he was "just playing on instinct"!!!! Freaking hallelujah sweat Jesus!!! Just imagine how good Tony becomes once he gets some quality coaching and team practice under his belt. I really don't think most of us realize what a talent Tony is until we see him on the floor at the Pit.

Playing against talent only makes you better, so I believe all the players at UNT will push themselves because of Tony Mitchell and our coaching staff. Example: if you play chess, you never play an opponent that has a much weaker game than yours or you'll never get better.

I think most of our team knows one another via AAU or buy association. Based on that I'd bet our team believes they can be something special if they work hard!!! That's another reason I think the gel factor will be rather short. My expectations are certainly high. I don't think UT, OU, TCU, or other teams fans expect anything but great things from their teams either. It's just been long time since UNT has had a sports team that should be able to live up to the hype. Oh, I'd say the same about UNT's Men's golf team. I was let down by the golf teams play in California at the regional's. Next year I will have very high expectations for our Men's golf team also.

Go Mean Green!!!

GrayEagle · August 29, 2011

If the football team does not make a bowl game in a season, that season is not a success. Why should basketball be different? North Texas did not even make the Dance. We have not even won a game there, so why should missing the party be judged a success? Someone explain this to me?

I am not trying to be one of these fans that is a football guy and doesn't "get" basketball, but I just don't get it. If we are bigtime, then we are bigtime. Almost is bullshit.

You sound like the "we beat Tennessee in the 70s" crowd to me.

Success is somewhat like beauty; it is mostly in the eyes of the beholder.

However, I don't think that you can equate appearing in a bowl game with appearing in the national tournament. Almost half of the 120 teams are eligible to appear in bowl games and the vast majority do. Only about 20% of the basketball teams can appear in the dance.

I don't have a media guide so I don't know the exact figures but I believe that we have appeared in the NCAA Tournament two of the last five years. We have had five or six 20-win seasons in a row which would be the equivalent of 8-win football seasons.

We were fortunate this past year to have a ranked recruiting class; not counting last year's #12 recruit in the nation, who should be eligible next semester.

Our basketball rankings have been roughly the equivalent of being in the top third in the nation, again approximately the same as being ranked #40 in football and we would kill for that, especially five years in a row.

It may be moderate success but it is success nonetheless.

greenminer · August 29, 2011

There are 300 teams in D-1 bball, and less than 70 get an invite.

There are 117 FBS teams, and half of them go to a bowl.

Apples vs. oranges, IMO.

Edited August 29, 2011 by greenminer

CMJ · August 29, 2011

The other guys said it better than me. I'm pretty sure EVEN counting the NIT, CBI, and CIT tournaments - (the last two being a pay your way in) a higher percentage of teams play in Bowl Games than the postseason in basketball.

KRAM1 · August 29, 2011

Agree...but then again, as a proud member of the Mean green nation, I have never laughed at North Texas! I have, however, laughed WITH UNT & several other members of the great Mean Green Nation from time to time. Big difference.

greenminer · August 29, 2011

A better debate might be return-on-investment regarding exposure.

I would be curious to see any research done on how exposure UNT gets by just being in the 1st round, as opposed to the NO Bowl.

While football drives the masses, the masses pick and choose what bowls they are interested in.

If you are interested in The Big Dance, even on a casual office-pool-pick'm level, it is hard to miss UNT's name.

greenminer · August 29, 2011

Once more tidbit:

I think a great barometer of our success has not just been the 20 win seasons, but - what? - 4 or 5 consecutive 20 win seasons. Tasty touched on it a year or two ago, but in a nutshell it was about how ridiculously rare it is for a non-Big 6 team to go on this type of run.

And it looks like that run is not going to end anytime soon.

GrayEagle · August 29, 2011

There are 300 teams in D-1 bball, and less than 70 get an invite.

There are 117 FBS teams, and half of them go to a bowl.

Apples vs. oranges, IMO.

Just to set the record straight there are 120 teams in the FBS and 35 bowls scheduled for 2011. The BCS championship will have two repeat teams so there will tentatively be 68 teams in 2011-12 bowls. If we can have a .500 record, we are virtually assured of a bowl game even though the SBC is only tied to two bowl games.

There are 345 Division I teams that compete for the 68 slots in the NCAA Basketball Tournament. It takes a much better record (percentage-wise) to get into that tournament, or the NIT. So, if you base success on the ability to compete in the Big Dance, you are handicapping basketball since it is much harder to qualify.

Yep, it's pretty much apples and oranges. That's why you can't set appearing in a bowl game as football success and require appearing in the Dance as success in basketball.