Git Sum Presidentin' (Republican primaries)

[UNT90]

--Obviously you are NOT in education..... our budgets have been cut regularly for years..... college tuition has rapidly climbed because of him and the Legislature..... local taxes are worse because of less state funding so locals have to pick it up.... and he has vetoed so many things that he said he supported.... [guess he didn't think the legislature would pass them and make a liar out of him] He even cut all health insurance from community college staffs [ even most of the legislature was appalled by it, it had been in the state budget for YEARS} ... The state doesn't give a huge support to community colleges, local taxes do. Community colleges lessen the burden on the state because of local funding.... then he decided to eliminate our insurance..... UNT etc. is all state money, plus tuition, donations... no local financial support.

--He is the worst governor for education EVER... includes Briscoe and Mark White. Also the State Parks in Texas are now a mess as well... one of his budgets provided ONE new pickup for the ENTIRE state park system. There are a lot more reasons to dislike him including the Spanish Highway project he wanted..... just read and listen. He is conservative, I agree... very conservative... too conservative... I guess not changing your car's oil and not paying your light bill is conservative too...... but it isn't smart.

Times are tough. Cuts had to be made because, unlike the federal government, this state is forced to balance it's budget every year.

Rick Perry is anything but a conservative. If he could have gotten away with it, he would have spent this state into debt to make everyone happy and get re-elected (see: Pres., Obama).

Saying he is waaaay conservative is an insult to conservatism. That would be like me saying Joe Lieberman was waaaay too liberal on national defense issues.

Edited August 13, 2011 by UNT90

[curtisdaa]

As a Texas teacher for the past 27 years, I will vote for him for president. If for no other reason than to get him out of Texas. I hope to be able to say "adios mofo" to slick Rick in November of 2012.

[Side Show Joe]

--Obviously you are NOT in education..... our budgets have been cut regularly for years..... college tuition has rapidly climbed because of him and the Legislature..... local taxes are worse because of less state funding so locals have to pick it up.... and he has vetoed so many things that he said he supported.... [guess he didn't think the legislature would pass them and make a liar out of him] He even cut all health insurance from community college staffs [ even most of the legislature was appalled by it, it had been in the state budget for YEARS} ... The state doesn't give a huge support to community colleges, local taxes do. Community colleges lessen the burden on the state because of local funding.... then he decided to eliminate our insurance..... UNT etc. is all state money, plus tuition, donations... no local financial support.

--He is the worst governor for education EVER... includes Briscoe and Mark White. Also the State Parks in Texas are now a mess as well... one of his budgets provided ONE new pickup for the ENTIRE state park system. There are a lot more reasons to dislike him including the Spanish Highway project he wanted..... just read and listen. He is conservative, I agree... very conservative... too conservative... I guess not changing your car's oil and not paying your light bill is conservative too...... but it isn't smart.

I am in education. I am a public school teacher. The problems with education in Texas are not monetary. Children in third world countries are more literate. There are many problems like, government mandates, teacher's unions, and tenure. But, I think the biggest problem is lack of interest. Many parents have a lack of interest in their children's education, thinking it is the roll of the public school to raise their kids. It is not. Too many students have no interest in their education. I spend a great deal of time everyday, trying to get through to these student's why they are in school and how they can improve their lives through education, just like I did.

I wasn't smart enough to earn a scholarship out of high school. My parents didn't have the money to pay for my school, but made too much money for me to qualify for financial aid. I worked three jobs while earning my bachelors degree, and slept three or four hours a night, if I was lucky. I never felt I was owed a higher education by society. I worked so hard and did so well, the University of North Texas awarded me a fellowship to earn my masters degree. My fellowship was not the result of public funds, or government aid. A donation from the private sector made my fellowship possible. Had I not received a fellowship, I would have worked another three or four jobs in order to earn my masters. Nothing was owed to me, and nothing is owed to you. Work for what you want.

The quality of education in the state of Texas is relative to the value each individual places on it. The state can not legislate results. The money allocated to education under Perry is not the problem.

[UNT90]

I am in education. I am a public school teacher. The problems with education in Texas are not monetary. Children in third world countries are more literate. There are many problems like, government mandates, teacher's unions, and tenure. But, I think the biggest problem is lack of interest. Many parents have a lack of interest in their children's education, thinking it is the roll of the public school to raise their kids. It is not. Too many students have no interest in their education. I spend a great deal of time everyday, trying to get through to these student's why they are in school and how they can improve their lives through education, just like I did.

I wasn't smart enough to earn a scholarship out of high school. My parents didn't have the money to pay for my school, but made too much money for me to qualify for financial aid. I worked three jobs while earning my bachelors degree, and slept three or four hours a night, if I was lucky. I never felt I was owed a higher education by society. I worked so hard and did so well, the University of North Texas awarded me a fellowship to earn my masters degree. My fellowship was not the result of public funds, or government aid. A donation from the private sector made my fellowship possible. Had I not received a fellowship, I would have worked another three or four jobs in order to earn my masters. Nothing was owed to me, and nothing is owed to you. Work for what you want.

The quality of education in the state of Texas is relative to the value each individual places on it. The state can not legislate results. The money allocated to education under Perry is not the problem.

Amen...... 1,000 times Amen.

One of the most spot on posts I have seen on this subject.

Throwing money at education has never worked in this country, and has caused parents and local officials to abdicate responsibilty for their child's education to the state and federal agencies. Personal responsibility, particularly parental responsibibilty (or lack thereof) is the reason for the decreased rating in U.S education as compared to the countries of the world.

I would be willing to bet that there is a correlation in the increase in single parent, children out of wedlock homes and the decrease in education, but I am much to lazy to even google it.

[Mean Green 93-98]

I would be willing to bet that there is a correlation in the increase in single parent, children out of wedlock homes and the decrease in education, but I am much to lazy to even google it.

When visiting with our local school superintendent, he told this was the #1 biggest problem in the schools today. He told me that when he started as a principal in the early 70's, every child lived in a home with his two married biological parents. The only exceptions were when a parent had died. Now the exception is when a child lives in a home with his two married biological parents.

[eulesseagle]

I am not a big Perry fan for these reasons:

1. You have the question of Texas forcing female students to take Gardasil shots to prevent STD's over the rights of the parents.

2. You have the mega Trans-Texas Corridor that was going to be built by a Spanish company and use eminent domain to secure the land. This corridor was to begin on the west coast of Mexico where China is currently building one of the largest sea ports in this hemisphere.

http://www.mexidata.info/id1278.html

http://insightanalytical.wordpress.com/2009/03/12/maps-major-ports-usmexico-border-transportation-planning-fhwa/

3. Accoring to The American Independent of 6-20-11 Texas has the highest number of entry level (minimum wage jobs) positions in the U.S. In Perry's defense...these are jobs vs. unemployment.

4. Tx. debt has doubled since Perry became governor.

http://www.politifact.com/texas/statements/2010/mar/04/bill-white/white-says-texas-debt-has-doubled-under-perry/

5. One of the worst records for education:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/editorial/outlook/7414727.html

6. If you are into conspiracy of the Bildiberger...he is a member:

IMHO, Perry is part of "The Establishment" and would keep the United States on course from Bush...Clinton...Bush...Obama.

Ron Paul, IMHO, is the only clear choice to undo what has already been done...however, it may be too late to fix.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

I am in education. I am a public school teacher. The problems with education in Texas are not monetary. Children in third world countries are more literate. There are many problems like, government mandates, teacher's unions, and tenure. But, I think the biggest problem is lack of interest. Many parents have a lack of interest in their children's education, thinking it is the roll of the public school to raise their kids. It is not. Too many students have no interest in their education. I spend a great deal of time everyday, trying to get through to these student's why they are in school and how they can improve their lives through education, just like I did.

I wasn't smart enough to earn a scholarship out of high school. My parents didn't have the money to pay for my school, but made too much money for me to qualify for financial aid. I worked three jobs while earning my bachelors degree, and slept three or four hours a night, if I was lucky. I never felt I was owed a higher education by society. I worked so hard and did so well, the University of North Texas awarded me a fellowship to earn my masters degree. My fellowship was not the result of public funds, or government aid. A donation from the private sector made my fellowship possible. Had I not received a fellowship, I would have worked another three or four jobs in order to earn my masters. Nothing was owed to me, and nothing is owed to you. Work for what you want.

The quality of education in the state of Texas is relative to the value each individual places on it. The state can not legislate results. The money allocated to education under Perry is not the problem.

---Nothing you said has anything to do with Perry and lack of support for education.... You aren't the only one that has had a rough time... Ever lived in a house without electricity, natural gas or propane.....I did for several years as a child. I too worked hard to get a degree as has many here... My wife lost her father to WWII.. and she had it worse that I did.

--I don't undestand why anyone in education would support Perry... He has nothing to help it and a lot to hurt it.

-I begin my 46th year in education this year... 30 years in public schools and now at a community college. I understand the problems.

Edited August 13, 2011 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[greenminer]

I think Screaming Eagle is right, Side Show.

I'm right there with you on your points, but they do not justify budget cuts.

I think we can all agree that these cuts do not solve the problem, and the more resources we have available for education, the better.

[Mean Green 93-98]

---Nothing you said has anything to do with Perry and lack of support for education....

Yes, it did. It underscored the fact that throwing money at the problem has not solved it so far, and will not solve it in the future.

[CaribbeanGreen]

Yes, it did. It underscored the fact that throwing money at the problem has not solved it so far, and will not solve it in the future.

"Throwing money" is one thing... cutting hundreds of thousands of teachers and programs is entirely another. It's not a zero sum game, education.

[mattmartin817]

Texas doesn't even have a teacher's union does it?

[Side Show Joe]

Texas doesn't even have a teacher's union does it?

No we don't. We have teacher's organizations. But they are often referred to as teacher's unions. I've heard it so much it kind of stuck.

[KRAM1]

Libs have been throwing more and more dollars at public education all across this nation and it continues to rate poorly on all counts. It is NOT the fault of the classroom teachers as they, as a general rule, do an excellent job. It's the mandates, the required testings the bloated administrative budgets and the lack of parental involvement in the education of their children. Our public schools have become "day cares" for absent parents. If you think this isn't true...look at the high performing schools...public and private and check out the time parents spend with their kids educations, assignments. Check out the support for the schools and the teachers by these parents.

Public education is having to deal with all the kids whose parents are interested in anything except their kids and their kids educations. Check out school districts (public) like Southlake, Argyle, Highland Park, etc. and you can see what happens when parents take their responsibilities seriously. Yes, these are considered wealthy districts, but none the less it shows what can happen when parents take their share of the responsibility for their kids education seriously.

While folks like Screamin Eagle always want to blame the lack of finances, it isn't the lack of finances that are keeping public schools from succeeding. Texas spends what, $3,000-$4,000 per student. That's enough...more than enough if all the administrative garbage was removed...who needs 5-6 assistant superintendents???? Why not consolidate some school districts????? Why not year round schooling...let's use all these expensive facilities to more efficient levels....let's stop the ESL crap and have kids speak english...if you want to live in the states let's make it Spanish as a second language. Let's stop paying people to have more kids and loading our public schools with more and more kids who have no parental support. Let's start adding some fees for extra-curricular activities...all of them...want to play? Pay! Let's look at the bus systems...why should kids who live within 2 miles of their schools have bus service????

Look, it isn't the quality of the teachers nor the "want to" of the classroom teachers...it's a lot of the crap that goes on....it "ain't about throwing more money at schools"...as much as the libs have traditionally believed it was...the problem is not money...it's over bloated administrations, more facilities than needed, free this and free that for kids who could at least pay something, it's all day pre-K (nothing more than free day care at the taxpayers expense), bus service that is way too convenient, etc., etc.

My bride is a retired school teacher...special ed and third grade, and she definitely gets it! She knows it isn't more money that will improve our public schools. And, it isn't the fault of the vast majority of classroom teachers.

All three of our kids went through public schools 100% of the time. All had excellent educations in our opinion...Denton ISD and Argyle ISD from start to finish for all three...we are proud of the education they received. It is not the money that is lacking to help improve our public schools. Those in public education who tell you that is the root of all evil are wanting the easy way out and a "way out" that has failed and failed and failed time and time again. Great...it has never worked throwing money at it so lets just throw more money at it! Great logic...sounds like the union mantra...libs love this logic!

It "ain't Perry", it wasn't Mark White or any other governor...it's the lack of parent involvement and caring, the over bloated administrative budgets, the unfunded mandates, the stupid end of year testing, etc., etc. Fix that crap and you fix public education and could probably lower the money collected from taxes going to public schools....and, yes, give all classroom teachers a raise in the process.

[Side Show Joe]

---Nothing you said has anything to do with Perry and lack of support for education.... You aren't the only one that has had a rough time... Ever lived in a house without electricity, natural gas or propane.....I did for several years as a child. I too worked hard to get a degree as has many here... My wife lost her father to WWII.. and she had it worse that I did.

--I don't undestand why anyone in education would support Perry... He has nothing to help it and a lot to hurt it.

-I begin my 46th year in education this year... 30 years in public schools and now at a community college. I understand the problems.

The state of Texas, of which Perry is the governor, has funded education for the next fiscal cycle. Just because you disagree with the amount of money allocated to education by the state, does not mean that Perry or the state has not met their obligation. The state will continue to provide children the opportunity to receive a quality education, should they choose to take advantage.

Now I do believe Texas needs a better system for funding education. Educational funding should not be tied to property taxes.

I hate that good teachers have been let go because of budget cuts. I hate it even more when I see good teachers let go, while bad teachers are retained just because they have tenure. Right now people everywhere are losing jobs. It would be wrong to expect teachers and others in the public sector not to be effected by the current economic conditions.

[meangreendork]

"Throwing money" is one thing... cutting hundreds of thousands of teachers and programs is entirely another. It's not a zero sum game, education.

I definitely agree. Fixing education is really an exercise in marketing, and a funny lesson in supply-side economics. The US has thrown a lot at the supply for education in the country, but the interest isn't there, and that interest is in the parents before it's in the kids.

Motivate the parents, and they'll motivate the kids. Motivating the parents means increased demand, justifiable supply, and increased gains.

Edited August 13, 2011 by meangreendork

[UNT90]

The state of Texas, of which Perry is the governor, has funded education for the next fiscal cycle. Just because you disagree with the amount of money allocated to education by the state, does not mean that Perry or the state has not met their obligation. The state will continue to provide children the opportunity to receive a quality education, should they choose to take advantage.

Now I do believe Texas needs a better system for funding education. Educational funding should not be tied to property taxes.

I hate that good teachers have been let go because of budget cuts. I hate it even more when I see good teachers let go, while bad teachers are retained just because they have tenure. Right now people everywhere are losing jobs. It would be wrong to expect teachers and others in the public sector not to be effected by the current economic conditions.

Sounds like henonly disagrees with the money that affects his benefits.

Thank God we are a right to work state. Unions, especially education unions, are the antithesis of the American dream. Get a job, do as little as possible, and nomway to get fired, absent anfelony crime. There is a reSon people have been flocking to this state in droves for the past 20 years

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

The state of Texas, of which Perry is the governor, has funded education for the next fiscal cycle. Just because you disagree with the amount of money allocated to education by the state, does not mean that Perry or the state has not met their obligation. The state will continue to provide children the opportunity to receive a quality education, should they choose to take advantage.

Now I do believe Texas needs a better system for funding education. Educational funding should not be tied to property taxes.

I hate that good teachers have been let go because of budget cuts. I hate it even more when I see good teachers let go, while bad teachers are retained just because they have tenure. Right now people everywhere are losing jobs. It would be wrong to expect teachers and others in the public sector not to be effected by the current economic conditions.

---The more you post the more it shows you don't understand... there is no tenure in Texas public schools ....maybe some districts somewhere (none I know of). I do know of several educators who have been let go because of poor performance. Just because of some sectors having a bad time doesn't mean others including education should lay people off. [ besides Texas supposedly has the BEST economy in America... employment in my town is so high they are having trouble finding people to fill jobs, partially because there is little affordable housing to put people in who want to move here]

---How can the state with the best economy have one of the three worse budget problems... it may make sense to you but not to most people. Educators and kid's education will suffer. Other Governors and Legislature sessions managed to do ok with a lesser economy.

---hmmmm... No property tax... you want a STATE income tax instead???. ... I don't.... The money must come from somewhere..... We already have the highest sales tax because of no income tax.

..

Edited August 15, 2011 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[All About UNT]

Reasons Perry will never win (mostly due to vetting):

1.) He was a Democrat before he realized he wouldn't advance very far into 1990s Texas State Politics and he jumped ship to become part of the party that would allow him to progress his seat of power.

2.) He stated on television "Texas is a unique place. When we came into the union in 1845, one of the issues was that we would be able to leave if we decided to do that... My hope is that America and Washington in particular pays attention. We've got a great union. There's absolutely no reason to dissolve it. But if Washington continues to thumb their nose at the American people, who knows what may come of that." and that will be a subject of scrutiny against him that most any opponent would twist to meet their objective.

3.) Trans Texas Corridor- Wow....talk about a waste of money. I have it from personal friends (a very good buddy of Perry's) in East Texas that stated Rick's Dad and some of the good ole boys out in East Texas took a trip to Austin one day...forced into his office and made him stand listen to them about the matter. They stated that if he went through with the project it would be political suicide and that he would lose all of his support. He was on the verge of getting it passed....but one week later stood down on the issue and announced the project was dead.

4.) His alignment with the Christian Right.......having a giant prayer rally (while 100% acceptable in many of your eyes) violates separation of church and state. While those lines are often enough crossed in the deep south states... Northerners, Californians, Floridians and more will not be smiling at the potential of nationwide Prayer Rallies. Try and think about how the other far more secular states would feel about this alliance? If Mitt Romney is politically castrated because of his almost non-practicing Mormon upbringing..... how will Rick fair? He would have been vastly better served if he held a rally of all religions vs. singling out just the evangelical Christian right. He went to a rally hosted by the AFA and anyone who doesn't know them should know that they are actually listed as a Hate Group by the Southern Poverty Law Center. The Cornerstone Church's John Hagee was slated to speak directly after Perry at the Rally. To quote what Hagee thought about the devastation of Hurricane Katrina "Hurricane Katrina was, in fact, the judgment of God against the city of New Orleans.” “New Orleans had a level of sin that was offensive to God,” Hagee said, because “there was to be a homosexual parade there on the Monday that the Katrina came.” If you don't see how Perry's alliance with this man can be used against him on the national level then you are on Cloud 9.

Ok....Rant over.

I voted McCain last time around and seriously....if he had stayed the Maverick Middle Man that he always was...he might have won. The decision was decided by two groups. The moderates who felt that McCain had slightly sold out to the right....and a demographic of African-Amercians who came out like never before to vote in this last election. I truly see nobody in this current cycle who impresses and this might be the first one since I reached voting age where I stay home of election day.

[Green2012]

6. If you are into conspiracy of the Bildiberger...he is a member:

IMHO, Perry is part of "The Establishment" and would keep the United States on course from Bush...Clinton...Bush...Obama.

Ron Paul, IMHO, is the only clear choice to undo what has already been done...however, it may be too late to fix.

Interesting side note on #6 is Perry's recent remarks on Bernanke. Isn't Bernanke (or the Chairman and Fed in general) "connected" to the Bildiberger group? Perry is almost rebelling or something now by his remarks on the Fed's secrecy and wanting them to address what their REAL goals are. The more I look into the other choices it seems Ron may be the best pic. Everybody has to remember that our government is comprised of three different branches. Although Ron has some very libertarian views on some topics, most or all of these would not pass or would be heavily modified. But I think having someone like Ron in would promote real cuts and solutions rather than the same ole same ole like you suggest "the establishment" would. And at 75 I'm pretty sure he isn't trying to be a career guy or start seeking reelection in his second year.

[KRAM1]

I voted McCain last time around and seriously....if he had stayed the Maverick Middle Man that he always was...he might have won. The decision was decided by two groups. The moderates who felt that McCain had slightly sold out to the right....and a demographic of African-Amercians who came out like never before to vote in this last election. I truly see nobody in this current cycle who impresses and this might be the first one since I reached voting age where I stay home of election day.

If you do stay home it is as good as a vote for Obama...the Obama campaign is counting on people who will stay home that would have otherwise voted against him. Think VERY VERY seriously about this before you give up your opportunity to vote. If you don't vote, it's the same as saying you like where Obama has and continues to take this great nation of ours. If that's the case, then stay home or go and vote for Obama...it's pretty much the same either way.

No rant, just the way it is...

I see I must have picked up an Obama fan with the -1. Ha!

Edited August 17, 2011 by KRAM1

[yyz28]

Does anyone actually ever do the math on any of this, or do you just make broad blanket statements without knowing why actions were taken or what the impact really was?

For instance. The Texas budget for 2010 was 182 Billion, of which 75.5 Billion (or 41.1%) was spent on education, and 59.7 Billion was spent on healthcare (or 32.8%, mostly covering unfunded mandates from the federal government). So when you've got the two largest line items that account for 75% of total spending in the state, and one of them you don't have much room to wiggle because of there is a federal government mandate to spend the money, where do you think the biggest place you can cut is?

This sort of parallels this situation in Washington, where nobody is willing to take on Social Security and Medicare and other Entitlements, even though not doing so only prolongs the problem, and a true solution to the debt situation CAN NOT EXIST without restructuring them.

The difference is that the politicians in Austin tackled the issue, though unpopular, because the founders of the state had the foresight to understand that politicians needed to be forced to live within their means and thus included a balanced budget clause in our state's constitution, one of a very few number of oversights the founders of the nation made.

So, in Austin, they handled it the best they could. Yes. They had to cut education spending as it was the biggest line item in the budget that they could actually do anything about. And they didn't cut it 10 billion like the fear mongers all claimed they would. Not 7 Billion. Not 5 Billion. ... but 4 billion in cuts to 75.5 billion dollar line item. Education spending was cut by 5.3%. ...and moreover, total spending was cut 15.2 billion. So this education spending cut accounted for 26.6% of the cut to the budget, even though education spending is 41.4% of total state spending. ...so it can be argued that they did everything they could to avoid huge cuts to education spending, and, indeed, forced the bulk of the cuts on other areas of spending.

I find it funny that people in this thread attack the governor for a decrease in spending on state parks, education and their own pet project then start railing that he has overseen the largest increase in the state's debt in history (a debt which is the result of accepting municipal bonds and not state level spending, and that isn't serviced by interest payments, but let's still use it as a political hot potato since the average citizen doesn't understand this fact).

I don't find Perry perfect, and he's done a good deal I wasn't excited with. His involvement with TTC and the HPV vaccine issue both are high on this list of things that I'm not a big fan of. He hasn't been as conservative as I'd like him to be. ...but when I look at the landscape of the folks in the GOP primary at present and narrow it down to the folks who could actually win the nomination, I then have to consider who of those people have the best chance in the general election. It's Romney or Perry. Given the choice, I'll take the guy who DIDN'T pass socialized medicine in their state.

I predict he'll win the Nomination, grab one of the tea party favorites as his running mate. I think the early attacks from the Whitehouse on Perry indicate they believe he's the favorite as well.

...but to be honest, unless this economy REALLY improves quickly, which I don't see happening given the current (and likely future policies of this administration) I think we could nominate Elmer Fudd and beat Obama next year. The economy and the fact that it has gotten SO MUCH worse since he took office will be the albatross around his neck, and he will be Carter-ed for it.

[Green2012]

...but to be honest, unless this economy REALLY improves quickly, which I don't see happening given the current (and likely future policies of this administration) I think we could nominate Elmer Fudd and beat Obama next year. The economy and the fact that it has gotten SO MUCH worse since he took office will be the albatross around his neck, and he will be Carter-ed for it.

Look yyz28, you make some good points but you got to look at how our economy got the way it did.

It was Bush's fault, the Chinese tsunamis, the south american spring, nascar kool-aid party baggers, the NRA, Rush Limbaugh, Bill O'Reilly, Stephen Colbert, Deepwater horizon explosion, HAARP, Anthony Weiner, etc. Obama hasn't done anything wrong. He's just being held back by the above people from fixing the problem.

[yyz28]

Look yyz28, you make some good points but you got to look at how our economy got the way it did.

It was Bush's fault, the Chinese tsunamis, the south american spring, nascar kool-aid party baggers, the NRA, Rush Limbaugh, Bill O'Reilly, Stephen Colbert, Deepwater horizon explosion, HAARP, Anthony Weiner, etc. Obama hasn't done anything wrong. He's just being held back by the above people from fixing the problem.

You forgot the Earthquake in Japan.

[GTWT]

going to hold out hope he's paid a little attention to History and knows you can't spend your way out of a recession/depression?

Rick

I'm not a historian but isn't that basically what Roosevelt did to get us out of the Great Depression? Of course WWII helped, which was government spending on a massive scale.

Edited August 20, 2011 by GTWT

[KRAM1]

I'm not a historian but isn't that basically what Roosevelt did to get us out of the Great Depression? Of course WWII helped, which was government spending on a massive scale.

Nope...many economists believe that FDR's programs were responsible for actually prolonging the Depression. It took WWII to bring the US (and the rest of the world) out of the depression. There have been several good articles and books written on this subject. You will always get a "yes-no" argument on this, but the more time passes the more objective people get on FDR (my Mom still thinks he was God's gift to the US and she's now 86) and his policies.