Unt Wants Nit But Not Cbi Or Cit

[foutsrouts]

I read Vito's blog post, and I didn't see any indication that this was part of the reasoning. Actually, it doesn't really say what the reasoning is at all; so I might not feel so free to impute motives to other people.

How does playing in the CBI/CIT fulfill that obligation?

I guess I'm just being like most human beings and going with the evidence at hand since they chose to provide very little. What is your reasoning?

Obviously, it allows fans to participate in the experience of a national post-season tourney, and to continue to gauge what kind of a team we have/had this year. Personally, the year this team had feels kind of incomplete to me. We won a lot of close games against questionable competition until we had the drop off, and then we began to show what we were made of in the 5 games leading up to the heartbreaker against UALR. I know that injuries and such were a factor in the ups and downs, but I'd like to see a little more of this team before it basically goes away. Doesn't look like I'm gonna get my wish.

[GreenBat]

The CBI & CIT both require buy ins. That's why SMU is playing the post season. If you are willing to pay for a post season spot, they'll take your money. There is no prestige or real intrest in these tournaments. HDNet is broadcasting one of them, I don't know which one and don't care.

[risinggreen]

The CBI & CIT both require buy ins. That's why SMU is playing the post season. If you are willing to pay for a post season spot, they'll take your money. There is no prestige or real intrest in these tournaments. HDNet is broadcasting one of them, I don't know which one and don't care.

There's prestige if you win, and not everyone does not care to watch a`CBI/CIT game featuring North Texas. Other than SBC games, our schedule this year was mainly populated by teams at the bottom of their conferences, and it would be nice to see how well we stack up against a group of pretty decent teams nationwide.

[MeanMag]

The fact that the best team we beat this year was Florida Atlantic kind of makes me think that we don't have a snowball's chance of going NIT. If the NIT had 64 teams we would have a chance, but I just don't see how the math could possibly work even if the top seed in every conference won their conference and conference tournament and went to the NCAA's. Glad to hear that we think we are so superior to these other teams who are going CIT and such, because I really wasn't aware of it. I know it may be a small factor in the decision making process, but the players and staff do have a small obligation to the fans who have sacrificed a lot of time, energy, and money supporting the team over the past 4 months. Too bad.

I mean this in the most respectful way possible;

You already received everything you were owed from this team, players and staff for your sacrifices in time, energy, and money. The team overpaid us fans that were fortunate enough to have made the trip to hot springs. We fans are owed nothing from players at this point, no matter how small you might think it is. The staff on this team have been nothing but appreciative and respectful of us fans and these players poured their guts onto the floor of the Summit. UNT owes it's players, which should be the only reason we would play in any post season tournament this year. What the staff owes UNT and it's fans is to look at what the program has now and what it needs to get to where we want to be year in and year out: The NCAA Tournament.

No one is saying that we think we are superior to those schools, we are saying it's not a good idea to pay to play those teams when coming so close to making it to where the players had their hearts and minds set. It's not slight against the schools who can gain something from playing in the post season tournament. Right now, we don't gain anything, if the players don't really want to be there.

[Greendylan]

There are plenty of legitimate reasons why the team might not want to participate in the CBI/CIT. However, I fear that the real reason is simply that the athletic department can't afford to pay. I'm sure they all know that an NIT bid isn't going to happen, and they only mentioned it to create the illusion that the school is making a conscious decision rather than facing economic realities.

[risinggreen]

There are plenty of legitimate reasons why the team might not want to participate in the CBI/CIT. However, I fear that the real reason is simply that the athletic department can't afford to pay. I'm sure they all know that an NIT bid isn't going to happen, and they only mentioned it to create the illusion that the school is making a conscious decision rather than facing economic realities.

Me thinks you hit the nail on the head, and that everyone on this board knows this to be true regardless of tongue in cheek comments about superiority. Having said that, I still think it's ridiculous that a school our size, and with a recently enacted athletic fee as well as some nice alumni contributions (Kuehne million etc.), cannot open up the purse strings for the chance at a little good publicity.

Even though the stadium is obviously a huge financial undertaking, I had hoped we had advanced beyond the penny pinching stage at this point. Somehow I don't think one of these tourneys would mortgage away UNT's future in the same manner that the U.S. Government has done so to its citizens.

Edited March 13, 2011 by risinggreen

[MeanMag]

Me thinks you hit the nail on the head, and that everyone on this board knows this to be true regardless of tongue in cheek comments about superiority. Having said that, I still think it's ridiculous that a school our size, and with a recently enacted athletic fee as well as some nice alumni contributions (Kuehne million etc.), cannot open up the purse strings for the chance at a little good publicity.

Even though the stadium is obviously a huge financial undertaking, I had hoped we had advanced beyond the penny pinching stage at this point. Somehow I don't think one of these tourneys would mortgage away UNT's future in the same manner that the U.S. Government has done so to its citizens.

Both you and Green Dylan are operating on wild speculation. Then, you make an argument against the athletic dept. based on an assumption for which you have no factual basis. Until you know for sure that the reason we aren't playing in the CBI or CIT is financial, I would not worry your pretty little head over it.

[risinggreen]

Both you and Green Dylan are operating on wild speculation. Then, you make an argument against the athletic dept. based on an assumption for which you have no factual basis. Until you know for sure that the reason we aren't playing in the CBI or CIT is financial, I would not worry your pretty little head over it.

Then what the Hell is the reason genius? This is an opinion board, and it would be great to hear your Einsteinian opinion, since I seriously doubt that anyone is going to come out and say that the school is to poor to play.

[UNTLifer]

Does the CBI or CIT really provide good publicity? Who played in these tournaments last year, who won them? That's what I thought. They are a wasted of time.

[foutsrouts]

Does the CBI or CIT really provide good publicity? Who played in these tournaments last year, who won them? That's what I thought. They are a wasted of time.

The punies got a nice top of the page article this morning in the DMN about their hosting of Oral Roberts on Wednesday. Not bad pub if you ask me. Could of been us, and we could have finally gotten our chance to kick some puny butt and officially claim the title of Metroplex BB champs in front of a predominantly MeanGreen crowd down at Moody. Too bad we're either too good, too poor, too disinterested, or too whatever to play in the CIT. Too bad.

[UNT90]

Does the CBI or CIT really provide good publicity? Who played in these tournaments last year, who won them? That's what I thought. They are a wasted of time.

What they do provide is a week of extra practice for the basketball team. Some schools can afford to pay for that extra week. I guess we can't?

[Green P1]

This is silly.

[UNTLifer]

The punies got a nice top of the page article this morning in the DMN about their hosting of Oral Roberts on Wednesday. Not bad pub if you ask me. Could of been us, and we could have finally gotten our chance to kick some puny butt and officially claim the title of Metroplex BB champs in front of a predominantly MeanGreen crowd down at Moody. Too bad we're either too good, too poor, too disinterested, or too whatever to play in the CIT. Too bad.

You really think we would have been paired up against SMU? If it was us and not SMU, we would have garnered a middle of the the sports section blurb.

A week's extra practice for a team full of seniors doesn't help us next year.

GreenP1 got it right, this is silly.

[foutsrouts]

You really think we would have been paired up against SMU? If it was us and not SMU, we would have garnered a middle of the the sports section blurb.

A week's extra practice for a team full of seniors doesn't help us next year.

GreenP1 got it right, this is silly.

Yeah, we would have likely gotten smu due to location, and I suspect that the pub would have been nice. You are right though. This is silly, because it is now all over and done with. Don't get it why they even bothered to put out the "NIT only" PR since everyone on the planet knew that was impossible. See ya next year.

[DallasGreen]

Uh, I really don't get the justification as to why we should think we are somehow "above" playing in one of these tourneys, since we just lost the SBC tourney, and could possibly play against someone like Air Force or SMU in the first round. I kind of look at it as a chance at redemption after screwing up late in the SBC regular season, and losing a very tough one against Little Rock. If someone has a legitimate reason other than a little money as to why these tourneys should be avoided, I would love to hear it. Winning a tournament of any kind would be special, since those titles really haven't been growing on trees around here in our long history of playing college basketball. Just don't get how we could turn down any opportunity at this point in time.

Back to the old philosophy--don't do what's best for the program do what costs less. I would have loved to play SMU, and it would draw well here or there.

[Greendylan]

Both you and Green Dylan are operating on wild speculation. Then, you make an argument against the athletic dept. based on an assumption for which you have no factual basis. Until you know for sure that the reason we aren't playing in the CBI or CIT is financial, I would not worry your pretty little head over it.

First of all, I used the words "I fear that," which implies speculation. I never pretended to have anything other than a gut feeling about the situation. Second, I did not necessarily "make an argument against the athletic dept." Instead, I made a guess about what might be going on and their subsequent P.R. strategy. I did not, however, state that they were wrong to take that action.

[MeanMag]

Then what the Hell is the reason genius? This is an opinion board, and it would be great to hear your Einsteinian opinion, since I seriously doubt that anyone is going to come out and say that the school is to poor to play.

That's just it, there is no reason. There's no reason to play in a post season tournament when 5 of your 1st 6 players are seniors. The one Junior (Hogans) has been banged up all year. White was on crutches at the end of the season. Tristan was ready to puke on the sidelines of the summit, because he was playing so hard. This team doesn't need another week of practice only to graduate half of it's roster in a couple of months.

Add that to the fact that your major contributors for next season are injured, or haven't gotten to campus yet, and it makes for absolutely no reason to play in a post season tournament. NOT 1 good reason. There are many teams that passed up these tournaments. Tulsa is one. So I don't buy into the "we're too poor to play", "woe is us" stuff. Argue that till you're blue in the face, but I guarantee it's not "the real" reason we aren't in the post season. The real reason we aren't in a post season tournament is because of a last second closely contested shot in Hot Springs, Arkansas.

This team left us wanting more. I'd say that's a pretty decent product we are putting on the floor if that's the case.

[MeanMag]

First of all, I used the words "I fear that," which implies speculation. I never pretended to have anything other than a gut feeling about the situation. Second, I did not necessarily "make an argument against the athletic dept." Instead, I made a guess about what might be going on and their subsequent P.R. strategy. I did not, however, state that they were wrong to take that action.

I understand, and didn't mean to imply you argued against it, you merely introduced to the speculative thought that UNT is too poor to play in a post season tournament that does it no good.

Others picked up this speculation as fact and started bringing up the US govt. and Taxes. Are you kidding me? This thread is full of fail.

This is not directed at you GreenDylan:

Paying to play in a post season tournament that isn't the NIT or NCAA is not in the programs' best interest just so some UNT alumnus can get off at work bragging to some stupid SMU ass clown. We should be secure enough with our basketball standing in the metroplex to not give a crap what any other school in it does, especially SMU.

If we were to play SMU, whose players would have more to prove? It certainly wouldn't be UNT. They've proven themselves over the past 4 years already.

Edited March 15, 2011 by MeanMag

[risinggreen]

If we were to play SMU, whose players would have more to prove? It certainly wouldn't be UNT. They've proven themselves over the past 4 years already.

The guys played like warriors down the stretch, and I'm certainly proud of them for that, but I beg to differ on your opinion that this team had nothing left to prove. With the high expectations we had coming into this season, many don't consider a middle of the pack finish in one of the lowest rated conferences in the country to exactly qualify as a stellar season. Not bad and very fun to follow, but definitely not exceptional.

I attended a dozen or so games this year and certainly enjoyed the entertainment and such, but the final result was obviously a letdown. Post-season of any reasonable sort would have been nice to see. Especially against teams like SMU and Air Force. You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but I guess your expectations were just a bit lower than mine.

[MeanMag]

The guys played like warriors down the stretch, and I'm certainly proud of them for that, but I beg to differ on your opinion that this team had nothing left to prove. With the high expectations we had coming into this season, many don't consider a middle of the pack finish in one of the lowest rated conferences in the country to exactly qualify as a stellar season. Not bad and very fun to follow, but definitely not exceptional.

I attended a dozen or so games this year and certainly enjoyed the entertainment and such, but the final result was obviously a letdown. Post-season of any reasonable sort would have been nice to see. Especially against teams like SMU and Air Force. You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but I guess your expectations were just a bit lower than mine.

My expectations were high. The way the season ended and the middle of it were certainly a let down. The type of balls on display in Hot Springs went a long way to adjusting my expectations which, like the season were a roller coaster. This team's proof that they were winners spanned far more than just one season.

I could not have stomached seeing Collin Mangrum play against the Mean Green a year after being a component to our tournament team. It wouldn't have felt right.

[UNTLifer]

Here's my point in all of this. The CBI/CIT really don't garner the program much prestige. Our team had their heart set on the NCAA's with the NIT as a consolation. Considering the injuries this team fought through, being down to eight players, Josh playing through an ankle injury late in the year that caused him to miss the last regular season game and Tristan and Kendrick getting banged up during the conference tournament, maybe they just didn't want to fight through the preparation without the ability to put the best team on the floor for lower level tournaments. These young men fought through alot this year, and while I was critical of them during the late season losses, they played their best when it counted. Let's let them end this on their terms and remember them for the four fabulous years they provided us fans and the University of North Texas.

[Quoner]

Here's my point in all of this. The CBI/CIT really don't garner the program much prestige. Our team had their heart set on the NCAA's with the NIT as a consolation. Considering the injuries this team fought through, being down to eight players, Josh playing through an ankle injury late in the year that caused him to miss the last regular season game and Tristan and Kendrick getting banged up during the conference tournament, maybe they just didn't want to fight through the preparation without the ability to put the best team on the floor for lower level tournaments. These young men fought through alot this year, and while I was critical of them during the late season losses, they played their best when it counted. Let's let them end this on their terms and remember them for the four fabulous years they provided us fans and the University of North Texas.

Fun with the CIT:

Today, the DMN said SMU pays $31,500 a game to host and then keeps the gate and concessions. SMU listed an official attendance of 1,090 for the first game. Tickets sell for $10 or $25 a piece. If they somehow sell an equal number of each, they still lose $12K. This is actually not as bad as I expected, but I expect the ticket mix would skew more towards the cheap seats, so let's say they lose closer to $15K a game. (Feel free to add in the $1-2K concessions estimate on your own time.)

If the exposure was there, this might be worth it. However, the only reason I even remembered any of this is because someone texted me a joke about the cost per game. I think it's fair to assume the tournament's biggest fans at this point are me and Matt Doherty. I can find enough first weekend tournament games to whip my ass and make me hate basketball and most average fans feel the same way.

[HoopManX]

Fun with the CIT:

Today, the DMN said SMU pays $31,500 a game to host and then keeps the gate and concessions. SMU listed an official attendance of 1,090 for the first game. Tickets sell for $10 or $25 a piece. If they somehow sell an equal number of each, they still lose $12K. This is actually not as bad as I expected, but I expect the ticket mix would skew more towards the cheap seats, so let's say they lose closer to $15K a game. (Feel free to add in the $1-2K concessions estimate on your own time.)

If the exposure was there, this might be worth it. However, the only reason I even remembered any of this is because someone texted me a joke about the cost per game. I think it's fair to assume the tournament's biggest fans at this point are me and Matt Doherty. I can find enough first weekend tournament games to whip my ass and make me hate basketball and most average fans feel the same way.

It's been a really fun tournament so far, tons of close games etc. THe two games at Moody certainly didn't benefit from Spring Break, but I think next years numbers will jump some. Not just playing in this tourney, but having the kind of games we've been having, helps moving forward. Going to Northern Iowa is going to be fun, and is a decent CUSA/MVC match-up. No one is claiming it to be what it's not, but it's late March and my team is playing OOC games, I'd have loved to see during the year. No real financial loss, build some momentum w/a very good roster next year. It's win/win for everyone

[UNTLifer]

SMU still does, and will always suck and lacks the balls to play us in basketball, so who gives a crap about what they do or who they play. They're just another allegation away from probation anyway, and nobody outside of their little pocket of Dallas cares about the program.

HoopManX, do you think we care? I've been on vacation and have heard nothing, not one drop of news regarding these spare tournaments,much less who is playing in them. The expense is just not justified. Losing 20 grand to play in a game nobody watches, that garners zero media coverage outside of the Park City News and the Pony Glue Factory is a waste.

[Green P1]

My ex-roommate's little brother plays for Jacksonville and had the phantom foul called on his spectacular block at the end of SMU's last game. If you watch the video it was a disgraceful call that gave SMU the win there.