Canales As Head Coach?

gangrene · November 8, 2010

I don't see how a retread is going to be "the answer" for the last 30 years of apathy. Howard Schnellenberger won a national championship so he certainly was "star-studded" and that hasn't translated into FAU being a national power.

I am not saying we should not hire someone who has been a head coach on more than an interim basis. I am just saying don't discredit Canales if he can get it done solely because he was brought in during Todd Dodge's last year.

I don't think anyone is discrediting Canales and certainly not because he worked with Todd Dodge. That's not the issue, at least not for me. The guy has been a Head Coach for TWO games!! TWO games!!! One could make the argument that Todd Dodge had more experience being a HEAD coach than Canales has.

And what, exactly, is the definition of a retread?? Someone that's held the same position at another school? Was Nick Saban a retread before he took the Alabama job? Lou Holtz? Steve Spurrier? Canales held the title of OC at three different schools, does that mean we hired a retread for OC when we hired Canales? Is Larry Coker a retread?? Sometimes it seems that UTSA is getting more national pub than UNT is and they haven't even played a single down of football yet.

MeanGreen61 · November 8, 2010

I don't think anyone is discrediting Canales and certainly not because he worked with Todd Dodge. That's not the issue, at least not for me. The guy has been a Head Coach for TWO games!! TWO games!!! One could make the argument that Todd Dodge had more experience being a HEAD coach than Canales has.

And what, exactly, is the definition of a retread?? Someone that's held the same position at another school? Was Nick Saban a retread before he took the Alabama job? Lou Holtz? Steve Spurrier? Canales held the title of OC at three different schools, does that mean we hired a retread for OC when we hired Canales? Is Larry Coker a retread?? Sometimes it seems that UTSA is getting more national pub than UNT is and they haven't even played a single down of football yet.

publicity doesn't win ball games and Coker hasn't put a team on the field since Miami.

Edited November 8, 2010 by MeanGreen61

Cr1028 · November 8, 2010

I don't think anyone is discrediting Canales and certainly not because he worked with Todd Dodge. That's not the issue, at least not for me. The guy has been a Head Coach for TWO games!! TWO games!!! One could make the argument that Todd Dodge had more experience being a HEAD coach than Canales has.

And what, exactly, is the definition of a retread?? Someone that's held the same position at another school? Was Nick Saban a retread before he took the Alabama job? Lou Holtz? Steve Spurrier? Canales held the title of OC at three different schools, does that mean we hired a retread for OC when we hired Canales? Is Larry Coker a retread?? Sometimes it seems that UTSA is getting more national pub than UNT is and they haven't even played a single down of football yet.

Neither Saban, Holtz, nor Spurrier were fired from their respective programs, so no, they are not retreads. Larry Coker is most certainly a retread in my eyes. He will not be successful at UTSA, Coker played Barry Switzer to Butch Davis' Jimmy Johnson. If not for Butch Davis leaving the program in such a good place when Coker took over, he wouldn't have won much of anything. The day Davis left, Miami started their fall from grace.

gangrene · November 8, 2010

Neither Saban, Holtz, nor Spurrier were fired from their respective programs, so no, they are not retreads. Larry Coker is most certainly a retread in my eyes. He will not be successful at UTSA, Coker played Barry Switzer to Butch Davis' Jimmy Johnson. If not for Butch Davis leaving the program in such a good place when Coker took over, he wouldn't have won much of anything. The day Davis left, Miami started their fall from grace.

Ok, so in order to be classified as a retread one has to be fired from that position....I can buy that. But, by that same definition, Canales is a two-time retread OC.

And, just for the record, I am in no way endorsing Larry Coker or suggesting he be considered for this position. The guy's a nut job and I agree with your assessment of his situation at Miami. However, I think UTSA definitely hired the right guy for their job at this period in their program's development. Likewise, I think Schnelly was the right hire for FAU but it's past due for them to begin looking for his replacement.

jtm0097 · November 8, 2010

Get us a win over MUTS and ULM, play a decent half against K-State, and you got the job.

Cr1028 · November 8, 2010

Does the fact that USF named their RB coach interim HC (and not OC, Mike Canales) when Leavitt was fired concern anyone? How about Canales referring to his "25 years of notes" for advice on how to be a HC? Or the fact that he's remained with the same organization for longer than three years only twice in his 25-year career?

Franks was named interim head coach because he was previously the head coach at Duke. Don't read so much into it.

eulessismore · November 8, 2010

Does the fact that USF named their RB coach interim HC (and not OC, Mike Canales) when Leavitt was fired concern anyone? How about Canales referring to his "25 years of notes" for advice on how to be a HC? Or the fact that he's remained with the same organization for longer than three years only twice in his 25-year career?

Not really, because they had no more football to play before the next season, and probably just wanted to keep Coach Carl Franks around to make sure the players were still going to classes; based on what I've read about him, that's something he was good at while at Duke, and continued at South Florida. I'm fairly certain it wasn't due to his won-loss (if people wonder why we kept Dodge as long as we did...) record at Duke, the only place he was HC. Here's something with his record:

Carl Franks bio from Wikipedia

gangrene · November 8, 2010

Franks was named interim head coach because he was previously the head coach at Duke. Don't read so much into it.

So you mean USF wanted an interim HC with previous FBS head coaching experience? Hmmmm....

eulessismore · November 8, 2010

So you mean USF wanted an interim HC with previous FBS head coaching experience? Hmmmm....

I'm fairly certain there's less to this story than meets the eye. You do realize that Franks was 7-45 at Duke, and that USF never planned for him to coach any practices or games, and that he was mostly known for academic compliance, right? In case you didn't look up his bio (I put a link in my previous post), he was pretty much there for keeping the kids going to class. But hey, Duke has been known as a place for academics, so maybe it just wasn't a place where anyone, even the legendary Carl Franks, could win much.

gangrene · November 8, 2010

I'm fairly certain there's less to this story than meets the eye. You do realize that Franks was 7-45 at Duke, and that USF never planned for him to coach any practices or games, and that he was mostly known for academic compliance, right? In case you didn't look up his bio (I put a link in my previous post), he was pretty much there for keeping the kids going to class. But hey, Duke has been known as a place for academics, so maybe it just wasn't a place where anyone, even the legendary Carl Franks, could win much.

No, you're right, I'm sure there's not much more to the story. I just found it curious, that's all.

FirefightnRick · November 8, 2010

Larry Coker is most certainly a retread in my eyes. He will not be successful at UTSA,

First define successful. Do they have to make the playoffs within the first three years or what?

Rick

MeanGreenTexan · November 8, 2010

He's sold me with his enthusiasm and passion. Hire him as permanent HC.

Yes. Me Too! I love enthusiasm and passion just about as much, if not more than winning! HIRE HIM! :bangin:

For the folks out there that cite Chico's passion to be HERE, at UNT, I say that is a bunch of dung. Canales wants to be a head coach. There's nothing wrong with that. I think it's great. This is his first opportunity to do that. Of course he wants to continue, so he will do and say the right things to keep his position, including being enthusiastic and passionate. He aint dumb.

For the folks who's main problem with hiring a "retread" or a former HC (fired or not) is that they will move on to another gig as soon as they can, I ask: What's the problem there? If a coach were to move on from UNT to a better program, it must mean that they led us to some pretty good seasons. That would be great!

We simply cannot afford to hand the coaching job over to someone simply because they show enthusiasm and passion. If that were the case, bring Dodge back!

UNT90 · November 8, 2010

Yes. Me Too! I love enthusiasm and passion just about as much, if not more than winning! HIRE HIM!

For the folks out there that cite Chico's passion to be HERE, at UNT, I say that is a bunch of dung. Canales wants to be a head coach. There's nothing wrong with that. I think it's great. This is his first opportunity to do that. Of course he wants to continue, so he will do and say the right things to keep his position, including being enthusiastic and passionate. He aint dumb.

For the folks who's main problem with hiring a "retread" or a former HC (fired or not) is that they will move on to another gig as soon as they can, I ask: What's the problem there? If a coach were to move on from UNT to a better program, it must mean that they led us to some pretty good seasons. That would be great!

We simply cannot afford to hand the coaching job over to someone simply because they show enthusiasm and passion. If that were the case, bring Dodge back!

Does it surprise anyone that most of the folks who rode the Dodge bandwagon to it's last stop have now taken a seat in the front row of the Canales bandwagon?

I think some on here may be a little too personally involved with this thing to be objective.

Troy this year is not the Troy of the past 3 years. They lost to freaking ULM and UAB, for goodness sakes. Troy's defense has been terrible, and their offense average. UNT was down the entire game, outside of a brief tie in the 1st quarter. I guess losing at home is acceptable to many on this forum who are used to blowout losses, but I don't find it the least bit impressive. Just another home loss to a below average (for their standards) Troy team.

I don't care if the coach handed you a football or said hello at the restaurant, I care whether or not the coach wins on Saturday. That didn't happen. Can we ease up on the lovefest after a freaking home loss?

Edited November 8, 2010 by UNT90

Green92 · November 8, 2010

Scary. I agree with UNT90. My world is upside down.

PlummMeanGreen · November 8, 2010

Canales is going to make this a tough decision. I like what I see the last two games.

Remember, who had really heard of Gary Patterson before he was elevated to Head Coach? We all know who he is now.

OK, for the visually impaired:

Gary Patterson came from a winning staff! Good Gosh!

I hate it when common sense doesn't seem to rule too well on this board and at North Texas (in general); a board which I have yet to see get its way with who it ever wanted as its next HFC and one that actually thinks one will now come from a football program on its way to its 6'th losing football season. We are giving our competitors much comic relief with such low expecations.

Forget the Sun Belt, too, as any semblance of a measuring stick for successs; it's a barometer for losers and those with very low goals if we can believe what almost every sports media outlet writes about our 10 year old league.

You poor, poor people who I guess think we've been making up all these stories about the mid-70's in MG Country, specifically our 1975 season. You are to be pittied for what you accept for success because you are the only ones in the NCAA who would accept such.

GMG!

Edited November 9, 2010 by PlummMeanGreen

oldguystudent · November 8, 2010

Can we ease up on the lovefest after a freaking home loss?

With my extremely limited experience watching UNT football, you could pretty much put an Acme brick on the sidelines and I would fall in love with it. Man, I need to get out more!

Got5onIt · November 8, 2010

Does it surprise anyone that most of the folks who rode the Dodge bandwagon to it's last stop have now taken a seat in the front row of the Canales bandwagon?

I think some on here may be a little too personally involved with this thing to be objective.

Troy this year is not the Troy of the past 3 years. They lost to freaking ULM and UAB, for goodness sakes. Troy's defense has been terrible, and their offense average. UNT was down the entire game, outside of a brief tie in the 1st quarter. I guess losing at home is acceptable to many on this forum who are used to blowout losses, but I don't find it the least bit impressive. Just another home loss to a below average (for their standards) Troy team.

I don't care if the coach handed you a football or said hello at the restaurant, I care whether or not the coach wins on Saturday. That didn't happen. Can we ease up on the lovefest after a freaking home loss?

Would you expect any less with the "knee jerkiness" of this place??? I mean, people were already calling for Canales to be head coach when he was first hired. We're like the fat girl waiting to be asked to the prom. The nerdiest guy to most will look like Fabio to her. We wont know how ugly the guy is until we look back at the prom pictures 20 years later. We're content with just getting asked out!

I commend Canales for his enthusiasm, etc. RV stated this is not an audition and will go through an extensive search. I'm fully expecting him to stick by that and hire a new face to run the UNT football program.

UNTLifer · November 8, 2010

OK, for the visually impaired:

Gary Patterson came from a winning staff! Good Gosh!

Outside of this year, So Does Canales! Good Gosh!

VideoEagle · November 8, 2010

RV stated this is not an audition and will go through an extensive search. I'm fully expecting him to stick by that and hire a new face to run the UNT football program.

RV can go through a extensive, national search and still find that Canales is the best fix. I don't know that he is. I think what he has done just in the two games shows he should get a full interview and an even chance. But, nothing he can do should make him get the job automatically above all other possible candidates.

Coaches with lots of experience as head coaches in one location fail in other locations: Dan Hawkins and Bob Tyler are two that come to mind quickly. Other coaches are fired for not performing at one school then win at their next: Hayden Fry for example. And coordinators from losing programs get hired as head coaches and sometimes succeed: Derek Dooley for example.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · November 8, 2010

Outside of this year, So Does Canales! Good Gosh!

This...again and again and again.

The problem is too many in our fanbase have their football weenies up for two coaches embroiled in lawsuits with their former universities, and no one else will do. Our fanbase is like a flock of sheep, constantly locked into one path.

Before the season, I said I'd be for the coaching staff being kept if we went 4-4 in conference. We can still do that. The only difference is Todd Dodge is no longer the head coach.

If we go 4-4 in conference, I'll be for keeping Canales over anyone else. If not, I'll be for Canales submitting his resume and interviewing like everyone else, with no guarantees.

Some people here were hell bent for or against Todd Dodge. Trying to pin three years of Dodge onto Canales' one season in Denton is absurd. This team obviously plays differently under Canales than it did under Dodge. Let's not pretend Canales is to blame for Dodge's 2007-2009 fiascos.

Canales has been a part of building a couple of winners - Arizona's rebuilding under Mike Stoops and South Florida's building under Jim Leavitt.

Canales wasn't hire here until January 29th of this year, a few days before recruiting ended. You can't pin the Dodge disaster on him, from any angle - recruiting or past performance.

(By the way, this was yet another Todd Dodge mistake, playing the "Ford and George are staying" charade thoughout last year's recruiting period instead of firing them right after the season and getting more college football coaches in here to help recruit better.)

Anyway, if Canales can get us to 4-4, hire him. If not, put him in line with the rest. But, either way, he's helped build enough winners elsewhere and wasn't here to lay the foundations of what is here now - he's just doing a hell of a job leading with what mess he's been left.

Army of Dad · November 8, 2010

Neither Saban, Holtz, nor Spurrier were fired from their respective programs, so no, they are not retreads. Larry Coker is most certainly a retread in my eyes. He will not be successful at UTSA, Coker played Barry Switzer to Butch Davis' Jimmy Johnson. If not for Butch Davis leaving the program in such a good place when Coker took over, he wouldn't have won much of anything. The day Davis left, Miami started their fall from grace.

Fall from power or national prominence maybe, but "the U" has never had nor ever will have any grace.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · November 8, 2010

More crazy predictions of Coker failure. Coker will be fine at UTSA, much to the chagrine of those UNT fans, who for reasons unknown, care.

UNT90 · November 8, 2010

This...again and again and again.

The problem is too many in our fanbase have their football weenies up for two coaches embroiled in lawsuits with their former universities, and no one else will do. Our fanbase is like a flock of sheep, constantly locked into one path.

Before the season, I said I'd be for the coaching staff being kept if we went 4-4 in conference. We can still do that. The only difference is Todd Dodge is no longer the head coach.

If we go 4-4 in conference, I'll be for keeping Canales over anyone else. If not, I'll be for Canales submitting his resume and interviewing like everyone else, with no guarantees.

Some people here were hell bent for or against Todd Dodge. Trying to pin three years of Dodge onto Canales' one season in Denton is absurd. This team obviously plays differently under Canales than it did under Dodge. Let's not pretend Canales is to blame for Dodge's 2007-2009 fiascos.

Canales has been a part of building a couple of winners - Arizona's rebuilding under Mike Stoops and South Florida's building under Jim Leavitt.

Canales wasn't hire here until January 29th of this year, a few days before recruiting ended. You can't pin the Dodge disaster on him, from any angle - recruiting or past performance.

(By the way, this was yet another Todd Dodge mistake, playing the "Ford and George are staying" charade thoughout last year's recruiting period instead of firing them right after the season and getting more college football coaches in here to help recruit better.)

Anyway, if Canales can get us to 4-4, hire him. If not, put him in line with the rest. But, either way, he's helped build enough winners elsewhere and wasn't here to lay the foundations of what is here now - he's just doing a hell of a job leading with what mess he's been left.

Posted 26 August 2010 - 10:52 AM

"Pick any two of the words, and you have your two words.

Coach Mike.

Coach Chico.

Coach Canales.

Mike Canales.

Chico Canales.

No matter your two word choice, the conclusion remains the same: Coach Mike "Chico" Canales is the wheel behind all of the football good happening at North Texas these days. And, we are happier than a glass of iced tea to have him!"

I have no doubt that if Coach Canales is named permanent head coach, you will predict a 12-0 season next year.

Hell, you might even attend a home game.

jimbob · November 8, 2010

This...again and again and again.

The problem is too many in our fanbase have their football weenies up for two coaches embroiled in lawsuits with their former universities, and no one else will do. Our fanbase is like a flock of sheep, constantly locked into one path.

Before the season, I said I'd be for the coaching staff being kept if we went 4-4 in conference. We can still do that. The only difference is Todd Dodge is no longer the head coach.

If we go 4-4 in conference, I'll be for keeping Canales over anyone else. If not, I'll be for Canales submitting his resume and interviewing like everyone else, with no guarantees.

Some people here were hell bent for or against Todd Dodge. Trying to pin three years of Dodge onto Canales' one season in Denton is absurd. This team obviously plays differently under Canales than it did under Dodge. Let's not pretend Canales is to blame for Dodge's 2007-2009 fiascos.

Canales has been a part of building a couple of winners - Arizona's rebuilding under Mike Stoops and South Florida's building under Jim Leavitt.

Canales wasn't hire here until January 29th of this year, a few days before recruiting ended. You can't pin the Dodge disaster on him, from any angle - recruiting or past performance.

(By the way, this was yet another Todd Dodge mistake, playing the "Ford and George are staying" charade thoughout last year's recruiting period instead of firing them right after the season and getting more college football coaches in here to help recruit better.)

Anyway, if Canales can get us to 4-4, hire him. If not, put him in line with the rest. But, either way, he's helped build enough winners elsewhere and wasn't here to lay the foundations of what is here now - he's just doing a hell of a job leading with what mess he's been left.

Don't forget, Canales was hired for just this scenario. RV knew he would in all likelihood fire Dodge; Canales was available as an OC and could probably guide a program as an interim HC and if Dodge made his number he still had Canales on staff. Smart, Machiavellian AD!