The Green Texas Flag

[drex]

I noticed that the Talons did not wave the green Texas battle flag at the Rice game. Will they do so at the LaLa game? Just curious. It would be a good tradition to keep going.

[FirefightnRick]

Considering the condition Boomer was in that day I fear what may have happened to the NT Battle Flag? They probably lost it and I'll have to go buy them another one for the third damn time!

Rick

[THOR]

talons dropping the ball again???

[UNTLifer]

Maybe somebody else should be responsible for these traditions. Heck, add a couple more cheerleaders and let them be responsible for the flag and Boomer. The Talons dropped the ball on lighting the tower, didn't bring the flag and have let Boomer fall to less than pristine condition tells me they don't care.

[CMJ]

Maybe somebody else should be responsible for these traditions. Heck, add a couple more cheerleaders and let them be responsible for the flag and Boomer. The Talons dropped the ball on lighting the tower, didn't bring the flag and have let Boomer fall to less than pristine condition tells me they don't care.

If you recall the non-lighting of the tower had a valid reason.

I don't know what the excuses are for the flag and/or Boomer - but how about waiting before passing judgement.

[THOR]

If you recall the non-lighting of the tower had a valid reason.

I don't know what the excuses are for the flag and/or Boomer - but how about waiting before passing judgement.

valid reason my arse! it was said in a previous thread that the talons of the past had to sometimes pry the box open just enough to flip the switch. these talons, or longer fingernails, are dropping the ball. if it's something that is that important to an organization, they will find a way to make it happen, just like the talons of the past did!

[UNTLifer]

If you recall the non-lighting of the tower had a valid reason.

I don't know what the excuses are for the flag and/or Boomer - but how about waiting before passing judgement.

Actions speak louder than words, and their lack of action speaks volumes.

[CMJ]

valid reason my arse! it was said in a previous thread that the talons of the past had to sometimes pry the box open just enough to flip the switch. these talons, or longer fingernails, are dropping the ball. if it's something that is that important to an organization, they will find a way to make it happen, just like the talons of the past did!

Yeah, I'm the one who said it dude.

The loop on the lock at the time was long enough at the time that you could trist it in such a way that you could the crack open the box and slide your hand in it. A semester or two before I graduated that lock was cut by NT for some reason, and a new lock was put on the box which we had a key too. But that lock did not have nearly the size of loop to gerry-rig it open if the key was ever lost(trust me, I tried).

Now the email that was posted on the forum a few days ago from Talons said another lock had been put on. Unless it was a lock with a look long such as the one in the mid to late 90's -- getting your hand undernear it would be impossible.

Talons Member Fall 1996 - Summmer 2001

[CMJ]

Actions speak louder than words, and their lack of action speaks volumes.

Again, you have no idea what sort of mitigating factors there were. Neither do I. But I do know, having been in Talons, sometimes crap happened.

Edited October 1, 2010 by CMJ

[THOR]

Yeah, I'm the one who said it dude.

The loop on the lock at the time was long enough at the time that you could trist it in such a way that you could the crack open the box and slide your hand in it. A semester or two before I graduated that lock was cut by NT for some reason, and a new lock was put on the box which we had a key too. But that lock did not have nearly the size of loop to gerry-rig it open if the key was ever lost(trust me, I tried).

Now the email that was posted on the forum a few days ago from Talons said another lock had been put on. Unless it was a lock with a look long such as the one in the mid to late 90's -- getting your hand undernear it would be impossible.

Talons Member Fall 1996 - Summmer 2001

hell, my memory sucks, but i do appreciate what you did back then, but i just think that if it was important enough, they would have found a way to light the tower...and fly the nt flag....and make sure the cannon was in proper care.

btw, i was never in the talons, have no idea what it entails, and was just a band geek during my days at north texas.

[CMJ]

Trust me, anytime I hear the Talons allegedly dropped the ball - it disappoints me greatly. Probably more than any non-Talon. I just know sometimes things just happened. Like all the times the Model A broke down. Or I seem to recall once that one of the hooks on the flagpole broke and we couldn't fly the damn thing.

Edited October 1, 2010 by CMJ

[FirefightnRick]

If you recall the non-lighting of the tower had a valid reason.

I don't know what the excuses are for the flag and/or Boomer - but how about waiting before passing judgement.

I didn't hear the excuse for not lighting the tower, but I bet it was less than valid? Still, he's accurate on the rest.

It continues to be a difficult task of mine to have to defend this group when they treat each upcoming football season as if it's just another thing to do on a house cleaning chore list.

"...and if I don't get to the laundry today, then oh well, I'll get it next week."

When in fact, it is THE MOST important thing on their list and their preparation for it has been less than acceptable.

Boomer, The Model A and Spirit Bell are not toys. It's time we stop treating them as such.

Very frustrating!

Rick

[FirefightnRick]

Now the email that was posted on the forum a few days ago from Talons said another lock had been put on. Unless it was a lock with a look long such as the one in the mid to late 90's -- getting your hand undernear it would be impossible.

Ok, is this the "VALID" reason you mentioned earlier, that someone else had put a lock on the damn thing and Talons didn't have the key? What a shocker that must have been that we win a game and someone has to go slug their way down to the tower at 10:30 on a saturday night in the THIRD WEEK OF THE FOOTBALL season to find that the lock had been changed?

Speaking of Talons and locks.

Currently Boomer has a lock on it's Limber Box and they lost the key to it..........LAST YEAR!!!!,....so in order to get into the box they removed the screws to the bottom portion of the hasp that I hand F@#$ING built and left it that way as late as the Rice game...THIS YEAR!!!. All the while, the lock that is too damn large for what it is being used for continues to swing back and forth scratching the shit out of a $1,000 piece of custom oak cabinetry.

Rick

Edited October 1, 2010 by FirefightnRick

[CMJ]

Not too hard to find the referenced thread Rick - but here was what the current Talons President sent out.

We had someone out at the tower to light it and had people there ready to celebrate but sadly, maintance had prevented the box from being able to be opened. The box that we open up to gain access to the tower light was bolted shut which prevented the tower from being lighted. We are currently working on this and it will be definitely fixed within the day.

Kayla Spears

Now, was this something that could have been avoided? Probably. But, I sure as hell didn't check that box everyday when I was in school, so if campus security had slapped on a new lock I wouldn't have known until the next time I tried to turn it on either.

Now the question to me is, how long ago had this been bolted shut? I would think that if they'd been turning the light on for the soccer gals or whatnot, they would have realized this --- unless it had been done within the 48 hours or so previous to the football win.

[FirefightnRick]

Not too hard to find the referenced thread Rick - but here was what the current Talons President sent out.

Now, was this something that could have been avoided? Probably. But, I sure as hell didn't check that box everyday when I was in school, so if campus security had slapped on a new lock I wouldn't have known until the next time I tried to turn it on either.

Now the question to me is, how long ago had this been bolted shut? I would think that if they'd been turning the light on for the soccer gals or whatnot, they would have realized this --- unless it had been done within the 48 hours or so previous to the football win.

As I expected, that is a pitiful excuse! They know what is coming up in September. Damn, they have all summer long to make sure these things are ready to go for the football season, especially considering they encourage people to follow them to the tower to light it green after a win. What if there's a short, what if one of the lights are out, what if.....? But as we know, they waited until they had to go and do it before even looking at the thing. The fact of the matter is, just as it has been for years, it's not a priority to them to get things ready for the upcoming season. Hard to believe, but I've been called the night before a game to ask where they can go get powder for the Cannon on more than one occasion over the years. Ridiculous but true.

You can make excuses all you want for them, but it's quite clear their responsibilities as a service and spirit organization are not a priority to them and it shows every freakin year. It's called a lack of pride and responsibility and I'm shocked that the university continues to give them what, a $10,000 check each year to operate on? If a school of this size is going to continue to rely on them to uphold what should be looked upon as an honored position to keep and uphold it's traditions and spirit then maybe the university needs to place their funding back to the way it was when I was there, making them raise their own money for their budget. Then maybe they would appreciate the responsibility they are given to uphold for this school a little better? Otherwise, someone with a better respect for the responsibilities this position requires needs to take the traditional historical items over.

Rick McKinney.....NOT VERY PROUD RIGHT NOW TO BE A TALON!

[CMJ]

Well I was called once a few years ago to give advice on how to fix a building issue at the Bonfire site half a country away? I was happy to help as best I could with advice. Look Rick, when I was in Talons former members (including you for all I know, though I never heard it from you myself) always bitched and moaned about the state of the current membership (some thought we had taken all the fun out, others that we weren't serious enough). We didn't get 10K bucks in my day (I think Chris Latham was working on some sort of monetary support but it didn't go through until my era all graduated), but I'm sure you woulda thought we were just as guilty at laying down on the job as these kids. It's not like we ever checked the lights during the summer to make sure they were working properly (unless it was one of us turning them on in the summer for the heck of it one night - which I did for my birthday in July one year - and then we'd typically hear about it from the administration)...because we didn't. We nearly ran out of gunpowder a few times (I remember once we were down to our final charge) because we didn't know we were almost out. And we could only get the gunpowder from Gus at the time if I recall correctly.

So I suppose in your eyes we didn't take any of that stuff seriously, but that's fine by me, because I know we cared.

Edited October 1, 2010 by CMJ

[UNT_playmaker]

Yeah I was really suprised that they didn't light the green tower, one of the advantages of still living in Denton, while being an alumni is looking at the admin tower with the green light turned on after any athletic victory.

Look forward to another victory soon and the tower being lit

All of these actions are inexcusable. Just hope they dont fall through on Homecoming.

[Rudy]

Being a Talon Alum, I can verify that crap does happen. Wait to pass judgement. I'm going to e-mail the president.

[SilverEagle]

Considering the condition Boomer was in that day I fear what may have happened to the NT Battle Flag? They probably lost it and I'll have to go buy them another one for the third damn time!

Rick

(heavy sigh) Rick, if another flag needs to be purchased please contact me for a contribution. The same goes for cannon supplies. I'll also go in on yearly tune-ups for the model-A. If there are any mechanical problems with the model-A, my local mechanic is prize winner at car shows for his restored model-A's, and I will be glad to try and get him involved with maintaining the car.

[ShopMeanGreen]

This whole thread makes me sad. I can't understand why the breaker box would be bolted shut unless someone actively didn't want the tower lit. Why would someone do that??? Because they didn't know better or just didn't care. I have a story with the Talons and would share at some point. I have a concern with whoever the faculty sponsor for the Talons is. That should be a link to Admin, Maint etc to make sure the box is not bolted shut, supplies are ready and precious traditions are properly cared for. Some of those things can't be replaced. Why anyone would have to jimmy their way into the box to turn the lights on is beyond me anyway. Can someone tell me how the Talons are currently structured (funding, sponsor and what department) I think The Athleic Dept should be responsible however they prob don't want it but likely would be willing to have alum support. I don't want to take money away from the athletic dept but I would guess they are a few of us that would be willing to spare a couple bucks to make thing run more smoothly. The new stadium is a perfect time to revamp the Talons and I'm willing to jump in to do whatever I can. There should be some structure near or in MGV that can be lit along with the tower, both can be lit by the Mean Green player of the game remotely. A new tradition.

Todd

[emmitt01]

This whole thread makes me sad. I can't understand why the breaker box would be bolted shut unless someone actively didn't want the tower lit. Why would someone do that??? Because they didn't know better or just didn't care. I have a story with the Talons and would share at some point. I have a concern with whoever the faculty sponsor for the Talons is. That should be a link to Admin, Maint etc to make sure the box is not bolted shut, supplies are ready and precious traditions are properly cared for. Some of those things can't be replaced. Why anyone would have to jimmy their way into the box to turn the lights on is beyond me anyway. Can someone tell me how the Talons are currently structured (funding, sponsor and what department) I think The Athleic Dept should be responsible however they prob don't want it but likely would be willing to have alum support. I don't want to take money away from the athletic dept but I would guess they are a few of us that would be willing to spare a couple bucks to make thing run more smoothly. The new stadium is a perfect time to revamp the Talons and I'm willing to jump in to do whatever I can. There should be some structure near or in MGV that can be lit along with the tower, both can be lit by the Mean Green player of the game remotely. A new tradition.

Todd

Courtland can defend the Talons all he wants. They are NOT the same as they were, even in my day. It became, unfortunatley, over time a social club. A social club that actively voted to exclude their alumni from having any sort of meaningful "voice" within the organization. Now why, if you planned on being responsible and upholding the traditions (several of which I started myself with nothing more than imagination and effort) of those that came before you would you do that? Ask your average student on campus, they don't exist or aren't revered.

(Cue Courtland saying that we weren't overly well known in his day either...I KNOW we were when I was around)

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

--- Can you imagine what what happen at A&M if some corps member failed to do as he was expected....??? [one of my sons was in it and the other a UNT grad] They would never forget that again... There is are very few excuses for these "errors" that would hold up. Someone or people need to have their rears kicked.

---These guys would NOT be very good Boy Scouts either...BE PREPARED .... check out everything ahead of time to see that it works and can be done as expected... They acted like little irresponsable kids. These guys will likely be failures in the corporate world. They don't put up with that either.

Yawl may not like Aggies but they are what they are because of high expectations... This guys need to be booted out (remove any official campus recognition).

Edited October 1, 2010 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[CMJ]

Courtland can defend the Talons all he wants. They are NOT the same as they were, even in my day. It became, unfortunatley, over time a social club. A social club that actively voted to exclude their alumni from having any sort of meaningful "voice" within the organization. Now why, if you planned on being responsible and upholding the traditions (several of which I started myself with nothing more than imagination and effort) of those that came before you would you do that? Ask your average student on campus, they don't exist or aren't revered.

(Cue Courtland saying that we weren't overly well known in his day either...I KNOW we were when I was around)

I love ya Emmitt, but very few really people really knew who we were. Other student groups yes, because we tried to make ourselves more known to them (especially your efforts when you were VP), but school spirit was so lacking when we were around, that the average person didn't know who we were. We got mistaken for the Wings ALL THE TIME. In my own world - folks in the RTVF department by and large didn't know who we were - and a surprising number of them were real sports fans (stereotypes be damned).

Alumni in general ALWAYS say it's not the same when they were in school - that's like the first rule of being an alumn! It's quite amusing for you to beat your chest about Talons being so much worse now than it was when we were walking the campus because you and I had many conversations about how the alumni needed to get over the fact that it was different than when they were around. Sure we liked when the alums showed up here and there, but we also resented if they tried to push us around. So can you blame the membership now if they do the same thing?

[CMJ]

--- Can you imagine what what happen at A&M if some corps member failed to do as he was expected....??? [one of my sons was in it and the other a UNT grad] They would never forget that again... There is are very few excuses for these "errors" that would hold up. Someone or people need to have their rears kicked.

---These guys would NOT be very good Boy Scouts either...BE PREPARED .... check out everything ahead of time to see that it works and can be done as expected... They acted like little irresponsable kids. These guys will likely be failures in the corporate world. They don't put up with that either.

Yawl may not like Aggies but they are what they are because of high expectations... This guys need to be booted out (remove any official campus recognition).

The Corps is also a military organization.

[FirefightnRick]

Well I was called once a few years ago to give advice on how to fix a building issue at the Bonfire site half a country away? I was happy to help as best I could with advice. Look Rick, when I was in Talons former members (including you for all I know, though I never heard it from you myself) always bitched and moaned about the state of the current membership (some thought we had taken all the fun out, others that we weren't serious enough). We didn't get 10K bucks in my day (I think Chris Latham was working on some sort of monetary support but it didn't go through until my era all graduated), but I'm sure you woulda thought we were just as guilty at laying down on the job as these kids. It's not like we ever checked the lights during the summer to make sure they were working properly (unless it was one of us turning them on in the summer for the heck of it one night - which I did for my birthday in July one year - and then we'd typically hear about it from the administration)...because we didn't. We nearly ran out of gunpowder a few times (I remember once we were down to our final charge) because we didn't know we were almost out. And we could only get the gunpowder from Gus at the time if I recall correctly.

So I suppose in your eyes we didn't take any of that stuff seriously, but that's fine by me, because I know we cared.

So are you saying that because you felt your era did a poor job that it is ok for the current group to do a poor job also as long as they themselves CARE? I hope that isn't what your saying because if so, that is another pitiful excuse for the current group's performance.

Besides, it doesn't really matter what we Talon alumni think. It's what the university and the fans of the Mean Green that the current Talons serve thinks and as you can see it has been noticed by the outsiders that this current group isn't getting it done. Interestingly, when one certain group from the past wasn't getting it done with Scrappy(Eppy), the AD dept was forced to step in and took Scrappy away from the Talon reponsibilities and gave it to the cheerleaders instead. I'm certain that current group CARED about it, otherwise they wouldn't have come crying to me when it happened. But at the end of the day CARING and having feelings about a job being done poorly is still a job being done poorly.

I swear I'm starting to respect Craig Helwig more and more for that move with each and every passing season.

Rick

Edited October 1, 2010 by FirefightnRick