A Little Psychoanalysis

[UNTFan23]

I just know that if I were an AD and was the CEO of soliciting funds for support, I would make sure they understood one thing: When you give, you are not giving to buy a piece of this team. No one owns this program but the students who provide the vast majority of its support through their student fees. I would tell any potential donor that they are giving to support student athletes, period. They are not giving so that that they can have a say in the hiring and firing of coaches or managing the program. If the above was not good enough for any would-be donor, then don't let the door hit you on the way out.

And, Fire Fighten Rick, I used to have respect for you, but no more my friend. I'll sit where I want to sit...with us common folk who don't want to listen to crap like yours.

Fine, you can tell me (as a donor) that I have no say in the hiring and firing of coaches, but I can also refuse to donate based on who is the current coach and let it be known that I will not donate until there is a replacement. We'll see who wins in the long run.

I'm sure a part of your job performance as an Athletic Director you are judged on retaining/expanding your donor base. If you start seeing a decrease in your donor base, you might start to think that maybe all those donors I lost were right when your raise wasn't what you were hoping 'cause your ability to keep your donor numbers up fell a little flat.

Just understand that I have something you want ... money to pay that coach you for some reason want to keep.

[Green Mean]

I just know that if I were an AD and was the CEO of soliciting funds for support, I would make sure they understood one thing: When you give, you are not giving to buy a piece of this team. No one owns this program but the students who provide the vast majority of its support through their student fees. I would tell any potential donor that they are giving to support student athletes, period. They are not giving so that that they can have a say in the hiring and firing of coaches or managing the program. If the above was not good enough for any would-be donor, then don't let the door hit you on the way out.

And, Fire Fighten Rick, I used to have respect for you, but no more my friend. I'll sit where I want to sit...with us common folk who don't want to listen to crap like yours.

No

[FirefightnRick]

I just know that if I were an AD and was the CEO of soliciting funds for support, I would make sure they understood one thing: When you give, you are not giving to buy a piece of this team. No one owns this program but the students who provide the vast majority of its support through their student fees. I would tell any potential donor that they are giving to support student athletes, period. They are not giving so that that they can have a say in the hiring and firing of coaches or managing the program. If the above was not good enough for any would-be donor, then don't let the door hit you on the way out.

And, Fire Fighten Rick, I used to have respect for you, but no more my friend. I'll sit where I want to sit...with us common folk who don't want to listen to crap like yours.

LOL!!!You come here bashing people with a broad stick then expect them to offer you a rubdown or something?

Funniest thing I've read all day.

Rick

Edited September 20, 2010 by FirefightnRick

[FirefightnRick]

I'm sure a part of your job performance as an Athletic Director you are judged on retaining/expanding your donor base.

Exactly, and don't forget the fact that.......IN THE REAL WORLD, most coaches and A.D.'s have season ticket sales incentives written into their contracts.

Good greif I can't believe this thread?????

Rick

[Green P1]

No

Maybe?

[SilverEagle]

I remember that one of the first things that Hayden Fry did was to have a town hall-type meeting and invited everyone to attend...including students faculty, and employees of the school. Basically he said that it was his assessment that the student body and the University in general had an inferiority complex regarding our image, both as an institution of higher learning and our athletic programs. He said that it was his assessment that North Texas was a GREAT UNIVERSITY (Adler would have loved that) and that we had nothing to feel inferior about. He pledged that he would see to it that the athletic programs matched the academic excellence at North Texas. He never talked about levels of giving, he just wanted everyone to show up and be proud of the Mean Green.

I've never seen anything like that gathering again. It was the beginning of a culture change at North Texas. Had he stayed, the culture change would have been complete.

And by the way, his assessment was right on. We've never been this understood by a head coach, or an AD, since he left.

[the real grad88]

I'm done with this thread and with this Board for a while. Ya'll have helped to clarify my "fan" philosophy and maybe I have helped to clarify the thinking of some of you (probably far away from my own thinking-which is fine). I think I will just keep buying my single game tickets and hotdogs for the kids, and teach them the fight song and watch them laugh and play and just have fun being Green. To each his own. Blessings.

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

This thread is Exhibit A1 for why the next hire can't be a local hero or cult figure - those too close (or, too admiring) will always have an excuse to keep them when things are going poorly (for four years in a row).

88's version of this is: "Ignore what you see on the field. The players aren't dealing cocaine, robbing, raping, or pillaging. And, they are going to class as well."

Oh, okay. If that's where the bar is set, I'll see you in the stands at the next Austin College game. We can enjoy the game of football together watching a fine group of law abiding young men who put studying first.

And, for the next act, a professional football league comprised solely of players with no less than one graduate degree. Business owners with MBAs, attorneys, doctors, professors. Cowboys Stadium will be packed to watch that action.

Edited September 20, 2010 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

[forevereagle]

I'm done with this thread and with this Board for a while.

Promise?

[Green Mean]

Maybe?

YES OR NO!!

[CMJ]

YES OR NO!!

Might or might not?

[eulessismore]

I remember that one of the first things that Hayden Fry did was to have a town hall-type meeting and invited everyone to attend...including students faculty, and employees of the school. Basically he said that it was his assessment that the student body and the University in general had an inferiority complex regarding our image, both as an institution of higher learning and our athletic programs. He said that it was his assessment that North Texas was a GREAT UNIVERSITY (Adler would have loved that) and that we had nothing to feel inferior about. He pledged that he would see to it that the athletic programs matched the academic excellence at North Texas. He never talked about levels of giving, he just wanted everyone to show up and be proud of the Mean Green.

I've never seen anything like that gathering again. It was the beginning of a culture change at North Texas. Had he stayed, the culture change would have been complete.

And by the way, his assessment was right on. We've never been this understood by a head coach, or an AD, since he left.

+1 for bringing up what we have really needed, rather than psychoanalysis, which is psychological warfare. I guess one of the most disappointing things I saw in the Rice game was our lack of using the running game to wear them down more when we had the opportunity (early in the game, instead of a low percentage pass play on 3rd and 2). To me, it looked like the Rice defense was wearing down by halftime, and continuing when we were up by 5. When we didn't have any answer to that coffin nail punt before their go ahead score, you could just about feel the air going out of the stadium. I kinda wished we'd taken an intentional safety and free kicked it from the twenty, at least giving our defense a chance against a longer field. It was like you could sense that deja vu, "oh no, here we go again" from the players and coaches. And then, even the cheerleaders not knowing when to hold the noise down when WE have the ball...

[MeanGreenTexan]

Fine, you can tell me (as a donor) that I have no say in the hiring and firing of coaches, but I can also refuse to donate based on who is the current coach and let it be known that I will not donate until there is a replacement. We'll see who wins in the long run.

I'm sure a part of your job performance as an Athletic Director you are judged on retaining/expanding your donor base. If you start seeing a decrease in your donor base, you might start to think that maybe all those donors I lost were right when your raise wasn't what you were hoping 'cause your ability to keep your donor numbers up fell a little flat.

Just understand that I have something you want ... money to pay that coach you for some reason want to keep.

PLEASE, EVERYONE UNDERSTAND THIS:

Regardless of how you feel about Dodge, Villareal, or anyone associated, please understand that when you withold supportive funding to the program (especially the MGC), you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater. No one sufferes more when you do that than the student-athletes. They don't deserve to have your frustrations taken out on them by reducing their scholly funds!!

UNTFan23, you're argument above completely overlooks this. I hope you reconsider.

Get on here and piss, moan, & complain all you want. Heck call for Dodge's head all you want, but to withold financial support to the students because you're not happy with the coaching situation is awful.

Edited September 20, 2010 by MeanGreenTexan

[mad dog]

And then, even the cheerleaders not knowing when to hold the noise down when WE have the ball...

Or when we have an injured player down on the field...

[rcade]

Get on here and piss, moan, & complain all you want. Heck call for Dodge's head all you want, but to withold financial support to the students because you're not happy with the coaching situation is awful.

Then I am an awful, awful person. I ain't paying jack for any more 1- and 2-win seasons.

Student-athletes earn scholarships by being good at their sports. If they play poorly, their scholarship spot is not guaranteed for four years. It will be given to someone else.

This isn't a bunch of third graders in YMCA football. They're adults who know their scholarships are tied to on-field success. If the MGC funds fewer scholarships next year because the team racked up another dismal season, them's the breaks.

[CMJ]

Of course...they're probably gonna cut back on track athletes or something, not football rcade.

[MeanGreenTexan]

Of course...they're probably gonna cut back on track athletes or something, not football rcade.

Bingo.

Soccer is not a revenue sport by any stretch of the imagination, but those girls are good and they need every dollar they can get/deserve.

It's great to see the softball ladies out on gamedays selling programs, but they are doing that out of need. Not for fun.

Coach Lama has put together a darn good tennis team. They also need all the funding they can get/deserve.

Coach Stracke is putting together a pretty nice golf team....,etc...

You get the idea. Just don't let coach Dodge get in your way of suppporting these students is all I'm asking.

rcade, will your witholding of funds help light a fire under RV to fire Dodge and get a new coach? Possibly.

If I'm RV though, how could I possibly know that your contribution would be guaranteed to come back to where it was, let alone raise? In the middle of that shuffle though, your witholding has definitely affected the other student athletes.

[yyz28]

This thread is, to me, why losing sucks so badly...

...because it causes fans who should have some sort of common ground to start ripping each other apart.

There are some truths in this thread that should be understood by EVERYONE -

1. A fan is an important fan even if he can't give a penny other than to scrape together money for a few GA tickets for a few home games each year. This fan's input and opinion has value.

2. A fan who is a donor at a higher level, has season tickets and gives to the MGC has a louder voice. This doesn't make them a better person, or even mean their opinion is BETTER, but it does mean that they have a larger voice. College Football isn't a Democracy, it is driven by money, and thus those who give more of theirs to support the program have a bigger voice.

3. We are all emotionally invested. The reactions to posts by fellow fans in this thread prove this point. We all love this University and feel the athletic program is an important part of the College experience.

Most of us came through this school during a time when the programs weren't an important part of the College experience (or it wasn't made an important part by the University like is common at most of the D1 schools across the country) and many of us are eager to see the programs become a larger part of the experience of being a student at UNT.

4. if we were winning, these conversations wouldn't be happening.

Sometimes "supporting the current team" and "supporting the program" are at odds - particularly this season when there is a 2% chance that the current team pulls off the miracle needed for this coaching staff to keep its job at the helm. Particularly when the current coaching staff is well liked, though not getting the job done. ...it is easier to fire someone you don't like.

It is prudent to look at the future and begin discussing what this future may look like in light of what has happened on the football field so far this season, but it is also important to support these players and these coaches so long as they are still fighting and clawing with our school's uniform on their backs and our logo on their chests.

I know passions and emotions are running high - but I urge everyone to simmer down the anger at one another.

We are stronger together and can do more for this year's team and more for the program as a whole going forward than we can when we're going at each other.

Go Mean Green!!!

[rcade]

rcade, will your witholding of funds help light a fire under RV to fire Dodge and get a new coach? Possibly. If I'm RV though, how could I possibly know that your contribution would be guaranteed to come back to where it was, let alone raise? In the middle of that shuffle though, your witholding has definitely affected the other student athletes.

Neither my dollars, nor my patience, are infinite. I know there are costs to NT if donors bail. But I am nearing the end of my rope as a NT supporter. If Dodge doesn't turn it around this year and somehow gets extended another season, I'm gone baby gone.

[UNTFan23]

PLEASE, EVERYONE UNDERSTAND THIS:

Regardless of how you feel about Dodge, Villareal, or anyone associated, please understand that when you withold supportive funding to the program (especially the MGC), you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater. No one sufferes more when you do that than the student-athletes. They don't deserve to have your frustrations taken out on them by reducing their scholly funds!!

UNTFan23, you're argument above completely overlooks this. I hope you reconsider.

Get on here and piss, moan, & complain all you want. Heck call for Dodge's head all you want, but to withold financial support to the students because you're not happy with the coaching situation is awful.

I am in no way withdrawing my support from the MGC, I was only trying to make a point that people's performance within the Athletic Department are measured on thing such as MGC contributions and that the poster's stance that donors (for more or less) don't matter was not correct.

It would take more than 6 seasons of bad football to make this Mean Green fan close up his wallet. Now if it were 6 seasons of bad football and basketball, it be a lot harder to maintain my current level of financial contributions ($500 - MGC; 2 FB/2 MBB Season tickets).