A Little Psychoanalysis

[eulessismore]

SOME of you on this board need to understand something about yourselves. SOME of you have an inferiority complex, and you don't know it...which is a part of the complex. SOME of you really get your swagger from how your team wins...or not. Someone said on another post, "I am a winner and I only associate with winners." My response is: Go jump on the UT bandwagon then. Do some of you really get embarrassed at work if we lose? When some college football "fan" ribs me for being a North Texas grad, I just say, "I am proud do be from a school that has a coach in which the players are true student athletes and the program is conducted with class....we will be winning soon...it's only a matter of time." Some need to take a break from all of this and get a handle on things.

I had some psychoanalysis one time from one one great psychiatrist and neurologist (brain doctor), who was probably the most hightly touted in either of those fields in this area. He may have been the last of his breed; the dark leather furniture in the dimly lit room, just asking you to tell your story (this was when I was spending more time trying to figure my life out). The guy passed away a few years ago, God rest his soul. The thing I liked about him was that he never couched things in "Counselor" talk, it was things like "have you been down?", "are you paying down the principle on your debts?". In one of the last sessions I can remember before he died, I told him about my then ex-girlfriend having left me for someone else. His statement (again, from a guy touted as having the highest academic and professional qualifications): "Well then, that just wasn't meant to be".

I was glad to see Dodge come here, and respect all he's done for upgrading our facilities (I still think he forced the issue of the new stadium), and improving the academic standards of our football players, but I have become increasingly convinced that his tenure will end sometime during or at the end of this season, barring a miracle.

If (most likely) and when (looking to be sooner) he is relieved of his present duties rather than turning out to be our Joe Paterno (which was my hope), I doubt if I'll think of any one thing that caused it; rather something like the words of that beloved old doctor, "that just wasn't meant to be".

[perryfrog]

I WANT us to win on the field...but as I said earlier, it is not the MOST IMPORTANT thing.

[the real grad88]

The "their great kids" and "he's a good guy" defense of Dodge is a bit shallow.

What school doesn't have real student athletes? What coach doesn't have integrity?

I think the history of college football says that there are lots of coaches who are willing to throw away a player if he can no longer win games. Fortunately, we don't have one of those coaches.

[NT03]

I think the history of college football says that there are lots of coaches who are willing to throw away a player if he can no longer win games. Fortunately, we don't have one of those coaches.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Every college coach in American has "thrown away" a player. I'm no Dodge basher , but he is human and does not walk on water.

Go ask ask former DL Charlie Brown about being thrown away , it's funny that you said this

Edited September 19, 2010 by NT03

[Mean Green Matt]

I think the history of college football says that there are lots of coaches who are willing to throw away a player if he can no longer win games. Fortunately, we don't have one of those coaches.

This is the real world, not fantasy land. College Football is a BUSINESS, whether you like to think of it that way or not. I still hope Dodge gets his 7 wins, but if he does not, good riddance. I thank him for giving it his all, and yes, for being a class act, but if he can't win ballgames at the college level, it's time to get someone that can.

[TheTastyGreek]

You have no idea what you are talking about. Every college coach in American has "thrown away" a player. I'm no Dodge basher , but he is human and does not walk on water.

Go ask ask former DL Charlie Brown about being thrown away , it's funny that you said this

Or Joe Miller, who wanted to apply for a medical redshirt and was refused.

[NT03]

Or Joe Miller, who wanted to apply for a medical redshirt and was refused.

I think there are at least 3 players that this happended to & while we are at it let's add Taylor Insall to the list

Again , I don't want to bash Dodge because this is a business and he has to do what he thinks will help this team win football games. The fact of the matter is what he has done/is doing isn't working.

Edited September 20, 2010 by NT03

[Green Mean]

How are players thrown away? It boils down to performance. And it's not like they're getting kicked out of school. These kids have it great...with the cost of education skyrocketing, them getting a free ride to play sports is an opportunity that very few are able to get. No kids are ever thrown around in any program. It is all about what these kids make it to be.

[C&S]

I think there are at least 3 players that this happended to & while we are at it let's add Taylor Insall to the list

There is an extensive list of players that Dodge has thrown away in his 4 years at UNT. Yea, he is a real class act.

[FirefightnRick]

Who even cares? A fan is a fan. Doesn't matter how much you give.

You could be the biggest monetary supporter, but you'll still never gain respect from me because of this kind of stupid crap you pull.

Why do you have so much animosity towards those who help fund our football team and it's scholarship program?

Rick

[Green Mean]

Why do you have so much animosity towards those who help fund our football team and it's scholarship program?

Rick

I don't think he or others do. However it is foolish to always base an argument on how much someone gives/donates to the athletics program. That doesn't diminish them as fans and supporters.

[Rudy]

I don't think he or others do. However it is foolish to always base an argument on how much someone gives/donates to the athletics program. That doesn't diminish them as fans and supporters.

I don't think the argument has ever been, "I give more so I'm a better fan." I think its more of a "How can you criticize if you don't give ANYTHING."

[Green Mean]

I don't think the argument has ever been, "I give more so I'm a better fan." I think its more of a "How can you criticize if you don't give ANYTHING."

Well if you attended school at UNT and paid for it then you have every right to criticize. Just my opinion.

[mad dog]

Good things don't happen just because we wish really, really hard for them. It's never "only a matter of time" until you win in college football.

I like this.

[FirefightnRick]

I don't think he or others do. However it is foolish to always base an argument on how much someone gives/donates to the athletics program. That doesn't diminish them as fans and supporters.

Well your entitled to your oppinion, I just don't agree with it. When you have made such a vast comitment as some of our posters have through such a tough time, when so many others have chosen to not give at all, then the donors come here and read an anonymous poster dogging on our fan base, then I think it's a legitimate question to ask. Because like it or not, someone whose helped keep this program afloat through such horrible times, and there are very very few of them at that, then they have more of a voice than someone whose done nothing to help the situation at all. I think that was the point of SUMG asking the question?

Basically, if your doing all you can, then fine. Your entitled to your oppinion. But if your some random bitch and moaner whose done nothing to help us turn this thing around then shut the F up!!!

Rick

[MeanMag]

I don't know if your reply was saying that it isn't a business or not. I am assuming you are saying it is not. If so, you are wrong. It is still a business. They run it with a business model. They have to raise their own money for scholarships, facilities, services, they even have to take out loans from the school if they need more money (athletic center), etc. They have a service model to grow their clientele. The only difference in this is that we have a dedicated student fee that gives them more money. Regardless, it is still a business that is seeking money to support itself in revenue through contracts, donors, sponsors, and services.

Unless I misunderstand you... Your argument is wrong on several points too. First, you assume that all FBS plays each other. Which they don't as we play lower level, therefore it is not necessarily an even split of wins/losses. I am confused by your first paragraph. Do you mean anything MORE than a one loss season is a fireable offense? Regardless, a one loss, two loss, or three loss even in the business sense is not a fire-able offense. Just look at the NFL. Third, it is widely known that practically all (even the big teams, some of which you mentioned, are often in the red). It doesn't mean they aren't a business. The organization sees it as a necessary loss for the good of the school.

Just because we aren't getting all the wins and losses... doesn't mean the overall product isn't there. Our program has a steady rise in average attendance due to several factors like RV changing the game day experience, a steady growth in our student population (we have went up 13000 students over the passed decade), i also think a spread offense is just more fun to watch to the general public then the smashmouth-run first offense Dickey pulled out. I think there are many things that you need to take in account for our fan base. Then consider what it could be like if we actually had a decent program to compliment it.

Travis,

I realize that I left some factors out. My post was mainly meant to argue those who compare Dodges record to their own jobs and say they'd be fired if they did the same in their 9-5 job. My point is their jobs and the job of winning a football game are quite different. They'd be better served arguing that Dodges record is the worst of any Division 1 coach right now.

The football program (at least the way we run it) right now is a non-profit organization meant to pay for these student-athletes to go to school(that's why they let you write off donations). That's what the NCAA would like to tell you as well. In the sense that the football program has to account for money and spend it and bring it in the way anyone with a bank account does, yes, I guess you could treat that as a business. Someone brought up the point of investing in the team, and I just felt the need to point out that it's generally a poor investment if you are seeking either money or wins in return.

[Green Mean]

Well your entitled to your oppinion, I just don't agree with it. When you have made such a vast comitment as some of our posters have through such a tough time, when so many others have chosen to not give at all, then the donors come here and read an anonymous poster dogging on our fan base, then I think it's a legitimate question to ask. Because like it or not, someone whose helped keep this program afloat through such horrible times, and there are very very few of them at that, then they have more of a voice than someone whose done nothing to help the situation at all. I think that was the point of SUMG asking the question?

Basically, if your doing all you can, then fine. Your entitled to your oppinion. But if your some random bitch and moaner whose done nothing to help us turn this thing around then shut the F up!!!

Rick

Fair enough. I want to clarify that I am not in the minority that criticizes our fans. If you ask me I think we have fans that are too nice as many on this board still seem to be wanting the Dodge era to continue this season and beyond. But I still say that if someone does bitch and moan about the program when he/she attended UNT, paid their dues, graduated and at some point donated to the athletics program through attending games, buying gear etc....I really don't think they should be criticized because they do less than other donors. Again I see what you are saying but I think we disagree just slightly.

[CMJ]

I think the last thing we should do is run off people when our fanbase is so small to begin with.

[Side Show Joe]

I think the last thing we should do is run off people when our fanbase is so small to begin with.

I agree. I'm ok with the angry fans. At least they care. If the most someone can give is wearing an old UNT shirt around Dallas and listening to the games on their radio, I'm cool with that. At least we are their team. I think we can disagree and still be on the same side, because we all want what is best for North Texas.

[GrayEagle]

I don't think he or others do. However it is foolish to always base an argument on how much someone gives/donates to the athletics program. That doesn't diminish them as fans and supporters.

Well, by definition it diminishes them as supporters since part of the support is financial. Besides, those that give the most are historically better members (fans). When you give more of your money, time, whatever to an organization you are far more likely to perpetuate that entity than the occasional attendee. It works for churches, service clubs and most other organizations. So, if it doesn't make you a better member it certainly does make you a more valuable member.

Personally, I'm also more prone to listen to a person who financially supports something than to the casual critic. Anyone can criticize, especially when it costs them nothing.

[C&S]

Yes, and Dodge is that man. Dodge can recruit in Texas like most coaches who would come to NT cannot. If I were a parent, I would rather have Dodge sitting in my living room over many, many other coaches because I know that my son is going to be treated with respect and that he will demand respect from the players. I know that he will be a true student athlete and not just used and thrown away when misfortune or injury happens. I want to see Dodge get the chance to recruit in Texas with this new football stadium. I hope he gets that chance.

Have you asked any former players whether they feel Dodge treated them with respect and dignity...

[rcade]

Anyone who thinks that Coach Dodge has always conducted himself with class at UNT needs to read what happened to Taylor Insall:

http://www.gomeangre...opic=32585&st=0

Insall, a center at Cooper High in Abilene, was recruited by UNT when Dickey was coach. He turned down UTEP and gave UNT a verbal commitment.

After Dodge became coach, Insall and the Cooper coach tried to contact Dodge repeatedly.

When they finally got a hold of him, Dodge didn't want to see Insall or talk to him. He had zero interest in honoring the commitment.

The ending of the article addresses Dodge directly:

You've proven you know how to win. In fact, over the past five years that's all you've done. But - and I recognize this may not actually be in your contract - the job isn't all about winning. It's also about teaching young men about things like honor and integrity.

And now, sadly, you've proven something else.

When it came to the Taylor Insall matter, you demonstrated neither.

Edited September 20, 2010 by rcade

[shaft]

I think the history of college football says that there are lots of coaches who are willing to throw away a player if he can no longer win games. Fortunately, we don't have one of those coaches.

Nope, Dodge will find any excuse to play his kid; slot receiver,in front of an experienced QB.

And all the whole donation sub-thread; I won't give to the university until they hire a new coach.

Look Dodge does a lot of the off field things really well. He's the face of a program Dickey refused to be. The problem is none of that has helped achieve a coach's primary goal; win games.

[the real grad88]

I just know that if I were an AD and was the CEO of soliciting funds for support, I would make sure they understood one thing: When you give, you are not giving to buy a piece of this team. No one owns this program but the students who provide the vast majority of its support through their student fees. I would tell any potential donor that they are giving to support student athletes, period. They are not giving so that that they can have a say in the hiring and firing of coaches or managing the program. If the above was not good enough for any would-be donor, then don't let the door hit you on the way out.

And, Fire Fighten Rick, I used to have respect for you, but no more my friend. I'll sit where I want to sit...with us common folk who don't want to listen to crap like yours.

Edited September 20, 2010 by the real grad88

[NT03]

I just know that if I were an AD and was the CEO of soliciting funds for support, I would make sure they understood one thing: When you give, you are not giving to buy a piece of this team. No one owns this program but the students who provide the vast majority of its support through their student fees. I would tell any potential donor that they are giving to support student athletes, period. They are not giving so that that they can have a say in the hiring and firing of coaches or managing the program. If the above was not good enough for any would-be donor, then don't let the door hit you on the way out.

And, Fire Fighten Rick, I used to have respect for you, but no more my friend. I'll sit where I want to sit...with us common folk who don't want to listen to crap like yours.

That student fee hasn't kicked in yet