Outside The Box But: What If Unt Went Indy'...

[PlummMeanGreen]

Yes, I know, probably another short thread here and I realize this is way outside the usual box of past (recent) thinking for us, but what BYU might (still) do this year (or better yet next year which is when I think they really pull the trigger on this Indy' thing); nevertheless, their serious talk of going the Indy' route in football is intriguing to me to a degree as to how might UNT do the same down the road and even in light of all negatives about being Indy' yet during another era of BCS football when leagues all stuck together never thinking about forsaking the other for brighter lights and TV contracts.

Today's Fort Worth Star Telegram "giant" Football Pre-Season Preview had a Sun Belt Conference blurb with one of its writers saying "...the Sun Belt Conference will never be a BCS Bowl Buster league." Well, sorta' pi$$ed me off with the "NEVER" attitude and the writer may very well be right with his assessment, but what about when:

A...UNT moves to its new football palace, we start fielding 1970'esqe Mean Green football teams who could get in Top 25 polls annually like former conference-mate Boise State has established;

B...play names schools even at home because of our new fooball palace and beat a few name schools who have some really decent, competitive teams;

C.....we start having lights out attendance numbers because UNT alums/Mean Green fans finally have a football stadium to hang their Metroplex & Beyond bragging rights onto.

What if one day one of our leaders wakes up and suddenly has the bright light bulb "a-ha" experience and we see that just maybe we have really been staying loyal to the wrong coalition of schools for too long with (still) no foreseeable percs for us by doing so or...........that we have really been fartin' in the wind while planning to spend yet another decade in the SBC as it keeps sending Bottom 50 conference champions to bowl games, ie, bowl games that will NOT even be close to one of the Big 4 BCS "money-makin" bowl like TCU & Boise State get into or like the "non BCS buster kind of conference the writer said of the SBC in today's Fort Worth Star Telegram Pre-Season Football Edition.

WHAT IF................BYU goes Indy' and proves it (a la Notre Dame) to have been a success for even them.............nevertheless, would being a Major Independent with a winning football program make it easier for UNT to get us to a BCS bowl much, much quicker (not mentioning a better "known" overall football schedule, better name schools coming to Denton unlike we have in the Sun Belt?

Couldn't we probably keep scheduling Army, Navy, and now even an Indy' "Brigham Young?" Don't all 3 of these schools want a trip to Texas every other year playing a fellow Indy'? NOTE: After all, we have scheduled Kansas State as late as Nov. 27'th this Fall so they are out there to schedule at unusual times of the season for those who think an Indy' schedule could be difficult.

I know this idea will without a doubt not be popular, but once you get through that initial "just say no to Indy'" phase and then start thinking "just what might be positives toward the idea in light of today's annual re-alignment talks, list any reason (if you have even one) that this might be worth a look-see. IMHO...BYU will declare their Independence next year and why not.....they are not joined at the hip with TCU or the MWC. Addendum: Folks, Texas A&M came within a gnat's whisker of shucking their over 100 year tradtion and association with UT-Austin to go to the SEC, so lets not get too much into this "be true to your conference" phase of this.

Moral: There has to be a way for us to move up without depending on the CUSA or other Texas schools who forever have thougth we had leprosy or something. Just thinking outside the box while we wait on the Clemson game.

[glick1980]

We tried that in the 70's and although we had our best teams ever we went to no bowls and never got the SWC invite we were looking for. We also lost Hayden Fry due to it, even though, and I may be wrong here, he was one of its initial supporters. He left because we weren't getting bowl game invites...

[Huff]

Been There...........Done That..........It Sucked

[foutsrouts]

Wouldn't rule it out under the right winning and nice attendance circumstances. We would suddenly be in a better conference.

[SUMG]

Here's the huge negatives:

No bowl tie-ins....as a matter of fact...there aren't any at large bowl spots...are there? And when bowls have a tie-in with a certain league and it doesn't have enough bowl eligible teams....the bowl usually has a backup conference (i.e. The Sun Belt) which gets first shot at sending the replacement team.

No all conference honors for your players. To this day, some of us think that the great DT Walter Chapman (and others from our Indy era) are not in the NT Hall of Fame....because current committee members have no All Conference honors for those players....to go on.

Scheduling for all the other sports...is pure Hell.

Edited August 27, 2010 by SUMG

[GrandGreen]

There may be quicker ways for an athletic program to commit suicide but not many. For all the reasons, Sumg cited above. Even the one of kind Norte Dame has to have a conference affiliation for it sports other than football. I would also add that Blakeley basketball teams in NT's independent days despite three years of twenty plus wins and spending a short time in the top twenty never came close to a post season game. I think this also contributed to Blakeley lack of recruiting success. Players of all sports like the recognition and competition of a conference.

[BeatNavy]

....as a matter of fact...there aren't any at large bowl spots...are there?

You are correct, there are no at-large bowl spots.

There are some which do not have predetermined back-ups though.

[PlummMeanGreen]

We tried that in the 70's and although we had our best teams ever we went to no bowls and never got the SWC invite we were looking for. We also lost Hayden Fry due to it, even though, and I may be wrong here, he was one of its initial supporters. He left because we weren't getting bowl game invites...

So now is the time to get back inside the safe confines of the box?

As written, probably a short thread here but was still mean't for pure speculation in the future. The SBC is the only shoe that fits North Texas right now and we all seem to know it. Thankfully, the climate in the NCAA is about conference change and that at least gives us a reason to dream forward, right?

Fact is, the Indy' route in the 70's was not a fun ride at all, in fact, was frustrating for us all who were around, but in the present NCAA anything can change on any day. At large berths for a possible "growing" coalition of Indy' schools would IMHO be possible, but that (again) is thinking outside the box, merely speculation as this whole thread ideas was actually mean't to be. In fact, this whole thread was inspired by the FWST writer saying 'the SBC will never be a BCS bowl buster" and most of us with ties with the SBC would probably silently say "hellsbells!" the guy is probably (unfortunately) right. (Boise Staters--lets us, ie, your former conference mates in on the BCS buster formula, OK)?

YET........how long do you think it would take Troy or MTSU or FAU to jump on the re-alignment bandwagon train to flee the SBC if they had the opportunity? Then are we all glad that we "hung right in there" with the Sun Belt Conference?

Coach Schnelly'burger said years ago they were needing to get out of the SBC. The MTSU people were giddy about leaving the SBC for the MAC at one time; Troy could probably fit in the eastern footprint of CUSA but their liberal admission standards might prevent that from ever happening.

UNT's main problem with CUSA is that we are located in Texas and the spoken sentiment with those from CUSA who would vote seems to be "not another Texas school in our league"; but the unspoken part would most likely be "especially one that is progressing & growing with warp speed like the University of North Texas."

Everyone is trying to get an inside edge among all our fellow schools in Texas who did not make the Big 12 cut. TCU doesn't want to be in bed with SMU any longer because they want the inside edge of not being in a conference with SMU which the MWC gives the Frogs. U of Houston's location (away from DFW) may create for TCU a traveling partner since the Frogs probably (for the moment) don't want to share their MWC connection in the Metroplex with SMU or UNT (and that would be the case with us if we had a "lights out" program selling out our new stadium every game IMHO." So yes, NCAA politics suck because it keeps aspiring schools on the outside looking in and keeps those inside knowing if they didn't have 75 years of a past big time football conference affiliation that they would be right down here with us.

Indy? Probably not a good idea based on our past, but lets see what BYU does if & when they go that route and then we carefully measure Independent status as a vehicle for UNT to get in a better conference situation as well as a better chance to be a BCS bowl buster school; that is, the part of the Sun Belt a reporter says collectively never be part of being in the NCAA neighborhood that produces BCS bowl busters. NOTE: I don't think comparing UNT's situation to the Fry era of the 70's makes sense any longer in light of the ever-changing league climate of the NCAA. TAMU's almost pulling the trigger to go with the SEC a few months ago and leave their bobsie-twin sister & fellow PUF school University of Texas says as Bob Dylan wrote "the time they are a-changin'.

So...........nothing ventured--nothing gained? (Mr. Neinas, we are patiently waiting for your suggestions of which I'd bet most of us would respect and accept).

GMG!

Edited August 27, 2010 by PlummMeanGreen

[greenminer]

I just left the corporate world for a career making tens of dollars

Don't miss these cliches, not one bit

Think outside the box

Caught in a holding pattern

/fine

Edited September 2, 2010 by greenminer

[PlummMeanGreen]

I just left the corporate world for a career making tens of dollars

Don't miss these cliches, not one bit

Think outside the box

Caught in a holding pattern

/fine

Hey, greenminer, I've long since gotten back inside my box.

GMG!

PS: Ten$ of dollar$, eh?

[Adub4ever]

i think indy becomes a possibillity once the stadium is finished. we could definitley find schools willing to do home and homes, but going indy means much tougher competition, more travel expense, and no bowl tie ins. i think we should wait till we have a foundation by winning atleast 2-3 SBC championships in a row, then if CUSA still doesnt want us, go indy.

[Green Mean]

I think going indy in just football is very doable after the new stadium is built. We would still be able to schedule our yearly 1-2 moneybag games, find 2-3 games in our region such as the Rice, UTEP, ASU, ULL NMSU, LTU etc. And the rest of the schedule would just be a combination and most of the games would be travel that is doable and not very much different than what we are doing now. The only issue I have with it is the bowl tie ins but if NT won 6-7 games, then I am sure somehow we would be able to find a bowl game out there and get an invite. So is it doable? Yes absolutely. Is it smart to do it right now? It's debatable but I wouldn't mind going indy if there was a proper plan in place.

[NM Green]

It does not make sense for us. If we were sitting here dominating the Belt and missing BCS bowls because a lack of schedule strength, sure. However, it makes a lot more sense for TCU to go Indy than for us to. Been wondering if the Frogs are entertaining this because their conference is about to blow. Boise nice program but everyone else is rough - Lose Utah and BYU and pick up Boise = dropoff.

On a seperate note Jones has to be considering going back to Hawaii to take them the route of independance. It was always his dream and now it makes pure sense. Hawaii indy with the rest of their games in the Big West.

GMG

[Lurker]

I just left the corporate world for a career making tens of dollars

Don't miss these cliches, not one bit

Think outside the box

Caught in a holding pattern

/fine

I think you knocked one out of the park with this post!