Texas St. And Utsa Are Getting "shown Interest" By Wac

[Arkstfan]

They don't even play a game until 2011 and they are passing ya'll in 2013?

Western Kentucky was a pretty good FCS and they haven't been able to beat you when the program was like a turtle on its back.

[Green Lantern]

Don't think that I actually BELIEVE what the UTSA fans are writing. Their fans are very enthusiastic which is a good thing, but it does make for amusing posts.

One of their fans who writes a lot on the Sun Belt board is convinced UTSA's football program will "pass UNT by" before 2013. How many conference championships have we won? Let them win 10, less than half of what we have and place at least one player in the NFL hall of fame and then we can start to talk about them catching up.

Just to clarify, I wasn't directing my post at your previous response. Really more of a general statement about UTSA's current state. They're getting thrown around in lot in realignment discussions (mostly forums and some media) with a lot of generalities about how excited people in SA are about getting college football there & how they have their act together ect.

Having lived in and still frequently visiting SA, I can tell you there is not widespread excitement regarding UTSA football there currently. Just like DFW, Austin & Houston, it is a Big 12 city. Not knocking all the progress that they are making as an institution overall, that's to be commended.

[TXST_CAT]

Here is an in depth interview with TXST AD Larry Teis. In this Interview he discusses ALL the projects taking place in the Athletic Department and FBS expansion.

Texas State Improvements

-Track Stadium to break ground in Fall 2010

-Track Removal from Bobcat Stadium and Capping North Endzone to start shortly there after hopefully to break ground Winter(Feb) 2011.

-2011 seating capacity should be up to or around 28K.

-Basketball Arena just finished remodeling Summer 2010

-Soccer Facilities Upgraded Summer 2010

-Baseball Softball Complex Completed Summer 2009

-Football Luxury Box Seating and Suites Summer 2009

[MeanGreen61]

Here is an in depth interview with TXST AD Larry Teis. In this Interview he discusses ALL the projects taking place in the Athletic Department and FBS expansion.

Texas State Improvements

-Track Stadium to break ground in Fall 2010

-Track Removal from Bobcat Stadium and Capping North Endzone to start shortly there after hopefully to break ground Winter(Feb) 2011.

-2011 seating capacity should be up to or around 28K.

-Basketball Arena just finished remodeling Summer 2010

-Soccer Facilities Upgraded Summer 2010

-Baseball Softball Complex Completed Summer 2009

-Football Luxury Box Seating and Suites Summer 2009

The reason that Texas State and UTSA are getting a lot of interest from the WAC is because they has very few options for expansion.

[Green Mean]

I could see Texas State in the Sunbelt or the WAC I suppose. There shouldn't be a reason why Wright Waters should not want TSU in our conference, especially if UNT is in it. I think overall they are in a very similar situation like UNT is.....a big school in college towns that are sort of those sleeping giants. Obviously UNT is ahead of them by a mile athletics wise but overall I really think Texas State and UNT could start a really nice and big rivalry. Just my thought.

[Eagle1855]

I could see Texas State in the Sunbelt or the WAC I suppose. There shouldn't be a reason why Wright Waters should not want TSU in our conference, especially if UNT is in it. I think overall they are in a very similar situation like UNT is.....a big school in college towns that are sort of those sleeping giants. Obviously UNT is ahead of them by a mile athletics wise but overall I really think Texas State and UNT could start a really nice and big rivalry. Just my thought.

Overall, UNT and Texas State have actually had a good rivalry- we've played them more than any other opponent. For that reason alone, I'm fine with Texas State joining the Belt. I couldn't care less about UTSA or their athletic ambition.

Edited July 22, 2010 by Eagle1855

[VideoEagle]

Here is an in depth interview with TXST AD Larry Teis. In this Interview he discusses ALL the projects taking place in the Athletic Department and FBS expansion.

Texas State Improvements

-Track Stadium to break ground in Fall 2010

-Track Removal from Bobcat Stadium and Capping North Endzone to start shortly there after hopefully to break ground Winter(Feb) 2011.

-2011 seating capacity should be up to or around 28K.

-Basketball Arena just finished remodeling Summer 2010

-Soccer Facilities Upgraded Summer 2010

-Baseball Softball Complex Completed Summer 2009

-Football Luxury Box Seating and Suites Summer 2009

Everything I have read is positive about TSSM making the jump, but do not think it is easy. It's not at all. Not to be a "negative nabob of negativism" but it is a very, very tough jump. (By the way, anyone know who used the phrase "negative nabob of negativism?" Let's make this thread more than just expansion!) I don't want this to sound like I don't think you can do it, but I believe you have only had four or maybe five winning seasons since moving to 1AA/FCS. Western Kentucky found a 80%+ winning percentage for nearly a decade led to lots of losses at the FBS level. I've little doubt TSSM can meet the requirements (with the uncontrollable exception of being a member of a FBS conference) but how will the donors react to the nearly inevitable bad seasons at the FBS level.

Bu the way, please don't take my stated questioning of UTSA's chances of making the FBS level as a slam against TSSM. I think finding a conference sponsor is the biggest challenge to both schools. But you have an actual team and a history of raising money for a football team. UTSA had a coach no one else wanted - and I mean NO ONE at any level - and a stadium there is no historical reason to think they can fill to 15K.

Let's be realistic, come December 2010 no one in a UTSA uniform will have even taken a snap, yet they claim they will be equivalent to the highest level of football mainly because a completely discredited coach claims they will be. TSSM has a MUCH better chance of making the jump.

[All About UNT]

Everything I have read is positive about TSSM making the jump, but do not think it is easy. It's not at all. Not to be a "negative nabob of negativism" but it is a very, very tough jump. (By the way, anyone know who used the phrase "negative nabob of negativism?" Let's make this thread more than just expansion!) I don't want this to sound like I don't think you can do it, but I believe you have only had four or maybe five winning seasons since moving to 1AA/FCS. Western Kentucky found a 80%+ winning percentage for nearly a decade led to lots of losses at the FBS level. I've little doubt TSSM can meet the requirements (with the uncontrollable exception of being a member of a FBS conference) but how will the donors react to the nearly inevitable bad seasons at the FBS level.

Bu the way, please don't take my stated questioning of UTSA's chances of making the FBS level as a slam against TSSM. I think finding a conference sponsor is the biggest challenge to both schools. But you have an actual team and a history of raising money for a football team. UTSA had a coach no one else wanted - and I mean NO ONE at any level - and a stadium there is no historical reason to think they can fill to 15K.

Let's be realistic, come December 2010 no one in a UTSA uniform will have even taken a snap, yet they claim they will be equivalent to the highest level of football mainly because a completely discredited coach claims they will be. TSSM has a MUCH better chance of making the jump.

Couldn't agree more in that Texas State has an easily marketable name where as UTSA stands to be a testament to those schools that believe they are larger than their britches.

[oldschoollefty]

Everything I have read is positive about TSSM making the jump, but do not think it is easy. It's not at all. Not to be a "negative nabob of negativism" but it is a very, very tough jump. (By the way, anyone know who used the phrase "negative nabob of negativism?" Let's make this thread more than just expansion!) I don't want this to sound like I don't think you can do it, but I believe you have only had four or maybe five winning seasons since moving to 1AA/FCS. Western Kentucky found a 80%+ winning percentage for nearly a decade led to lots of losses at the FBS level. I've little doubt TSSM can meet the requirements (with the uncontrollable exception of being a member of a FBS conference) but how will the donors react to the nearly inevitable bad seasons at the FBS level.

Bu the way, please don't take my stated questioning of UTSA's chances of making the FBS level as a slam against TSSM. I think finding a conference sponsor is the biggest challenge to both schools. But you have an actual team and a history of raising money for a football team. UTSA had a coach no one else wanted - and I mean NO ONE at any level - and a stadium there is no historical reason to think they can fill to 15K.

Let's be realistic, come December 2010 no one in a UTSA uniform will have even taken a snap, yet they claim they will be equivalent to the highest level of football mainly because a completely discredited coach claims they will be. TSSM has a MUCH better chance of making the jump.

That would be the late, great Howard Cosell

BTW, he said "nattering nabob of negativism"

Edited July 22, 2010 by oldschoollefty

[Mean Green 93-98]

That would be the late, great Howard Cosell

BTW, he said "nattering nabob of negativism"

Hey, this is a great thread hijack!

Anyone know any other good Howard Cosell quotes?

[Arkstfan]

That would be the late, great Howard Cosell

BTW, he said "nattering nabob of negativism"

Actually it was William Safire who wrote it for Agnew.

[Arkstfan]

I could see Texas State in the Sunbelt or the WAC I suppose. There shouldn't be a reason why Wright Waters should not want TSU in our conference, especially if UNT is in it. I think overall they are in a very similar situation like UNT is.....a big school in college towns that are sort of those sleeping giants. Obviously UNT is ahead of them by a mile athletics wise but overall I really think Texas State and UNT could start a really nice and big rivalry. Just my thought.

Expansion is really a presidential matter.

[aztecskin]

WKU is only failing because they made the jump? I doubt that. It's more likely that whatever advantages that gave them a winning team in FCS--be it coaching and superior talent or a combination thereof-- were nullified by equally good and/or superior teams in the FBS. They couldn't scale up that talent. Looking at the Florida schools, and you can maybe make the argument that because of the deep talent well thy is the state, they can scale up somewhat and that is the reason they made the jump relatively smoothly.

So, we are really asking if UTSA or Tx St can scale up. (UTSA moreso, because they don't even have a winning system in place).

If other schools have not already tapped the Texas talent well, they should -in theory- land on their feet in the FBS. That said, I have become even more depressed about UNT because we suck so bad and all we have are 'scuses that SMoo and the Toads don't want to let us play. ugh.

gmg

[Arkstfan]

WKU is only failing because they made the jump? I doubt that. It's more likely that whatever advantages that gave them a winning team in FCS--be it coaching and superior talent or a combination thereof-- were nullified by equally good and/or superior teams in the FBS. They couldn't scale up that talent. Looking at the Florida schools, and you can maybe make the argument that because of the deep talent well thy is the state, they can scale up somewhat and that is the reason they made the jump relatively smoothly.

So, we are really asking if UTSA or Tx St can scale up. (UTSA moreso, because they don't even have a winning system in place).

If other schools have not already tapped the Texas talent well, they should -in theory- land on their feet in the FBS. That said, I have become even more depressed about UNT because we suck so bad and all we have are 'scuses that SMoo and the Toads don't want to let us play. ugh.

gmg

FAU made the I-AA semi-finals and began transition. They won 9 games in transition and went 4-3 vs. I-A. The next year playing a Sun Belt schedule they fell flat and went 2-9.

UConn fell off big as they moved into I-A, bounced back and fell again once they began playing a Big East schedule and are doing fairly well. South Florida did well until their second CUSA and first Big East years. UAB was fairly constant. UCF transitioned well and fell apart as they joined the MAC and have rebounded.

Studying transition teams it is very rare to maintain a fairly high level through I-AA into I-A and league play. Not that uncommon for a school to have bust year in the process but that is likely attributable to the difference in transfer rules and the smaller scholarship limits.

Looking at a historical perspective, the prospects for UTSA are better than the prospects for Texas State. A TSSM has to deal with a real and identifiable history of limited success and is more likely to struggle through the process. UTSA will be more similar to the USF, FIU, FAU, UAB scenarios (though UAB had a fairly decent Division III history). FIU over-accelerated and have a hole to get out of while FAU has done well having a winning record against everyone in the Sun Belt except Troy (1-4), Middle Tennessee (1-4)(2007 the only year they won a share of the title is the only year they beat those schools), and ULM (3-2) (bizarrely the home team has never won in FAU-ULM series) and has a winning record vs. UNT (5-0) ULL (4-1) FIU (4-1) and ASU (3-2) (home team has never lost).

It is counter-intuitive, but if you want to push another Texas team for the Sun Belt UTSA is likely the better choice.

[MeanGoingGreen]

FAU made the I-AA semi-finals and began transition. They won 9 games in transition and went 4-3 vs. I-A. The next year playing a Sun Belt schedule they fell flat and went 2-9.

UConn fell off big as they moved into I-A, bounced back and fell again once they began playing a Big East schedule and are doing fairly well. South Florida did well until their second CUSA and first Big East years. UAB was fairly constant. UCF transitioned well and fell apart as they joined the MAC and have rebounded.

Studying transition teams it is very rare to maintain a fairly high level through I-AA into I-A and league play. Not that uncommon for a school to have bust year in the process but that is likely attributable to the difference in transfer rules and the smaller scholarship limits.

Looking at a historical perspective, the prospects for UTSA are better than the prospects for Texas State. A TSSM has to deal with a real and identifiable history of limited success and is more likely to struggle through the process. UTSA will be more similar to the USF, FIU, FAU, UAB scenarios (though UAB had a fairly decent Division III history). FIU over-accelerated and have a hole to get out of while FAU has done well having a winning record against everyone in the Sun Belt except Troy (1-4), Middle Tennessee (1-4)(2007 the only year they won a share of the title is the only year they beat those schools), and ULM (3-2) (bizarrely the home team has never won in FAU-ULM series) and has a winning record vs. UNT (5-0) ULL (4-1) FIU (4-1) and ASU (3-2) (home team has never lost).

It is counter-intuitive, but if you want to push another Texas team for the Sun Belt UTSA is likely the better choice.

1. We don't need to expand.

2. If we did, why UTSA? Have you bought into all of the hype? Their coach took one of, if not, the best football programs in the US and made it a .500 team. They are hyped by a small number of trolls on a few conference boards. They have a glorified OFF CAMPUS stadium. Their first football schedule isn't one that will bring fans.

3. Academic wise, UTSA accepts roughly 90% of applicants. That alone speaks miles.

4. Are they strong in any sports? Nope.

[Arkstfan]

I don't see any compelling reason to expand at this time. I think the current 9/12 soon to be 10/12 format is good. I'm not a fan of title games by non-AQ leagues, the money isn't there.

As I scan the horizon looking for schools that we ought to look at, my list of schools looks roughly like this.

1. Missouri State. Sort of the Midwest's version of Montana except they aren't nearly that good in football. In their market, they hold about the same percentage of the fan interest as WKU does in Bowling Green but the market is 3X larger. Would enter the league with best basketball and baseball facilities and it wouldn't be close. Problem is they aren't likely to leave the Valley for football reasons. Still would be the head of my wish list. If they call we start talking how soon can they come.

2. Louisiana Tech. Already FBS, might be the tipping point to get the league into the I-Bowl in next contract. Doesn't add anything new to the league but they are in the region and aren't transitioning. That carries value.

3. Appalachian State. Fringe of the footprint, can transition easily, compatible with most of the league academically. Sucks to get to.

4. Georgia Southern. Better within the footprint bridges Troy/USA to FIU/FAU gap.

5. UTSA. Decent not great hoops, clean slate helps in transition.

6. Texas State. No consistent success in either football or basketball

[aztecskin]

From a purely selfish standpoint: gimme UTSA expansion. I don't really care if they are good for the Belt or not. I don't really care if it is smart on their part. I like the Texas rivalry, and because of the student population and the ties to the 7th largest city in the nation, I think we can have an actual rivalry.

As cool as Tx St is in party-schoolness, and as worthy as all the arguments make them seem to be, UTSA is already Big time college basketball. They are more big time in my mind than TX St is.

I don't want another Denton-like city, or a UNT-like team. I like the variety and the closeness.

Plus, we get to beat on one of UT's little brothers and that is close enough to beating UT in my book. (coloring book)

[LoveMG]

the sunbelt is improving but i can't wait for unt to get out of it. it will be stuck in the minnow end of the pool for a long time. we need to be at least to the level of cusa if not higher. don't settle for less.

[untjim1995]

the sunbelt is improving but i can't wait for unt to get out of it. it will be stuck in the minnow end of the pool for a long time. we need to be at least to the level of cusa if not higher. don't settle for less.

I read this line of thinking a lot on here, but I think that, in reality, moving to another conference with current Texas schools will be incredibly difficult. I would love to be in a better conference, too, but CUSA seems to be covered as we stand currently with plenty of Texas schools, none of whom prefer to be in a conference with us (kind of like the board mostly feels about Texas State and UTSA), and the private schools within that conference vote together. So that leaves the MWC, which is certainly a step up from CUSA, but TCU has already made it clear that Baylor isn't welcome to join their conference when the Big XII almost blew up. I don't see them giving UNT any favors on this end, either, as they seem to love having the area all to themselves to recruit players to play in the MWC. So, that leaves the WAC, which is about to be just as weak as the SBC when Fresno State and Nevada or Hawaii leave. With all of this in place, I just don't see how we are "settling" for the SBC right now. It just seems that there is nowhere else for us to go. How would you convince CUSA/MWC to take us, especially if the other Metroplex teams in those conferences are against having you join?