The Case For And Against The Wac

MCMLXXX · June 23, 2010

Fresno Budget Problems

http://www.fresnobee.com/2010/06/21/1979165/bulldog-athletics-financing-in.html#ixzz0rcIr2L2w

GrandGreen · June 23, 2010

Here is my source. Where did you get your numbers from? Not Being smart just curious because that looks of by a large margin.
THE POTENTIAL REPLACEMENTS
CAL POLY
San Luis Obispo, Calif.
Budget: $11.4 million
Sports: 20
Classification/Conference: FCS/Great West
TV Market: 120
Football record last 5 yrs: 35-22
Avg. football attendance (2009): 9,588
Avg. men's basketball attendance (2009-'10): 2,165
Pluses: California location.
Minuses: No timetable in place to move to FBS.
Hawaii fact: The late Stan Sheriff's alma mater.

MONTANA
Missoula, Mont.
Budget: $13 million
Sports: 14
Classification/Conference: FCS/Big Sky
TV Market: 166
Football record last 5 yrs: 59-10
Avg. football attendance (2009): 24,417
Avg. men's basketball attendance (2009-'10): 3,382
Pluses: Strong FCS playoff tradition in football. Led FCS in attendance.
Minuses: Yet to decide if it will pursue FBS membership. Might be tied to Montana State in 2-for-1 deal
Hawaii fact: UH is 4-1 against the Griz in football.

NORTH TEXAS
Denton, Texas
Budget: $16.7 million
Sports: 13
Classification/Conference: FBS/Sun Belt
TV Market: 5 (Dallas)
Football record last 5 yrs: 10-49
Avg. football attendance (2009): 18,228
Avg. men's basketball attendance (2009'10): 2,716
Pluses: Already FBS member. Texas location, major facilities upgrades, including new 30,000-seat stadium to open in 2011. Possible travel partner for Louisiana Tech.
Minuses: Turned WAC down six years ago. Preference is Conference USA. Football in down cycle.

PORTLAND STATE
Portland, Ore.
Budget: $10.5 million
Sports: 15
Classification/Conference: FCS/Big Sky
TV Market: 22
Football record last 5 yrs: 22-33
Avg. football atttendance (2009): 6,082
Avg. men's basketball attendance: 1,009
Pluses: Oregon location and major hub.
Minuses: No timetable to go FBS.
Hawaii Fact: June Jones transferred to PSU after leaving UH.

SACRAMENTO STATE
Sacramento, Calif.
Budget: $15.8 million
Sports: 20
Classificiation/Conference: FCS/Big Sky
TV Market: 20
Football record last 5 yrs: 20-36
Avg. football attendance (2009): 9,935
Avg. men's basketball attendance (2009-'10): 680
Pluses: California location and proximity to Nevada, San Jose State and Fresno State.
Minuses: No timetable for FBS membership. Facilities lacking.
Hawai'i fact: WAC associate member in baseball.

TEXAS STATE
San Marcos, Texas
Budget: $19 million
Sports: 16
Classification/Conference: FCS/Southland
TV Market: 48 (Austin)
Football record last 5 yrs: 36-24
Avg. football attenndance (2009): 12,488
Avg. men's basketball attendance (2009-'10): 1,654
Pluses: Texas location for recruiting. Possible travel partner for Louisiana Tech.
Minuses: No timetable for FBS membership.

UC DAVIS
Davis, Calif.
Budget: $20.5 million
Sports: 23
Classification/Conference: FCS/Great West
TV Market: 20 (Sacramento)
Football record last 5 yrs: 27-29
Avg. football attendance (2009): 9,908
Avg. men's basketball attendance (2009-'10): 1,748
Pluses: California location and proximity to WAC members Nevada, San Jose State and Fresno State. Best fit academically.
Minuses: No timetable for FBS.
Hawai'i fact: UH President M.R.C. Greenwood and Manoa Chancellor Virginia Hinshaw both held positions at UC Davis.

FBS: Football Bowl Subdivision (formerly known as Division I-A). FCS: Football Championship Subdivision (formerly known as Division I-AA). Sources: Individual schools and Star-Advertiser research.

http://www.staradver...s_got_Next.html

Well, TSUSM data was strangely not included in the NCAA data base. so I used a bias source a San Marcos newspaper: www.sanmarcosrecord.com/sports/x1048581371/The-state-of-Bobcat-athletics-Budget-and-salaries-

Apparently this link does not work, but it is easy to find. Do you really think TSUSM is spending that kind of money in the Southland? It looks like some pretty sloppy research by the Star; For example, it lists NT with 13 sports; any FB division school has to have 16. The term budget is also pretty nebulous; maybe it is including capital costs in TSUSM's number. At least the NCAA data has some breakdown to components.

I applaud UTSA and TSUSM desire and progress toward moving up. I think both schools are hindered by their proximity to each other and most fans don't know what a challenge it is going to be. The beginning of any project is usually the time for wild enthusiasm. As time marches, on the task can look much more challenging. The fun of announcing big series with name schools and pontificating on the great attendance and support your team will garner could easily fade as your team is clobbered and those big envisioned crowds never materialize.

Edited June 23, 2010 by GrandGreen

gangrene · June 23, 2010

If we go to the WAC UNT will be left behind.

If you really believe that then why are you trying so hard to convince us to join you in your plight?

TXST_CAT · June 23, 2010

If you really believe that then why are you trying so hard to convince us to join you in your plight?

Because I see UNT, TXST and UTSA becoming good rivals one day. Although many of you look down on our program we are well positioned to become a good FBS program. Our program is on the rise and I would like for us to join a conference wit instate rivals. I am not foolish enough to think CUSA is going to look to add additional teams from Texas any time soon. I really feel the WAC with an Eastern Division of UNT, TXST, and UTSA would be able to rival the SMU, UTEP, UofH and Rice of CUSA. As for Schedules three of your four division mates would be in State. I wish nothing but the Best for UNT but I think you guys could do better than sitting on your hands in the Belt waiting for a call from CUSA that may never happen.

SilverEagle · June 23, 2010

Isn't this the scene in Citizen Kane where Kane is forcing himself to applaud for his girlfriend's very pathetic singing performance? NOT because he really believes that she can sing, but because his ego won't let him admit that he is wrong about her.

Hmmmm, :rolleyes:

UNT90 · June 23, 2010

Because I see UNT, TXST and UTSA becoming good rivals one day. Although many of you look down on our program we are well positioned to become a good FBS program. Our program is on the rise and I would like for us to join a conference wit instate rivals. I am not foolish enough to think CUSA is going to look to add additional teams from Texas any time soon. I really feel the WAC with an Eastern Division of UNT, TXST, and UTSA would be able to rival the SMU, UTEP, UofH and Rice of CUSA. As for Schedules three of your four division mates would be in State. I wish nothing but the Best for UNT but I think you guys could do better than sitting on your hands in the Belt waiting for a call from CUSA that may never happen.

Not that we are looking down, but that we are looking up. Like it or not, Tx. St. is not on UNT's level, and it should be UNT's mission to make sure they never are. Just look at your comparison thread of athletic budgets. Just about every single school in there is FCS. Kind of an insult to compare UNT to FBS schools, no?

Some of us are trying to go forward, not backward, and step back into the old Big West is an unbelievable step backwards, as is joining any conference with any plan to incorporate a FCS team into the mix. We are in that conference now. We are looking to get out of that conference.

And for those who are looking forward to a rivalry with TSU or UTSA, could you please, please, please, set your sights just a little higher?

I swear, it's like the parent of a child being satisfied with a 6th grade education for that child.

MeanGoingGreen · June 23, 2010

Apparently this link does not work, but it is easy to find. Do you really think TSUSM is spending that kind of money in the Southland? It looks like some pretty sloppy research by the Star; For example, it lists NT with 13 sports; any FB division school has to have 16. The term budget is also pretty nebulous; maybe it is including capital costs in TSUSM's number. At least the NCAA data has some breakdown to components.

I applaud UTSA and TSUSM desire and progress toward moving up. I think both schools are hindered by their proximity to each other and most fans don't know what a challenge it is going to be. The beginning of any project is usually the time for wild enthusiasm. As time marches, on the task can look much more challenging. The fun of announcing big series with name schools and pontificating on the great attendance and support your team will garner could easily fade as your team is clobbered and those big envisioned crowds never materialize.

The data you'll find is TSU's old budget. They passed an athletic fee to boost the budget, and that is now kicking into effect. So, yes, TSU's budget is in the $19-20 million range. Which is another reason why we need to make sure we embrace them, or keep ahead of them. <_<

VideoEagle · June 23, 2010

Isn't this the scene in Citizen Kane where Kane is forcing himself to applaud for his girlfriend's very pathetic singing performance? NOT because he really believes that she can sing, but because his ego won't let him admit that he is wrong about her.

Hmmmm,

You are very observant, even at 6:30am!