Drill Here Drill Now!

eeally · May 3, 2010

Nice job BP...no sense in investing in Green Energy...We have Oil Reserves floating all around us. Potential negative impact on Gulf Coast Economy is going to be enormous.

Hopefully a war will break out or something.

I am sure BP will pony up for this disaster. Or will the tax payer...huh!!!

UNTflyer · May 3, 2010

It happens. I suppose we could go one of two ways if you want to stop drilling for oil...

Go back to horse and buggy modes of transportation, or

Mandate alternative energy use that is so expensive and difficult to produce that only the wealthy could afford it.

BTW, didn't your hero Obama just open up offshore drilling? This is all his fault.

UNT90 · May 3, 2010

Nice job BP...no sense in investing in Green Energy...We have Oil Reserves floating all around us. Potential negative impact on Gulf Coast Economy is going to be enormous.

Hopefully a war will break out or something.

I am sure BP will pony up for this disaster. Or will the tax payer...huh!!!

So how do you feel about nuclear energy?

eulessismore · May 3, 2010

So how do you feel about nuclear energy?

Just to get this out there, I'll describe myself as an environmentalist who says that increased use of nuclear must be among the options to be considered. Also, I'm just talking power generaltion here, not transportation. Sadly, it will be in the weeks and months to come (forget about what BP is saying about 6-8 days for a "containment dome" to be effective) before we will know what kinds of increases, and how permanent those increases, for the costs of fossil fuels due to the present situation in the Gulf. I'll count myself as ignorant as anyone in not knowing the extent of damage one well blowout could cause; I thought, with the exception of some places in the Middle East, that crude had to be pumped under pressure to reach the surface, rather than acting like an artesian well.

I think it's reasonable to say that the costs of such power generating fuels of natural gas will be increasing, and that increase may push some overall measure of energy production costs (whatever source anyone chooses will vary widely from almost any other source in calculating these things-perhaps due to where they're getting their research funding).

I like this one, because it examines certain environmental advantages of nuclear over other energy sources, but also examines the economic disbenefits of constructing new nuclear plants compared to "fossil fuels". Regardless of how long, or at what costs, the BP blowout continues, I think it's safe to say that use of increased safeguards will drive costs for petroleum and natural gas higher as a result. So, maybe the cost/benefit analyses will make nuclear look safer. Honestly, at this point, I think more is known about providing multiple layers of safeguards for nuclear than about developing additional safeguards for offshore. Anyway, here's one take on it by some DOE study, but you have to know the costs for natural gas and other petroleum will be rising, and therefore making some of the author's conclustions more obsolete than they already are:

DOE on comparative costs of nuclear to other energy sources,,

KRAM1 · May 3, 2010

I am a big fan of the nuclear power option, but all options have their own sort of risks. Life, in general, is a risk. "Stuff" happens and it can be bad. No one wants this sort of thing to happen, especially not the oil and gas firms. It is, indeed, their worst nightmare. But, they do happen, and they will...one day one of the wind turbines will collapse and fall on something or someone...does that mean we shouldn't use wind power? Dams have broken in the past...does that mean we shouldn't harness the power of water? The Russians had a bit of a problem with a nuke plant...again, should we eliminate the nuclear power option altogether? No to all of the above. We must do the best we can to minimize the dangers and contain the damage should a problem occur. And, we must continue to look for alternative and new sources of power...hydrogen anyone?

One thing I am a bit happy about is that the media is not calling for Obama's head for his delay in sending in the federal gov't help. We don't need that sort of thing as was done to the Bush administration when Katrina hit. I wouldn't expect the media to make a big deal out of it like they did the previous administration for obvious reasons, but it is good it hasn't been a topic of discussion. What needs to be the topic of discussion is how we mitigate the damage, fix the leak and find ways to keep it from happening once again. The environment will recover, fishing will return, the economy of the gulf will rebound, and, hopefully, lessons will be learned.

Anyone who thinks this is a Republican or a democrat "issue" or that someone in the oil and gas industry is enjoying this situation is just plain "nuts".

This is a problem for America and a challenge for the gulf region. America and the resilient people who live and work in the gulf region will overcome this disaster and will be stronger and better for it.

eeally · May 4, 2010

yea stuff happens. Like the death of the electric car.

Govt subsidies to the Oil Industry despite its 4 top companies being in the top 10 of Fortune 500.

Hey we need it OIL but when your slogan is Drill Here Drill Now and you can't cap your wells?? I don't know.

Tell it to the fish and better yet to the Fishing industy.

Have fun spinning this one....lets look to Rick Perry for his analysis.

Act of God.....I guess its as good as any other explanation.

eulesseagle · May 4, 2010

yea stuff happens. Like the death of the electric car.

Govt subsidies to the Oil Industry despite its 4 top companies being in the top 10 of Fortune 500.

Hey we need it OIL but when your slogan is Drill Here Drill Now and you can't cap your wells?? I don't know.

Tell it to the fish and better yet to the Fishing industy.

Have fun spinning this one....lets look to Rick Perry for his analysis.

Act of God.....I guess its as good as any other explanation.

eeally, you can purchase an electric car today, in the USA, if you want to. San Diego, along with other western cities have electic hook ups around the city for green minded people. with the drawback of battery failure you (as another poster cited in a similar post...)will spend a few thousand for a battery. the government would have to do something really draconian for all americans to drive green.

Subsidies? what doesn't the government subsidize....should be the question. RR, Airlines, Welfare, Agriculture, Auto, Banking, Nursing homes, MHMR....oh yea, soon to be Insurance.....the list is way too long. The government tightly controls just about all aspects of all companies but gives you the impression (at times) that you have control. Kinda like socialism light....think about it....the government wants you to regurgitate the pavlovian response that america is a republic, the land of the free...home of the brave and cite how many freedoms that we have while they enforce socialistic policies. it is like the story of a frog who is inticed to take a warm bath by a hungy hobo. before long the frog is cooked and was not even aware of the danger.

There are layers of safeguards in all these industries, as has been already pointed out in this post and other similar posts. how far do you go with system redundancies? the problem with this along with other industries is that when something happens people want greater safeguards....and....the government responds by taking greater control. does it matter if it is airliners, amtrak, tainted peanut butter, agrarian diseases, immigration, drugs or anything else? I am sure the fine that BP will pay will be dependent upon how much they will contribute to the democratic party and how many hands will be "greeeeezed."

SilverEagle · May 4, 2010

I am a big fan of the nuclear power option, but all options have their own sort of risks. Life, in general, is a risk. "Stuff" happens and it can be bad. No one wants this sort of thing to happen, especially not the oil and gas firms. It is, indeed, their worst nightmare. But, they do happen, and they will...one day one of the wind turbines will collapse and fall on something or someone...does that mean we shouldn't use wind power? Dams have broken in the past...does that mean we shouldn't harness the power of water? The Russians had a bit of a problem with a nuke plant...again, should we eliminate the nuclear power option altogether? No to all of the above. We must do the best we can to minimize the dangers and contain the damage should a problem occur. And, we must continue to look for alternative and new sources of power...hydrogen anyone?

One thing I am a bit happy about is that the media is not calling for Obama's head for his delay in sending in the federal gov't help. We don't need that sort of thing as was done to the Bush administration when Katrina hit. I wouldn't expect the media to make a big deal out of it like they did the previous administration for obvious reasons, but it is good it hasn't been a topic of discussion. What needs to be the topic of discussion is how we mitigate the damage, fix the leak and find ways to keep it from happening once again. The environment will recover, fishing will return, the economy of the gulf will rebound, and, hopefully, lessons will be learned.

Anyone who thinks this is a Republican or a democrat "issue" or that someone in the oil and gas industry is enjoying this situation is just plain "nuts".

This is a problem for America and a challenge for the gulf region. America and the resilient people who live and work in the gulf region will overcome this disaster and will be stronger and better for it.

Don't worry, the right wing faction will find a way to make it all Obama's fault. Even though the difference between Katrina and this disaster is that there was plenty of warning (it's called watching it on radar) about Katrina and there wasn't any forwarning about this. Plus BP initially said that they had it covered.

KRAM1 · May 4, 2010

Don't worry, the right wing faction will find a way to make it all Obama's fault. Even though the difference between Katrina and this disaster is that there was plenty of warning (it's called watching it on radar) about Katrina and there wasn't any forwarning about this. Plus BP initially said that they had it covered.

The governor of the state of Louisiana and the City of New Orleans initially said they had it covered too. Again, I am glad that the press is not trying to make a political game out of this...just looks like some individuals are...time to focus energy on getting this stopped, cleaned up and learning another lesson. NO ONE wanted this to happen and no one is getting any pleasure out of what happened. The good people of Louisiana and the gulf coast have suffered plenty in recent years, but have come back strong and will again...much to their own initiative and can do spirit.

eeally · May 4, 2010

eeally, you can purchase an electric car today, in the USA, if you want to. San Diego, along with other western cities have electic hook ups around the city for green minded people. with the drawback of battery failure you (as another poster cited in a similar post...)will spend a few thousand for a battery. the government would have to do something really draconian for all americans to drive green.

Subsidies? what doesn't the government subsidize....should be the question. RR, Airlines, Welfare, Agriculture, Auto, Banking, Nursing homes, MHMR....oh yea, soon to be Insurance.....the list is way too long. The government tightly controls just about all aspects of all companies but gives you the impression (at times) that you have control. Kinda like socialism light....think about it....the government wants you to regurgitate the pavlovian response that america is a republic, the land of the free...home of the brave and cite how many freedoms that we have while they enforce socialistic policies. it is like the story of a frog who is inticed to take a warm bath by a hungy hobo. before long the frog is cooked and was not even aware of the danger.

There are layers of safeguards in all these industries, as has been already pointed out in this post and other similar posts. how far do you go with system redundancies? the problem with this along with other industries is that when something happens people want greater safeguards....and....the government responds by taking greater control. does it matter if it is airliners, amtrak, tainted peanut butter, agrarian diseases, immigration, drugs or anything else? I am sure the fine that BP will pay will be dependent upon how much they will contribute to the democratic party and how many hands will be "greeeeezed."

UNTLifer · May 4, 2010

Flux Capacitor!

Katrina? Take a historical look at how much money New Orleans and the state of Louisiana took from the federal government over the years to take care of and improve their levy system and then ask them where that money went. I think more than a few folks lined their pockets and walked away.

Was the federal response to Hurricane Rita, Ike, etc... any different? What about the Iowa and Tennessee floods, or the Arkansas/Mississippi tornados? Seems some folks wanted others to take care of them and were looking for a handout while others got to work and took care of themselves.

Edited May 4, 2010 by UNTLifer

eulessismore · May 5, 2010

Flux Capacitor!

Katrina? Take a historical look at how much money New Orleans and the state of Louisiana took from the federal government over the years to take care of and improve their levy system and then ask them where that money went. I think more than a few folks lined their pockets and walked away.

Was the federal response to Hurricane Rita, Ike, etc... any different? What about the Iowa and Tennessee floods, or the Arkansas/Mississippi tornados? Seems some folks wanted others to take care of them and were looking for a handout while others got to work and took care of themselves.

I heard on NPR the other day that the Louisiana County projected to be hit the worst by this well blowout had the lowest unemployment rate

of any county in the country before this hit. I couldn't find a source for that, but, according to this, Louisiana had one of the lowest unemployment rates in the country, better than Texas, in March.

Unemployment by state for March, 2010.

Of course, as mentioned on NPR, a lot of that work was in energy and fishing, and we all know what will happen in the foreseeable future for fishing. So, any wonder they might want some "economic damages" from BP?

Still, maybe what you're talking about is some kind of multiple offenses of irresponsible behavior by the state of Louisiana, and by extension, those residing there. Honestly, I just don't see the great similarities between Katrina and this well blowout; if you see that as two indicators leading strongly to that conclusion, then I guess I'm that much closer to admitting that I link the behaviors of BP in this and the explosion at their Texas City refinery. With either of those scenarios, I'm still seeing one big problem: With Katrina and the Texas City refinery explosion, there were warnings that were ignored and with likely consequences that were well known. If anyone here can claim that they could have, or did, foresee a well blowout such as this, I'd have to see some prediction they made about it without the benefit of hindsight.

I certainly hope to God that BP can get this thing under control, and soon. Still, I think I'm being realistic to say that the cause of offshore drilling has been set back for years, and that we'll be eating a lot less shrimp and paying maybe another dollar a gallon for gasoline by the end of this summer. Our only real hope is that we can learn a lot more about what will work to provide our future energy needs. At this point, I'm more convinced than I had been as to the abundance of near shore petroleum reserves in the Gulf of Mexico. How we can balance economic and environmental factors still remains an unknown. Sorry folks, we've got to have both, and, yes, we'll end up paying more as consumers.

The bright side is, as prices go up, we conserve more. When that happens, sometimes I end up standing while riding the train to work. No big deal, since I mostly sit while working. I hope we can all find transportation and power options that work for each of us.

UNTflyer · May 5, 2010

yea stuff happens. Like the death of the electric car.

Govt subsidies to the Oil Industry despite its 4 top companies being in the top 10 of Fortune 500.

Hey we need it OIL but when your slogan is Drill Here Drill Now and you can't cap your wells?? I don't know.

Tell it to the fish and better yet to the Fishing industy.

Have fun spinning this one....lets look to Rick Perry for his analysis.

Act of God.....I guess its as good as any other explanation.

Looks like the only one trying to "spin" in this thread is you. You are somehow trying to make this a Republican/Conservative problem. Last I checked, everybody in America, with the exception of maybe Ed Begley, Jr., uses oil and natural gas and wants it cheaper. The way you make it cheaper is to increase supply and try to decrease demand. Since our population continues to rise and we consume more and more electricity, I doubt we can do anything other than slow the growth of demand.

Accidents happen. Oh well. Sorry about the little fishies and the fisherman, but again things happen. There are over a half million producing wells just in the U.S. and I read one estimate of 30 million wells worldwide. That's 30 million wells pumping oil 24/7. The number of accidental spills considering the scope of production is miniscule. But for some reason, you want to jump up and down on your soapbox like a madman and make this political. I don't get it at all.

UNTLifer · May 5, 2010

euless, my response was aimed more at Silver Eagle's comment about the "right wing faction" claiming this is Obama's fault and his comparison to Katrina. My comment about "getting to work" stems from the recovery from the disasters noted in my post, not the overall unemployment rates of said region.

UNTflyer · May 5, 2010

Don't worry, the right wing faction will find a way to make it all Obama's fault. Even though the difference between Katrina and this disaster is that there was plenty of warning (it's called watching it on radar) about Katrina and there wasn't any forwarning about this. Plus BP initially said that they had it covered.

Meanwhile, the left wing faction is trying to make it the fault of Republicans. See the original post of this thread for an example.

And didn't just about everything get blamed on Bush for the last 8 years, even crap that had nothing to do with the office of President? Sucks being in the Big Boy Chair sometimes, doesn't it?

Edited May 5, 2010 by UNTflyer

stebo · May 6, 2010

Ole Brownie's doing one heck of a job. Nothing to see here! Y'all remember Brownie? He was on Fox News the other day accusing the President for this mess. Geez Louise. Why can't some things just be an accident? BP is one of the good guys in oil. They do not buy oil from the mideast... thus they don't fund terrorism. They had a screw up and will pay for it, stuff happens. Nothing political here - just a bad accident.

UNT90 · May 6, 2010

Of course Eealy won't answer how he feels about Nuclear Energy. Why? Maybe because if he said he was in favor of more of this type of energy, he knew I would point out that after the 3 Mile Island accident, the USA stop opening new nuclear power plants... for 30 years... Just a slight over-reaction, which was a factor in the ever-increasing demand for oil. Now that this accident is a generation removed, you see people looking again to nuclear energy as a solution.

Accidents happen. It's the over-reaction that causes the most damage to the American people.

It's the cheap political cheerleading (like was done to start this topic) that is a huge problem in actually accomplishing needed governmental reform in this country.

UNTLifer · May 6, 2010

I love how the politician from West Virginia, his name escapes me, says he will now have a hard time voting for off-shore drilling, yet I'm sure he still fully supports coal mining although it has a much worse safety record.

Cerebus · May 10, 2010

I have a couple of things to add.

1) Stopping off shore drilling will do zero to reduce demand. That means production would move from American companies, with very safe saftey records (this is the first major spill in the gulf after 40 years of drilling), to foreign companies, mostly in the countries like Nigeria and China, which have abysmal saftey and enviromental records. This will lead to MORE enviromental damage.

2) Electric cars... wooo... you might want to look up the half life of even the best lithium ion battery packs used in those cars, not to mention the incredibly high usage of toxic rare earth elements such as neodymium. Almost all of those rare earth elements needed in battery/magnet usage for hybrids are found mostly in only one place on earth, China. Lets give them MORE money so they can finally launch those nuclear aircraft carriers they have been talking about for the last 10 years.

eeally · May 10, 2010

Of course Eealy won't answer how he feels about Nuclear Energy. Why? Maybe because if he said he was in favor of more of this type of energy, he knew I would point out that after the 3 Mile Island accident, the USA stop opening new nuclear power plants... for 30 years... Just a slight over-reaction, which was a factor in the ever-increasing demand for oil. Now that this accident is a generation removed, you see people looking again to nuclear energy as a solution.

Accidents happen. It's the over-reaction that causes the most damage to the American people.

It's the cheap political cheerleading (like was done to start this topic) that is a huge problem in actually accomplishing needed governmental reform in this country.

Love Nuclear: no problems at all.....tadum : guess what we meet in the middle again. This post is to demonstrate why we can't just DRILL HERE DRILL NOW....that FOX was taunting at the rest of the world when gas was very high.. I support all options..really do! But safety first. How many tanks of gas will this cost BP...or the taxpayer or the consumer? and those poor fish...

Cerebus · May 10, 2010

Love Nuclear: no problems at all.....tadum : guess what we meet in the middle again. This post is to demonstrate why we can't just DRILL HERE DRILL NOW....that FOX was taunting at the rest of the world when gas was very high.. I support all options..really do! But safety first. How many tanks of gas will this cost BP...or the taxpayer or the consumer? and those poor fish...

Did you ignore my post right above yours? Us stopping drilling wont change demand. Production will go to countries with much laxer enviromental laws, they will damge the enviroment more.

UNTFan23 · May 10, 2010

Love Nuclear: no problems at all.....tadum : guess what we meet in the middle again. This post is to demonstrate why we can't just DRILL HERE DRILL NOW....that FOX was taunting at the rest of the world when gas was very high.. I support all options..really do! But safety first. How many tanks of gas will this cost BP...or the taxpayer or the consumer? and those poor fish...

What about BP's shareholders? I think the stock has lost more than 5 billion in value. How do you think employees/shareholders of the company with some of their life savings tied up in their companies stock feel?

DeepGreen · May 10, 2010

Did you ignore my post right above yours? Us stopping drilling wont change demand. Production will go to countries with much laxer enviromental laws, they will damge the enviroment more.

Agree. Just like manufacturing has shifted from the U.S. to overseas (China, India, etc.) where there are no environmental laws or standards. Think only the U.S. pollutes the air Mr. Gore?

Army of Dad · May 10, 2010

2) Electric cars... wooo... you might want to look up the half life of even the best lithium ion battery packs used in those cars, not to mention the incredibly high usage of toxic rare earth elements such as neodymium. Almost all of those rare earth elements needed in battery/magnet usage for hybrids are found mostly in only one place on earth, China. Lets give them MORE money so they can finally launch those nuclear aircraft carriers they have been talking about for the last 10 years.

Actually we have a pretty good quantity here and in Canada. Though they are not being mined at the present and we do not have the refineries needed to process the ore. So they are found here, but pretty much only China produces them for immediate use.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20100414/sc_livescience/usmilitarysupplyofrareearthelementsnotsecure

Cerebus · May 10, 2010

Actually we have a pretty good quantity here and in Canada. Though they are not being mined at the present and we do not have the refineries needed to process the ore. So they are found here, but pretty much only China produces them for immediate use.

http://news.yahoo.co...ementsnotsecure

The greatest source of PROVEN reservers is in China, they are found else where, but the largest number and easiest to mine are those in China. It's also my understanding that canadian reservers are much like the oil sand shales, they are a much highest cost to mine and don't make economic sense unless the price is higher than it is now.