"let's Just Talk" Diplomacy

KRAM1 · February 13, 2010

Classic, is this the article you first referenced?

Cheney's Revenge in the WSJ.

My linkhttp://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704022804575042112185849380.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_sections_opinion

Yep...and why would anyone give you a -1 for just posting the link? Amazing. I gave you a +1 to try to even it out a bit. Seems some folks just like to be negative! ha!

KRAM1 · February 13, 2010

Honestly, at this point, I'm pretty ashamed at what the Republicans have done in regards to higher education in Texas, especially at my UNT, and I'm not even a Republican. But, I guess Governor Perry should be given a pass on his appointees, because he's only been in office for ten years, and needs another four to get things right.

eulessismore...not wanting to start a "dust up" or anything, but can you be specific about what "the Republicans have done in regards to higher education in Texas" that has you "pretty ashamed"?

eulessismore · February 14, 2010

eulessismore...not wanting to start a "dust up" or anything, but can you be specific about what "the Republicans have done in regards to higher education in Texas" that has you "pretty ashamed"?

Well, to make a long story short (and I won't paste links to the Denton Record Chronicle article that NT03 posted in UNT News, where there are also links to the "Transition Agreement"). But, just in case you haven't noticed, many of us are not pleased with the situation wich resulted in the resignation of Gretchen Bataille as President, which was voted on and accepted 7 to 2 by the UNT Board of Regents, all of whom have been appointed by Governor Perry. Maybe the almost $750k that this action cost UNT is no big deal to some, and maybe (for reasons unknown to the public), there were good reasons for it, but, couldn't this have been handled better, at a time when the University is undertaking to start asking a lot of people in the UNT community to increase their giving levels, or to start giving for the first time? And, doesn't it make it a little harder that Gayle Strange, who had been in charge of a campaign which was intended to raise $170 million for the University, resigned from that position, giving as her reason the handling of the Gretchen Bataille situation?

But, if you don't think the governor should be held responsible for the appointments he/she makes, I will disagree. I will commend you for having mentioned in the Republican GOP Gubernatorial primary thread (although not too directly) the problems with the Republican Gubernatorial candidate Medina, over her recent self destructing remarks on the "9-11 Truther" beliefs (while others were still making positive comments about her AFTER those remarks were make public). And, by the way, one of the Democratic candidates, Farouk, followed her on that position shortly thereafter.

I guess what I'm suggesting is that we may be coming to a time when considering political candidates, the person, their statements, and their actions may become more important than their political party. And I do feel it's fair, since you mentioned digressing in your original post, to bring up statewide political issues on higher education, since we must have a strong economy in order to make everything else possible, and higher education is at least a part of preparing for the future economy.

Rudy · February 14, 2010

eeally's comment is just about as good as SE's comment that the republicans want to bring the USA back to the 19th century.

What about his comment that all gun owning whites secretly want to shoot blacks?

KRAM1 · February 14, 2010

Well, to make a long story short (and I won't paste links to the Denton Record Chronicle article that NT03 posted in UNT News, where there are also links to the "Transition Agreement"). But, just in case you haven't noticed, many of us are not pleased with the situation wich resulted in the resignation of Gretchen Bataille as President, which was voted on and accepted 7 to 2 by the UNT Board of Regents, all of whom have been appointed by Governor Perry. Maybe the almost $750k that this action cost UNT is no big deal to some, and maybe (for reasons unknown to the public), there were good reasons for it, but, couldn't this have been handled better, at a time when the University is undertaking to start asking a lot of people in the UNT community to increase their giving levels, or to start giving for the first time? And, doesn't it make it a little harder that Gayle Strange, who had been in charge of a campaign which was intended to raise $170 million for the University, resigned from that position, giving as her reason the handling of the Gretchen Bataille situation?

But, if you don't think the governor should be held responsible for the appointments he/she makes, I will disagree. I will commend you for having mentioned in the Republican GOP Gubernatorial primary thread (although not too directly) the problems with the Republican Gubernatorial candidate Medina, over her recent self destructing remarks on the "9-11 Truther" beliefs (while others were still making positive comments about her AFTER those remarks were make public). And, by the way, one of the Democratic candidates, Farouk, followed her on that position shortly thereafter.

I guess what I'm suggesting is that we may be coming to a time when considering political candidates, the person, their statements, and their actions may become more important than their political party. And I do feel it's fair, since you mentioned digressing in your original post, to bring up statewide political issues on higher education, since we must have a strong economy in order to make everything else possible, and higher education is at least a part of preparing for the future economy.

Hey, appreciate the reply...but still wondering what you meant by what "the Republicans have done to higher education in Texas". If all you mean is that the BOR decided to go in a different direction on the President of UNT, I have a hard time seeing how that is a major blow to "higher education in Texas" being delivered by the "Republicans". I agree with the concept of holding people accountavble for the actions and comments...not just politicians however. BTW...that last statement is not directed at eulessismore. I appreciawhichted his reply.

eulesseagle · February 14, 2010

eulessismore, I believe that it would be difficult to find "any" politician, or any of us, that have not spoken irresponsibly at anytime in their career, including myself.

If anyone is looking for a "perfect speak" candidate there are none. The whole internet is full of mis-speaks.

What I believe is more important is the issues that the candidate represents and has voted for than a couple of gaffs, well meaning or not.

As far as what candidate Medina stands for is in this link:

http://www.medinafortexas.com/commonSense.php#governmentRole

Makes sense to me.

Basically what this comes down to is do we want continued spending and higher spending and more debt which leads to higher taxes on all consumer goods or at what point do we, as Texans or the American people, wake up and decide that government programs "must" be cut to survive.

A banker friend of mine told me that low income individuals are now cashing their income tax checks which average about $6,500. I do not fault anyone for being in that particular situation but you, me and all other tax payers are footing that bill.

We also discussed that with the increase of taxes there are always those on the cusp of bankruptcy or those just above the welfare line. As taxes are raised the more individuals fall through to the welfare rolls which will require greater taxation on those above the poverty line. At some point something has to give and hopefully it will not be riots in the streets as what Greece is experiencing. I would only suggest of those who are interested read some english language newspapers from europe to get a grasp of what may come here on our current course of tax and spend. Is this just the democrats? no. Is this just the republicans? no. what social programs have either side ridded itself of when the other party "owned" congress? Government just keeps getting bigger and just about all congressmen say we can not cut this because it is one of the holy grail programs. I would vote for any candidate who would state that thier only goal is to reduce the size of government and start cutting "all" government programs. Well that is a pipe dream that will never come true.

UNTflyer · February 15, 2010

Honestly, at this point, I'm pretty ashamed at what the Republicans have done in regards to higher education in Texas, especially at my UNT, and I'm not even a Republican. But, I guess Governor Perry should be given a pass on his appointees, because he's only been in office for ten years, and needs another four to get things right.

HUH?! You're "not even a Republican" and you are ashamed of what "republicans" have done to higher education? Shocking.

Did not a republican legislature just vote for (and a Republican governor sign): an athletic fee for UNT, a new law school for UNT-Dallas, increased research funding to elevate universities to Tier 1 status, increase state financial aid, and eliminated the 10% rule?

And how exactly is the governor be held "held responsible" for his appointments? They are not appointed solely at the governor's will, they have to be approved by the Senate. And once they are in place, they cannot be removed without cause.

BTW, I looked up Dr. Charles Mitchell (appointed by Perry) on Open Secrets, and guess what? He's a Democrat! All of his donations have been to the campaigns of black Democrats (Ron Kirk, Eddie Bernice Johnson, and James Sweatt). I'm no fan of Perry, but geez... put that boogeyman back in the closet, will ya?

Travis · February 15, 2010

HUH?! You're "not even a Republican" and you are ashamed of what "republicans" have done to higher education? Shocking.

Did not a republican legislature just vote for (and a Republican governor sign): an athletic fee for UNT, a new law school for UNT-Dallas, increased research funding to elevate universities to Tier 1 status, increase state financial aid, and eliminated the 10% rule?

And how exactly is the governor be held "held responsible" for his appointments? They are not appointed solely at the governor's will, they have to be approved by the Senate. And once they are in place, they cannot be removed without cause.

BTW, I looked up Dr. Charles Mitchell (appointed by Perry) on Open Secrets, and guess what? He's a Democrat! All of his donations have been to the campaigns of black Democrats (Ron Kirk, Eddie Bernice Johnson, and James Sweatt). I'm no fan of Perry, but geez... put that boogeyman back in the closet, will ya?

Your facts are too inconvenient!

EagleGreen · February 15, 2010

Hey, appreciate the reply...but still wondering what you meant by what "the Republicans have done to higher education in Texas". If all you mean is that the BOR decided to go in a different direction on the President of UNT, I have a hard time seeing how that is a major blow to "higher education in Texas" being delivered by the "Republicans". I agree with the concept of holding people accountavble for the actions and comments...not just politicians however. BTW...that last statement is not directed at eulessismore. I appreciawhichted his reply.

Here is a good start to see the craziness in the Texas school board; mostly by conservatives: http://www.alternet.org/rights/145658/texas_education_board_is_trying_to_infuse_schoolbooks_with_ultraconservative_ideology

Edited February 15, 2010 by EagleGreen

yyz28 · February 16, 2010

...look, I'm agnostic, so I have no real dog in the Religion hunt, but I must say, the article sort of blows its own credibility out of the water when its headline is "Texas Education Board Is Trying to Infuse Schoolbooks with Ultraconservative Ideology"...

...and one of the quotes they use to back up this assertion is "...But we are a Christian nation founded on Christian principles..."

How is that statement NOT true. ...or how is it ultraconservative?

...and what does ANY of this have to do with International Diplomacy? Stealth Thread Hijack, perhaps?

Rudy · February 16, 2010

Your facts are too inconvenient!

So are the left's.

Censored by Laurie · February 17, 2010

How is that statement NOT true. ...or how is it ultraconservative?

Didn't read the article, don't care...but in response to this: Treaty of Tripoli 1797, Article 11.

eulessismore · February 17, 2010

HUH?! You're "not even a Republican" and you are ashamed of what "republicans" have done to higher education? Shocking.

Did not a republican legislature just vote for (and a Republican governor sign): an athletic fee for UNT, a new law school for UNT-Dallas, increased research funding to elevate universities to Tier 1 status, increase state financial aid, and eliminated the 10% rule?

And how exactly is the governor be held "held responsible" for his appointments? They are not appointed solely at the governor's will, they have to be approved by the Senate. And once they are in place, they cannot be removed without cause.

BTW, I looked up Dr. Charles Mitchell (appointed by Perry) on Open Secrets, and guess what? He's a Democrat! All of his donations have been to the campaigns of black Democrats (Ron Kirk, Eddie Bernice Johnson, and James Sweatt). I'm no fan of Perry, but geez... put that boogeyman back in the closet, will ya?

Hey, I'm just basically not convinced that the tuition deregulation, which was, as I recall, passed by a Republican legislature and signed by a Republican governor was uniformly good. It may be that it has led to improvements in Texas higher education. I do know that tuition and fees have increased more than the overall rate of inflation since it was passed in 2003.

Still, things have changed since I was an undergrad in the 1970's and in state tuition was dirt cheap. Even then, it would have been difficult for me to get that first degree if I hadn't earned VA benefits and afterwards, got a teaching assistantship on my way to a master's. So, things like that are available; although I wish I weren't still hearing about veterans' benefits being received late...and no credit to the Democrats or Republicans on that.

Overall though, I think there is a logic to decentralizing tuition, in placing some power with those who have the responsibility for providing educational services. But, it's discouraging to me seeing a reversal of that by the centralization of so many UNT functions in the System offices in Dallas by Lee Jackson and the Board of Regents. Why is it that the governor and the legislature are not responsible for these appointees, and the appointees responsive to the entire UNT community? And I don't really care whether the appointees are Democrats or Republicans; they still need to evaluate and take appropriate actions regarding the staff they hire, even the Chancellor. I'm not even advocating at this point, "Fire Jackson"! Still, the BOR could show some independence regarding his proposals, such as moving the System offices and IT administration to Dallas.

It seems there are limited ways for those who are displeased with the recent actions by the UNT System leadership to express that; 1.)hold those who appointed and confirmed them responsible at the polls, or 2.)withhold financial giving to UNT. I don't think the latter is a good idea.

Oh, and by the way, I don't think it is, or really was, significant that Lee Jackson was a Republican when he served as Dallas County Judge. At that time, one had to be a Republican to get elected to countywide office in Dallas; now the reverse seems true. Those who want to be in those elected county offices will usually just join whatever party they think gives them the best chance to win. I think Jackson has always worked in a bipartisan fashion, and still does, notably with Royce West. What really matters, in my opinion, is whether Chancellor Jackson is working for the greater good of the UNT community. Personally, I think he has in many ways, but not in the recent matters regarding transfers of functions from Denton to Dallas and in the "resignation" of Bataille.