Sense

Ole Green Guts · November 22, 2009

At this time it does not make any sense to fire TD right now with the stadium opening in 2011.

Why Not to Fire Now....

1. Lower qualitiy of applicants (TD only gets three years @ NT)

2. Restart everything with stadium 2 years away.....

3. If 2010 is a bad season for the new coach we loss momentum of the new stadium

Why to Wait......

TD Has Success in 2010

1. TD gets ample chance to win

2. If successful - Winning and excitement are carried into new stadium

3. Recruiting will be even better

4. I believe we are right on the verge of being great and want to see it all on the line next year.

TD losses in 2010

1. Reason for TD to go and spospect coaches will see they can get a chance.

2. Better applicants with the new stadium near completion (recruiting tool)

3. New coach and stadium = Excitment

Based on TD and the stadium it does not make sense to me to let him go now.

KingDL1 · November 22, 2009

Here let me help you:

Why Not to Fire Now....

1. ~~Lower qualitiy of applicants (TD only gets three years @ NT)~~ Not a problem, and would not affect candidates. Dodge's record speaks for its self

2. ~~Restart everything with stadium 2 years away.....~~ Sounds like the best time to do it, plus we do have versatile talent already here. Dodge is a good recruiter

3. ~~If 2010 is a bad season for the new coach we loss momentum of the new stadium~~ A very good time to get a fresh start to get said momentum.

Why to Wait......

TD Has Success in 2010

1. ~~TD gets ample chance to win~~ Still unproven and appears to be a high risk.

2. ~~If successful - Winning and excitement are carried into new stadium~~ Well that is true but it shows that you are not that sure how big that if is.

3. ~~Recruiting will be even better~~ Not sure it is a good thing Dodge may appear as a lame duck Coach, but I do think is a good recruiter.

4. ~~I believe we are right on the verge of being great and want to see it all on the line next year.~~ I kind of felt that way last year, but I feel we lack preparation this year.

TD losses in 2010

1. ~~Reason for TD to go and spospect coaches will see they can get a chance.~~ I would rather do it now and rolling

2. ~~Better applicants with the new stadium near completion (recruiting tool)~~ This argument is just as good this year if not better. because it give the new coach to have a year in his system before the stadium opens

3. ~~New coach and stadium = Excitment~~ why wait?

Edited November 22, 2009 by KingDL1

Cr1028 · November 22, 2009

lets say td is not a coach but just a fan at a game of his alma mater ut. mack brown just lost today to go 5-30 in his third season. does td want to see mack brown back next year? i say no.

Mack Brown makes over ten times what Dodge makes. They pretty much have their pick of the talent pool for the entire state. If someone goes 2-10 at Texas they are probably gone after their first season. It is not quite the same scenario as we have.

GoMeanGreen1999 · November 22, 2009

Mack Brown makes over ten times what Dodge makes. They pretty much have their pick of the talent pool for the entire state. If someone goes 2-10 at Texas they are probably gone after their first season. It is not quite the same scenario as we have.

Assuming we finish this year with 2 wins and Dodge comes back next year and wins 4 I think you bring him back for year 5.

Some of you need to go play the lottery on a consistent basis.

Edited November 22, 2009 by GoMeanGreen1999

forevereagle · November 22, 2009

At this time it does not make any sense to fire TD right now with the stadium opening in 2011.
Why Not to Fire Now....
1. Lower qualitiy of applicants (TD only gets three years @ NT)
2. Restart everything with stadium 2 years away.....
3. If 2010 is a bad season for the new coach we loss momentum of the new stadium
Why to Wait......
TD Has Success in 2010
1. TD gets ample chance to win
2. If successful - Winning and excitement are carried into new stadium
3. Recruiting will be even better
4. I believe we are right on the verge of being great and want to see it all on the line next year.
TD losses in 2010
1. Reason for TD to go and spospect coaches will see they can get a chance.
2. Better applicants with the new stadium near completion (recruiting tool)
3. New coach and stadium = Excitment
Based on TD and the stadium it does not make sense to me to let him go now.

Why Not to Fire Now....

1. Lower qualitiy of applicants (TD only gets three years @ NT) - Given the record, this is not an issue. Candidates now know that 5 wins in three seasons is not acceptable.

2. Restart everything with stadium 2 years away..... - Why not? Better to try and put together a winning season in our first year of the stadium than trying to rebuild.

3. If 2010 is a bad season for the new coach we loss momentum of the new stadium - With a new coach, there will likely be new excitement.

Why to Wait......

TD Has Success in 2010 - Big assumption here.

1. TD gets ample chance to win - He hasn't already had that chance?

2. If successful - Winning and excitement are carried into new stadium - If. Same can also be said for potential new coach.

3. Recruiting will be even better - No way to know that.

4. I believe we are right on the verge of being great and want to see it all on the line next year. - All I have seen shows me that we are on the verge of losing more close games, not winning them.

TD losses in 2010

1. Reason for TD to go and spospect coaches will see they can get a chance. - Prospect coaches can already see that they can get a chance. They know what they need to do to keep the job.

2. Better applicants with the new stadium near completion (recruiting tool) - Will we not see the same higher quality applicants with the stadium in construction?

3. New coach and stadium = Excitment - We can still get new coach excitement without the stadium. It may even help donations for the stadium if people are excited by the new staff instead of feeling like it will be more of the same with the old staff.

I wish I could feel more optimistic about the future with Dodge at the helm, but I just cannot see any reason to be at this point. We took an easy schedule full of winnable games and managed to only get 2 wins. Say what you will about close and all that, but close is not there. No one cares that we almost won games, especially the way in which we lost them. And that is what hurts the most, we have had leads and blown them consistently. I made a (half) joke at the end of the first half tonight - "4 point lead, we've blown bigger leads than that. No problem." The sarcasm is lost in type, but it turned out to be more prophetic than I guessed at the time.

LoveMG · November 22, 2009

Mack Brown makes over ten times what Dodge makes. They pretty much have their pick of the talent pool for the entire state. If someone goes 2-10 at Texas they are probably gone after their first season. It is not quite the same scenario as we have.

ok, lets take the thinking part out of it. take fan x watching coach x who is 5-30; would fan x be excited and want to give coach x another year after seeing anotherl loss? same for td the fan; i dont think he would want to keep himself around.

UNTflyer · November 22, 2009

Mack Brown makes over ten times what Dodge makes. They pretty much have their pick of the talent pool for the entire state. If someone goes 2-10 at Texas they are probably gone after their first season. It is not quite the same scenario as we have.

We're little North Texas, we should have no expectations of being better than 2-10 for 3 straight years.

Got it.

Travis · November 22, 2009

It is not only us negatives on the board that feel he should go. Just look at the crowds (or lack there of) in the stands. If it wasn't for half the crowd being ARMY we would have had yet another weak showing. Top it off, you should hear what students are saying around campus. Something must be done because the athletic department is losing support from the fan base. This is so crucial at a time we are needing the exact opposite.

VideoEagle · November 22, 2009

It is not only us negatives on the board that feel he should go. Just look at the crowds (or lack there of) in the stands. If it wasn't for half the crowd being ARMY we would have had yet another weak showing. Top it off, you should hear what students are saying around campus. Something must be done because the athletic department is losing support from the fan base. This is so crucial at a time we are needing the exact opposite.

You mean the crowds that have shown a steady year over year increase in the last three years? Perhaps you mean the Mean Green club donations that are now at an all time high?

UNTflyer · November 22, 2009

The stadium should not even be a factor in this decision. Dodge needs to go. I see no indication of improvement in this team.

Games are closer? So what? 2-10 this year is just as good as 2-10 last year.

CaribbeanGreen · November 22, 2009

"close losses" got the last guy here (and hundreds of guys around the country) canned. And most of those guys (if not all) had won a heck of a lot more at some point.

Here, it's all talk of potential for a coach that is the worst in-game tactician I've ever seen, and whose HS record outside of the factory-win 10 every year machine at SLC is .500.

Travis · November 22, 2009

You mean the crowds that have shown a steady year over year increase in the last three years? Perhaps you mean the Mean Green club donations that are now at an all time high?

You know as good as I do that the numbers aren't correct. I have been to many games and I have never seen such inflated attendance numbers. And, all you have to do is look at how many people come to beginning games only to not show up the next few weeks. Each time it gets worse and worse. If you can't recognize that then you haven't been going to the games lately.

IT would be a fallacy to credit mean green club to what Dodge is doing right now. You don't know that and it is weak to give this current program credit for that. People are tired of what is going on. You should hear what the students are saying. And, I don't blame them...

VideoEagle · November 22, 2009

You know as good as I do that the numbers aren't correct. I have been to many games and I have never seen such inflated attendance numbers.

So the athletic department is paying extra for scanning tickets, slowing down fans getting into the game and thus irritating them, just so RV can lie about the attendance? That really defies any kind of logic or reasoning. You honestly think they are going to purposely take an action that will lower attendance so they can lie to increase attendance? It would be cheaper not to and RV certainly wants to save money.

Furthermore, if the athletic department was going to lie about attendance, why didn't they inflate the lower games to at least 15000? Obviously, they did not. Instead they reported the accurate numbers.

IT would be a fallacy to credit mean green club to what Dodge is doing right now. You don't know that and it is weak to give this current program credit for that.

What year so the biggest increase in donations EVER to the Mean Green Club? The year Todd Dodge was hired. Has it declined from that peak? Yes, but it remains FAR higher that any year before that and it remains so. I see a lot more $1000 donors than ever before. None of the ones I know really spend that much time thinking about the soccer program. I do know of one $1000 donor and one for sure and I think two more $500 donors who joined specifically because of Todd Dodge.

Even at 11,000 a game, that is three times the fans showing up for any other sport. If not to football, to what are you attributing the increase? Track?

This year is terrible, but certainly not the most terrible year in of the program. Trust me on that as I've been around since Hayden was here! In down years, it is easy to get too depressed just as in up years it easy to get to excited. The title of this thread is "sense," which is something NT fans need to use this year!

And I tried to ignore it, but I just can't. You should have written "You know as well as I do."

Edited November 22, 2009 by VideoEagle

Cerebus · November 22, 2009

Announced attendance include season tickets sold but not actually used, per my understanding.

Green Dozer · November 22, 2009

lets say td is not a coach but just a fan at a game of his alma mater ut. mack brown just lost today to go 5-30 in his third season. does td want to see mack brown back next year? i say no.

What???? This makes no sense, such an unrealistic comparison.

Green Mean · November 22, 2009

Mack Brown makes over ten times what Dodge makes. They pretty much have their pick of the talent pool for the entire state. If someone goes 2-10 at Texas they are probably gone after their first season. It is not quite the same scenario as we have.

Mack Brown makes millions more than Dodge but they also play talent ten times better than what NT has to play excluding money bag games.

football fan · November 22, 2009

Announced attendance include season tickets sold but not actually used, per my understanding.

That is correct. Actual scanned attendance for WKU and ULM was approx 4K and 6K respectively. Just stellar!

Edited November 23, 2009 by football fan

Cr1028 · November 23, 2009

Mack Brown makes millions more than Dodge but they also play talent ten times better than what NT has to play excluding money bag games.

That is my point. TEXAS BRINGS THE BODYBAGS!! The only team Texas has to compete with year in and year out, on the field and off it(for recruits) is Oklahoma, everyone else is just another victim. You think our talent level is better than everyone we play (out of conference include) except for Troy?

wardly · November 23, 2009

we are in a catch 22. td and the new stadium are connected, as we point to a winning season in 2010 as a prelude to new stadium opening in 2011. the question rv has before him is a] keep dodge , and hope the 6 losses by less than a touchdown in 09 will turn into wins in 2010, or b]replace him now, and hope a new coach can turn losses into wins next year. who do we have a better chance to win with next year? td, or someone like the oc at houston? it would have to be someone who runs the same type of system we have in place based upon the players recruited in the past 3 years. you make the call.

AJR2010OX · November 23, 2009

If there has been one thing thats upset me over the past two years as a student, its that Todd Dodge hasn't been able to motivate his players when positive things have come from the stadium process. I remember last year, after the hard fight with the stadium, Dodge couldn't even motivate his players and we laid a huge egg (I forgot who we were playing). This year, he couldn't motvate his players against ULM and Army. You would hope you would get a more inspired effort out of a coach- especially how so many students have criticized the need for a new stadium (which, thank god we are getting) with such monumental things that benefit primarily the football team.

jimmyjames_99 · November 23, 2009

Question, can Dodge replace Ford? Or are they too linked at the hip?

It is understood that the spread is Dodge's bag, but how much control does Ford really have over the offense... Could a new spread-based offensive coordinator come in and help turn this around?

UNT Mean Green · November 23, 2009

Question, can Dodge replace Ford? Or are they too linked at the hip?
It is understood that the spread is Dodge's bag, but how much control does Ford really have over the offense... Could a new spread-based offensive coordinator come in and help turn this around?

Yes, he could and should. But will TD be around to make that decision???

gangrene · November 23, 2009

We're little North Texas, we should have no expectations of being better than 2-10 for 3 straight years.
Got it.

Throw in something about not having any money and I think you've got a slogan UNT can go with.

Buying Mean Green gear in the new SLC-shade of green for the entire family - $325

Witnessing every heartbreaking home game loss of the Dodge era in person - $3,100

Countless hours spent debating on GMG.com - $123,783 in lost work productivity.

Knowing your team will somehow find a way to lose in the last five minutes of the game - priceless.

KRAM1 · November 23, 2009

Buying season tickets and going to the game with friends...priceless

Enjoying great tailgating with friends and Mean Green nation members...priceless

Seeing a new stadium unfold in my lifetime...priceless

Enjoying that game day atmosphere and the great looking coeds on a Saturday afternoon...priceless

Free beer...priceless

Meeting GMG.com members at each game...priceless

Getting to meet fans from the opposing team before and after each game...priceless

Being in a stadium for a college football game...priceless

Talking Mean Green football around the water cooler at work...priceless

Looking forward to each home game...priceless

Watching the Green Brigade the last few games...priceless (they seem to have gotten even better)

OK, I could go on...but I'll end (sort of) with a paraphrase of a quote from the ever infamous, Quoner, "it's only a game"! :lol:

Come on folks...plenty to enjoy! The wins WILL come, and they will be so sweet to see from my same seats at Fouts next year!

GO MEAN GREEN!

Quoner · November 23, 2009

Buying season tickets and going to the game with friends...priceless
Enjoying great tailgating with friends and Mean Green nation members...priceless
Seeing a new stadium unfold in my lifetime...priceless
Enjoying that game day atmosphere and the great looking coeds on a Saturday afternoon...priceless
Free beer...priceless
Meeting GMG.com members at each game...priceless
Getting to meet fans from the opposing team before and after each game...priceless
Being in a stadium for a college football game...priceless
Talking Mean Green football around the water cooler at work...priceless
Looking forward to each home game...priceless
Watching the Green Brigade the last few games...priceless (they seem to have gotten even better)
OK, I could go on...but I'll end (sort of) with a paraphrase of a quote from the ever infamous, Quoner, "it's only a game"!
Come on folks...plenty to enjoy! The wins WILL come, and they will be so sweet to see from my same seats at Fouts next year!
GO MEAN GREEN!

If you don't mention Christians and lions, you are not really quoting me.