Fire Dodge Now Rick!

[Mean Green 93-98]

From the predictions thread it seemed that the majority of us expected us to go in there and compete and maybe even steal a victory.

I think you need to re-read that thread. Even several of those who predicted a close game or victory acknowledged they weren't basing their predictions on reality.

[meangreanmick]

So who's to blame for the talent deficiency after 3 years???? Troy went from Sunbelt bottom feeder to formidable mid-major in a few years, did you forget that??? So you're so much better than everyone because you give $10k a year right? Real fans sacrifice to give, knowing we'd all give a cool million if we had it. Your "elitist" attitude & attack of this fan makes you the real a$$ clown, IMO.

"We DO NOT have the talent yet to compete with anyone better than the top of the sunbelt." ---> This statement by you is laughable & ridiculous. What happened in Troy this past weekend has been happening the last 5 seasons for NT vs the top of the Belt. So again, I ask yo, who's responsible for the talent deficiency???????

I don't care if you are a student or the president. Reality is reality. Money is what drives major college football. If its elitist to state the obvious, then sign me up for that - I didn't say if or what I donate. I am not stating an opinion here, to say money is what drives major college football is pretty much motherhood and apple pie. What is elitist is telling me I am not a good enough fan and that I ACCEPT being average in the Sunbelt because I support the team rather than continually criticize everything about it - that is what is wrong with some of the folks on this board (student or not). If I don't think our team is as good as I want us to be, I choose to be more engaged and more supportive. Taking shots at any part of the program or telling everyone how you won't support it until they are good only hurts the program, especially when done from afar on the internet.

Laughable and ridiculous? As you quote me, all I said was we "don't have the talent". Are you saying that we DO have the talent to compete with Troy or Alabama? Anyone that thinks our team right now has the same amount of experienced talent as Troy is completely out of touch with reality.

Obviously, the head coach and his staff are responsible for recruiting and preparing the talent. However, these knee jerks about games are what is laughable and ridiculous. What happened at Troy was pretty much what would be expected based on the talent of the 2 teams. (I think we were within 4 points of the line?).

When was Troy a Sunbelt bottom feeder? Since we started playing them in 2003, they were 6 -6, 7-5, 4-7, 8-4, 8-4. Those 4 wins in 2004 were against sunbelt or provisional sunbelt teams and I believe one of those was against us. To my recollection, I think we have only beaten them 1 time since 2003?

[Got5onIt]

I don't care if you are a student or the president. Reality is reality. Money is what drives major college football. If its elitist to state the obvious, then sign me up for that - I didn't say if or what I donate. I am not stating an opinion here, to say money is what drives major college football is pretty much motherhood and apple pie. What is elitist is telling me I am not a good enough fan and that I ACCEPT being average in the Sunbelt because I support the team rather than continually criticize everything about it - that is what is wrong with some of the folks on this board (student or not). If I don't think our team is as good as I want us to be, I choose to be more engaged and more supportive. Taking shots at any part of the program or telling everyone how you won't support it until they are good only hurts the program, especially when done from afar on the internet.

Laughable and ridiculous? As you quote me, all I said was we "don't have the talent". Are you saying that we DO have the talent to compete with Troy or Alabama? Anyone that thinks our team right now has the same amount of experienced talent as Troy is completely out of touch with reality.

Obviously, the head coach and his staff are responsible for recruiting and preparing the talent. However, these knee jerks about games are what is laughable and ridiculous. What happened at Troy was pretty much what would be expected based on the talent of the 2 teams. (I think we were within 4 points of the line?).

When was Troy a Sunbelt bottom feeder? Since we started playing them in 2003, they were 6 -6, 7-5, 4-7, 8-4, 8-4. Those 4 wins in 2004 were against sunbelt or provisional sunbelt teams and I believe one of those was against us. To my recollection, I think we have only beaten them 1 time since 2003?

, it'

I agree, with every loss the rope holding the guillotine is getting thinner & thinner for this board.

Yes, it is well known that money drives college football. Noone disputes that. Attacking a fan for the amount they give is the issue I had. 10 people give a $1k or 1 person gives $10k, it's all the same. I'm just glad they're donating. With that said, as a supporter/donator, you have the right to bitch/moan if you're not happy with the state of the program. I commend you for "increasing your support" in down times. But, as you stated, money is the deciding factor, so what do most Boosters do when programs perform as crappy as THIS program has done teh last 3 years - They pull their money. What do AD's do when this happens? They fire people. What happens when programs win?? Booster donations go up. If you know all this, why are you so surprised by these type of comments? Is it because at NT we don't have a pro athletics culture? i hate to break it to you, but thsi is how it works at most collegiate athletic programs.

Noone is knocking you for supporting the program. Don't just follow blindly & SPEAK UP if you're disgusted at the current state of affairs. One man decides who coaches what sports. He can make mistakes, he's only human. Then again, you could be happy at the direction NT is heading.

Edited October 26, 2009 by Got5onIt

[LAZER]

I don't care if you are a student or the president. Reality is reality. Money is what drives major college football. If its elitist to state the obvious, then sign me up for that - I didn't say if or what I donate. I am not stating an opinion here, to say money is what drives major college football is pretty much motherhood and apple pie. What is elitist is telling me I am not a good enough fan and that I ACCEPT being average in the Sunbelt because I support the team rather than continually criticize everything about it - that is what is wrong with some of the folks on this board (student or not). If I don't think our team is as good as I want us to be, I choose to be more engaged and more supportive. Taking shots at any part of the program or telling everyone how you won't support it until they are good only hurts the program, especially when done from afar on the internet.

Laughable and ridiculous? As you quote me, all I said was we "don't have the talent". Are you saying that we DO have the talent to compete with Troy or Alabama? Anyone that thinks our team right now has the same amount of experienced talent as Troy is completely out of touch with reality.

Obviously, the head coach and his staff are responsible for recruiting and preparing the talent. However, these knee jerks about games are what is laughable and ridiculous. What happened at Troy was pretty much what would be expected based on the talent of the 2 teams. (I think we were within 4 points of the line?).

When was Troy a Sunbelt bottom feeder? Since we started playing them in 2003, they were 6 -6, 7-5, 4-7, 8-4, 8-4. Those 4 wins in 2004 were against sunbelt or provisional sunbelt teams and I believe one of those was against us. To my recollection, I think we have only beaten them 1 time since 2003?

You are right I do not give money to UNT. In fact, they pretty much pay me to go to school here. That must mean I especially do not deserve to have an opinion on my universities FB program. Your argument that I do not deserve an opinion because I do not give money to the university is dumb. Whether a student or an alumni, you are entitled to your opinion whether you give 0$ or 1,000,000$ so please save it for someone that cares. Although I appreciate your donation to the program, nobody cares about how much you give.

Before you make statements about me do you research. With the exception of my last few posts I have been nothing but supportive of this FB team. As a student I do not have 10K laying around to give to the program. However, what I can do is show up to all the games that my class load permits and go nuts during the game. The posters on this board that know me can tell you I am far from the negative fair weather fans that come on hear and cause trouble.

I never said any of you were bad fans because you support the FB team through rough times. My first year at UNT was 2005. We have never been good since I have been a student. Unlike many of you I cannot remember the past when we actually were good. Nonetheless, I continue to support UNT athletics and always will. Fire Fighting Rick once said he does not support MG football because they are good, he supports MG football because they are his team. When I get down about how we are playing I try to always follow that statement.

Although I will always support UNT football, I can criticize it as well. I still think what is wrong with you and many on this board is that to many of you are satisfied with a coach that has a 4-26 record and are also satisfied with being competitive with half the sunbelt. To be honest, the true reason I am criticizing the team is because I support and care about the university. I obviously set my standards much higher that you because I want the team to be have a better record than 4-26 and I would like to to be able to compete with more than half the teams in the lowly sunbelt. In order to reach what I think is our potential, Dodge must be on his way out the door today. We have a great opportunity to turn this program in the right direction with the new stadium. I do not want to lose that opportunity because I chose to support an awful coach that will never turn this program around. We do not get many opportunities like this so lets not blow it.

Finally, I really like how you assume that my current posts has anything to do with our loss to Troy. In reality, my poor opinion of Dodge has to do with his 4-26 record. How can you be satisfied with his performance? The performance of this football team is embarrassing to this university.

Sincerely,

A Poor A**clown that cant afford to give to the university

[untStein]

New policy: for every negative comment, you will be charged $1,000 and that will go directly to the program. Perfectly reasonable.

[UNT90]

To be honest, the true reason I am criticizing the team is because I support and care about the university.

From the mouth of babes.

When the critizism stops, so will the caring. The day that we lose 50-26 and no one is griping about it on here is the day when we go back to D1AA football. I look forward to the day that we lose by 3 in a bowl game and people are on here calling for the coaches head. Why? Because that means they care about the program.

[meangreanmick]

, it'

I agree, with every loss the rope holding the guillotine is getting thinner & thinner for this board.

Yes, it is well known that money drives college football. Noone disputes that. Attacking a fan for the amount they give is the issue I had. 10 people give a $1k or 1 person gives $10k, it's all the same. I'm just glad they're donating. With that said, as a supporter/donator, you have the right to bitch/moan if you're not happy with the state of the program. I commend you for "increasing your support" in down times. But, as you stated, money is the deciding factor, so what do most Boosters do when programs perform as crappy as THIS program has done teh last 3 years - They pull their money. What do AD's do when this happens? They fire people. What happens when programs win?? Booster donations go up. If you know all this, why are you so surprised by these type of comments? Is it because at NT we don't have a pro athletics culture? i hate to break it to you, but thsi is how it works at most collegiate athletic programs.

Noone is knocking you for supporting the program. Don't just follow blindly & SPEAK UP if you're disgusted at the current state of affairs. One man decides who coaches what sports. He can make mistakes, he's only human. Then again, you could be happy at the direction NT is heading.

Well, I do speak up, I just don't do it in a way that (in my opinion) hurts the program more than it helps. I don't dispute that people have the right to criticize if they don't like how things are going, but (again, in my opinion) that hurts more than it helps if it is done in the manner that it is often done on this board. If I don't like how things are going, I go talk to the athletic department, Rick V included. He or anyone up there will talk to or meet with anyone that wants to about anything you want to. I wonder how many of the negative posters on this board have ever actually tried to communicate with Rick V/the athletic department in a constructive manner - students included.

I doubt that anyone on this board has the money to force the athletic program to do anything (such as fire the coach). Mattress Mac was a very large donor who I believe has pulled his support because Dickey was fired. That didn't change the decision, all that does is hurt the program. I know people think they can push a change at an athletic program by withholding money, but the reality is that only works if you are a big time donor throwing out a hundreds of thousands, if not millions (and of course we don't have too many of those). Otherwise, you are just witholding some money and making it more difficult for a program the size of UNT but not really changing anything for the positive. At 1,000 each, it would take more people than we have in the Mean Green club to force a change like that. All anyone is doing that pulls money is just making it a little bit harder for us.

I did not mean to attack anyone for the amount of money they donate - upon re-reading my first post I didn't word that very well so I apologize for that. It gets pretty old seeing the posts that tell me I am settling for mediocrity because I choose to support the program rather than try to tear it apart at every turn. If you want to change the program for the better, do it in a positive way not a negative way. It will make it a little bit easier on those of us that are trying to do positive things to help improve the program.

[Green Dozer]

So who's to blame for the talent deficiency after 3 years???? Troy went from Sunbelt bottom feeder to formidable mid-major in a few years, did you forget that??? So you're so much better than everyone because you give $10k a year right? Real fans sacrifice to give, knowing we'd all give a cool million if we had it. Your "elitist" attitude & attack of this fan makes you the real a$$ clown, IMO.

"We DO NOT have the talent yet to compete with anyone better than the top of the sunbelt." ---> This statement by you is laughable & ridiculous. What happened in Troy this past weekend has been happening the last 5 seasons for NT vs the top of the Belt. So again, I ask yo, who's responsible for the talent deficiency???????

I've held my donation from athletics the last 2 years because of Todd Dodge. My money went to my respective college of study and you can book it will be going there again if Teflon Todd isn't fired at the end of this year.

This is just the way programs like Texas, Alabama, Penn St., and OU, etc. have been built. People just withheld their money until things went their way. Your attitude, and ones similar, are what has been a problem for the football program as far back as I can remember which is the Fry days. I would say to you to re-think it, because it is a big reason as to why we are where we are. This program needs everybody.

[yyz28]

Wow... this thread is pretty wild. I've already gone through three bowls of popcorn reading this one.

1. The loss sucked. No doubt.

2. This team IS better than last year. No doubt.

3. We HAVE been competitive in every game save this one and the Alabama game this year (yes, even MTSU, despite the slow start, we had every opportunity to win that game).

I want can't tell you if I think Dodge should return next season right now or not. Ask me at the end of the season. The folks calling for his head today, I think, are very reactionary. Let's look at the end result of this season when we get there, look at the season in comparison to the past two (and not just wins and losses) and then determine if the direction is the right one and if we want to stick it out another year. I think the answer for most, given the investment we've already made, will be yes. ...and here's the most important part that, perhaps, many here fail to notice - there is nothing we can do to change it. We don't make these decisions.

[houstonmeangreen]

well, I don't really know what is the best decision, but I will say it doesn't seem the TD hire decision was a good one...we are into his 3rd year and have won a total of 4 games in the middle of the 3rd season. The defense is pretty bad, esp against the pass...this too rest on TD's shoulders.

The Offense line looks great, other than that...not so good....but we do have some great talent on this team...you can see it, it is just that this program is not a cohesive functioning machine that wins games. Also, I think a lot of the play calling leaves something to be desired....turnovers, penalties, special teams....so many problems, many we shouldn't have after 2 1/2 years under TD.

It just appears TD was not a good decision and I wouldn't think next year these problems will all of a sudden go away.

[mad dog]

I have held off voicing my opinion for a while, out of respect for the team and the job they were trying to accomplish. I held off because, somewhere, there was a tiny flicker of hope that I may have been completely wrong about this program: that maybe a .500 season wouldn't be out of the question. Last Saturday, after looking at the score, I discovered something truly disturbing.

I just didn't care.

Somewhere along the line, that tiny flame got snuffed out. I don't know if it was Troy in particular, or some other game where we found a way to lose in the final second. I don't know which demoralizing loss did it for me, or if it was even the net result of any game in particular. It may have been reading Ira Smith's comments about "it's going to be tough, but we are going to go to work" and knowing that this team has mentally checked out already. It may well have been the pervasive atmosphere of failure and despair this program has exuded for the latter half of this decade. Whatever the reason, my support, which had been on life support for years, finally flatlined.

At the beginning of this season, I decided not to renew my season tickets. The reason I used was that my wife and I recently moved into a new house, and we needed the money at home. While that was a good reason, I honestly could have come up with the money if it meant enough to me. Looking back, I believe I talked myself out of it because I was tired of getting kicked in the groin every single week for three years. I was tired of defending my school, and exhausted from getting up for each new season - finding the positivity when I knew there was none to be had.

It isn't that I don't want the best for North Texas - it will always be my school. It isn't as though I can just drop UNT and adopt another team (though, to my shame, I did actually try - I just couldn't do it). It is just that I hated feeling terrible all the time, with no end in sight - I simply ran out of faith. So, with my emotional investment withdrawn, there was nothing to sustain my financial investment.

Will North Texas ever find a way back to competitive play? Will the Administration find a way to whip this thing into shape? Will Coach Dodge find success here? I hope it does - I really only want what's best for the team. I just got tired of pretending the plate of manure in front of me tasted like ice cream.

[Eagle1855]

I have held off voicing my opinion for a while, out of respect for the team and the job they were trying to accomplish. I held off because, somewhere, there was a tiny flicker of hope that I may have been completely wrong about this program: that maybe a .500 season wouldn't be out of the question. Last Saturday, after looking at the score, I discovered something truly disturbing.

I just didn't care.

Somewhere along the line, that tiny flame got snuffed out. I don't know if it was Troy in particular, or some other game where we found a way to lose in the final second. I don't know which demoralizing loss did it for me, or if it was even the net result of any game in particular. It may have been reading Ira Smith's comments about "it's going to be tough, but we are going to go to work" and knowing that this team has mentally checked out already. It may well have been the pervasive atmosphere of failure and despair this program has exuded for the latter half of this decade. Whatever the reason, my support, which had been on life support for years, finally flatlined.

At the beginning of this season, I decided not to renew my season tickets. The reason I used was that my wife and I recently moved into a new house, and we needed the money at home. While that was a good reason, I honestly could have come up with the money if it meant enough to me. Looking back, I believe I talked myself out of it because I was tired of getting kicked in the groin every single week for three years. I was tired of defending my school, and exhausted from getting up for each new season - finding the positivity when I knew there was none to be had.

It isn't that I don't want the best for North Texas - it will always be my school. It isn't as though I can just drop UNT and adopt another team (though, to my shame, I did actually try - I just couldn't do it). It is just that I hated feeling terrible all the time, with no end in sight - I simply ran out of faith. So, with my emotional investment withdrawn, there was nothing to sustain my financial investment.

Will North Texas ever find a way back to competitive play? Will the Administration find a way to whip this thing into shape? Will Coach Dodge find success here? I hope it does - I really only want what's best for the team. I just got tired of pretending the plate of manure in front of me tasted like ice cream.

welcome to my world.

[meangreanmick]

You are right I do not give money to UNT. In fact, they pretty much pay me to go to school here. That must mean I especially do not deserve to have an opinion on my universities FB program. Your argument that I do not deserve an opinion because I do not give money to the university is dumb. Whether a student or an alumni, you are entitled to your opinion whether you give 0$ or 1,000,000$ so please save it for someone that cares. Although I appreciate your donation to the program, nobody cares about how much you give.

OK, I actually never said if or what I donated, so not sure where your comment about not caring how much I give came from. The point is, if you don't give anything and you continue to make derogatory comments and tear at the program, how are you actually helping the program? You come to some games? Thats nice, but doesn't offset the negativity you create around the program. So yeah, you can have an opinion and express them on this board. But don't fool yourself into thinking you are doing something at all good for MY program. And it damn sure doesn't give you the right to tell me how I accept being average because I support MY program rather than tear it down. I express my opinions, but I do it in a way that someone that needs to know it hears it and it doesn't hurt the program.

I never said any of you were bad fans because you support the FB team through rough times. My first year at UNT was 2005. We have never been good since I have been a student. Unlike many of you I cannot remember the past when we actually were good. Nonetheless, I continue to support UNT athletics and always will. Fire Fighting Rick once said he does not support MG football because they are good, he supports MG football because they are his team. When I get down about how we are playing I try to always follow that statement.

I beg to differ. I paraphrase, but I believe you said something like the problem with the posters on this board is that they feel being competitive/average in the sunbelt is good enough. Sounds like you are saying I have a problem in how I support the team (the kind of fan I am).

I still think what is wrong with you and many on this board is that to many of you are satisfied with a coach that has a 4-26 record and are also satisfied with being competitive with half the sunbelt.

Now see, there you go again. You say you aren't saying we are bad fans, but you feel the need to point out what is wrong with me as a fan and many of the fans on the board. And your evidence of MY "satisfaction" with the coach is what? You evidence of MY being "satisfied" with being competitive with half the sunbelt is what? Is it that I support the program in positive ways? Is it that if I don't like something I go talk to the AD or someone in the program about it (as anyone on this board could) rather than be a coward about it?

How can you be satisfied with his performance? The performance of this football team is embarrassing to this university.

Again, where did I say I was satisfied with the performance of the coach, the team, or the program?

Sincerely,

A Poor A**clown that cant afford to give to the university

Now see, here you got it right. Can't, or doesn't? You can't afford to give $5?

The point isn't whether you give money or not. There are 2 points here. 1) You make demands that the team should immediately be a Cadillac like you are entitled to it, but the funding for this program is a Pinto. So yes, I am saying you (in general, not you personally) should take into consideration how much you (in general, not you personally) fund this program when posting comments on this board or anywhere else on the internet that can be picked up by alumni, fans, prospective athletes, etc. Why don't you head down to Park Place Lexus and throw down some GMC kind of money. When that doesn't work, tell them you don't except mediocrity and that you have always been a big Lexus fan, therefore you deserve it.

2) Since you can't quite pickup on this, let me connect the dots for you. A program like ours that is trying to claw its way up doesn't need the negativity, it needs people doing positive things to help, not negative things. If you (in general) fund this thing with 100 million dollars, you deserve to gripe all you want and it won't hurt the program cause it has lots of money (see the Texas's, Alabama's etc that everyone likes to reference in defending their right to hurt our program). Any a**clown can throw out shots at a program like ours and tell everyone they don't accept average and therfore they are a better fan, but it does no good for anyone except the a**clown saying it. So yes, I say put up or shut up. That might be money or it might be some other POSITIVE you can contribute that exceeds your negativity.

If you have an opinion, go meet with the athletic department and express it. If they won't talk to you, let me know and maybe I will have to eat my words on that. Until then, you don't become a big time program by tearing it down with piss ant comments on the internet. You fund it and support it. When it becomes big time, then you can go on back to being a piss ant complainer and it won't hurt it.

I am not satisfied at all with where are (coaching, program, team, etc). But I choose to be part of the solution rather than create more problems.

[TheTastyGreek]

I have held off voicing my opinion for a while, out of respect for the team and the job they were trying to accomplish. I held off because, somewhere, there was a tiny flicker of hope that I may have been completely wrong about this program: that maybe a .500 season wouldn't be out of the question. Last Saturday, after looking at the score, I discovered something truly disturbing.

I just didn't care.

Somewhere along the line, that tiny flame got snuffed out. I don't know if it was Troy in particular, or some other game where we found a way to lose in the final second. I don't know which demoralizing loss did it for me, or if it was even the net result of any game in particular. It may have been reading Ira Smith's comments about "it's going to be tough, but we are going to go to work" and knowing that this team has mentally checked out already. It may well have been the pervasive atmosphere of failure and despair this program has exuded for the latter half of this decade. Whatever the reason, my support, which had been on life support for years, finally flatlined.

At the beginning of this season, I decided not to renew my season tickets. The reason I used was that my wife and I recently moved into a new house, and we needed the money at home. While that was a good reason, I honestly could have come up with the money if it meant enough to me. Looking back, I believe I talked myself out of it because I was tired of getting kicked in the groin every single week for three years. I was tired of defending my school, and exhausted from getting up for each new season - finding the positivity when I knew there was none to be had.

It isn't that I don't want the best for North Texas - it will always be my school. It isn't as though I can just drop UNT and adopt another team (though, to my shame, I did actually try - I just couldn't do it). It is just that I hated feeling terrible all the time, with no end in sight - I simply ran out of faith. So, with my emotional investment withdrawn, there was nothing to sustain my financial investment.

Will North Texas ever find a way back to competitive play? Will the Administration find a way to whip this thing into shape? Will Coach Dodge find success here? I hope it does - I really only want what's best for the team. I just got tired of pretending the plate of manure in front of me tasted like ice cream.

Basketball. 16 days. Just turtle up until then, and get ready to have your Mean Green sports spirit renewed.

[KRAM1]

I have held off voicing my opinion for a while, out of respect for the team and the job they were trying to accomplish. I held off because, somewhere, there was a tiny flicker of hope that I may have been completely wrong about this program: that maybe a .500 season wouldn't be out of the question. Last Saturday, after looking at the score, I discovered something truly disturbing.

I just didn't care.

Somewhere along the line, that tiny flame got snuffed out. I don't know if it was Troy in particular, or some other game where we found a way to lose in the final second. I don't know which demoralizing loss did it for me, or if it was even the net result of any game in particular. It may have been reading Ira Smith's comments about "it's going to be tough, but we are going to go to work" and knowing that this team has mentally checked out already. It may well have been the pervasive atmosphere of failure and despair this program has exuded for the latter half of this decade. Whatever the reason, my support, which had been on life support for years, finally flatlined.

At the beginning of this season, I decided not to renew my season tickets. The reason I used was that my wife and I recently moved into a new house, and we needed the money at home. While that was a good reason, I honestly could have come up with the money if it meant enough to me. Looking back, I believe I talked myself out of it because I was tired of getting kicked in the groin every single week for three years. I was tired of defending my school, and exhausted from getting up for each new season - finding the positivity when I knew there was none to be had.

It isn't that I don't want the best for North Texas - it will always be my school. It isn't as though I can just drop UNT and adopt another team (though, to my shame, I did actually try - I just couldn't do it). It is just that I hated feeling terrible all the time, with no end in sight - I simply ran out of faith. So, with my emotional investment withdrawn, there was nothing to sustain my financial investment.

Will North Texas ever find a way back to competitive play? Will the Administration find a way to whip this thing into shape? Will Coach Dodge find success here? I hope it does - I really only want what's best for the team. I just got tired of pretending the plate of manure in front of me tasted like ice cream.

Sorry to read this post. This one is especially hard to read as I realize how heartfelt it is and where it is coming from. The saddest part to me is the fact that, once again, support for one's university is tied to the football team's won-loss record. I get kidded about my loyalty to UNT all the time by my friends who graduated elsewhere. I get the emails and calls after each and every loss, so what? UNT is not the football team and I am personally not defined by the college teams I support. Heck, there have been some years when all three colleges I graduated from were taking it in the shorts every week. You think that was fun to take? No, but these things change and it is part of the fun of being a college sports fan, and a UNT fan in particular. I would encourage folks to get a bit of perspective on this whole thing. You are not defined by the won-loss record of the school you attended or graduated from. "Emotional investment" is self-made...you can make it positive or negative...yes, you really can. Anyway, I ask you to keep the faith in your university. It is much grander than just it's football program.

GO MEAN GREEN. I encourage all who feels as illuvius32 does to watch the UNT Traditions video posted on another thread here on GMG.com. Might help your emotional side get a big uplift.

[yyz28]

Sorry to read this post. This one is especially hard to read as I realize how heartfelt it is and where it is coming from. The saddest part to me is the fact that, once again, support for one's university is tied to the football team's won-loss record. I get kidded about my loyalty to UNT all the time by my friends who graduated elsewhere. I get the emails and calls after each and every loss, so what? UNT is not the football team and I am personally not defined by the college teams I support. Heck, there have been some years when all three colleges I graduated from were taking it in the shorts every week. You think that was fun to take? No, but these things change and it is part of the fun of being a college sports fan, and a UNT fan in particular. I would encourage folks to get a bit of perspective on this whole thing. You are not defined by the won-loss record of the school you attended or graduated from. "Emotional investment" is self-made...you can make it positive or negative...yes, you really can. Anyway, I ask you to keep the faith in your university. It is much grander than just it's football program.

GO MEAN GREEN. I encourage all who feels as illuvius32 does to watch the UNT Traditions video posted on another thread here on GMG.com. Might help your emotional side get a big uplift.

Best and most under-rated post of the week. Perspective.

Thanks KRAM! Great post and points.

[mad dog]

Sorry to read this post. This one is especially hard to read as I realize how heartfelt it is and where it is coming from. The saddest part to me is the fact that, once again, support for one's university is tied to the football team's won-loss record. I get kidded about my loyalty to UNT all the time by my friends who graduated elsewhere. I get the emails and calls after each and every loss, so what? UNT is not the football team and I am personally not defined by the college teams I support. Heck, there have been some years when all three colleges I graduated from were taking it in the shorts every week. You think that was fun to take? No, but these things change and it is part of the fun of being a college sports fan, and a UNT fan in particular. I would encourage folks to get a bit of perspective on this whole thing. You are not defined by the won-loss record of the school you attended or graduated from. "Emotional investment" is self-made...you can make it positive or negative...yes, you really can. Anyway, I ask you to keep the faith in your university. It is much grander than just it's football program.

GO MEAN GREEN. I encourage all who feels as illuvius32 does to watch the UNT Traditions video posted on another thread here on GMG.com. Might help your emotional side get a big uplift.

I appreciate your support for the school, but you really do give me tired head sometimes. I think you're insinuating several things about my post that are pretty wrong, and, although I won't be drawn into a war of words, I felt it might be good to correct them so that others don't take your opinion and run with it.

This board, as you might conclude from the site name, is dedicated to North Texas althletics, chiefly football. So my focus of what North Texas means to me, when posted on that forum, should be taken in that context. Your conclusion that I don't or won't support the university as a whole because of how the football team performs is truly a straw man argument. I always love to see great things happen with the university: my Public Administration department, for one, has been a monumental success and continues to draw top students from around the nation. Football has nothing to do with them, so it doesn't affect my contributions or service to them. Likewise, my support of them has absolutely nothing to do with football, which is, again, the whole point of this particular forum.

Your posts lately have switched from a "good things are happening for Mean Green Football" to your current alignment of "good things are happening for the University of North Texas." And, not to douse your fervor in any way, but do you think the fact you DID graduate from three different schools maybe helps you out a little bit? When it comes to colleges, I don't have any other option besides North Texas. I can't simply put a blindfold on and play random selection with my diplomas. You said you have had a few weeks where all of "your colleges" have taken it in the shorts. Well, all of "my colleges" have been taking it in the shorts most every week for the past four years.

When they lose, it hurts. When they lose a lot, I hurt a lot. When they have a bad week, I have a bad week. That is the nature of being a fan - an emotional investment with the intent of drawing an emotional return. But the risk is that return may be negative. When that fire gets too hot for too long, you may need to step out for a while. Is it fair to my wife, my family and friends to be in a bad mood every weekend during the fall? I am not "defined" by a win-loss record, but I am defined by how I treat others. If you, though iron control, obliviousness, or some other mechanism, are able to steel yourself though the same fire that I feel, then I wilingly concede that you are a better man than I am. Your trophy is in the mail.

But please don't confuse, though intention or not, my stepping away from the table with abandoning the university. As you say, there are many facets and avenues of support that I might choose to explore. For the moment, though, none of them can be found on a football message board.

[houstonmeangreen]

Best and most under-rated post of the week. Perspective.

Thanks KRAM! Great post and points.

This is perspective....having supported the MG since the H fry days, I have many times been one of a few hundred, not thousands, of fans at a football game. I don't live and die by the football score of UNT....or UT and U of Neb where I also have degrees from, but after years of difficult seasons you just loose the energy to deal with the constant season disappointments....it wears you down. I am proud of the MG and UNT and only want the best for every aspect of UNT....that is why it pains me so much year in and year out....as we can most agree, being a unt fan is difficult and usually painful.

One thing is I will not spend the time and money to come to the games at UNT...my expectations are too low. I have cancelled airfares and eaten the tickets for Army games, navy games, etc once the season started because of the w/l record...it is no longer cheap to go to an away game (UNT home game) from Houston....it takes hours of your time and money....so this can change when I feel like it will not be just another disappointing weekend of college football hosted by the MG.

Just let me say that I am very happy about the new stadium, I thank RV has done a good job...but TD may prove to be a poor decision, I am proud of the football players...they do their best, I am happy for the students and know many will have a bright future as they travel thru life and I am sure things will change in the future....for the better.

I will be at the new stadium on opening weekend...that is for sure...God willing.

[Guest GrayEagleOne]

What about our esteemed college defensive coordinator?

You and P1 are very perceptive. Here are the national rankings for some major offensive/defensive categories:

OFFENSE

Scoring Offense.....75

Rushing Offense.....33

Passing Offense.....54

Total Offense.........37

First Downs............52

DEFENSE

Scoring Defense.....117

Rushing Defense......98

Passing Defense......104

Total Defense..........111

First Downs Allowed..108

We tend to let DeLoach off the hook because he had done so well when he was here before and this is only his second year back but the statistics speak for themselves. Furthermore, we've put up these numbers against our easiest schedule in several years.

My biggest concern with Dodge is does he know how to win and can he teach his players to win? The jury is still out on that one but we should begin to have the picture by season's end. I don't believe that he should be fired until then. He could still make substantial improvement this year although I haven't really seen any indicators except the improvement in talent.

Edited October 26, 2009 by GrayEagleOne

[SUMG]

I have held off voicing my opinion for a while, out of respect for the team and the job they were trying to accomplish. I held off because, somewhere, there was a tiny flicker of hope that I may have been completely wrong about this program: that maybe a .500 season wouldn't be out of the question. Last Saturday, after looking at the score, I discovered something truly disturbing.

I just didn't care.

Somewhere along the line, that tiny flame got snuffed out. I don't know if it was Troy in particular, or some other game where we found a way to lose in the final second. I don't know which demoralizing loss did it for me, or if it was even the net result of any game in particular. It may have been reading Ira Smith's comments about "it's going to be tough, but we are going to go to work" and knowing that this team has mentally checked out already. It may well have been the pervasive atmosphere of failure and despair this program has exuded for the latter half of this decade. Whatever the reason, my support, which had been on life support for years, finally flatlined.

At the beginning of this season, I decided not to renew my season tickets. The reason I used was that my wife and I recently moved into a new house, and we needed the money at home. While that was a good reason, I honestly could have come up with the money if it meant enough to me. Looking back, I believe I talked myself out of it because I was tired of getting kicked in the groin every single week for three years. I was tired of defending my school, and exhausted from getting up for each new season - finding the positivity when I knew there was none to be had.

It isn't that I don't want the best for North Texas - it will always be my school. It isn't as though I can just drop UNT and adopt another team (though, to my shame, I did actually try - I just couldn't do it). It is just that I hated feeling terrible all the time, with no end in sight - I simply ran out of faith. So, with my emotional investment withdrawn, there was nothing to sustain my financial investment.

Will North Texas ever find a way back to competitive play? Will the Administration find a way to whip this thing into shape? Will Coach Dodge find success here? I hope it does - I really only want what's best for the team. I just got tired of pretending the plate of manure in front of me tasted like ice cream.

Then if that's the way you really feel.....why are you still a moderator on a UNT sports fan message board? Or better question: Why is Harry keeping you on as a moderator if you no longer give a ?

Edited October 27, 2009 by illuvius32

[CaribbeanGreen]

Then if that's the way you really feel.....why are you still a moderator on a UNT sports fan message board? Or better question: Why is Harry keeping you on as a moderator if you no longer give a ?

Dropping a public S-bomb angrily at a mod = Pedro Cerrano Balls.

[shaft]

Then if that's the way you really feel.....why are you still a moderator on a UNT sports fan message board?

Because he's a fan, just not a stupid fan.

Dodge's hasn't given us anything to support.

I didn't approve of firing Dickey, so I with held support until I saw what Dodge could do. I haven't started giving again, and I won't until Dodge is gone.

[EagleMBA]

Illuvius, I sense your pain and frustration...been there...but only for short periods. Four or five days after the last game, I'm always ready for more and you will be too. I sense an opportunity for relief coming this weekend. If you are tired of taking it in the shorts, a little wKY should help!

[hickoryhouse]

Illuvius, I sense your pain and frustration...been there...but only for short periods. Four or five days after the last game, I'm always ready for more and you will be too. I sense an opportunity for relief coming this weekend. If you are tired of taking it in the shorts, a little wKY should help!

please please please please please..........

I sure hope so, there is no reason we should lose this game, but then again even without going to their board I know they are probably saying the same thing....

[mad dog]

Then if that's the way you really feel.....why are you still a moderator on a UNT sports fan message board? Or better question: Why is Harry keeping you on as a moderator if you no longer give a ?

Dunno... but I'll give you a while to think about it.