We Are All About Tradition

PerryG2480 · October 18, 2009

LMAO @ Todd Dodge telling Jub Jub that we just can't give a "team like them" a short field. You'd think we were playing Alabama again.

Censored by Laurie · October 18, 2009

Much better football team isn't saying much when we were by far the worst team possibly in history of college football the last 2 seasons.
Winning can just happen. See other teams in similar or worse conditions than when Dodge arrived : La Tech , Idaho ..

So whats the solution? Do tell me. I see a football team that is a few plays away from being 4-2...and I see 90% of the significant players on the participation report with a Fr., So., or Jr. next to their name. I see a team that I'm so excited about that I'll pass on friend's party's, drinks with the cute girls and trips to NYC to watch on my computer solo b/c I think that a coach who I was ready to kick out before the season has this thing headed in the right direction finally and turning heartbreaking losses into wins is right around the corner.

Should we have hired a high school coach? No. Did we? Yes. Did Dodge look competent in his first 2 years? No. Does he now? Yes. Can we take back those first 2 years? No. But since we stuck with him during his learning curve, shouldn't he be given a chance to do perform now that he knows the college game. Yes.

Want to toss Dodge out? Who are we getting? And how we paying for it? And how long does he get to install his system, and players...and how long till we want to fire him

NT03 · October 18, 2009

So whats the solution? Do tell me. I see a football team that is a few plays away from being 4-2...and I see 90% of the significant players on the participation report with a Fr., So., or Jr. next to their name. I see a team that I'm so excited about that I'll pass on friend's party's, drinks with the cute girls and trips to NYC to watch on my computer solo b/c I think that a coach who I was ready to kick out before the season has this thing headed in the right direction finally and turning heartbreaking losses into wins is right around the corner.
Should we have hired a high school coach? No. Did we? Yes. Did Dodge look competent in his first 2 years? No. Does he now? Yes. Can we take back those first 2 years? No. But since we stuck with him during his learning curve, shouldn't he be given a chance to do perform now that he knows the college game. Yes.
Want to toss Dodge out? Who are we getting? And how we paying for it? And how long does he get to install his system, and players...and how long till we want to fire him

Calm down and take a drink. We are all f'n pissed. I heart u , I always have

I never said we should get rid of him , because he will be here this year and next no matter what. My point is winning can happen at this level and I don't buy into any excuses one may have. When Dooley can take a LaTech team to a bowl game in his 1st year winning can happen. When f'n Idaho is wrecking shop with a 1st year ( maybe 2nd.. i don't know) winning can happen.

We are in year 3 and happy with heartbreaking losses to conferences opponents ? I think everyone has a right to be pissed , I mean it's 4 - 26 and we got Troy next week so 4 - 27. Dodge needs win NOW to impress recruits and fans. The more he does not win , the further we dig our hole. We will be even better next year , but I can bet every other team in the belt feels the exact same way. Things have to get better because there is no way in hell we can open up a new stadium with another new coach and new system with another coach's players

Edited October 18, 2009 by illuvius32

UNT90 · October 18, 2009

The worst coached team in college football.

Bar none.

When does it get better? When is the learning curve going to be completed?

This is a bad defensive team. 30, 24, 30... that's the points scored on this defense in the FIRST HALF of every Sun Belt game. They can't pressure the QB and are still awful in pass defense.

I don't know the answer, but I am beginning to wonder if we will win 3 games NEXT year. I see us beating WKU, and thats it the rest of this year.

Got5onIt · October 18, 2009

So whats the solution? Do tell me. I see a football team that is a few plays away from being 4-2...and I see 90% of the significant players on the participation report with a Fr., So., or Jr. next to their name. I see a team that I'm so excited about that I'll pass on friend's party's, drinks with the cute girls and trips to NYC to watch on my computer solo b/c I think that a coach who I was ready to kick out before the season has this thing headed in the right direction finally and turning heartbreaking losses into wins is right around the corner.
Should we have hired a high school coach? No. Did we? Yes. Did Dodge look competent in his first 2 years? No. Does he now? Yes. Can we take back those first 2 years? No. But since we stuck with him during his learning curve, shouldn't he be given a chance to do perform now that he knows the college game. Yes.
Want to toss Dodge out? Who are we getting? And how we paying for it? And how long does he get to install his system, and players...and how long till we want to fire him

3 years is enough time, IMO, for any coach at this level to show something. RV royally screwed this up by hiring a coach who's had to learn this game at this level at our expense. Yes, the team isn't losing 40-0, yes the talent level has improved, yes NT has a new stadium coming IN SPITE OF DODGE. not because of him. But, if we're all in agreement that the talent level is equal on the field then why is this team still only sporting 1 win in 6 tries during year 3? Who's out there? Troy's old head coach, Kragthorpe, maybe, any number of d1 assistants who have the experience. But you're right, the question is how will NT pay them? RV handcuffed the school with a ridiculous 5 year deal.

As for system, look at NMSU. They went to a pro style offense and have transitioned well. They were 2-2 until tonight's thrashing. The spread offense is a staple in college football. I don't think the "transition" will be an issue with this team.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · October 18, 2009

Same old piss poor playcalling does it again 4th and 7 screen to RB for a loss. Nice try players too bad the coaches did not help you with playcalling

Got to admit that as well as Tune was throwing it downfield, I was surprised by that call. But, Dunbar had been running well...so well that FAU's defense obviously keyed on him for that play.

Here's an old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old, old football idea: Have a tight end you can go to in these situations. :ph34r:

Edited October 18, 2009 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

UNT_playmaker · October 18, 2009

Mr favorite Qb we have had since Scott Hall and Andrew Smith was Woody Wilson, I had really high expectations for him and how well he played in the much hyped UNT-SMU matchup at Fouts, that fool could run the ball and pass and not give the ball away into turnovers

Oh well, we never really had much luck in the QB department in years

Green P1 · October 18, 2009

So whats the solution? Do tell me. I see a football team that is a few plays away from being 4-2...and I see 90% of the significant players on the participation report with a Fr., So., or Jr. next to their name. I see a team that I'm so excited about that I'll pass on friend's party's, drinks with the cute girls and trips to NYC to watch on my computer solo b/c I think that a coach who I was ready to kick out before the season has this thing headed in the right direction finally and turning heartbreaking losses into wins is right around the corner.
Should we have hired a high school coach? No. Did we? Yes. Did Dodge look competent in his first 2 years? No. Does he now? ~~Yes~~ Almost. Can we take back those first 2 years? No. But since we stuck with him during his learning curve, shouldn't he be given a chance to do perform now that he knows the college game. Yes.
Want to toss Dodge out? Who are we getting? And how we paying for it? And how long does he get to install his system, and players...and how long till we want to fire him

This. With one slight modification.

GoMeanGreen1999 · October 18, 2009

...for this coaching staff.
The Dodge era is the worst in school history.
It's time to end the high school experiment.

You may be upset at the end of the year, because this team could lose out and Dodge is coming back for his fourth and probably fifth years.

shaft · October 18, 2009

So whats the solution?

At the very least Dodge should be put on notice.

Dodge should be dismissed has head coach if he does not produce a winning record next season (2010).

If this team doesn't win two more games this season, Dodge should be dismissed at the end of this season (2009).

Edited October 18, 2009 by shaft

yyz28 · October 18, 2009

and the student section will leave after halftime

Yawn. Don't put this on the Students. I was on that side, and the Alumni side lost at least 50% of the crowd at halftime as well. :rolleyes:

yyz28 · October 18, 2009

This is a bad defensive team.

This is NOT a bad defensive team. They had a TERRIBLE night, but you can't call the team that came in there tonight, ranked #1 in the belt, BAD.

I know we're all frustrated, and this losing by one score at the end thing will be the story of this season, but let's slow down a bit. The defense has been MUCH better this year and until last night played well enough to be the best defense in our league. ...and frankly, when you look at the second half, you can really only say the defense was bad for one half.

Everyone tries to find the problem and point a finger at it. This isn't Todd Dodge's Fault. This isn't Riley's fault. This isn't the fault of the rest of the coaching staff. This isn't the fault of the defense or DeLoach. ...this is a lot of little problems with all of the above listed items and a few that aren't listed that when combined are giving us the same result.

This team CAN win. This team IS competitive. This team HAS made major strides since last year. If you're paying any attention and can get the anger and frustration goggles off you'll see that.

I'm PROUD of this team, from top to bottom. The learning curve hasn't been as steep as we all want, and further adjustments need to be made, but we're in the ballgame, which is a pretty huge change from last year. Let's give credit where credit is due, and let's not call part of our team BAD which really isn't.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · October 18, 2009

This is NOT a bad defensive team. They had a TERRIBLE night, but you can't call the team that came in there tonight, ranked #1 in the belt, BAD.

Would you agree that we need a new secondary coach? I posted last week that we should move the secondary coach, Chuck Petersen, to the offensive side of the ball, where he spent 17 seasons at Air Force as WR coach, then offensive coordinator/QB coach. Then, hire in a good safeties coach in his place to team with Carlton Buckels. I've never really understood why Petersen, an offensive coach for the meat of his career, was brought in to coach on the other side of the ball.

untcampbell · October 18, 2009

Fake, serious question for you:

Do you subscribe to the philosophy that if a team is losing, it is only the coach's fault?

You have been anti-Dodge since day one, even when he didn't have the talent to compete (my opinion).

Now, I think most agree that our talent pool has been upgraded. Tonight, the secondary plays off the receivers more than anytime this season (except maybe Alabama). And you want the Secondary coach's head.

Leads me to a couple of other serious inquiries:

** Why do these kids that are contributing to the upgrade in talent want to come play for such "bad" coaches?

** Why have we suddenly opened up the "transfer pipeline?"

** We acknowledge it is ok for referees to make bad calls, but not coaches? We accept players that make bad penalties, throws and fumbles, but coaches can't call the wrong play every once in a while (and I do disagree with the screen call in that situation)? Do the coaches hold fumbling drills during practice so the players will be better at it, coach players to make penalties at untimely moments, drill interception into our QB's heads or encourage poor route running?

Saying all of that, I have to admit to you Fake, 4-26 is becoming increasingly incredulous to see. Makes it awfully hard to be Mr Positive.

But, what the hell,

GMG

Keith7 · October 18, 2009

Dodge should have traded for Tony Gonzalez in the offseason

TheTastyGreek · October 18, 2009

Fake, serious question for you:
Do you subscribe to the philosophy that if a team is losing, it is only the coach's fault?
You have been anti-Dodge since day one, even when he didn't have the talent to compete (my opinion).
Now, I think most agree that our talent pool has been upgraded. Tonight, the secondary plays off the receivers more than anytime this season (except maybe Alabama). And you want the Secondary coach's head.
Leads me to a couple of other serious inquiries:
** Why do these kids that are contributing to the upgrade in talent want to come play for such "bad" coaches?
** Why have we suddenly opened up the "transfer pipeline?"
** We acknowledge it is ok for referees to make bad calls, but not coaches? We accept players that make bad penalties, throws and fumbles, but coaches can't call the wrong play every once in a while (and I do disagree with the screen call in that situation)? Do the coaches hold fumbling drills during practice so the players will be better at it, coach players to make penalties at untimely moments, drill interception into our QB's heads or encourage poor route running?
Saying all of that, I have to admit to you Fake, 4-26 is becoming increasingly incredulous to see. Makes it awfully hard to be Mr Positive.
But, what the hell,
GMG

He doesn't want Petersen fired. He's said from the beginning that Petersen is one of the best and most qualified coaches on the staff... But that it's a little odd we've taken a career offensive coach and decided to put him on the defensive side of the ball. Doesn't seem to be the best use of the man's talent and expertise.

UNT90 · October 18, 2009

This is NOT a bad defensive team. They had a TERRIBLE night, but you can't call the team that came in there tonight, ranked #1 in the belt, BAD.
I know we're all frustrated, and this losing by one score at the end thing will be the story of this season, but let's slow down a bit. The defense has been MUCH better this year and until last night played well enough to be the best defense in our league. ...and frankly, when you look at the second half, you can really only say the defense was bad for one half.
Everyone tries to find the problem and point a finger at it. This isn't Todd Dodge's Fault. This isn't Riley's fault. This isn't the fault of the rest of the coaching staff. This isn't the fault of the defense or DeLoach. ...this is a lot of little problems with all of the above listed items and a few that aren't listed that when combined are giving us the same result.
This team CAN win. This team IS competitive. This team HAS made major strides since last year. If you're paying any attention and can get the anger and frustration goggles off you'll see that.
I'm PROUD of this team, from top to bottom. The learning curve hasn't been as steep as we all want, and further adjustments need to be made, but we're in the ballgame, which is a pretty huge change from last year. Let's give credit where credit is due, and let's not call part of our team BAD which really isn't.

Talk to me after Troy and Ark St. They both may hang well over half a hundred on us. Lets look at the evidence.

Ball St. - Horrible team with 8 or 9 new starters on offense playing their 1st game when we played them.

Ohio - Played in monsoon which effectively eliminated Ohio's passing game.

Alabama - terrible, but expected

MTSU - 30 points by halftime. Against a QB that couldn't hit wide open receivers if they were more than 10 yards downfield.

ULL - Didn't see the game, but anytime you give up 2 TD drives in the 4th to lose the game, not good.

FAU - 30 points by halftime. Against an 0 - 4 team that may be the 3rd worst in our conference.

As for the best yardage defense in the league, I think that you will find that we don't hold that position after last night's game. I know we won't by the end of the year. The D has improved against the run, but still can't get pressure on the QB which exposes the secondary.

I really don't know how you defend this unit after last night. When your offense scores 40, your supposed to win. Period.

Edited October 18, 2009 by UNT90

GoMeanGreen1999 · October 19, 2009

I've never really understood why Petersen, an offensive coach for the meat of his career, was brought in to coach on the other side of the ball.

In all seriousness, what does this coaching staff do that makes much sense at all? I am right there with you - never made much sense to me either.

Fake, serious question for you:
Do you subscribe to the philosophy that if a team is losing, it is only the coach's fault?

when you win 4 out of your first 30 games, what isn't his fault? Schools will shake their head in amazement next year when we bring him back for a fourth year after a 5-31 start.

untjim1995 · October 19, 2009

So whats the solution? Do tell me. I see a football team that is a few plays away from being 4-2...and I see 90% of the significant players on the participation report with a Fr., So., or Jr. next to their name. I see a team that I'm so excited about that I'll pass on friend's party's, drinks with the cute girls and trips to NYC to watch on my computer solo b/c I think that a coach who I was ready to kick out before the season has this thing headed in the right direction finally and turning heartbreaking losses into wins is right around the corner.
Should we have hired a high school coach? No. Did we? Yes. Did Dodge look competent in his first 2 years? No. Does he now? Yes. Can we take back those first 2 years? No. But since we stuck with him during his learning curve, shouldn't he be given a chance to do perform now that he knows the college game. Yes.
Want to toss Dodge out? Who are we getting? And how we paying for it? And how long does he get to install his system, and players...and how long till we want to fire him

CBL and I are completely on the same page concerning the current state of our program. The improvement is drastic, but there are no wins with it--that is just how amazingly poor we were last year. If that's Dodge's fault, I won't argue, but the AD cannot fire him. There is just no money for our AD to do this. I have heard about this re-shuffling the deck in the AD and moving Dodge to some other position, but I just don't see Dodge leaving to go be a high school coach again and somehow saving the AD $$$. More likely is the case where we are paying two coaches at the same time, which we did with Dickey--while he was also the OC at Utah State. How did that work out for us when it came time for Dodge to get assistants? We got a bunch of high school coaches. Like it or not, Dodge will be here this year and next year. The new stadium should be able to provide enough revenue streams to allow us to buyout one year of Dodge's contract and get us a new coach to enter the 2011 season. But buying out two years or more isn't gonna happen--unless we just don't win another game this year AND lots of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ are found to make the change.

shaft · October 19, 2009

But we can't afford to keep Dodge.

If Dodge isn't going to see year 5 and the new stadium, then why suffer through Dodge year 4?

This team might go 3-9 this season only to maybe go 5-7 next season. Why open the stadium with a new coach and suffer through 3 more rebuilding years?

Fire Dodge in two weeks and get a new coach in here by December to start building towards the year we open the stadium.

untbowler · October 19, 2009

But we can't afford to keep Dodge.
If Dodge isn't going to see year 5 and the new stadium, then why suffer through Dodge year 4?
This team might go 3-9 this season only to maybe go 5-7 next season. Why open the stadium with a new coach and suffer through 3 more rebuilding years?
Fire Dodge in two weeks and get a new coach in here by December to start building towards the year we open the stadium.

Give it up, Dodge will be back next season.

Has he improved, in many ways, but he can not coach them to a win. Are the supporters going to be happy going 2-10 or 1-11 this year, while blowing 5-6 wins with bone-head penalties, sucktastic Kicking, and conservative playcalling with a 4Q lead? Well seems like consensus is yes, Mean Green Fans are happy with moral victories and are content to wait yet another year for the glorified recruits to hit the field, if they actually ever get on the field. UNT has a bad track record of getting their "studs" onto the field.

UNTLifer · October 19, 2009

Would you agree that we need a new secondary coach? I posted last week that we should move the secondary coach, Chuck Petersen, to the offensive side of the ball, where he spent 17 seasons at Air Force as WR coach, then offensive coordinator/QB coach. Then, hire in a good safeties coach in his place to team with Carlton Buckels. I've never really understood why Petersen, an offensive coach for the meat of his career, was brought in to coach on the other side of the ball.

There's a solution. Put a coach that has a history of coaching offense in a option/running scheme in charge of a position on the offensive side of the ball for a team that runs the "spread." Why are you ignoring the special teams play? Talk about costing us the game. Knox is a disaster. How he was ever a JUCO All-American is beyond me.

I'm still waiting for the fire Deloach, Nelson, etc... posts from you since our coaches on the other side of the ball produced 40 points. You pounded your chest over the Nelson hiring when the meat of his credentials were coaching at Iowa State, always the threat to win the Big XII and play in a BCS bowl.

I couldn't be in more agreement with CBL. If you can't see the improvement in this team this year then you are blind. After watching the Rice game last year, I'm shocked the team is as competitive as it is this year. That team was lost. This team is on the right track and I think can win 5 games this year. They will be bowl eligible next near.

Let's see, first it was "fire the high school coaches," now it is "move Peterson to the offense and hire a good safeties coach." What will it be when the youngsters back there start clicking?

What happened to your leave from this board? Idle threat? The Tulsa fans run you off? Did you stay till the end Saturday night, or pack up and leave early?

untbowler · October 19, 2009

There's a solution. Put a coach that has a history of coaching offense in a option/running scheme in charge of a position on the offensive side of the ball for a team that runs the "spread." Why are you ignoring the special teams play? Talk about costing us the game. Knox is a disaster. How he was ever a JUCO All-American is beyond me.
I'm still waiting for the fire Deloach, Nelson, etc... posts from you since our coaches on the other side of the ball produced 40 points. You pounded your chest over the Nelson hiring when the meat of his credentials were coaching at Iowa State, always the threat to win the Big XII and play in a BCS bowl.
I couldn't be in more agreement with CBL. If you can't see the improvement in this team this year then you are blind. After watching the Rice game last year, I'm shocked the team is as competitive as it is this year. That team was lost. This team is on the right track and I think can win 5 games this year. They will be bowl eligible next near.
Let's see, first it was "fire the high school coaches," now it is "move Peterson to the offense and hire a good safeties coach." What will it be when the youngsters back there start clicking?
What happened to your leave from this board? Idle threat? The Tulsa fans run you off? Did you stay till the end Saturday night, or pack up and leave early?

Go get a room so you can continue your personal vendetta elsewhere.

As for the rest, why should we remain content with moral victories. Yeah we have blown 3 fourth quarter leads!!! The only records that counts are W/L's which we do not have. I am resigned to the fact dodge is back for Year 4 but he sure as hell have us bowl bound by then.

GoMeanGreen1999 · October 19, 2009

That team was lost. This team is on the right track and I think can win 5 games this year. They will be bowl eligible next near.

Seriously? 5 wins this year? So this team that has only won 4 out of its last 30 is going to turn it around in the next 6 games and go 4-2? Who are we going to beat? Why not 6-0?

untjim1995 · October 19, 2009

But we can't afford to keep Dodge.
If Dodge isn't going to see year 5 and the new stadium, then why suffer through Dodge year 4?
This team might go 3-9 this season only to maybe go 5-7 next season. Why open the stadium with a new coach and suffer through 3 more rebuilding years?
Fire Dodge in two weeks and get a new coach in here by December to start building towards the year we open the stadium.

Here are my simple questions for you: where do you get the money to pull this off and how do you get off saying that we cannot afford Dodge? First of all, in three of the worst seasons that our alma mater has faced, our attendance is way higher than it ever would have been under Dickey or Simon and its not even close. This is as much a reason as any that we only have one $$ game on the schedule. Secondly, the trouble with your scenario is that a financial problem is hard to overcome--as in, we pay said coach $250K a year and his contract is for 5 years. He is in his third year, meaning he has money due to him for the remainder of said contract--or two years, if you will. If we fire said coach at the end of this year, we owe him $500K, unless you settle with him for less (say he walks for $350K if he leaves now.) However, Dodge doesn't seem like an idiot when it comes to money, as he knows that in this economy, a high school job might pay $100-125K somewhere, at the most. So the chances of him settling for anything less is almost nil.

But, in your scenario, we fire him. You know, we, as in UNT, that famously rich school that has an abundance of $$ that they just throw at the Athletic Department. Oh wait--I meant UT, not UNT, where we have almost no money whatsoever and are trying to figure out a way to LOWER COSTS so as to still build a new stadium. If we fired Dodge at the end of the year, we will have to pay for 2 more years of his salary (roughly $500K) then go and pay a new coach. Now I guess you can go hire another high school coach, or an unknown assistant/head coach from Division 2 or NAIA, but that person will still require a salary--probably around $200K or so, at the minimum. As I have said before, when the other Texas schools pay their coaches at least 3x what we will pay, I can't see a scenario where that works out too well, i.e., similar to what we have witnessed for the last 5 years for sure. So, yeah, like him or not, Dodge stays here for year 4, unless someone finds a ton of cash and wants him fired--it has to be both, too, not either or. You answer those, then we can talk about possibilities at the end of the year.