Constructive Criticism

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

For better or worse, we're stuck with Todd Dodge for the remainder of this season. We're probably stuck with him for 2010 as well.

Many of us said before the season that the defense and special teams would be the saving grace of this team in 2009, if there was to be any saving at all. For the most part, that has been (predictably) true. But, even with the mistakes they made on Saturday, we'd have still won if the offense wasn't such a crapshoot!

All the offense needs is some real direction. I know many of you are emotionally tied to the high school guys that Todd Dodge brought with him, as well as to his son. But, based on what is happening, you have to be realistic. The defense and special teams have gotten markedly better under experienced coaching. The offense would do the same with experience leadership; and, we already have those parts on board.

We have SMU talk on the message board today. What is it that is different about SMU and June Jones is his second year that is different than Todd Dodge last year? Well, honestly, it's the overall experience of the coaching staff. It's that way everywhere, fellas.

Bo Levi Mitchell ain't that great. But, he's got coaches on his side of the ball that have the whole unit ready. They've taken "another coach's players" and made them successful in their scheme. Yes, it can be done. This has been talked to death for the past two years in countless threads - new coaches can win immediately with "other people's players."

Todd Dodge needed to take Naughty By Nature's advice and be O.P.P. hip from the very start. But, he didn't...and he wasn't. June Jones is down with O.P.P. and is doing well with it...just like the countless examples of others before (Mack at Texas, Stoops at OU, Kragthorpe at Tulsa, Graham at Rice, etc., etc., etc.).

Those of us who have talked about having high school coaches being a detriment have long been labeled "negative nancies" and other such garbage. But, the truth is the truth. We are going to have about the same talent as every other Sun Belt school no matter who the head coach is. The difference is what happens once those guys are on campus. If they are to develop at all, they have to have coaches who know how to do it.

Football up here simply isn't the same as football at the high school level. The same as NFL football isn't the same as football down here in college. Todd Dodge has got to see it by now. He's drizzled off a high school coach every offseason so far. This year he needs to drizzle off two.

If I were Todd Dodge, these would be my offseason moves:

(1) Ford and George, gone

(2) Move Chuck Peterson back to offensive side of the ball, where he spent 17 years at Air Force as its receivers coach, then QB coach and offensive coordinator. Give him the title, co-offensive coordinator/pass game coordinator

(3) Elevate Spencer Leftwich to co-offensive coordinator/run game coordinator

(4) Elevate Gary DeLoach to full assitant head coach, and give him and Mike Nelson co-defensive coordinator roles

(5) Elevate Shelton Gandy, our best recruiter, to recruiting coordinator, freeing up Peterson who will have more duties already as Pass Game OC.

(6) Elevate Carlton Buckels to secondary coach

(7) Hire a safeties coach

(8) Hire a receivers coach

(9) Sign a JUCO QB with height, size and a long ball arm to compete immediately for the starting QB job

(10) Sign a prep QB with height, size and a long ball arm to compete immediately for the starting QB job

(11) Move Riley to back-up QB/WR ala Ryan Tannehill at Texas A&M

Why move Peterson? Peterson's strengths and experience are not on the defensive side of the ball. We're five games into 2009 and only have two interceptions - both by the same player, Royce Hill...a cornerback under the charge of Carlton Buckels. That isn't much better than the past two seasons. Put Peterson back in his natural coaching position. He's got a ton more experience coordinating offenses and developing QBs and WRs at this level...and lot more than George, Ford, and Dodge combined. Put it to use.

Swallow your pride and go look at how many interceptions SMU has this year. I'll save you the time: through five games they've got 13...10 by the secondary. They are coached by Derrick Odum, who coached safeties at Utah before June Jones hired him. His best pupil at Utah - current San Diego Charger Eric Weddle. Odum was also secondary coach for Art Briles at Houston in 2003 and 2004, before going back to coach at his alma mater, Utah.

Our front seven is doing well under Nelson and Deloach. The secondary is okay. It would do better with Buckels in charge with an experienced safeties coach helping.

The coaching moves shouldn't bust the budget because you are hiring in position coaches, not coordinators. You lose two and hire two, while putting the rest where they belong. Getting a bona fide trigger man at QB would back off opposing defenses for good, every game.

If Todd Dodge does all eleven of those things, I personally guarantee that North Texas will beat Kansas State next year as well as Army and Rice, and will hang with Clemson the entire game. And, I will also guarantee that if he makes no changes at all to his coaching staff, and doesn't have a real difference maker at QB in 2010, we could easily be 0-4 against a very favorable out of conference schedule.

Of course...these changes would mean Todd Dodge swallowing his pride as well. If he can do that, the biggest learning curve of all will have been attained...you can't be cowboy in 21st century college football.

Edited October 12, 2009 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

[Stan R]

Agree with pretty much everything except the Riley to WR/backup QB comment. I'm not totally against doing that I'd just like to give RD the rest of the season to see how his turnover tendencies improve/worsen. Also would a new OC help with that via playcalling, keeping RD out of situations where he would be more likely to throw the pic?

So let me ask this. Are you against Riley because of the turnovers or because you just don't think he can ever accurately throw the long ball? Or a combination of the long ball and injury prone-ness? Personally I have real concerns about him holding up over the long term. I think we can't afford to lose the continuity if every year you can expect him to be out 3-4 games due to some injury. To aggravate things, he's a running QB who puts himself in situations to get injured even more. I don't like the long term prospects, but I love his speed as a WR/DB. Call me a blasphemer I guess.

[LongJim]

Many of us said before the season that the defense and special teams would be the saving grace of this team in 2009, if there was to be any saving at all. For the most part, that has been (predictably) true. But, even with the mistakes they made on Saturday, we'd have still won if the offense wasn't such a crapshoot!

If you're going to make this argument, please be honest about it. The offense did it's job Saturday. They gave up 10 points in much the same manner that the defense and special teams did--mental blunders--but they did enough to win the ballgame. You have a 10 point lead with less than 10 minutes left in the 4th. You cannot say that the defense and special teams played well enough to win Saturday. They simply did not by any stretch of the imagination. They folded like an origami dragon when they could least afford to. Magical college coaches did not make any difference.

Our front seven is doing well under Nelson and Deloach. The secondary is okay. It would do better with Buckels in charge with an experienced safeties coach helping.

Possibly. I don't disagree that it's much better in all areas.

If Todd Dodge does all eleven of those things, I personally guarantee that North Texas will beat Kansas State next year as well as Army and Rice, and will hang with Clemson the entire game. And, I will also guarantee that if he makes no changes at all to his coaching staff, and doesn't have a real difference maker at QB in 2010, we could easily be 0-4 against a very favorable out of conference schedule.

You're hedging your bet because you know RD will be playing QB next year. What do you predict with all coaches gone and Riley still at QB? 2-2? At the SBC/MAC/CUSA level, RD is a difference maker, IMO.

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

Agree with pretty much everything except the Riley to WR/backup QB comment. I'm not totally against doing that I'd just like to give RD the rest of the season to see how his turnover tendencies improve/worsen. Also would a new OC help with that via playcalling, keeping RD out of situations where he would be more likely to throw the pic?

So let me ask this. Are you against Riley because of the turnovers or because you just don't think he can ever accurately throw the long ball? Or a combination of the long ball and injury prone-ness? Personally I have real concerns about him holding up over the long term. I think we can't afford to lose the continuity if every year you can expect him to be out 3-4 games due to some injury. To aggravate things, he's a running QB who puts himself in situations to get injured even more. I don't like the long term prospects, but I love his speed as a WR/DB. Call me a blasphemer I guess.

I'm not "against Riley"...I'm for good, consistent quarterbacking.

You already list the reasons for replacing him:

(1) He turns the ball over

(2) He's not a long ball threat

(3) His injury history

(4) His athleticism would better serve the team at another position

The interceptions hurt, but so do the fumbles. He still carries the ball "like a loaf of bread." The interceptions, I think, are simply a factor of his size. He's not 6' as listed. And, this sin't 1983 when players were smaller, so the Doug Flutie mentions are worthless. If he could see over the line, they wouldn't have to roll him out and do all of this other stuff without his feet planted. And, he wouldn't be making risky throws.

Look, you're either got a long ball arm or you don't. He doesn't. You need to at least have the threat of it. Teams have figured out already that he doesn't have it and have adjusted their defenses accordingly.

The injuries. Just look at Saturday night. His left arm and his ankles are wrapped. I mean, what's the point? The kid is seven games into his career and all of that. Seriously. At some point, you sit down and look at the long term health of the player. He's only going to be a college football player for four years. After that, he's going to live a life off the field. What quality of life would you want him to have? Permanently dazed from concussions? Hobbling around in his 40s like Earl Campbell and Jim Otto?

You put guys where they can help the team the most. Because of the way Todd Dodge has handled QBs (recruiting and otherwise), we're kind of stuck with Riley right now. But, you can dip down and get a JUCO guy at QB right away. Look at Josh Heupel in 1999 at OU. They didn't have jack at QB. Stoops came in assessed the situation and Mike Leach found Heupel - a JUCO guy who wasn't even the full-time starter. He was splitting time at his JUCO with another QB!

The people who argue that, 'well, Riley would take hits at receiver, too.' Well, yes...but, not on every play or even every other play. Plus, with his athleticism, he'd likely not take too many direct hits at receiver. At QB, he's hit from all angles, sometimes not knowing it's coming so he can't prepare for it. A reciever can often prepare for a hit and, for lack of better word, dodge it and not take it directly. As I've said before, I'd love to see him returning punts and kicks as well. It's not that the kid isn't hardnosed. He is. But, his body just isn't there. And, for some reason, it seems to be sinful to admit that. Too much emotion is wrapped up in it for some people to even discuss.

[NT03]

I'm all for hiring a new OC

Signing a JUCO QB

Letting Char do some recruiting , players really like him

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

You're hedging your bet because you know RD will be playing QB next year. What do you predict with all coaches gone and Riley still at QB? 2-2? At the SBC/MAC/CUSA level, RD is a difference maker, IMO.

I don't see it. There's not going to be another coach, so he's going to be in there. If there were a whole new coaching staff - including head coach - I doubt he'd stay anyway. He didn't commit to us in the first place. He came to play for his dad. If his dad went, I'd bet he would go as well.

In any case, a new coach would have a different philosophy. Other than Colorado, another father-son coach-QB combo, I don't really see any other 5-9, 5-10/190ish QBs anywhere. A new coach would bring in a JUCO kid or two, sign a couple of preps, and let them battle it out. That needs to happen here - even under Todd Dodge...but, I doubt it will. It's too bad, too, because we'll waste a very experienced O-line this year and next on inconsistent QB play.

I've eaten alot of almonds and, so, I'm feeling healthy and full.

[LongJim]

I don't see it. There's not going to be another coach, so he's going to be in there. If there were a whole new coaching staff - including head coach - I doubt he'd stay anyway. He didn't commit to us in the first place. He came to play for his dad. If his dad went, I'd bet he would go as well.

In any case, a new coach would have a different philosophy. Other than Colorado, another father-son coach-QB combo, I don't really see any other 5-9, 5-10/190ish QBs anywhere. A new coach would bring in a JUCO kid or two, sign a couple of preps, and let them battle it out. That needs to happen here - even under Todd Dodge...but, I doubt it will. It's too bad, too, because we'll waste a very experienced O-line this year and next on inconsistent QB play.

You don't see it. So you're saying 2-2 then?

I've eaten alot of almonds and, so, I'm feeling healthy and full.

They're good for you.

[NTEX1990]

part of the issue here is trying to let riley continue to make big plays. Saturday night our running game was killin em and that should have been the ONLY thing we continued to focus on. That seems to be the biggest issue here, thinking your son is more valuable than what he really is. Riley is good, but he is not Tim tebow or someone that will put his team on the shoulders and carry them to victory --- at least on a consistent basis

[Green P1]

The injuries. Just look at Saturday night. His left arm and his ankles are wrapped. I mean, what's the point? The kid is seven games into his career and all of that. Seriously. At some point, you sit down and look at the long term health of the player. He's only going to be a college football player for four years. After that, he's going to live a life off the field. What quality of life would you want him to have? Permanently dazed from concussions? Hobbling around in his 40s like Earl Campbell and Jim Otto?

Now you're really getting creative with your arguments against Rodge.

[TIgreen01]

TFLF, have you watched the games or just looked at box scores? Serious question.

I don't know that you can just move a player like Riley from QB to WR/DB b/c his greatest strength is his leadership. At QB, you maximize the impact he has. He will get better with the interceptions. I do agree that we need to recruit some QBs in here asap, though---b/c in a running spread offense, your QB is an injury risk---no matter how big/small he is.

[GoMeanGreen1999]

If you're going to make this argument, please be honest about it. The offense did it's job Saturday. They gave up 10 points in much the same manner that the defense and special teams did--mental blunders--but they did enough to win the ballgame. You have a 10 point lead with less than 10 minutes left in the 4th. You cannot say that the defense and special teams played well enough to win Saturday. They simply did not by any stretch of the imagination. They folded like an origami dragon when they could least afford to. Magical college coaches did not make any difference.

Possibly. I don't disagree that it's much better in all areas.

You're hedging your bet because you know RD will be playing QB next year. What do you predict with all coaches gone and Riley still at QB? 2-2? At the SBC/MAC/CUSA level, RD is a difference maker, IMO.

I think the defense played well enough to win. The INT for 6 and the blocked punt for 6 were not their fault. Take away those and we win. The thing that bothers me about our offense is that is seems to have very little flow. Do we not have passing plays to the center of the field? It seems like most of our passing game is towards the sidelines.

Riley doesn't bother me. As I posted in another thread, his numbers in terms of INT's and TD's are almost spot on with where Vizza was this early in his career. I just think it is going to take him some time to adjust. I do think he probably gives you the best option to win only because he is more familiar with the offense than say Baine is.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

--This year may not be what I hoped to see, but it is lightyears better than what we had last year.

[Quoner]

TFLF, have you watched the games or just looked at box scores? Serious question.

If there's box scores that break down which body parts of players are taped, I want a copy.

[GoMeanGreen1999]

I definately think we need a new OC for next year. I am officially on this bandwagon: Here is a good option at the end of the season:

http://www.uoflsports.com/sports/m-footbl/...pe_steve00.html

[LongJim]

The INT for 6 and the blocked punt for 6 were not their fault.

No one's arguing otherwise.

Take away those and we win.

Make the stops/don't make the penalty on 4th and we win. Punt the football 35 yards and we win. It's always OPP--(right Lonnie?)--other people's problems.

It's the entire team's problem, and throwing the offense under the bus isn't going to solve it.

[FloMoGrad]

--This year may not be what I hoped to see, but it is lightyears better than what we had last year.

Spot on!

Last year was disheartening, this year leaves me more optimistic... We're two plays away from being 3-2....Let that sink in for a moment...

Call it what you will, but losing close games and heartbreaking losses will make these kids stronger and teach them how to close out games, which we had several chances to do with both Ohio and ULaLa...

[Will to Win]

We need Coach Dodge to call plays or get a new O.C. now.

Play Jeremy Phillips and take out #44 on passing downs.

Riley telegraphing where he is going to throw.

Nathan Tune has a stronger arm, lets have a QB rotation during games.

Please fix our DL and have those guys ready and set 2 seconds before the snap instead of right after the snap.

[TIgreen01]

If there's box scores that break down which body parts of players are taped, I want a copy.

touche.

[Mean Green 93-98]

I definately think we need a new OC for next year. I am officially on this bandwagon: Here is a good option at the end of the season:

http://www.uoflsports.com/sports/m-footbl/...pe_steve00.html

I don't think it's very realistic, but that would be an incredible hire at OC.

[GoMeanGreen1999]

I don't think it's very realistic, but that would be an incredible hire at OC.

Maybe not, but maybe there is one out in Abilene that would fit....

[untgeorge]

I don't think it's very realistic, but that would be an incredible hire at OC.

Better hire at HC.

[UNT90]

The injuries. Just look at Saturday night. His left arm and his ankles are wrapped. I mean, what's the point? The kid is seven games into his career and all of that. Seriously. At some point, you sit down and look at the long term health of the player. He's only going to be a college football player for four years. After that, he's going to live a life off the field. What quality of life would you want him to have? Permanently dazed from concussions? Hobbling around in his 40s like Earl Campbell and Jim Otto?

You put guys where they can help the team the most. Because of the way Todd Dodge has handled QBs (recruiting and otherwise), we're kind of stuck with Riley right now. But, you can dip down and get a JUCO guy at QB right away. Look at Josh Heupel in 1999 at OU. They didn't have jack at QB. Stoops came in assessed the situation and Mike Leach found Heupel - a JUCO guy who wasn't even the full-time starter. He was splitting time at his JUCO with another QB!

The people who argue that, 'well, Riley would take hits at receiver, too.' Well, yes...but, not on every play or even every other play. Plus, with his athleticism, he'd likely not take too many direct hits at receiver. At QB, he's hit from all angles, sometimes not knowing it's coming so he can't prepare for it. A reciever can often prepare for a hit and, for lack of better word, dodge it and not take it directly. As I've said before, I'd love to see him returning punts and kicks as well. It's not that the kid isn't hardnosed. He is. But, his body just isn't there. And, for some reason, it seems to be sinful to admit that. Too much emotion is wrapped up in it for some people to even discuss.

Several problems. You do realize that Heupel was listed at 6'1", right? So, figuring OU fudges like every other college program on the face of the earth (still don't understand why), that would make him exactly 1" taller than Riley. I know size matters, but one inch? Really? Also, as I remember, not the best long arm in the college game.

Also, Riley was out for the year last year after three games at receiver, so I think the injury argument is kind of weak. I do agree that we should recruit a competitive QB, because, as someone has already mentioned, running QBs get hurt in college football. Fact of life. You should always recruit to get better at every position.

But speaking of Heupel, maybe he could be your OC replacement, or maybe the next HC:

http://footballrecruiting.rivals.com/viewc...1&year=2010

Also, with all this extra responsibility (co coordinators offense and defense), these coaches are gonna want a pay bump. We have seen how having co-head coaches has worked out so well for the cowboys.

Edited October 12, 2009 by UNT90

[DallasGreen]

I don't see it. There's not going to be another coach, so he's going to be in there. If there were a whole new coaching staff - including head coach - I doubt he'd stay anyway. He didn't commit to us in the first place. He came to play for his dad. If his dad went, I'd bet he would go as well.

In any case, a new coach would have a different philosophy. Other than Colorado, another father-son coach-QB combo, I don't really see any other 5-9, 5-10/190ish QBs anywhere. A new coach would bring in a JUCO kid or two, sign a couple of preps, and let them battle it out. That needs to happen here - even under Todd Dodge...but, I doubt it will. It's too bad, too, because we'll waste a very experienced O-line this year and next on inconsistent QB play.

I've eaten alot of almonds and, so, I'm feeling healthy and full.

Two games 6 interceptions and a fumble. Mack Brown knew Riley was no D-1 QB @ 5' 10". He is an athlete much better suited to be a wide receiver. Whether you like it or not Tune is 6" 2" with one interception in six quarters of play against the best two teams played to date. He is not a runner but with the depth @ running back and Riley @ his correct position of wide receiver we give the offense a much better chance of success. Riley will not grow and become able to see downfield and he will never have Tune's arm strength. Do what is best for him and the team and get him out of the QB role now. After Hawkins of CU threw a pick 6 @ Austin his dad benched him permanently. Riley needs to play, but it's time TD realizes he's out of position @ QB in D-1.

[DallasGreen]

Several problems. You do realize that Heupel was listed at 6'1", right? So, figuring OU fudges like every other college program on the face of the earth (still don't understand why), that would make him exactly 1" taller than Riley. I know size matters, but one inch? Really? Also, as I remember, not the best long arm in the college game.

Also, Riley was out for the year last year after three games at receiver, so I think the injury argument is kind of weak. I do agree that we should recruit a competitive QB, because, as someone has already mentioned, running QBs get hurt in college football. Fact of life. You should always recruit to get better at every position.

But speaking of Heupel, maybe he could be your OC replacement, or maybe the next HC:

http://footballrecruiting.rivals.com/viewc...1&year=2010

Also, with all this extra responsibility (co coordinators offense and defense), these coaches are gonna want a pay bump. We have seen how having co-head coaches has worked out so well for the cowboys.

UNT has never sought the best, just the cheapest. I don't see that changing--a D-1 assistant for H/C will cost a minimum of $800K. We will go with the $250K HS coach because of the $$$$$. You either pay a la SMU or you don't hunt with the pack. No road wins in the SBC in 2.5 years is what $250K buys. Pay competitively or get back to 1-AA where your salaries are now. Otherwise you are just a D-1 pretender and not even an SBC contender!!!!!!!!

[untjim1995]

Well, I wanted Kragthorpe back before he took the Tulsa job and when we fired Simon. He was an awesome coach when he was here and after he left, esepcially at A&M where he was the OC when they won the Big XII. But, at the time, he told the DRC back then that he wanted no part of being the HC at UNT. It probably didn't matter anyway, as Dickey got ram-rodded thru and we had a cheap head coach. Now, who knows, maybe with a new stadium that changes, but he knows he can make more as an offensive coordinator at a big-time BCS school than here at UNT--unless, of course, UNT does soemthing it never has done and pays their next coach a competitive salary. But, I do agree with you--he would be a tremendous hire here. But, I doubt it would happen, as Dodge isn't going anywhere until at least the end of next year, when there wold only be one year left on his contract and we enter into the new stadium.