The Mean Green Of The Future

[KRAM1]

OK, hang with me here...so, I am attending a reunion of some old Air Force buddies back in Missouri last week and decide after it concludes to drive to Stillwater for Sunday evening before heading back to Denton. I get there, check into the hotel on campus (very nice by the way), and decide to walk by Boone Pickens Stadium on the way to Eskimo Joe's for a burger and a beer. As I walk past the very impressive stadium and all the new work going on (yes, the construction work is continuing in spite of what you may have read about it halting due to Boone's "losses" in the current economy), and there is a sign for "Fan Appreciation Day" starting at 5PM...I thought it was for Sunday, but it took place the evening before. However, Sunday was the first day of practice in pads for the Cowboys and the public was invited into the practice area for the first hour of practice (and will be allowed into the fenced in practice area every day at 4:45pm until school starts next Tuesday for the 1st hour of practice). Let me tell you, those boys are fast and BIG! Anyway, practice was fun, but the purpose of my post is to compare the fans attitude toward OSU's pre-season "meet and greet" to UNT's...

OK, let's set the stage...OSU has close to the same umber of students on it's main campus as UNT, the city of Stillwater is about 1/2 the size of Denton and both cities are about the same distance from the "larger cities" nearby (OK City and Tulsa vs Dallas and Ft. Worth). Pop. in Dallas/Ft. Worth is, of course, larger than that of OK City/Tulsa.

So, let's see UNT has about 350 or so fans show up...UNT provides food, music, games for the kids, talks by AD and Coaches, player autograph table, season ticket pick up, etc., etc. From what I could gather at OSU...no food, no kids games...BUT...how many people show up on a Saturday evening...... 7,500 plus. They shut the line off at 7PM but hung but Coach Gundy, QB Zach Robinson, WR Dez Bryant and others hung around for the autographs until everyone got through the line...they had 4 stations set up with different players for autographs and questions/answers. They also had the soccer team there for the meet and greet and autograph session and some folks just wanted to talk to the Lady Cowgirls...go figure. They even held them past "feeding time...yes, they were called to dinner at 7PM, but stayed until everyone got through the line to "meet and greet"...event was inside Gallagher Hall (basketball arena) and the line ran out and around....

This for a team with a history of being a "step child" even in Oklahoma...no great population center itself. Folks, this is what should be happening at UNT... 2500 - 3000 fans should have been in attendance at the Kickoff-Cookout not 350. The fan base has just got to find a way to "get over" past history and help this team and program move on. In fact there were about as many people watching the 1-hour Sunday practice as UNT had at it's Kickoff-Cookout. Sure...lots more money at OSU right now and bigger staff, etc., etc.

But, OSU is not the most fan friendly place you can imagine...a guy I was talking to was complaining that you had to buy season tickets if you wanted a ticket to the opening season Georgia game at Stillwater. No season tickety...no Georgia ticket. I think they did that with the home game with OU last year and folks are still grumbling. In fact, with seats left, OSU did not open single game ticket sales for the OU game last ywear and has no plans to open up single game tickets for Georgia...and the paper said season ticket sales are about 10% less than last season! So, not all is love and kisses at OSU or any other place, yet 7500+ show up for "fan appreciation" day in Stillwater.

That is showing your support...and what do you think the busibnesses in Stillwater and especially around the campus thought of "fan appreciation day"? They were packed! Restaurants, OSU clothing shops, gas stations, hotels, etc., etc. all reported great sales....

That, my Mean Green fan friends, is where UNT is heading, but it needs fan support to get there. OSU did not get there over night...a few years ago they had about 1000 show up for a similar event and they thought they were doing good...and yes, they have been winning a bit more lately and are ranked #11 going into a seson opening game with #13 Georgia...but, it didn't happen over night...and the road was not smooth for the fans. UNT is on the same path if you ask me, and the fan base needs to pick it up a bit to help make it happen even faster...a little support from the business community wouldn't hurt either.

THis will be a great time to be a member of the Mean Green nation...GO MEAN GREEN...BEAT BALL STATE.

[Mean Green 93-98]

The last sentence of your post will be a good first step toward getting there.

[NT91]

When NT cracks the top 20..then you will see the 5K-7K show up for the BBQ!

NT had about 1500 to 2K the first year TD was in town.

[KRAM1]

When NT cracks the top 20..then you will see the 5K-7K show up for the BBQ!

NT had about 1500 to 2K the first year TD was in town.

And, there in lies a major part of the problem..."fair weather fans". OSU has not been in the Top 20 on a regular basis through out the years, and has seen several "less than stellar" seasons in recent history. Yet, the fans still turn out and do not seem to "turn" on the program like UNT's "so-called" fans tend to do....when UNT fans "learn" how to be fans, they'll turn out even in the lean years. My bride and I attended that Cookout in TD's first year, and I do not recall there being 2000 in attendance..yes, many more than this year's event, but 2000 seems a bit on the high side. But, you could have it correct....so, where were at least 1000 of those 2000 this year???? Bigger town, bigger metroplex, food, kids games, 5K run, etc., etc. Where oh where are the fans?????

Just so they show up at Fouts for the first and every other home game this season and beyond....BUY SEASON TICKETS and support the Mean Green. GO MEAN GREEN...Beat Ball State!

[island eagle]

When NT cracks the top 20..then you will see the 5K-7K show up for the BBQ!

NT had about 1500 to 2K the first year TD was in town.

We've been in the top 20 at least twice over the years (I think maybe 3 times) and it didn't do much then for fan support. But, maybe it will now in this age of increased publicity.

[greenminer]

We've been down this road before. Let's rehash, shall we?

DFW market is not the same as Stillwater.

Our conference vs. their conference

budgets.

opponents.

our previous administrations.

This is going to be a long way up, friends. We'll be out of this recession before we can count on 25K+ Mean Green fans every Saturday, win or lose.

Right now the best thing we can do is start fixing our product. Start winning.

[UNT90]

We've been in the top 20 at least twice over the years (I think maybe 3 times) and it didn't do much then for fan support. But, maybe it will now in this age of increased publicity.

Different times. With today's mass media, and the focus on college football as the #2 sport in America, things would change drastically for this program if it could achieve a top 25 ranking.

[ColoradoEagle]

I've always said that the football stadium is the largest factor in keeping people away. It looks terrible from 35, from North Texas Blvd, and from the 50 yard line. More than anything else, it screams, "We don't really take this seriously." Once the new stadium is built, win or lose, attendance at all NT sports will improve year over year.

[Guest GrayEagleOne]

The new stadium will help, winning will help even more, but if you really want 7,000 on Kickoff Day then put us in the Big 12.

[SilverEagle]

The new stadium will help, winning will help even more, but if you really want 7,000 on Kickoff Day then put us in the Big 12.

Jack, I was thinking exactly the same thing.

[ColoradoEagle]

7,000?

Winning helps but it doesn't fill the stadium; we learned that under DD. On top of that, the stadium is one hell of an eyesore coming into town, and makes the school look rinky-dink. This affects recruiting in all the sports, student spirit, and community support. I'm not saying that we're going to have sold out games from here until eternity once the stadium is built. What I'm saying is that Fouts operates as a negative for everything about the school as opposed to a neutral. It's the only thing 95% of people driving through see of UNT, and most of them keep on driving.

[Travis Scott]

Kram,

Great post. In a few weeks our season begins...with a clean slate. the past is the past. I believe this season begins a whole new chapter in Mean Green Football...one that leads to and includes winning. the stadium issue has been resolved so there is no need for anyone to dwell on that...but we also can't (as fans) wait for the new one to be built to start to show up. this team needs 'all-weather' fans right now!

[UNTflyer]

We've been in the top 20 at least twice over the years (I think maybe 3 times) and it didn't do much then for fan support. But, maybe it will now in this age of increased publicity.

We've been in the top 20 once. In 1977. I'm not counting I-AA polls.

[hickoryhouse]

7,000?

Winning helps but it doesn't fill the stadium; we learned that under DD. On top of that, the stadium is one hell of an eyesore coming into town, and makes the school look rinky-dink. This affects recruiting in all the sports, student spirit, and community support. I'm not saying that we're going to have sold out games from here until eternity once the stadium is built. What I'm saying is that Fouts operates as a negative for everything about the school as opposed to a neutral. It's the only thing 95% of people driving through see of UNT, and most of them keep on driving.

That stadium has been making us look substandard for years, why else would they film a movie about a crap Texas college football team there.... But we have addressed that recently and unless something major and off the radar happens we will no longer be burdened by Fouts.

This team needs more support, we all realize that. There are things that need to happen and first and foremost is winning! Once that bridge has been crossed people will come. After that local businesses can step up more effectively, advertising can be more effective, word of mouth will carry more weight and on and on and on. It all starts with winning.

Texas is the motherland to football, well that and ohio and florida I suppose but I digress, we should be able to pull support in this climate but no one supports a loser just look at SMU and their attendance numbers. People didn't come to the kickoff when DD was winning championships because the admin was different, there was less advertising and most importantly we never developed the culture of school spirit that other schools seem to. We will get a boost when we win, and with that boost period we need to capitalize and generate the school spirit that is lacking at UNT and has been for years. There are us, the few, the rediculous, the fans... and then there are the masses upon masses of UNT alums who don't give a s**t. We have a huge uphill road to climb with them, but we can start with the current and future student....

Steps to improve this?

1. put a winning product on the field

2. encourage student participation vigorously, we have been for a while but lets step it up more. Some how we have to break the culture of apathy and make it "cool" for students to go to games and support their school.

After we do these things, we can focus on the old alums, but as we all have been witness, the school culture here vs. BCS "big school" there is different. Change the culture on campus, which has been happening, and we change the dark cloud of apathy that we as a Mean Green Nation feel. We, the supporters, have the power to talk about our college, which we do, promote our university, which we do, and explain our support to those that don't understand it. We need more of us!

[ColoradoEagle]

People didn't come to the kickoff when DD was winning championships because the admin was different, there was less advertising and most importantly we never developed the culture of school spirit that other schools seem to.

The stadium didn't sell out because: no one cared about who we were beating, most students/alums felt like the athletic program was a joke, and going to a game at Fouts is a pretty terrible college football experience. The new stadium solves two, and hopefully some day, three out of three.

We've come a long ways even since I was a student, but to tell yourself that winning will fill the stadium is gearing yourself up for disappointment. The largest crowd I've ever seen there was an opening game against the '03 Bumbling Baylor Bears.

Edited August 12, 2009 by ColoradoEagle

[UNT90]

The stadium didn't sell out because: no one cared about who we were beating, most students/alums felt like the athletic program was a joke, and going to a game at Fouts is a pretty terrible college football experience. The new stadium solves two, and hopefully some day, three out of three.

We've come a long ways even since I was a student, but to tell yourself that winning will fill the stadium is gearing yourself up for disappointment. The largest crowd I've ever seen there was an opening game against the '03 Bumbling Baylor Bears.

I think what was missing in the DD era was a statement win. I kept an eye on UNT back then, and attended only about one game a year, so I qualified as the average fan, and I kept waiting for UNT to challenge a major team. Not necessarily beat, but compete down to the wire with a top 25 team. It never happened. You just can't get the casual fan excited about a 27-0 loss to Texas, I don't care how many times you sack Chris Sims. Alumni, and everyone else, will take notice when we compete with top 25 competition, not when the new stadium opens.

Texas loves it's football winners.

[ColoradoEagle]

Like I said, winning doesn't magically solve problems. TCU struggles year after year to get over 35k (stadium holds 45k I think?) to their home games, despite regularly putting a ranked squad on the field. You could argue that they have fewer alumni than we do, but I think you could also argue that they probably have more alumni who give a crap than we do.

[UNT90]

Like I said, winning doesn't magically solve problems. TCU struggles year after year to get over 35k (stadium holds 45k I think?) to their home games, despite regularly putting a ranked squad on the field. You could argue that they have fewer alumni than we do, but I think you could also argue that they probably have more alumni who give a crap than we do.

I think we kill them with the shear number of grads we have in the area if we could go 12-1 . Wouldn't it be nice ot find out??

[LoveMG]

let us host 8 home games including georgia, texas, texas tech and put us in the big 12 in an area with no pro sports then you will get your dreamed attendance at a preseason event. until then think fau for homecoming and consider the real differences.

[Green Mean]

Just consistently win and create buzz against well known teams nationally and everything else will take care of itself.

[FirefightnRick]

Our Apple tree doesn't grow nearly as many Apples as their Orange tree does.

Rick

[KRAM1]

Point is...if you want to be "big time" you better start acting like it...and start by getting yourself and everyone else you can into the stands at Fouts this season. See you at Fouts.

GO MEAN GREEN.

And, stop blaming the fact that DFW is not like Stillwater...everyone can find a reason why they can't do something...I am asking you to find the reason why you CAN support UNT!

GO MEAN GREEN...Fill Fouts Field for every home game in 2009!!!!

[GreenBat]

Point is...if you want to be "big time" you better start acting like it.

Kram has it figured out, now if the University will figure it out!

[GrandGreen]

The stadium didn't sell out because: no one cared about who we were beating, most students/alums felt like the athletic program was a joke, and going to a game at Fouts is a pretty terrible college football experience. The new stadium solves two, and hopefully some day, three out of three.

We've come a long ways even since I was a student, but to tell yourself that winning will fill the stadium is gearing yourself up for disappointment. The largest crowd I've ever seen there was an opening game against the '03 Bumbling Baylor Bears.

Actually a history of winning is the most likely way to build up a program. I believe those that think a new stadium is a panacea for all of NT's football woes are in for a big disappointment. The stadium, short term, is not going to significantly alter the competition coming into Denton. Going from an old to new 30,000 seat stadium is not going to alter the economics of college football. Teams that can fill mega stadiums are not likely to schedule away games when they can make substantially more money at home and keep the home field advantages. Likewise, I don't think a new stadium will have much of an effect on the scheduling of other Texas teams in Denton who can come up with a myriad of reasons not to play NT. The new stadium will be a great building block for recruiting and elevating the program, but it is not going to turn a struggling Belt team into big time program without a lot more factors greatly improving.

ColoradoEagle, based on your comments here; I doubt that you will ever be more than a casual NT fan. I have been going to NT games for decades, and I have never thought going to Fouts was a "terrible experience" or that the program was a joke. First, I have been to a lot of so called great football stadiums and I can honestly state that the stadium I watch a game is a minor consideration in my enjoyment of the game. Now where I set in the stadium may be, paying premium prices to be in the OU or UT end zone in seats that wouldn't accommodate the average pygmy does have a negative effect. NT is not going to be playing in a big six conference any time soon, and most that think NT's program is a joke will not change their opinions. Because those opinions are derived from a type of herd mentality that believes winning and hype are superior to loyalty or allegiance to their University.

Edited August 12, 2009 by GrandGreen

[ColoradoEagle]

I have been and will always be a die-hard fan of NT sports. I've put a lot of time, effort, and money (at least for the time, ha) into helping the program in what little way that I could.

You contradict yourself on the 'winning' argument. You say that winning builds a program, and then later you say that we can't rely on people who only care about winning and aren't loyal to their school. Obviously a winning program generates more interest than a losing program, but it's not the most important ingredient. Having students who are proud of their alma mater, later becoming alumni with fond memories of their school and athletics is what builds a program. RV and the athletic department has done a lot in slowly building up interest at a school whose students and community were apathetic for decades. Part of being proud of your school is the venues the sports are played in, and honestly, my first thought when I saw Fouts was of Waterboy.

That isn't to say that people can't be proud with inferior facilities; many people still are. But we're not talking about people on this message board, we're talking about current students, alumni, and DFW. Those people take a bit more prodding to show up on Saturdays. A new stadium, as I said before, will not magically result in sell-outs. What it will do is give future students a different perspective of North Texas, the same way little additions like the Rec Center have in recent years.

As far as scheduling the big time opponents, I personally don't care. I know others obviously do, and hopefully that is a cog that will fall into place eventually.