U.s. "one Of The Biggest Muslim Countries"

UNTflyer · June 3, 2009

It is important to note that "if you actually took the number of Muslim Americans, we'd be one of the largest Muslim countries in the world".

So says President Barack Obama. Or I should say: Barack Hussein Obama.

That's right: Barack Hussein Obama. Say it proud. Say it out loud. The middle moniker that dared not speak its name during the election campaign is now front and centre of the US president's attempt to woo the Muslim world, the theme of his visits to Riyadh on Wednesday and Cairo on Thursday.

Petrified of the potential political fallout of being branded a Muslim, Candidate Obama - a practicing Christian - never used the name "Hussein" and its use was frowned upon as a forbidden code for the nutty accusation that he was some kind of Islamic Manchurian candidate.

No more. To say Barack Hussein Obama - BHO for short - now appears to be the height of political correctness.

As I argue in this analysis for the Telegraph dead tree edition, Obama is seeking to return to a Middle East policy based on realism - buttressed by the bona fides of his own multi-cultural (including Muslim) background.

In Strasbourg two months ago, the president tried out his full name. Days later in Ankara, he was introduced to the Turkish parliament by his full name.

As ABC's Jake Tapper and Sunlen Miller astutely outline here, the Obama administration is embracing the new president's inner Muslim, as it were, with deputy national security adviser that Obama had "experienced Islam on three continents...growing up in Indonesia, having a Muslim father -- obviously Muslim Americans [are] a key part of Illinois and Chicago".

So that's once, twice, three times a Muslim?

Just in case the Arab world hasn't yet got this message of inbuilt tolerance, Mr Obama himself has gone a step further. In an interview with France's Canal Plus released on Tuesday evening, he suggested that the United States might be a Muslim country.

Obama said he wanted to "create a better dialogue so that the Muslim world understands more effectively how the United States but also how the West thinks about many of these difficult issues like terrorism, like democracy, to discuss the framework for what's happened in Iraq and Afghanistan and our outreach to Iran, and also how we view the prospects for peace between the Israelis and the Palestinians".

So far, so blah - President George W. Bush often expressed much the same sentiments.

But then, as is his habit , Obama turned the concept around. "Now, the flip side is I think that the United States and the West generally, we have to educate ourselves more effectively on Islam.

"And one of the points I want to make is, is that if you actually took the number of Muslim Americans, we'd be one of the largest Muslim countries in the world. And so there's got to be a better dialogue and a better understanding between the two peoples."

Obama said in Turkey that Americans "do not consider ourselves a Christian nation or a Jewish nation or a Muslim nation". John McCain was criticised in 2007 for saying the US was "a Christian nation", later amending this to "a Judeo-Christian valued nation".

Of course, the concept of separation of church and state, which derived from the First Amendment to the Constitution, means that the US is not officially a Christian nation or a nation of any other particular religion. Which means, I suppose, that the US is as much a Muslim nation as a Christian one.

It's a bold - some might say audacious - turnaround by the president.

It's also a classically Obamaesque move.

During the 2008 campaign, he skillfully made himself, through his life story, the personification of change.

Now, implicitly contrasting himself with the born-again, evangelical Bush who pursued a pst-9/11 "crusade" against terrorism, Obama is presenting himself to the Islamic world as the personification of a new, tolerant - and, yes, partly Muslim - America.

Censored by Laurie · June 3, 2009

I really thought you were better than this. Eulesseagle, no...FFR, no...

this is sad.

eulesseagle · June 3, 2009

I really thought you were better than this. Eulesseagle, no...FFR, no...
this is sad.

"Truth is hate to those who hate the truth."

Gosh, I do not see any misquotes in the article. Informative and factual. Excellent post UNTflyer.

CBL, we all know you are a "little" on the liberal side so I can see where you would "feel" a "little" offended. Since this is the truth, I am not offended.

UNTflyer · June 3, 2009

First, I don't think he's Muslim. I just think he's inexperienced and doesn't speak well off the cuff.

Second, the United States ranks 61st in number of Muslims... we're not even CLOSE to being "one of the biggest Muslim countries."

Finally, don't cry about the use of your middle name as a fear tactic, then turn around and use it as a diplomatic tool with people who have made it clear that their goal is the destruction of our culture.

Edited June 3, 2009 by UNTflyer

Censored by Laurie · June 3, 2009

Finally, don't cry about the use of your middle name as a fear tactic, then turn around and use it as a diplomatic tool with people who have made it clear that their goal is the destruction of our culture.

That is the point right there. If every Muslim wants to destroy America, then every Christian murders doctors, blows up abortion clinics and hears god telling them to cut off the arms of their baby's...every Catholic has an 8 year old boy they love to diddle 4 times a week...every Jew owns a movie studio...every Hindi runs a Quik-e-Mart...

Hey, you know who hates the Taliban has much, nay, more than we do? MUSLIMS!! Only they have to live with them hindering progress a whole hell of a lot more intimatly than the US. Apparantly, unbeknowst to you guys, the Middle East is not ~~Kansas~~ Southlake...its not homogeneous.

So, yeah...BHO: But then, as is his habit , Obama turned the concept around. "Now, the flip side is I think that the United States and the West generally, we have to educate ourselves more effectively on Islam."

You both just did a brilliant job of proving our president right. Congrats.

Green Guy Bass · June 3, 2009

First, I don't think he's Muslim. I just think he's inexperienced and doesn't speak well off the cuff.
Second, the United States ranks 61st in number of Muslims... we're not even CLOSE to being "one of the biggest Muslim countries."
Finally, don't cry about the use of your middle name as a fear tactic, then turn around and use it as a diplomatic tool with people who have made it clear that their goal is the destruction of our culture.

CBL just made a great point. And I am pretty sure Obama can speak off the cuff. He is pretty articulate really, do we really need to examine some of the off the cuff comments from GWB?? Also, I don't want to hear about fear tactics, the Bush administration thrived on them.

UNTflyer · June 3, 2009

I didn't say they want to destroy America... I said they want to destroy our culture. That is, they want to see America an Islamic country. Don't believe me? Read their websites, their beliefs. Like Christianity, their goal is to spread their faith and influence to all parts of the world.

Now, normally religious evangelism is harmless (at least in the 20th century). But not with Islam. They are stuck in the middle ages. Their faith is destructive, brutal, and misogynistic. Tell me, CBL... can you name a Muslim country where democracy and freedom are the cornerstone of their culture? No. Turkey seems to be the exception to the rule.

I look at Islamic countries and see women treated worse than dogs. I see religion ruling governments, and religious courts passing sentences that would make Mangele nauseous. I know all I need to know about Islam, thank you.

UNTflyer · June 3, 2009

CBL just made a great point. And I am pretty sure Obama can speak off the cuff. He is pretty articulate really, do we really need to examine some of the off the cuff comments from GWB?? Also, I don't want to hear about fear tactics, the Bush administration thrived on them.

Jesus Tap-Dancing Christ, stop making everything about Bush.

Obama is NOT articulate. Take away the teleprompter and he talks like a debate team rookie.

Green Guy Bass · June 3, 2009

Jesus Tap-Dancing Christ, stop making everything about Bush.
Obama is NOT articulate. Take away the teleprompter and he talks like a debate team rookie.

Well, he seems pretty articulate during interviews, and the teleprompter thing might be the most nit-picky thing ever. Every president has used one. At least he can read his.

meangreendork · June 3, 2009

Just in case the Arab world hasn't yet got this message of inbuilt tolerance, Mr Obama himself has gone a step further. In an interview with France's Canal Plus released on Tuesday evening, he suggested that the United States might be a Muslim country.
Obama said he wanted to "create a better dialogue so that the Muslim world understands more effectively how the United States but also how the West thinks about many of these difficult issues like terrorism, like democracy, to discuss the framework for what's happened in Iraq and Afghanistan and our outreach to Iran, and also how we view the prospects for peace between the Israelis and the Palestinians".

This.

This basically shoots this randomly sourced article in the foot. How does "the US might be Muslim country" equal "the Muslim world and the Western world need a better dialogue to handle Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, and possibilities for peace with Israel/Palestine"?

But I'm not seeing the issue here. So he's taking his experience with the Muslim world and trying to make good on it in his dealings with that side of the world. Fine, good. Not every Muslim wants to blow up a bus in my neighborhood. Some do, but generally speaking, most don't. Might as well make nice with the moderates that don't like to kill themselves for a false war they think the West wants to start with them. If the guy wants to make use of his Islamic middle name to do so, linking it with the places he was in growing up, that's fine.

And no, the US isn't a single-religion nation. We have about as many religions and denominations within those as we have ethnic groups. So that's an accurate statement.

But saying, "the US is one of the biggest Muslim countries" gets a great big WTF.

Edited June 3, 2009 by meangreendork

DeepGreen · June 3, 2009

Second, the United States ranks 61st in number of Muslims... we're not even CLOSE to being "one of the biggest Muslim countries."

I just heard that we are the 38th largest Muslim country. 61st, 38th, who's counting. Definitely not one of the biggest.

The left does not see this (BHO) as a threat but I do. With luck, I'll be pushing daisies before the Muslim influence in the U.S. comes to past.

Censored by Laurie · June 3, 2009

I didn't say they want to destroy America... I said they want to destroy our culture. That is, they want to see America an Islamic country. Don't believe me? Read their websites, their beliefs. Like Christianity, their goal is to spread their faith and influence to all parts of the world.

Most don't give a damn about us. They care about raising their families...making a living...enjoying life. The exact same thing any Christian, Jewish or Atheist wants. There are people, I'm sure who want a world-wide caliphate...just like there are Christians readying for the new Crusade. Don't believe me? Watch Jesus Camp. The fact that seems to be lost here is that these are extreme minorities.

Now, normally religious evangelism is harmless (at least in the 20th century). But not with Islam. They are stuck in the middle ages. Their faith is destructive, brutal, and misogynistic. Tell me, CBL... can you name a Muslim country where democracy and freedom are the cornerstone of their culture? No. Turkey seems to be the exception to the rule.

How about the largest Islamic nation in the world? Indonesia. How about Nigeria? Algeria? and now Tunisia? Their faith is not what is destructive...rather faith of any kind in cohort with politics...a fact that it took "Christian" nations a good 1800 years to fully realize. How long have Islamic nations had to come to the same realization?

I look at Islamic countries and see women treated worse than dogs. I see religion ruling governments, and religious courts passing sentences that would make Mangele nauseous. I know all I need to know about Islam, thank you.

That is the problem.

June 3, 2009

I just heard that we are the 38th largest Muslim country. 61st, 38th, who's counting. Definitely not one of the biggest.
The left does not see this (BHO) as a threat but I do. With luck, I'll be pushing daisies before the Muslim influence in the U.S. comes to past.

Maybe he was talking size? We are a pretty large country...

UNTflyer · June 3, 2009

Most don't give a damn about us.

That's not what Barack Hussein Obama says.

UNTLifer · June 3, 2009

That is the point right there. If every Muslim wants to destroy America, then every Christian murders doctors, blows up abortion clinics and hears god telling them to cut off the arms of their baby's...every Catholic has an 8 year old boy they love to diddle 4 times a week...every Jew owns a movie studio...every Hindi runs a Quik-e-Mart...
Hey, you know who hates the Taliban has much, nay, more than we do? MUSLIMS!! Only they have to live with them hindering progress a whole hell of a lot more intimatly than the US. Apparantly, unbeknowst to you guys, the Middle East is not ~~Kansas~~ Southlake...its not homogeneous.
So, yeah...BHO: But then, as is his habit , Obama turned the concept around. "Now, the flip side is I think that the United States and the West generally, we have to educate ourselves more effectively on Islam."
You both just did a brilliant job of proving our president right. Congrats.

Where did Flyer state every Muslim wants to destroy America? I think the leadership of these countries and their fundamental Islamic views make his point extremely valid. Non-muslims are considered infidels in Islam and Islam teaches that infidels must be killed. Not a religion I want to cozy up to.

Plus the point is that Obama ran from his middle name during the election and is now embracing it. I would respect him a little more if he would just stand up for something, anything.

hickoryhouse · June 3, 2009

Plus the point is that Obama ran from his middle name during the election and is now embracing it.

The most important part of the article as I read it. It seems very awkward that using his middle name during the election was taboo, but suddenly it isn't such a big deal anymore. How politically expedient

The broad strokes with which some are painting the Islamic religion is frightening and narrow minded. However there are extremeist muslim governments that have the stated view of jihad against the west. These views and the governments that hold them, both publicly and privately, need to be taken very seriously and not overlooked. To pretend that they do not exist would not be wise and could, IMO, endanger us as a nation, and a culture.

June 3, 2009

Non-muslims are considered infidels in Islam and Islam teaches that infidels must be killed.

(sub in Christians) -- The Bible says the same thing. Plenty of places in the bible... I bet on some Camel Racing fansite they are saying that the Bible says to kill non-Christians.

Also, it is *his* middle name. I get his the benefit of when to use *his* middle name and when he doesn't want it used.

Mean Green 93-98 · June 3, 2009

(sub in Christians) -- The Bible says the same thing. Plenty of places in the bible... I bet on some Camel Racing fansite they are saying that the Bible says to kill non-Christians.

Really. Show me one place in the Bible where Christians are told to kill non-Christians.

When one of Christ's followers tried it, He rebuked him, "All they that take the sword shall perish with the sword." That strikes quite a contrast with the founder of Islam.

hickoryhouse · June 3, 2009

Could be an Old Testament vs. New Testament thing

KRAM1 · June 3, 2009

Maybe that's the "change" he kept talking about during the campaign...no middle name allowed during the campaign...middle name OK after winning presidency so he can effectively kiss the backside of every Muslim nation in the world.

That's change we can all believe in.....can't wait to see what he apologizes for in Egypt.

Nice post, Flyer...the truth does make some folks revert to "well Bush did this and Bush did that" as their only response. Funny, isn't it? I wonder how long it will be before our more liberal friends start holding BHO and his administration responsible for what they are doing? It's not my fault, Johnny did it too....boo hoo...boo hoo... the little boy cried when he was caught throwing roks at school.

June 3, 2009

Could be an Old Testament vs. New Testament thing

It is.. I have never understood why the Old Testament doesn't count as the Bible anymore.

Deuteronomy 17

17:2 If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant; 17:3 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 17:4 And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel; 17:5 Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

...and maybe we should be rioting in the streets for having Jesus in a cartoon:

24:16 And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him: as well the stranger, as he that is born in the land, when he blasphemeth the name of the Lord, shall be put to death.

GreenBat · June 3, 2009

Maybe that's the "change" he kept talking about during the campaign...no middle name allowed during the campaign...middle name OK after winning presidency so he can effectively kiss the backside of every Muslim nation in the world.
That's change we can all believe in.....can't wait to see what he apologizes for in Egypt.
Nice post, Flyer...the truth does make some folks revert to "well Bush did this and Bush did that" as their only response. Funny, isn't it? I wonder how long it will be before our more liberal friends start holding BHO and his administration responsible for what they are doing? It's not my fault, Johnny did it too....boo hoo...boo hoo... the little boy cried when he was caught throwing roks at school.

What exactly is President Obama's adiministration doing, except attempting to get the country back on track. While you non-thinkers may not agree with the way he is attempting to do his job, he is still trying to do the job.

KRAM1 · June 3, 2009

What exactly is President Obama's adiministration doing, except attempting to get the country back on track. While you non-thinkers may not agree with the way he is attempting to do his job, he is still trying to do the job.

Yep, Hugo and Pravda think he's on the right track and doing a great job.

UNTflyer · June 3, 2009

What exactly is President Obama's adiministration doing, except attempting to get the country back on track. While you non-thinkers may not agree with the way he is attempting to do his job, he is still trying to do the job.

Too bad you didn't apply this same logic to Bush.

UNTLifer · June 3, 2009

What exactly is President Obama's adiministration doing, except attempting to get the country back on track. While you non-thinkers may not agree with the way he is attempting to do his job, he is still trying to do the job.

Responding to the above in bold and your comments below, why is it that the left/liberals resort to namecalling, etc...?

Edited June 3, 2009 by UNTLifer