Oh No Not Again

eulesseagle · March 24, 2009

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/m...-signing-rules/

great video on this:

im mad as he**

Edited March 24, 2009 by eulesseagle

oldguystudent · March 24, 2009

Campaign lies? Massive spending? Pandering to the wants of his own party and supporters? Using a single party government to his advantage? Man. Never seen that before. I better start obsessing daily on it. You may even agree with the actions taken below, but they were still outright campaign lies. Somebody on here has said before that the country got through Nixon, Ford and Carter. We'll get through Bush/Clinton/Bush/Obama as well. The world is not going to end, the sky is not going to fall, and the market will recover (Personally, I blame Obama for yesterday's 6.8% market jump. He's obviously toying with us by personally manipulating individual stock prices across the market spectrum).

SPENDING RHETORIC

"To restore confidence in government, [George W. Bush] will...attack pork-barrel spending."

[source: Bush-Cheney 2000 website]

SPENDING REALITY

Since assuming office, President Bush has failed to veto a single bill, despite the enormous amount of pork that has crossed his desk. Even conservatives are getting frustrated. The Heritage Foundation recently wrote, "Budget discipline clearly isn't a priority of this administration, so why pretend it will get tough on frivolous measures like these?"

[source: Heritage Foundation, 6/28/04]

TAX RHETORIC

"y far the vast majority of my tax cuts go to the bottom end of the spectrum." [source: George W. Bush, 2/15/00]

"Governor Bush's income tax cuts will benefit all Americans, but they are especially focused on low and moderate income families."

[source: Bush-Cheney 2000 – Taxes website]

TAX REALITY

The top 20 percent of earners received 69.8 percent of President Bush's tax cuts. [source: CBPP, 4/23/04, p. 17]

Millionaires received an average tax cut of $123,000. Those in the bottom quintile of earners received an average tax cuts of $27. Those in the second to bottom quintile received an average cut of $317. [source: CBPP, 4/23/04, p. 17]

DEFICIT RHETORIC

"As President, Governor Bush will pay the debt down to a historically low level."

[source: Bush-Cheney 2000 website]

DEFICIT REALITY

As of July 30, the national debt stood at $7,316,567,571,232.89, a record high. This year's budget will also create a record deficit: $445 billion, according to the White House. [source: Treasury Department, 8/3/04, Reuters, 7/31/04]

SOCIAL SECURITY RHETORIC

"The Social Security surplus must be locked away only for Social Security." [source: Bush-Cheney 2000 – Social Security website]

SOCIAL SECURITY REALITY

During 2002, the first fiscal year for which Bush was responsible, he spent $159 billion of the Social Security Trust Fund surplus.

[source: CBO Historical Budget Data, ]

eulesseagle · March 24, 2009

Campaign lies? Massive spending? Pandering to the wants of his own party and supporters? Using a single party government to his advantage? Man. Never seen that before. I better start obsessing daily on it. You may even agree with the actions taken below, but they were still outright campaign lies. Somebody on here has said before that the country got through Nixon, Ford and Carter. We'll get through Bush/Clinton/Bush/Obama as well. The world is not going to end, the sky is not going to fall, and the market will recover (Personally, I blame Obama for yesterday's 6.8% market jump. He's obviously toying with us by personally manipulating individual stock prices across the market spectrum).
SPENDING RHETORIC
"To restore confidence in government, [George W. Bush] will...attack pork-barrel spending."
[source: Bush-Cheney 2000 website]

SPENDING REALITY
Since assuming office, President Bush has failed to veto a single bill, despite the enormous amount of pork that has crossed his desk. Even conservatives are getting frustrated. The Heritage Foundation recently wrote, "Budget discipline clearly isn't a priority of this administration, so why pretend it will get tough on frivolous measures like these?"
[source: Heritage Foundation, 6/28/04]
TAX RHETORIC
"y far the vast majority of my tax cuts go to the bottom end of the spectrum." [source: George W. Bush, 2/15/00]
"Governor Bush's income tax cuts will benefit all Americans, but they are especially focused on low and moderate income families."
[source: Bush-Cheney 2000 – Taxes website]
TAX REALITY
The top 20 percent of earners received 69.8 percent of President Bush's tax cuts. [source: CBPP, 4/23/04, p. 17]
Millionaires received an average tax cut of $123,000. Those in the bottom quintile of earners received an average tax cuts of $27. Those in the second to bottom quintile received an average cut of $317. [source: CBPP, 4/23/04, p. 17]
DEFICIT RHETORIC
"As President, Governor Bush will pay the debt down to a historically low level."
[source: Bush-Cheney 2000 website]
DEFICIT REALITY
As of July 30, the national debt stood at $7,316,567,571,232.89, a record high. This year's budget will also create a record deficit: $445 billion, according to the White House. [source: Treasury Department, 8/3/04, Reuters, 7/31/04]
SOCIAL SECURITY RHETORIC
"The Social Security surplus must be locked away only for Social Security." [source: Bush-Cheney 2000 – Social Security website]
SOCIAL SECURITY REALITY

During 2002, the first fiscal year for which Bush was responsible, he spent $159 billion of the Social Security Trust Fund surplus.
[source: CBO Historical Budget Data, ]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/7851925a-17a2-11...00779fd2ac.html

the sky is not falling yet....maybe the dollar.

meangreendork · March 24, 2009

Campaign lies? Massive spending? Pandering to the wants of his own party and supporters? Using a single party government to his advantage? Man. Never seen that before. I better start obsessing daily on it. You may even agree with the actions taken below, but they were still outright campaign lies. Somebody on here has said before that the country got through Nixon, Ford and Carter. We'll get through Bush/Clinton/Bush/Obama as well. The world is not going to end, the sky is not going to fall, and the market will recover (Personally, I blame Obama for yesterday's 6.8% market jump. He's obviously toying with us by personally manipulating individual stock prices across the market spectrum).

Heh. Pretty much sums my post.

UNTLifer · March 24, 2009

As Emirel says: "Pork Fat Rules!"

eulesseagle · March 24, 2009

i voted libertarian for the record.

so far the b hussain obama's administration has now outspent g walker bush's biggest budget by 4x.

currently china and russia are calling for the abandonment of the u.s. dollar. china, as we all know, owns most of our debt.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/7851925a-17a2-11...00779fd2ac.html

(china)

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/article/600/42/375364.htm

(russia)

as far as whose fault......congress......all of them.......well at least 98% of them......

Edited March 24, 2009 by eulesseagle

EagleD · March 25, 2009

i voted libertarian for the record.
so far the b hussain obama's administration has now outspent g walker bush's biggest budget by 4x.
currently china and russia are calling for the abandonment of the u.s. dollar. china, as we all know, owns most of our debt.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/7851925a-17a2-11...00779fd2ac.html
(china)
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/article/600/42/375364.htm
(russia)
as far as whose fault......congress......all of them.......well at least 98% of them......

Is that b/c George W. Bush kept the cost of the Iraq & Afghanastan wars out of the budget?

eulesseagle · March 25, 2009

Is that b/c George W. Bush kept the cost of the Iraq & Afghanastan wars out of the budget?

what is the question??

EagleD · March 25, 2009

GWB's budget did not include the cost of the war. Obama's does. Is this why Obama's budget appears to be 4 times bigger?

I'm just asking.

hickoryhouse · March 25, 2009

Congressional information report in regards to War costs past and future

Quote: (because i don't know how to do that whole scripting thing...

"CBO Projections of Future Costs. Based on two illustrative scenarios

assuming a more and a less gradual drawdown in deployed troop levels, CBO

updated its projections for the cost of all three operations for the next ten years from

2009 - 2018 in September 2008. CBO projects that over the next ten years war costs

for DOD, State, and VA could total

! $440 billion if troop levels fell to 30,000 by 2010; or

! $865 billion if troop levels fell to 75,000 by 2013.13"

The war looks like it is going to cost us about half as much as al of the stimulous, bailout, TARP, etc...... over the next 1o years. I don't know if this was accounted for by the Bush presidency but I do know that it cost about 12.4 Billion a month to keep the GWOT, Afganistan and Iraq going during 2007, 08. so even if it is 150 + billion a year during the Bush years, that is barely 1/24000th of the 3.6 Trillion yearly budget being proposed by Obama.

Obama Budget gets criticized by other countries

"And also on Wednesday, Mirek Topolanek, Czech president of the European Union, condemned Obama's plans to spend the way out of recession as "a road to hell"." I thought that Obama was going to improve our relationship with countries in Europe and around the world?

George Bush's final budget draws ire from Europe as well But is $500,000,000,000 smaller than Obama's!

But to answer the question on Bush's budget accounting for the wars,

"That claim of a balanced budget hinges on only $70bn in spending on the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, an estimate that even White House aides acknowledge they will exceed during the next fiscal year."

Yes it did, but it obviously did not account for it enough.

oldguystudent · March 25, 2009

so even if it is 150 + billion a year during the Bush years, that is barely 1/24000th of the 3.6 Trillion yearly budget being proposed by Obama.

Just for clarity, 150,000,000,000 / 3,600,000,000,000 is 1/24, not 1/24000.

ETA -- A little historical context on national debt:

The national debt peaked at 128 percent of gnp in 1946. After the war, although the debt continued to rise, the gnp until the 1980s rose much faster, so that by 1979-1981 the debt/gnp ratio was only 33 percent.

The real difference between that 128% then and whatever percentage its at now is that nearly all debt was domestically held then. A majority is still held domestically now, but only around 60% or so if my memory serves correctly.

Edited March 25, 2009 by oldguystudent

hickoryhouse · March 25, 2009

Sorry about that... Working and posting at the same time doesn't work well with math, or in general for that matter.

Yes I mis-spoke, 1/24th

Sorry

UNT90 · March 25, 2009

Just for clarity, 150,000,000,000 / 3,600,000,000,000 is 1/24, not 1/24000.
ETA -- A little historical context on national debt:
The national debt peaked at 128 percent of gnp in 1946. After the war, although the debt continued to rise, the gnp until the 1980s rose much faster, so that by 1979-1981 the debt/gnp ratio was only 33 percent.
The real difference between that 128% then and whatever percentage its at now is that nearly all debt was domestically held then. A majority is still held domestically now, but only around 60% or so if my memory serves correctly.

Who was President when this nation first went into debt? I seriously don't know, but am assuming it would be FDR.

oldguystudent · March 25, 2009

Who was President when this nation first went into debt? I seriously don't know, but am assuming it would be FDR.

Looks like that would be George Washington. From Wiki:

The United States has had public debt since its inception. Debts incurred during the American Revolutionary War and under the Articles of Confederation led to the first yearly reported value of $75,463,476.52 on January 1, 1791. Over the following 45 years, the debt grew, briefly contracted to zero on January 8, 1835 under President Andrew Jackson but then quickly grew into the millions again.[18]The first dramatic growth spurt of the debt occurred because of the Civil War. The debt was just $65 million in 1860, but passed $1 billion in 1863 and had reached $2.7 billion following the war. The debt slowly fluctuated for the rest of the century, finally growing steadily in the 1910s and early 1920s to roughly $22 billion as the country paid for involvement in World War I.[18]

eulesseagle · March 26, 2009

GWB's budget did not include the cost of the war. Obama's does. Is this why Obama's budget appears to be 4 times bigger?
I'm just asking.

you will have to show me that. even so bho budget is 4-5x more that gwb's budget. i would think bells would be going off in your head about the size of this budget and the overtness of more socialistic programs......i blame both the dems and repub for this. incramentalism is no longer what we fear it is the big step.