Unt Recruiting Update

Brett Vito · December 15, 2008

GreenAlums · December 15, 2008

So, what's the point of..."And in a final note...." part about getting torched by recruits UNT was interested in. My guess vito helped convince the recruit UAB was a better choice..... again...Grrrrr!

Quoner · December 15, 2008

So, what's the point of..."And in a final note...." part about getting torched by recruits UNT was interested in. My guess vito helped convince the recruit UAB was a better choice..... again...Grrrrr!

Did he convince the other two not to go to Monroe?

Mean Green 93-98 · December 16, 2008

UNT appears to have landed easily its most sought-after recruit thus far today, when Ira Smith committed to the Mean Green.

That seems to be an accurate statement, perhaps with the exception of Prior. It's strange that neither ESPN nor Rivals have him rated. Scout shows him as a 2-star recruit.

I think we've got enough DBs now. Linemen, linemen, linemen!

UNT90 · December 16, 2008

Sure does seem like we keep recruiting a bunch of DBs and WRs. What does that say about last year's class?

Just askin

UNT2012 · December 16, 2008

Sure does seem like we keep recruiting a bunch of DBs and WRs. What does that say about last year's class?
Just askin

Ask the offensive coordinator if they had enough talent at WR? Clayton George had only Stick and Fitz that made some plays.

Tell Deloach he has enough DB's after starting two true freshman some of the season. Eventually sitting one on the bench for the last 5 games.

Mean Green needs players everywhere.

December 16, 2008

Sure does seem like we keep recruiting a bunch of DBs and WRs. What does that say about last year's class?
Just askin

Inexperienced. We're looking for instant help.

Charlie NT 73 · December 16, 2008

I am glad the staff was able to recruit a very good CB in Smith.

Yes, there were 4 or 5 true freshmen CB's and Safeties that were

pushed into starting positions. I think the staff wants a couple of

JUCO veterans to help the secondary, and not put all the pressure

on the young guys. Smith is a very good CB!

As far as WR's, I think the staff will not pass on a quality WR. Would

you pass on a 4 star WR if the prospect would commit?

Maruice Langston would be a huge get for the Mean Green.

DL, DE, OL guys are out there, and the staff has known for a long

time what prospects they want to recruit. I would bet the prospect

list is very long for these positions. Let the staff handle this area.

The recruits will develop, and commit.

Last, do not feel like the staff is losing the war, becasue our buddy

Vito likes to focus on the prospects that choose another school, or

that a comitment is not listed on Rival or Scouts all america teams.

The statement made about the staff not knowing college level talent

is plain ass stupid! Geez! There is a ton of talented prospects trying

to make up there minds too. North Texas is a great opportunity and

a great school for these prospects. The commitments will come!

UNTLifer · December 16, 2008

Sure does seem like we keep recruiting a bunch of DBs and WRs. What does that say about last year's class?
Just askin

It says last year's class were true freshmen and need time to mature. Look around at any team and the majority of starters are Jr.'s and Sr.'s. It would be ideal to RS almost every freshman class to build depth, something we are sorely lacking. Signing these JUCO's hopefully allows some of these young men from the last two classes to mature and be worked in to the lineup not thrown in the fire.

It's really not that hard to comprehend.

UNT90 · December 16, 2008

It says last year's class were true freshmen and need time to mature. Look around at any team and the majority of starters are Jr.'s and Sr.'s. It would be ideal to RS almost every freshman class to build depth, something we are sorely lacking. Signing these JUCO's hopefully allows some of these young men from the last two classes to mature and be worked in to the lineup not thrown in the fire.
It's really not that hard to comprehend.

The good old "they'll be better when they are Jr and Sr" argument. A while back we looked at every team in the conference, and that look showed that almost all have rosters similiar to ours. I guess we are the only place that has that "magic" pill we give guys between the Soph and Jr. year. Dang, why don't we just give it to them before the Frosh year, then all problems are solved!! Foolishness.

round and round we go.

UNT90 · December 16, 2008

Last, do not feel like the staff is losing the war, becasue our buddy
Vito likes to focus on the prospects that choose another school, or
that a comitment is not listed on Rival or Scouts all america teams.
The statement made about the staff not knowing college level talent
is plain ass stupid! Geez! There is a ton of talented prospects trying
to make up there minds too. North Texas is a great opportunity and
a great school for these prospects. The commitments will come!

Yes, a reporter is the cause for bad football at UNT.

I think it is a legit concern whether or not this staff can evaluate college level talent. The product on the field indicates that is a very big concern. This staff had very little experience evaluating college talent when they arrived at UNT, and we have sucked two straight years, so why would talent evaluation not be a concern?

Talent is talent. With playing time it will improve. There was lots of playing time and little improvement this year. To me, that indicates a lack of talent or poor coaching, or a combination of the two.

Man, it's seems like i'm bashing Dodge. That is not my intent. Are there any realist on this board?

UNTLifer · December 16, 2008

The good old "they'll be better when they are Jr and Sr" argument. A while back we looked at every team in the conference, and that look showed that almost all have rosters similiar to ours. I guess we are the only place that has that "magic" pill we give guys between the Soph and Jr. year. Dang, why don't we just give it to them before the Frosh year, then all problems are solved!! Foolishness.
round and round we go.

It is the same at every level, but this seems to be lost on some of our fans. High school juniors and seniors are better than freshmen and sophmores. That is why there is a JV team. The same goes for professional football. Yes, the other teams have the same percentage, or close to it, of freshmen and sophmores on their roster as NT does, but those kids aren't starting.

Patrick Cobbs was able to spell Kevin Galbreath for two years and get used to D1 ball. You don't think that made him more successful when he was a Junior and Senior? The jump from HS to D1 college football is a large one, and one of the reasons so many teams redshirt their freshmen class. It allows the kids to mature, get used to college life/being away from home and adjust to the speed of the game.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · December 16, 2008

Yes. And, your concerns are the concerns of many...and not just fans. Believe me. I wish I could fully explain, but I always promise not to burn sources and I never will. Just be comforted in the fact that although it may seem like our AD and coach are aloof to the fact that the program is in shambles, many with a stake in the current condition understand and are keeping the heat on. Whether or not RV and Dodge ever admit there is a flame is another story altogether, but time is the greatest avenger.

As to developing players, it's just laughable to say player need two to three years to develop. Freshman and sophomores from around the country contribute. T.Y. Hilton of FIU is the best example in the Sun Belt. If this staff really believed that, they wouldn't have thrown Giovanni Vizza in there as a freshman. Especially so soon after Daniel Meager had a game where he set all sorts of passing records.

The truth is, Giovanni Vizza is a real talent, just a Daniel Meager was. That Nevada's Chris Ault offered the kid a scholarship is proof enough. Vizza caught the buzz of the Dodge hiring and switched his commitment. But, now, that buzz is long gone. Otherwise, he'd be preparing for the Wolfpack's fourth consecutive bowl appearance.

And, what you saw on the field the past two seasons is what was behind the buzz - nothing but hype.

I honestly feel for Vizza. He's the one bona fide signee we can point to in the whole mess. No one else around him is being developed quickly. He loses his top two targets in Fitzgerald and Stickler. Earlier in the season, he lost his old high school target. He'll be starting from scratch in 2009, which is inexcusable for as many WRs as have been signed around here.

When you objectively look at the thing you understand the problem is coaching. Passes dropped. Fumbles by receivers as well as running backs. Punts fumbled. Kickoffs fumbled. Does any coach at all on the team know how to coach ball safety? After two years, anyone?

Plays constantly disrupted by the inability to pass block or run block with any modicum of consistency. The refusal to consistently add the protection a regular tight end or H-back affords offenses like those at other colleges that run the spread. Heck, OU even has a fullback...that they throw to and hand the ball to in their spread! That on top of his blocking.

It's coaching. Players don't develop themselves. It begins in February and goes through the summer. This coaching staff is outprepared and outproduced across the board even in the Sun Belt Conference months before the season's first snap is taken.

On the defensive side of the ball. It's not even worth running through the number of player run through the secondary over the past two seasons. Start with JUCO transfer Evyn Roman and work your way forward. JUCO transfers played this year in the secondary and we gave up even more points. More JUCOs are being signed even though high school defensive backs have also been signed in each class. Some will be in their third year on campus this fall and not yet "developed" enough to get on the field...

...against regular competition from the Sun Belt! Forget for a moment how they were thoroughly whipped by the likes of OU, Arkansas, and...Rice! Just recall how Sun Belt teams lit them up. Coaching, coaching, coaching. Or, a sore lack thereof.

A defensive line composed of players moved from tight end, defensive ends moved in, and offensive linemen moved over for depth. Linebackers who can't regularly fill gaps, resulting in long runs. The same linebackers who can't get sideline to sideline play after play. These coaches simply do not have the ability to get the players to play every down of every game like its important the way a college coaching staff would.

So, yes. Yes, there are many realists here. We are as shellshocked as you are about the whole thing. But, short of winning the lottery, or making a few million dollars quickly in sales, we can't buy our way out of it. Believe me, after hearing from more than a few parents, I'd do it if I had the means just for the sake of their kids who are toiling for our alma mater. I really, really hope they get a bona fide coaching staff in here for them before their eligibility expires.

Edited December 16, 2008 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

December 16, 2008

Yes, a reporter is the cause for bad football at UNT.
I think it is a legit concern whether or not this staff can evaluate college level talent. The product on the field indicates that is a very big concern. This staff had very little experience evaluating college talent when they arrived at UNT, and we have sucked two straight years, so why would talent evaluation not be a concern?
Talent is talent. With playing time it will improve. There was lots of playing time and little improvement this year. To me, that indicates a lack of talent or poor coaching, or a combination of the two.
Man, it's seems like i'm bashing Dodge. That is not my intent. Are there any realist on this board?

I don't think that the talent that we are getting is a concern. They are faster, many are bigger, and most are more highly rated by Rivals, Scout, and ESPN than any of Dickey's classes. We have been 1 or 2 in the conference recruiting-wise under Dodge.

The question is the coaching of this talent. Why are there seemingly so many mistakes? Why are they not highly motivated? Why are there no adjustments when the other team stops our offensive strengths? Why are special teams so poor? Why do we get blown out so often?

To answer your question...I vote for poor coaching.

UNTLifer · December 16, 2008

Go back and look at the roster from 2003-2004. Click on our starters, Blount, Awasome, Cobbs, Knowlton, etc..., and look at their bio. Most of them gained experience as backups throughout their freshman year, not as starters. They had upperclassmen players to look up to and to learn from, as well as coaches to develop their talent. This is all I'm saying. Our current freshmen are thrown in as starters and are learning on the fly instead of learning from upperclassmen.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · December 16, 2008

So, it's the upperclassmen who are supposed to be coaching and not the coaches? Who, then, coaches and leads the upperclassmen? Are we to believe that the coaching staff is just standing by waiting for the players to police themselves?

I know that's not what you mean to say. But, come on. Ball safety, and well as gap discipline on defense, are very, very basic things that should have been drilled into the players skulls in the two springs and two falls that Dodge and Company have had them.

untgeorge · December 16, 2008

I don't think that the talent that we are getting is a concern. They are faster, many are bigger, and most are more highly rated by Rivals, Scout, and ESPN than any of Dickey's classes. We have been 1 or 2 in the conference recruiting-wise under Dodge.
The question is the coaching of this talent. Why are there seemingly so many mistakes? Why are they not highly motivated? Why are there no adjustments when the other team stops our offensive strengths? Why are special teams so poor? Why do we get blown out so often?
To answer your question...I vote for poor coaching.

Comparisons to Dickey's classes are irrelevant.

Rivals had us 3rd in the conf in 2008, tied for 7th in 2007. Not 1st or 2nd.

UNT90 · December 16, 2008

Go back and look at the roster from 2003-2004. Click on our starters, Blount, Awasome, Cobbs, Knowlton, etc..., and look at their bio. Most of them gained experience as backups throughout their freshman year, not as starters. They had upperclassmen players to look up to and to learn from, as well as coaches to develop their talent. This is all I'm saying. Our current freshmen are thrown in as starters and are learning on the fly instead of learning from upperclassmen.

I understand your argument, but do you seriously think Patrick Cobb would not have been successful starting as a frosh or Soph? Jamario won the rushing crown as a frosh. How many successful 3 or 4 year starters were there during the championship runs? I don't know, but I know you do. It just concerns me that after attempting to address two positions last year in recruiting, we appear to be again concentrating on the same 2 positions. If they were 4 or 5 star players, great, but they're not. What does that say about the staff's confidence in the improvement of those frosh and sophs as they mature?

Would be interesting to know when Deloach was hired. Maybe he had no imput in the DBs and now wants others? Just a theory.

Or, and this is worst case scenerio, maybe these are the only commits we can get. I really don't think so, but who knows.

Edited December 17, 2008 by UNT90