Big 12: It's Ou

Green Dozer · November 30, 2008

Computers decided this one. They will play Mizzou, and then on to Miami:

http://www.sportsline.com/collegefootball/story/11142732

Edited November 30, 2008 by Green Dozer

StealthEagle84 · November 30, 2008

This is by far the biggest BS I have ever seen in college football. The question comes down to who should be ranked higher, Texas or Oklahoma? No one is debating whether Texas Tech should be in the mix. They have proven they don't deserve to be in the conversation (barely beat Baylor and Nebraska + very weak schedule). So who should be ranked higher, UT or OU? I thought they had settled this on the field of play in Dallas a few months ago, but I guess not. Mack Brown and the Horns have every right to royally pissed off. There is no better time than now to argue for a playoff.

Edited November 30, 2008 by StealthEagle84

CMJ · November 30, 2008

Bigger than a undefeated SEC school being left out?

Bigger than a school that was #1 in both human polls being left out?

Bigger than two schools that didn't win their league going to the Title game(one that didn't win its division)?

This is par for the course in my estimation.

Edited November 30, 2008 by CMJ

H-towngreen · November 30, 2008

My biggest problem is the voters not the computers. Alot of people bitch and moan for a playoff and for it to "be played on the field". Well, I guess those people don't vote in either the Harris or AP poll, because the matter was settled on the field, UT won.

mad dog · November 30, 2008

Just embarassing. There are two 11-1 teams, and one beat the other. It is as simple as that. All the other arguments (strength of schedule, timing, points scored, points given up, weather, position of Mercury, whether the groundhog sees its shadow) are secondary arguments. If they had both lost to different opponents, then we can start the wild ass goose chase. But to let such an easy decision escape you is final and clinching proof of BCS madness.

emmitt01 · November 30, 2008

Does everyone prefer kleenex or puffs?

CMJ · November 30, 2008

Does everyone prefer kleenex or puffs?

:lol:

How about this for crying? What happens if Mizzou pulls off the shocker next week over OU and then USC passes Texas?

MeanGreengdub · November 30, 2008

It's hard to argue either way for them. They both deserve it but I think if they were to play a one game playoff, OU is the stronger team right now and would win.

I think to get rid of this mess first off, get rid of the Big 12 North and South and have just one Big 12 champion at the end. Then, somehow, come up with a better way of breaking a tie besides who is ranked higher. I'm an OU fan but I do think it sucks for Texas. There really isn't a good argument though. Someone is going to get screwed until they change the system.

H-towngreen · November 30, 2008

How about this for crying? What happens if Mizzou pulls off the shocker next week over OU and then USC passes Texas?

Don't have to worry about USC passing UT. Florida yes, USC no. But what if Florida does beat Alabama. OU moves to number 1, but would UT be able to hold off Florida? Possibly a OU UT championship game?

GreenMachine · November 30, 2008

My biggest problem is the voters not the computers. Alot of people bitch and moan for a playoff and for it to "be played on the field". Well, I guess those people don't vote in either the Harris or AP poll, because the matter was settled on the field, UT won.

That was 7-8 weeks ago. Many things change over the course of an entire football season. Ole Miss beat Florida but that doesn't mean Ole Miss should be ranked higher. Yes, UT did beat OU week 5 but if they were to play today, I have no doubt OU would win. I hate both schools so I don't care who goes.

CMJ · November 30, 2008

Don't have to worry about USC passing UT. Florida yes, USC no. But what if Florida does beat Alabama. OU moves to number 1, but would UT be able to hold off Florida? Possibly a OU UT championship game?

Nope, I think you would then have people argue(much like they did against Michigan acouple years ago) that a conference Champion deserves to go over another school. Recall, going into that scenario that Michigan(3) was ranked ahead of Florida(4), but when USC lost(who was #2) to UCLA - Florida leap frogged Michigan. The argument used was that Michigan didn't win their conference.

I would expect either Florida or USC to similarly leap frog an idle, non conference champion Texas.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · November 30, 2008

Yes, they're all 11-1 and Tech beat Texas 39-33.

The difference was strength of schedule. On the final weekend, the following happened that helped OU past Texas:

(1) Pittsburgh beat West Virginia. This win kept Pitt ranked, which helped Cincinnati SOS. OU played and beat Cincinnati.

(2) Cincinnati beat Syracuse and moved up to #13 in the final BCS rankings.

(3) TCU, did not play, but moved up to #11 in the final BCS rankings. OU played and beat TCU.

(4) East Carolina thrashed UTEP. UT beat UTEP.

(5) Nebraska, who OU beat, defeated Colorado, who UT beat. The Huskers, then, helped OU's SOS.

(6) Missouri, who Texas beat, lost to Kansas, who both OU and UT beat. But, the Missouri loss weighed against Texas.

Rice and Arkansas won, which should have helped Texas. The problem was that some of the computer polls count in conference strength of schedule. There, the Nebraska and Kansas wins bumped OU more than the Owl and Hog wins boosted Texas.

In the end, it was scheduling. When everyone was 11-1, and the Big 12 had the BCS tie-breaking rule in place, Texas scheduling UTEP and FAU hurt it. Both TCU and Cincinnati finished in the Top 13 of the final BCS poll, giving OU a 3-1 record over BCS schools in the final Top 15. Meanwhile, Texas had just one win over a Top 15 BCS school. Missouri dropped to #20, behind TCU and Cincinnati, with their loss to Kansas.

So, congratulations to the Longhorns for proving to FAU that you were tougher than coach Schnellenberger thought. And, for going on the road to El Paso to beat the Miners. In the end, it all meant nothing...because you couldn't beat Texas Tech.

Playoffs, anyone?

Edited November 30, 2008 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

Eagle1855 · November 30, 2008

and then USC passes Texas?

not. a. chance. I know you're out there in La-La land (which is meant as a fun jab, as I love southern california) but Texas' body of work is far more impressive than that of USC. If OU loses, I suspect Texas sneaks in the back door of the title game. Florida will jump Texas if it beats Alabama so I can't envision a situation where Texas is in the title game with OU. Take a look at the latest BCS to see how far USC would have to go.

I will agree with your first post, however. Auburn getting left out was a joke, as was a couple of teams that didnt win their conference playing for the title. But this is the system we've got. I think OU or Texas are both interchangeable this year. Tough thing for UT is realizing they were one dropped INT away from this not even being a discussion. OU cannot say the same.

Edited November 30, 2008 by Eagle1855

UNTflyer · November 30, 2008

What if Florida beats Alabama by 1 in a great SEC title game and OU loses to Missouri?

Rematch between Florida and Bama?

Edited November 30, 2008 by UNTflyer

Eagle1855 · November 30, 2008

What if Florida beats Alabama by 1 in a great SEC title game and OU loses to Missouri?
Rematch between Florida and Bama?

nah, voters wont want to see that again and they wont be able to resist a Florida - Texas showdown. Story writes itself. Pitting the biggest recruiting state's best programs, each led by heisman candidates for the National Title? ESPN would be showing their O face for 5 straight weeks. You thought USC/Texas was bad...

Edited November 30, 2008 by Eagle1855

CMJ · November 30, 2008

not. a. chance. I know you'e out there in La-La land (which is meant as a fun jab, as I love southern california) but Texas' body of work is far more impressive than that of USC. If OU loses, I suspect Texas sneaks in the back door of the title game. Florida will jump Texas if it beats Alabama so I can't envision a situation where Texas is in the title game with OU. Take a look at the latest BCS to see how far USC would have to go.

Actually I think USC's body of work might be equal to Florida. Let's face what has to be realized by now...the SEC is really down this year.

(And I usually wave the SEC is the best league in the country banner)

The conference has 3 ranked teams(I'm using the current BCS rankings btw), but only one after the two top dogs of Bama and UF. Stalwarts such as LSU, Auburn, and Tennessee are nowhere to be seen this year. USC lost to Oregon State on the ROAD, but Florida lost to Old Miss at HOME. I'd say the Beavers and Rebels are about equal - solid programs this year, just out of the top 25.

Ranked schools....Florida has beaten #16 Georgia and #24 Florida State(and Alabama should they win Saturday).

USC has beaten...#10 Ohio State and # 19 Oregon.

EDGE USC (so far....if they beat Bama, obviously you give this to UF)

Nonconference opponents - USC had Virginia (AWAY), Ohio State, Notre Dame

Florida had Hawaii, Miami, Citadel, and FSU(AWAY)

EDGE USC (USC traveled across the country to play UVA, then took on OSU and had their ancient rivalry with a down ND. UF had a down Miami, a rebuilding Hawaii, a joke in The Citadel, and at their ancient rivals of FSU. I give the slight nod to USC based on who they played, and in UF's only road game, they didn't have to travel far)

Looks pretty equal to me.

THOR · November 30, 2008

Nonconference opponents - USC had Virginia (AWAY), Ohio State, Notre Dame
Florida had Hawaii, Miami, Citadel, and FSU(AWAY)
EDGE USC (USC traveled across the country to play UVA, then took on OSU and had their ancient rivalry with a down ND. UF had a down Miami, a rebuilding Hawaii, a joke in The Citadel, and at their ancient rivals of FSU. I give the slight nod to USC based on who they played, and in UF's only road game, they didn't have to travel far)
Looks pretty equal to me.

uva finished 5-7, nd 6-6, osu 10-2

miami 7-5, fsu 8-4, hawaii 7-5

i don't see how you give the edge to usc. yes, the osu victory was big, but it was at home and osu isn't a world dominating team this year.

uf beat three teams that are going to bowl games, usc only 2. osu will probably get to a bcs bowl, but boise st could have an argument.

to me, i don't 'see how usc could jump florida or be better.

Eagle1855 · November 30, 2008

Looks pretty equal to me.

We're not going to agree on which teams had tougher schedules or which team has proven more... though I think you makes some good points about Florida. However, I feel like they are going to rock Bama next weekend and I think the Big 10 is just as weak as the Pac-10, top to bottom, so UF will ultimately have a better resume.

What we can agree on is the fact that USC is a good ways away from Texas in the BCS standings and the fact that neither play another game before the bowl season makes the chance of voters jumping USC over Texas as close to 0% as I can imagine.

Edited December 1, 2008 by Eagle1855

Smitty · December 1, 2008

I agree that UT belongs in the Big 12 title game ahead of OU...but I am looking forward to the prospect of a Florida vs. Oklahoma national title game. That could be fun.

CMJ · December 1, 2008

We're not going to agree on which teams had tougher schedules or which team has proven more. What we can agree on is the fact that USC is a good ways away from Texas in the BCS standings and the fact that neither play another game before the bowl season makes the chance of voters jumping USC over Texas as close to 0% as I can imagine.

Technically USC does have another game remaining. I expect the Trojans to stomp the Bruins in a similar fashion to the way UT stomped Texas A&M.

emmitt01 · December 1, 2008

Im not so sure I would put UT in the national title game....provided OU loses to Mizzou. The question is whetheer voters are tired of sending teams that cant win their conference to the title game.

CMJ · December 1, 2008

Im not so sure I would put UT in the national title game....provided OU loses to Mizzou. The question is whetheer voters are tired of sending teams that cant win their conference to the title game.

Which the last 2 years - they have answered with a resounding "No" when given the chance. That was my original hypothesis.

Eagle1855 · December 1, 2008

Im not so sure I would put UT in the national title game....provided OU loses to Mizzou. The question is whetheer voters are tired of sending teams that cant win their conference to the title game.

in that case, you couldn't have a repeat of Bama nd Florida... so you decide between Penn State and USC as to which loss was more egregious. Personally, I think Texas is a better team than both, which is why I don't know that you can play the whole "only win a national title if you win your conference" card.

What I find more alarming than any of this is the fact that there are 3 teams that are undefeated that aren't in a BCS conference and only one of them is going to a respectable bowl game.

UNT_playmaker · December 1, 2008

Texas beat Oklahoma in a bowl game setting, which was the Cotton Bowl.

Texas beat OU in a neutral field by two posessions.....by double digits....

Why is OU ranked ahead of Texas in the BCS???? Really????

CMJ · December 1, 2008

What I find more alarming than any of this is the fact that there are 3 teams that are undefeated that aren't in a BCS conference and only one of them is going to a respectable bowl game.

I find this sad too. Damn Buckeyes beating Michigan ruined Boise's shot.