Gm And Ford Bailout

[Eagle1855]

Mitt Romney: Let Detroit Go Bankrupt

Read this earlier. I thought it was a well-organized op-ed piece. Makes some good points.

Throwing money at a problem won't fix a system that doesnt work. The system needs to be overhauled.

[Green P1]

There has never been a legitimate threat from the production of electric vehicles. Why? Because they suck ass.

Take the EV1 for example. The EV1 failed for several reasons - the batteries had to be replaced after 6-8 months. A full charge under normal driving conditions resulted in about 60 miles of travel. Recharge time on these things was 8 hours. Owners home electric bills were so high that it was cheaper to burn gasoline. In short, the cars sucked and nobody wanted them.

The fact is, auto makers would build gerbil-powered vehicles if there was enough demand.

You know what else sucked ass?

this:

Know what was more reliable, cheaper, and could travel further?

this:

[FirefightnRick]

These corporations won't go anywhere...they will just have get smart and use their brains to figure out how to restructure their whole company and operations for the U.S. market.

There you go.

What I like is how the Japanes U.S. automakers are in better shape. Sure they offer electric combo vehicles, but that isn't driving their success, their management in how they run their company is. Their workers make less maybe because they don't have unions driving up their costs, but then again, they have jobs and seem happy? I haven't paid that much attention but have they had any major layoffs recently or in the past years?

Does anyone ever see the U.S. changing to a protectionist free market?

Rick

[Censored by Laurie]

There you go.

What I like is how the Japanes U.S. automakers are in better shape. Sure they offer electric combo vehicles, but that isn't driving their success, their management in how they run their company is. Their workers make less maybe because they don't have unions driving up their costs, but then again, they have jobs and seem happy? I haven't paid that much attention but have they had any major layoffs recently or in the past years?

Does anyone ever see the U.S. changing to a protectionist free market?

Rick

Are you insinuating that U.S. automakers are struggling b/c of unions?

How does what the industry calls "shitty cars"(proper usage) factor into your assessment?

[Coffee and TV]

There is a decent documentary on the EV1. It proposed that Detroit purposely killed the project from the beginning ... as a way to say, "hey, we tried!" Then people like UNTflyer will say the same thing.

I find it absurd that they didn't let people buy EV1s. They only let them lease them... and didn't let them renew the leases. So the company came and towed all the EV1s away and junk piled them. That is very crazy. How can you claim to have a product, but not really *sell* it?

Who Killed the Electric Car?

[Quoner]

Are you insinuating that U.S. automakers are struggling b/c of unions?

How does what the industry calls "shitty cars"(proper usage) factor into your assessment?

It's the perfect storm of shit and unrealistic unions. Just wait until global competition ramps up for airlines and the crap that passes for customer service from the Big 6 is put to the international test. Here's a good analysis to get the convo started: http://www.swelblog.com/

[meangreendork]

It's the perfect storm of shit and unrealistic unions. Just wait until global competition ramps up for airlines and the crap that passes for customer service from the Big 6 is put to the international test. Here's a good analysis to get the convo started: http://www.swelblog.com/

It's a combo of poor vehicle design and unions going ape$sh@t with their demands. Union costs make autoworkers for GM and Ford worth like, $70-$80 per hour (for pensions, etc). However, Honda and the rest are going like, $40-50 per hour and they're doing fine while also putting out good vehicles. Yeah, the US auto-makers need to totally re-think their system.

[Green Guy Bass]

Who Killed the Electric Car?

Good documentary. It will drive you nuts.

[GoMeanGreen1999]

Read this earlier. I thought it was a well-organized op-ed piece. Makes some good points.

Throwing money at a problem won't fix a system that doesnt work. The system needs to be overhauled.

At the committee meetings today in Washington, with the execs from Ford and GM sitting there, one of the lawmakers made the comment "It sure was funny watching all of you get out of your luxury JETS with tin cups in your hands."

[GoMeanGreen1999]

Good documentary. It will drive you nuts.

I need to watch that. I always enjoy a good documentary.

[oldguystudent]

Throwing money at a problem won't fix a system that doesnt work. The system needs to be overhauled.

My years in textbook sales sure as hell proved that theory to be true. The fed's thrown millions upon millions upon millions into the school system. See how much better it's gotten?

[FirefightnRick]

Are you insinuating that U.S. automakers are struggling b/c of unions?

How does what the industry calls "shitty cars"(proper usage) factor into your assessment?

Before I answer your question, answer mine first. Are you or anyone you know in a Labor Union that deals with high paid, low skilled labor, specifically pertaining to the UAW or any of the government defense contractors in this country?

Rick

[BeanCounterGrad'03]

Here's an excerpt of an interview that Larry King did recently with Michael Moore. While I know that he is the conservatives' anti-Christ, I think he makes a good point about management not doing a good enough job of watching consumer wants and needs.

Michael Moore's thoughts on auto industry bailout

And thus ends my attempt to keep this thread going on FOREVER!!!!!

[UNTflyer]

Here's an excerpt of an interview that Larry King did recently with Michael Moore. While I know that he is the conservatives' anti-Christ, I think he makes a good point about management not doing a good enough job of watching consumer wants and needs.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

[Coffee and TV]

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

I take it you've never seen Bowling for Columbine.

[Green Mean]

Here's an excerpt of an interview that Larry King did recently with Michael Moore. While I know that he is the conservatives' anti-Christ, I think he makes a good point about management not doing a good enough job of watching consumer wants and needs.

Michael Moore's thoughts on auto industry bailout

And thus ends my attempt to keep this thread going on FOREVER!!!!!

Part of that is true. That is why foreign automakers began taking over huge sales in the 90's and have a huge share of the market today. The people running Ford and GM were complete morons and they didn't act upon the needs and wants of the people.

[GoMeanGreen1999]

Good documentary. It will drive you nuts.

You are right - it does drive you nuts. I am watching it now, and it does drive you nuts. These people offered GM 1.8 million for 78 cars and they turned it down. Sounds like to me they don't need the money.

[NT03]

Can Fouts have a bailout so we can start this party started right....

[FirefightnRick]

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Rick