Unt Football

bigntex · November 9, 2008

After watching the streaming video of the FAU game, I just see so many consistent inconsistenties. Lack of preperation, focus, failure to adjust, lack of game planning by either side of the ball. Total domination on the line of scrimmage, both sides of the ball. Gio had his ass handed to him. Whoever said he wasn't running for his life, is kidding themselves. UNT had no answer for FAU's defense. Cam fumble, Casey fumble, Gio's tipped ball at the line and the sure drop of a throw that goes through the WR's hand into the DB's,, will not win many games, but FAU gave it back. But when it was time to execute, X's and O's, UNT got out coached in every aspect of the game.

This season is a coaching staff issue. Focus is huge. I cannot tell you how many dropped balls this season. How many drops that go through a WR's hands into a DB for a pick. I can't tell you how many times when UNT gets 3rd and long that it cannot stop the blitz packages, through scheme and play calling. I guarantee you that the entire two and some three deep of Tech would start at UNT at almost every position. Dodge tries to run the Tech spread but he doesn't have the athletic OL nor the pure strength of the Tech o-line. Tech also has the speedy wideouts and play makers on the dink and dunk passing game. UNT has no crossing route schemes ala Tech. Montgomery is a good back but has no speed. The future at running back will be Dunbar and #2 or maybe somelse that can take the ball to the house. Until UNT opponents have to respect the run, UNT will not win games. The defense gives UNT 75 to 90 yards a game in the running game by playing straight up but then UNT cannot dink and dunk. UNT has no deep threat what so ever and all UNT Wr's are possession types of receivers. You would like to see #2, Dunbar, and some more speed next season at WR. All you experts were so high on the big stud WR, but yet where is he, on the bench.

Defense, no speed at outside LB. Don't get me wrong, those guys bust ass but speed is speed. Witness FAU running back streaking down the sideline on the outsdide LB for six points on the throwback. DL, other than #94, is not a legitimate college d-1 line. What can you say about the secondary. TOAST all season long. DB's have been toast all year.

UNT cannot buy out put Dodge, it can't afford to. I think Dodge is a decent offensive mind but lets face it, he needs a lot of help. Dodge needs to make 3 or more coaching changes. UNT safties coach was a running QB coach at the Air Force, what does he know about pass defense? Several heads need to go.

Seniors don't respect Dodge, as witnessed on this board by their parents. All that craps flows down hill. If seniors are not happy, the team is not happy. Dodge cannot leave the QB's in the pocket on every freaking play. He never moves the pocket, he threw in a TE to give the defense more gap responsibiity but they know the TE is only a run blocker. TD has to adjust his offense to the college level. He has to recognize his lack of talent and make adjustments accordingly, as does DeLoach. If your going to get dominated on defense, you might as well make them march the ball down the field and earn long TD drives instead of giving up the big plays.

I think when Riley steps in next season ( I believe Gio will get screwed, just my opinion), Dodge will have to adjust, or Riley won't last the entire season. TD must "hit" on, not miss on, this year's JUCO class. UNT struck out last recruiting season, not one JUCO really was a difference maker. How can you recruit a over weight, slow footed OL from the JUCO ranks that has no chance in hell beating out the players you have on campus? Makes no sense. UNT waisted schollies to (2) JUCO o line man that are no better and most likely not as good as Bailey, Menard, or Rose. They could have gone for a playmaker on offense and more defense. Where the hell did they get that kicker? A student body try out would get you a more consistent kicker.

Gio, my friend, keep your head up. I know you can't stand losing but your friends are still behind you 100%. You were sold on Dodge and his magic, it just isn't there yet. Dodge is in over his head.

Green Dozer · November 9, 2008

Bigntex-you have a good post, but you contradict yourself. You talk about how Dodge is in over his head, and cannot get the team to focus, then you make a comparison with Tech. Well, don't you think if Dodge truly had the right personnel for his system, and Deloach had the players for his system, then the "focus" part would not be an issue? How do you know that this team is not properly prepared? Do you attend practices? I know that dropped balls is a sign, but the QB running for his life in a game is not. So, that means he is under pressure from an OL that cannot block. Before Dodge ever coached a game, many posted how it would take time to get his system going, and how exciting it would be. Now, its as if those thoughts were never posted. Tech was not in the National Title hunt in Leach's first couple of years, he had to get players for his system. As for the seniors not respecting him, well he did not recruit them and many have lost playing time. Nobody likes change that effects them, but unfortunately this happens, right or wrong. If we were winning, we would say that is what happens everywhere, and not give it a second thought. But since we are losing, everything gets put under the microscope. It is going to take time here. Good points (exept for the senior/parent thing) , but please make up your mind which it is.

Edited November 9, 2008 by Green Dozer

Travis · November 9, 2008

Bigntex-you have a good post, but you contradict yourself. You talk about how Dodge is in over his head, and cannot get the team to focus, then you make a comparison with Tech.

I am glad you pointed this out. This was my thought when I was reading this thread. First it is a coaching staff issue... then it is because we don't have better players. Which one is it? I actually lean on the side of it being a coaching issue as I have seen other teams have a better turn around with less. But, what do I know. I am just a caveman... when my cell phone rings, i think it is little deamons inside of it trying to steal my soul.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · November 9, 2008

After watching the streaming video of the FAU game, I just see so many consistent inconsistenties. Lack of preperation, focus, failure to adjust, lack of game planning by either side of the ball. Total domination on the line of scrimmage, both sides of the ball. Gio had his ass handed to him. Whoever said he wasn't running for his life, is kidding themselves. UNT had no answer for FAU's defense. Cam fumble, Casey fumble, Gio's tipped ball at the line and the sure drop of a throw that goes through the WR's hand into the DB's,, will not win many games, but FAU gave it back. But when it was time to execute, X's and O's, UNT got out coached in every aspect of the game.
This season is a coaching staff issue. Focus is huge. I cannot tell you how many dropped balls this season. How many drops that go through a WR's hands into a DB for a pick. I can't tell you how many times when UNT gets 3rd and long that it cannot stop the blitz packages, through scheme and play calling. I guarantee you that the entire two and some three deep of Tech would start at UNT at almost every position. Dodge tries to run the Tech spread but he doesn't have the athletic OL nor the pure strength of the Tech o-line. Tech also has the speedy wideouts and play makers on the dink and dunk passing game. UNT has no crossing route schemes ala Tech. Montgomery is a good back but has no speed. The future at running back will be Dunbar and #2 or maybe somelse that can take the ball to the house. Until UNT opponents have to respect the run, UNT will not win games. The defense gives UNT 75 to 90 yards a game in the running game by playing straight up but then UNT cannot dink and dunk. UNT has no deep threat what so ever and all UNT Wr's are possession types of receivers. You would like to see #2, Dunbar, and some more speed next season at WR. All you experts were so high on the big stud WR, but yet where is he, on the bench.
Defense, no speed at outside LB. Don't get me wrong, those guys bust ass but speed is speed. Witness FAU running back streaking down the sideline on the outsdide LB for six points on the throwback. DL, other than #94, is not a legitimate college d-1 line. What can you say about the secondary. TOAST all season long. DB's have been toast all year.
UNT cannot buy out put Dodge, it can't afford to. I think Dodge is a decent offensive mind but lets face it, he needs a lot of help. Dodge needs to make 3 or more coaching changes. UNT safties coach was a running QB coach at the Air Force, what does he know about pass defense? Several heads need to go.
Seniors don't respect Dodge, as witnessed on this board by their parents. All that craps flows down hill. If seniors are not happy, the team is not happy. Dodge cannot leave the QB's in the pocket on every freaking play. He never moves the pocket, he threw in a TE to give the defense more gap responsibiity but they know the TE is only a run blocker. TD has to adjust his offense to the college level. He has to recognize his lack of talent and make adjustments accordingly, as does DeLoach. If your going to get dominated on defense, you might as well make them march the ball down the field and earn long TD drives instead of giving up the big plays.
I think when Riley steps in next season ( I believe Gio will get screwed, just my opinion), Dodge will have to adjust, or Riley won't last the entire season. TD must "hit" on, not miss on, this year's JUCO class. UNT struck out last recruiting season, not one JUCO really was a difference maker. How can you recruit a over weight, slow footed OL from the JUCO ranks that has no chance in hell beating out the players you have on campus? Makes no sense. UNT waisted schollies to (2) JUCO o line man that are no better and most likely not as good as Bailey, Menard, or Rose. They could have gone for a playmaker on offense and more defense. Where the hell did they get that kicker? A student body try out would get you a more consistent kicker.
Gio, my friend, keep your head up. I know you can't stand losing but your friends are still behind you 100%. You were sold on Dodge and his magic, it just isn't there yet. Dodge is in over his head.

100% correct. I would only add that it is the responsibility of the athletic director, president, and board to find someone for a buy out. That's what happens at the major powers.

However, we have the misfortune of having a board that doesn't care enough to buy out, an athletic director without the balls to buy out, and a president without sense enough to lead a buy out. I'm beginning to think that the board simply ignores what's going on, Bataille simply defers to RV about what's going on, and RV simply stays in denial about what's going on.

And, so, here is where we're left - chalking up another lost season. The difference between these two and any of the 19 I've been a part of as either a student or alumni is that we are now never competitive in any game whatsoever if the school is a full FBS.

People mention recruiting and the off-season. Just give me a break. We're not getting the best players in the Dallas-Fort Worth area. We're not even getting the second or third best. All that hype about "Dodge and his Texas prep connections" is just as big a ruse as "Dodge is an offensive genius." He doesn't have the former, and never was the latter.

It's a ruse, all a damn ruse. And, we're the suckers. Again. High school coaches standing on a college sideline getting their butts kicked week after week after week. Pathetic.

Green Dozer · November 9, 2008

100% correct. I would only add that it is the responsibility of the athletic director, president, and board to find someone for a buy out. That's what happens at the major powers.
However, we have the misfortune of having a board that doesn't care enough to buy out, an athletic director without the balls to buy out, and a president without sense enough to lead a buy out. I'm beginning to think that the board simply ignores what's going on, Bataille simply defers to RV about what's going on, and RV simply stays in denial about what's going on.
And, so, here is where we're left - chalking up another lost season. The difference between these two and any of the 19 I've been a part of as either a student or alumni is that we are now never competitive in any game whatsoever if the school is a full FBS.
People mention recruiting and the off-season. Just give me a break. We're not getting the best players in the Dallas-Fort Worth area. We're not even getting the second or third best. All that hype about "Dodge and his Texas prep connections" is just as big a ruse as "Dodge is an offensive genius." He doesn't have the former, and never was the latter.
It's a ruse, all a damn ruse. And, we're the suckers. Again. High school coaches standing on a college sideline getting their butts kicked week after week after week. Pathetic.

Lonnie,

He did win 79 games in 5 years and lost 1. NO, it has not translated to wins here, but he had to be doing something right. Wish he/we knew what that something was/is.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · November 9, 2008

Lonnie,
He did win 79 games in 5 years and lost 1. NO, it has not translated to wins here, but he had to be doing something right. Wish he/we knew what that something was/is.

At his last five years at a rich high school. Go take a look at his high school coaching record prior to Southlake. It ain't great. He took over a school that already had a winning tradition. The other places he went, not so much, and he wasn't able to do much for them.

Green Dozer · November 9, 2008

At his last five years at a rich high school. Go take a look at his high school coaching record prior to Southlake. It ain't great. He took over a school that already had a winning tradition. The other places he went, not so much, and he wasn't able to do much for them.

I know. As a matter of fact, his record before Southlake was below .500.

UNTLifer · November 9, 2008

Lonnie, you make a lot of accussations about RV, the BOR and Dr. B. Do you have any proof or is this all opinion?

Many coaches have better results with a well funded and supported program. Your points come across as those from someone with a personal issue. You act like NT has high $$ alumni growing on trees.

VideoEagle · November 9, 2008

Lonnie, you make a lot of accussations about RV, the BOR and Dr. B. Do you have any proof or is this all opinion?

No, he doesn't. If you talk to people involved with other college programs in person, universally they say to give Todd Dodge more time, that RV is doing an incredible job with the resources he has and NT is about two games worse than every expert predicted them to be regardless of who was coaching. But there is a vocal group on this board, so of whom post under two or three different names to make their numbers appear larger, who have a blind hatred of RV, TD, Br. B, Lee Jackson and anyone currently associated with NT athletics.

GoMeanGreen1999 · November 9, 2008

No, he doesn't. If you talk to people involved with other college programs in person, universally they say to give Todd Dodge more time, that RV is doing an incredible job with the resources he has and NT is about two games worse than every expert predicted them to be regardless of who was coaching.

I used to hear "man that Houston Nutt is just an under rated coach." Yet NO other bigger schools ever hired him away. If RV has done so much good with the limited resources that he has, he would be gone. That talk from "other" schools is no more than talk.

The buyout money is there for Dodge, whether or not RV gets the ball rolling is a completely different subject, but the money is there.

Green Dozer · November 9, 2008

I used to hear "man that Houston Nutt is just an under rated coach." Yet NO other bigger schools ever hired him away. If RV has done so much good with the limited resources that he has, he would be gone. That talk from "other" schools is no more than talk.
The buyout money is there for Dodge, whether or not RV gets the ball rolling is a completely different subject, but the money is there.

99,

Where is the money? Not being smart, but inside knowledge or good guess?

GoMeanGreen1999 · November 9, 2008

99,
Where is the money? Not being smart, but inside knowledge or good guess?

It's there.

VideoEagle · November 9, 2008

talk from "other" schools is no more than talk.
The buyout money is there for Dodge, whether or not RV gets the ball rolling is a completely different subject, but the money is there.

Wow. Other people who actually who are will to speak in person about subjects on which they have personal knowledge "is just talk." But an anonymous poster for who there is no reason to believe as access to NT financial records can state "the buyout money is there for Dodge."

Thankfully, the lunatic fringe on this board will not be making any decisions about the future of NT athletics!

VideoEagle · November 9, 2008

It's there.

Because he says it's there and since he says it's there the money must be!

Green Dozer · November 9, 2008

It's there.

Excuse me, but the question was not whether the money is there or not. Do you have real, indisputable knowledge or are you just guessing? I know we both went to UNT, but it is a real simple question.

GoMeanGreen1999 · November 9, 2008

Because he says it's there and since he says it's there the money must be!

This University didn't hire a High School coach and give him the money they did, without a buyout clause. If they want to buyout the coach, they can find the money. Whether they will or not remains to be seen. Some of the same comments about DD were around - "we don't have any money to buy the guy out", but somehow it got done.

Edited November 9, 2008 by GoMeanGreen1999

VideoEagle · November 10, 2008

This University didn't hire a High School coach and give him the money they did, without a buyout clause. If they want to buyout the coach, they can find the money. Whether they will or not remains to be seen. Some of the same comments about DD were around - "we don't have any money to buy the guy out", but somehow it got done.

I'm sure there is a buyout clause in the contract. That doesn't mean NT has the money to pay it. More importantly, the decision makers aren't ready to give up on Dodge yet.

The group who gave the money to buy out DD are also not ready to give up on Dodge yet. If you believe money to buy out Todd Dodge this year is going to come from the same source as the money to buy out DD, you are mistaken.

Aquila_Viridis · November 10, 2008

I'm sure there is a buyout clause in the contract. That doesn't mean NT has the money to pay it. More importantly, the decision makers aren't ready to give up on Dodge yet.
The group who gave the money to buy out DD are also not ready to give up on Dodge yet. If you believe money to buy out Todd Dodge this year is going to come from the same source as the money to buy out DD, you are mistaken.

Forget about the buyout clause. What about termination for nonperformance?

Smitty · November 10, 2008

Lonnie,
He did win 79 games in 5 years and lost 1. NO, it has not translated to wins here, but he had to be doing something right. Wish he/we knew what that something was/is.

Sometimes a coach's tactics and system at one level simply don't translate to the next. Look at Gerry Faust at Notre Dame, Steve Spurrier with the Redskins, Lou Saban with the Dolphins - great coaches at their former level but unsuccessful at the next. I'm not saying the judgment is final yet with Dodge, but it starts to look that he's another in that long line.

I believe that in almost all cases, a coach deserves four or five years minimum. But no such rule can be unassailable and without exception. When you have two years in which the results are this lopsided, even in one of the lower FBS conferences, and so little progress appears to have been made, some very hard evaluations need to be made after this second season is over. I hope RV takes a hard look and consults privately with knowledgeable college football professionals, like some retired coaches, to determine if this staff deserves a third year.

oldguystudent · November 10, 2008

Forget about the buyout clause. What about termination for nonperformance?

Just looked through his contract. No clause for termination for nonperformance. I did see a clause I found interesting though. Section 5.06

5.06 Right to Reassign UNT reserves the right, in sole Athletic Director's discretion, to reassign Coach Dodge to another position with different duties at the institution for the remainder of the Term of this Agreement or any portion thereof. In such case, Coach Dodge will receive his Base Salary and the benefits applicable to other staff in a comparable position. If UNT makes such a decision to reassign Coach Dodge and Coach Dodge refuses to accept such reassignment, then UNT may terminate this Agreement for just cause.

If I'm reading this right, they could reassign him to locker room towel boy for $275,000/yr. If he refused to do it, they can terminate the contract without buying him out.

I still want to know if the players had any fight in them yesterday. Two things I want to see going forward..

1) Playing for 60 minutes

2) An admission that the spread may need some adjustment and adaptation in the FBS environment.

Green Mean · November 10, 2008

No, he doesn't. If you talk to people involved with other college programs in person, universally they say to give Todd Dodge more time, that RV is doing an incredible job with the resources he has and NT is about two games worse than every expert predicted them to be regardless of who was coaching. But there is a vocal group on this board, so of whom post under two or three different names to make their numbers appear larger, who have a blind hatred of RV, TD, Br. B, Lee Jackson and anyone currently associated with NT athletics.

While he has done a commendable job in his time here, I dont think that is the issue...the main issue is that he has hired a coach that seems almost incompetent in running a D1 football program. Also those other people from other college programs probably did not have their team losing by 30-40 plus points every week. Had that happened to their programs then their perspective would be completely different.

Edited November 10, 2008 by Green Mean

Green Dozer · November 10, 2008

Sometimes a coach's tactics and system at one level simply don't translate to the next. Look at Gerry Faust at Notre Dame, Steve Spurrier with the Redskins, Lou Saban with the Dolphins - great coaches at their former level but unsuccessful at the next. I'm not saying the judgment is final yet with Dodge, but it starts to look that he's another in that long line.
I believe that in almost all cases, a coach deserves four or five years minimum. But no such rule can be unassailable and without exception. When you have two years in which the results are this lopsided, even in one of the lower FBS conferences, and so little progress appears to have been made, some very hard evaluations need to be made after this second season is over. I hope RV takes a hard look and consults privately with knowledgeable college football professionals, like some retired coaches, to determine if this staff deserves a third year.

Smitty,

Didn't we consult Gene Stallings a few years ago? Anybody recall what he said and what if any we have applied? There are good models of smaller schools who have built successful program.

SilverEagle · November 10, 2008

Just looked through his contract. No clause for termination for nonperformance. I did see a clause I found interesting though. Section 5.06
If I'm reading this right, they could reassign him to locker room towel boy for $275,000/yr. If he refused to do it, they can terminate the contract without buying him out.
This is what the AD did to Matt Simon. He was reassigned and stayed at some meaningless position for a year before he moved on to another job.

Smitty · November 10, 2008

Smitty,
Didn't we consult Gene Stallings a few years ago? Anybody recall what he said and what if any we have applied? There are good models of smaller schools who have built successful program.

I would hope we listened.

NT80 · November 10, 2008

Smitty,
Didn't we consult Gene Stallings a few years ago? Anybody recall what he said and what if any we have applied? There are good models of smaller schools who have built successful program.

One thing I remember he said was to put a fence around our practice field to protect the grass. We did and now use the field for the MG village and tailgating tents.