What I Think Is Needed To Have A Better Team

OldTimer · November 9, 2008

These are not new beliefs they have been expressed in one or more of of my gmg posts.

Offense:

1. Until we have bigger OL in weight, strenth and quality we won't have better run success with open lanes, more passing success...as our QB won't have to run for his life every play and/or has to hurry his passes we won't have consistent offensive success. I honestly believe our OL is doing the best they can but with a 250 some-odd OT the odds are against them. Our walk-on WR's are doing their best and haven't given up. But, I believe next year we will have the red shirted WR's to help make our passing improved.

I understand that NT is recruiting several JC OL, over 300 lbs and includes two- 3* and 1-4* which are to come in for an official visit along with others who, if we are lucky, will remedy this problem...if not them then some others we are courting will. Again I believe our current OL players are doing the best they can and haven't given up. This should give our QB more time to read his WR's routes and make better passes. We are also pursuing a JC stud WR with 4.4 speed who is coming in for a visit which should help fill the shoes of Fitzgerald and Strickler.

The combination of these events and timing evidently fit in with Coach Dodge's rebuilding process. Folks it does take time to rebuil

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Defense:

Until the offense doesn't leave the defense to play almost the entire game we won't have defensive success. While I was unable to view the game today the radio announcers were commenting that our defensive linemen was standing around looking worn out the last quarter of the game. Again, I believe our DL did not give up and were doing their best.

Even then it will be necessary to have some DT in the middle of our DL that can rush into the oponents backfield and disrupt the opponents offensive game and not have to depend upon our Safety's to make the tackles. Size and weight plus quality in these position is necessary. Looking at our beginning of the season we had Charlie Brown at 255 lbs at DT along with Jonathan Stewart at 260 lbs...in our two deep and then lost Joseph Miller for the last few games at 275 lbs. We are using Tobe Nwigwe 252 lbs at DT instead of DE where he belongs. He has the quality and fighting spirit even playing at DT to be one of the leading tackles in the SBC. In addition we lose Isaac Thomas and Joseph Miller graduate this year.

I understand we have offers out to 8 JC DT/DE all with size and weight and I know are 3* and 2 others that I believe NT have been offerred, not counting our HS prospects...all of which will be coming in for official visits in the next few weeks.

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I don't even believe Coach Dodge fully knew the mess he inherited and considering everything I see the improvements over last year (except 2 wins vs 1 win so far this year but there are 2 more games to go. I still have faith in him and our coaches and believe he is the right coach for NT....we just have to have faith and patience. I really believe we will have another quality recruiting class this year to continue this rebuilding.

oldguystudent · November 9, 2008

The linemen should be required to make a minimum of three trips through the team buffet.

eulessismore · November 9, 2008

The linemen should be required to make a minimum of three trips through the team buffet.

It sounds like Nate Jenkins could fill those requirements. Honestly, I couldn't understand why it was a problem for an OL to be on the heavy side. I thought that was the whole point. Games I've watched this year (and in which we were beaten) had us playing against O-linemen who were not on the slim side, but we weren't getting a pass rush against them.

SUMG · November 9, 2008

These are not new beliefs they have been expressed in one or more of of my gmg posts.
Offense:
1. Until we have bigger OL in weight, strenth and quality we won't have better run success with open lanes, more passing success...as our QB won't have to run for his life every play and/or has to hurry his passes we won't have consistent offensive success. I honestly believe our OL is doing the best they can but with a 250 some-odd OT the odds are against them. Our walk-on WR's are doing their best and haven't given up. But, I believe next year we will have the red shirted WR's to help make our passing improved.
I understand that NT is recruiting several JC OL, over 300 lbs and includes two- 3* and 1-4* which are to come in for an official visit along with others who, if we are lucky, will remedy this problem...if not them then some others we are courting will. Again I believe our current OL players are doing the best they can and haven't given up. This should give our QB more time to read his WR's routes and make better passes. We are also pursuing a JC stud WR with 4.4 speed who is coming in for a visit which should help fill the shoes of Fitzgerald and Strickler.
The combination of these events and timing evidently fit in with Coach Dodge's rebuilding process. Folks it does take time to rebuil
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Defense:
Until the offense doesn't leave the defense to play almost the entire game we won't have defensive success. While I was unable to view the game today the radio announcers were commenting that our defensive linemen was standing around looking worn out the last quarter of the game. Again, I believe our DL did not give up and were doing their best.
Even then it will be necessary to have some DT in the middle of our DL that can rush into the oponents backfield and disrupt the opponents offensive game and not have to depend upon our Safety's to make the tackles. Size and weight plus quality in these position is necessary. Looking at our beginning of the season we had Charlie Brown at 255 lbs at DT along with Jonathan Stewart at 260 lbs...in our two deep and then lost Joseph Miller for the last few games at 275 lbs. We are using Tobe Nwigwe 252 lbs at DT instead of DE where he belongs. He has the quality and fighting spirit even playing at DT to be one of the leading tackles in the SBC. In addition we lose Isaac Thomas and Joseph Miller graduate this year.
I understand we have offers out to 8 JC DT/DE all with size and weight and I know are 3* and 2 others that I believe NT have been offerred, not counting our HS prospects...all of which will be coming in for official visits in the next few weeks.
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I don't even believe Coach Dodge fully knew the mess he inherited and considering everything I see the improvements over last year (except 2 wins vs 1 win so far this year but there are 2 more games to go. I still have faith in him and our coaches and believe he is the right coach for NT....we just have to have faith and patience. I really believe we will have another quality recruiting class this year to continue this rebuilding.

Tobe Nwigwe is still a Middle Linebacker. I think you meant Eddrick Gilmore.

Anyway, can you please explain why you think that there are improvements this year over last year? How is that? Last year, we were at least competitive in most of the Sun Belt games (except for Troy). This year we haven't been competitive in any SBC game. (unless you call the ULM game competitive).

I know we beat WKU again, but they aren't in the league yet (for football).

NT80 · November 9, 2008

Nice but an OL doesn't cover opponent's receivers or try to tackle on special teams.

H-towngreen · November 9, 2008

It sounds like Nate Jenkins could fill those requirements. Honestly, I couldn't understand why it was a problem for an OL to be on the heavy side. I thought that was the whole point. Games I've watched this year (and in which we were beaten) had us playing against O-linemen who were not on the slim side, but we weren't getting a pass rush against them.

Because Jenkins was so big that he couldn't play more than a few plays at a time...aka out of shape. He is being red shirted this year. So he will still have 2 years of elibility. I really do think the O line will be much improved next year. Right now we have a Freshman in Feeley, a rs fresh in Johnson, a soph in Santiago, and Hollivay a JR this year, add in Drake who returns for his Jr year and I think it will be a heck of line in the future. Throw in Jenkins, Gill, and whoever else and I think we will be set.

GoMeanGreen1999 · November 9, 2008

Well here is what I think is needed: Coaching. This defense is miles ahead now than where it started just this season alone. However, they can only do so much. Your offense has to be able to not only move the ball, but score also. It's so funny - we always got down on DD's offense because it was boring and didn't score. Now it's half way exciting, but the result is still the same.

eulessismore · November 9, 2008

Well here is what I think is needed: Coaching. This defense is miles ahead now than where it started just this season alone. However, they can only do so much. Your offense has to be able to not only move the ball, but score also. It's so funny - we always got down on DD's offense because it was boring and didn't score. Now it's half way exciting, but the result is still the same.

It does seem sad that on the rare occasion that we get good field position off a kickoff return, that we either can't score, or as today, turn it over.

filmerj · November 9, 2008

It does seem sad that on the rare occasion that we get good field position off a kickoff return, that we either can't score, or as today, turn it over.

or we penalty our way out of decent field poeition.

November 9, 2008

I agree with H-town, the OL should be the least of our worries next year. The return of Drake and a fit Jenkins should upgrade the offensive line. The defensive line is another matter. We need someone(s) with size who can get a push on opposing lines and allow some LBs and safeties to shoot in the gap that they create even if they're not able to get to the quarterback. We definitely need some beefy tackles. Our hope for the futurte is Franklin and Cantly but they won't be ready next year.

We also need defensive backs and special teams players. Hell, we even need wide receivers. But, most of all, we need coaches that will have these kids prepared to play each week. There are too many missed assignments and out of position players that don't tackle that well to be a successful Division 1-A team. I enjoyed watching the FIU defense. It seemed that there were always three players around the ball and if the first one missed there was always someone to back him up. Swarm defense is what I call it. They seldom ever gave up a big play.

The worst, however, is the (not co) special teams. Poor decisions, fumbles, poor coverage, botched punt and extra point blocking combined with poor coaching leaves us on the short end of field position every game. We need the second coming of Phillip Graves who is willing to sacrafice his body to break up wedge blocking and make tackles. We need a complete overhaul.

Say what you will about Dickey's unimaginative offense but he usually had decent defenses and special teams. To make matters worse, next year we have to find a punter.

Smitty · November 9, 2008

I agree with H-town, the OL should be the least of our worries next year. The return of Drake and a fit Jenkins should upgrade the offensive line. The defensive line is another matter. We need someone(s) with size who can get a push on opposing lines and allow some LBs and safeties to shoot in the gap that they create even if they're not able to get to the quarterback. We definitely need some beefy tackles. Our hope for the futurte is Franklin and Cantly but they won't be ready next year.
We also need defensive backs and special teams players. Hell, we even need wide receivers. But, most of all, we need coaches that will have these kids prepared to play each week. There are too many missed assignments and out of position players that don't tackle that well to be a successful Division 1-A team. I enjoyed watching the FIU defense. It seemed that there were always three players around the ball and if the first one missed there was always someone to back him up. Swarm defense is what I call it. They seldom ever gave up a big play.
The worst, however, is the (not co) special teams. Poor decisions, fumbles, poor coverage, botched punt and extra point blocking combined with poor coaching leaves us on the short end of field position every game. We need the second coming of Phillip Graves who is willing to sacrafice his body to break up wedge blocking and make tackles. We need a complete overhaul.
Say what you will about Dickey's unimaginative offense but he usually had decent defenses and special teams. To make matters worse, next year we have to find a punter.

I agree with working on the defensive line and better special teams, but I must disagree that offensive line should be the least of our worries next year.

As long as we run the spread, the offensive line should be at the top of our priorities every year. Look at Texas Tech. I don't mean to compare us to them, because a top Big 12 program will be able to out-recruit us for the foreseeable future. But what makes Tech's spread work so well is their line. With so many receivers on the field, their ability to protect Harrell is what allows them to do the things they do. I wonder if sufficient emphasis was put on recruiting linemen in Dodge's first two recruiting classes, which seemed heavier on skill-position players. We need size and depth on the line and we can't be satisfied with five good linemen in any year, because there will be injuries. Depth on the offensive line means success on offense, fewer punts, and less time on the field for the defense. It all starts with the offensive line.

foutsrouts · November 9, 2008

So why aren't guys like Rose and Glass getting significant time on the OL if that is one of our major problems? Glass is strong as an ox, and Rose ain't too bad either. I guess it's because they were recruited by the man in black?

wardly · November 9, 2008

this team is worse than last years, and i see no improvement. we have only been competative against w.k., offense scoring less and defense giving up more, plus for the 2nd straight year we have no kick return coverage. this is a very bad team.

The Fake Lonnie Finch · November 9, 2008

When you look at Mario Cristobal taking a pathetic FIU program and it's 26 game losing streak and turning it around "without his players" you have to wake up to the reality that coaching matters.

Germaine Dawson, Chad Rose...do those names ring a bell. They were starters in 2006. Where are they now? Colt Mahan - relegated to special teams and now only getting on the playing field late in the season? Not one snap behind center to Daniel Meager? With all of the blowout we've been in, not one snap? Not even to try to change to pace when Vizza is off?

Dropped passes galore. Terrible pass protection. Inconsistent run game. The inability to convert thrid downs. That is the offense side of the ball.

The defensive side is giving up 100 yard rushers every game and 100 yard receivers every game. They can neither stop the run nor the pass. Long runs for touchdowns. Long passes for touchdowns. Screen passes for long touchdowns. Nothing works on the defensive side of the ball.

Blocked kick after blocked kick on special team. Ten games into the season and the kick returners are still fumbling and mishandling kickoffs. It's atrocious, our special teams.

And, this is all on the players?

Look, Mario Cristobal is using "some other coaches players." Heck, Nick Saban at Alabama is using "someone else's players." Cut, the crap of saying the players aren't good enough. It doesn't fly. It's the coaching, or lack thereof. You don't play as poorly as this team has for so many games without there being a problem at the top. The buck stops at the top, not with the players.

untgeorge · November 9, 2008

When you look at Mario Cristobal taking a pathetic FIU program and it's 26 game losing streak and turning it around "without his players" you have to wake up to the reality that coaching matters.
Germaine Dawson, Chad Rose...do those names ring a bell. They were starters in 2006. Where are they now? Colt Mahan - relegated to special teams and now only getting on the playing field late in the season? Not one snap behind center to Daniel Meager? With all of the blowout we've been in, not one snap? Not even to try to change to pace when Vizza is off?
Dropped passes galore. Terrible pass protection. Inconsistent run game. The inability to convert thrid downs. That is the offense side of the ball.
The defensive side is giving up 100 yard rushers every game and 100 yard receivers every game. They can neither stop the run nor the pass. Long runs for touchdowns. Long passes for touchdowns. Screen passes for long touchdowns. Nothing works on the defensive side of the ball.
Blocked kick after blocked kick on special team. Ten games into the season and the kick returners are still fumbling and mishandling kickoffs. It's atrocious, our special teams.
And, this is all on the players?
Look, Mario Cristobal is using "some other coaches players." Heck, Nick Saban at Alabama is using "someone else's players." Cut, the crap of saying the players aren't good enough. It doesn't fly. It's the coaching, or lack thereof. You don't play as poorly as this team has for so many games without there being a problem at the top. The buck stops at the top, not with the players.

Right on, brother.

TIgreen01 · November 9, 2008

Look, Mario Cristobal is using "some other coaches players." Heck, Nick Saban at Alabama is using "someone else's players." Cut, the crap of saying the players aren't good enough. It doesn't fly. It's the coaching, or lack thereof. You don't play as poorly as this team has for so many games without there being a problem at the top. The buck stops at the top, not with the players.

QFT. The definitive post on the 2008 season, if you ask me.

SilverEagle · November 9, 2008

Right on, brother.

I'll second that "right on", especially the part about Chad Rose, Germaine Dawson and Daniel Meager.

H-towngreen · November 9, 2008

So why aren't guys like Rose and Glass getting significant time on the OL if that is one of our major problems? Glass is strong as an ox, and Rose ain't too bad either. I guess it's because they were recruited by the man in black?

I don't see the O-line as a major problem. They are creating holes for Cam. And they are giving Vizza plenty of time to throw the ball. Vizza is not at any point having to run for his life.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't load up on O-linemen this recruiting class, you should do it every year. Keenan Flax is a verbal of NT and is a beast. He has offers from some top programs such as Mizzu and Ark. And we also have 2 others counting as recruits for next year. Aaron Fortenberry?? the kid who verbaled to Houston before he blew out his knee and Nick Leppo. So that is 3 OL recruits for this year.

I just think this year the main focus should be D-line help. Juco for help now and High School kids to build depth for the future. We should sign at least Juco 2 DT's and a Juco D-end to go opposite of Gilmore.

I heard in interesting thing during the game, we only have 12 sr's on this team. How many did we have last year??? I know it wasn't alot.

Green Mean · November 9, 2008

Couldnt agree with you more Lonnie. We talk about players and the cupboard being bare but these are pretty decent football players. We are not playing LSU every week. Our talent is not BCS level for the most part but our opponents are not BCS either unless they are body bag games only to get raped and collect a check. This coaching staff is awful and it is amazing people are still thinking Dodge is the right man for this job. This coaching staff needs an overhaul and its that simple. Yesterday in a few tv games they were mentioning coaches and Mario Christobal is one guy that is rumored to be looked by better programs and he is only in his 2nd year at FIU. Folks it is time to realize how FAR we have fallen in college football. It is not like we were a powerhouse before but atleast we were respectable. While this school has potential, all of that is going away very fast because Dodge and his clan are taking this program to the bottom of the crapper.

Edited November 9, 2008 by Green Mean

Green Dozer · November 9, 2008

Nice but an OL doesn't cover opponent's receivers or try to tackle on special teams.

Got to have players for these things to. Need some Defensive Backs w/ speed, but special teams is a problem I think is more of the coaching issue.

Green Dozer · November 9, 2008

About the Sunbelt. All this talk about when Dodge took over, us not being good but not in the crapper. Well, I think the Sun Belt is the crapper and for four years we were just the least smelling turd. That said, I think it takes time to build our way out of here. I don't want to be Ball St., ranked one year, then forgotten the next twenty. They are not the next Boise. I want out of the crapper, and if this is what it takes, then it will be worth it.

Edited November 9, 2008 by Green Dozer

Got5onIt · November 9, 2008

Simplest solution:

New head coach & new staff. Problem solved.

houstonmeangreen · November 9, 2008

Couldnt agree with you more Lonnie. We talk about players and the cupboard being bare but these are pretty decent football players. We are not playing LSU every week. Our talent is not BCS level for the most part but our opponents are not BCS either unless they are body bag games only to get raped and collect a check. This coaching staff is awful and it is amazing people are still thinking Dodge is the right man for this job. This coaching staff needs an overhaul and its that simple. Yesterday in a few tv games they were mentioning coaches and Mario Christobal is one guy that is rumored to be looked by better programs and he is only in his 2nd year at FIU. Folks it is time to realize how FAR we have fallen in college football. It is not like we were a powerhouse before but atleast we were respectable. While this school has potential, all of that is going away very fast because Dodge and his clan are taking this program to the bottom of the crapper.

You are on the money my friend. Did you see the Tech game va OSU.....Tech looks like a BSC no one to me...remember just a few years ago we could play with these guys...even win. Now we can't whip our own ass with a leather strap.....we are soooooo far behind in every aspect of our football program....terrible.....was watching the UNT southern kentucky (is that their name ?) game. They are just finishing a 50 Million dollar renovation of their stadium....we are 3 years away from being in a new stadium...hope admin doesn't cheap out on the stadium....a real fear here.....we have to quit jacking around and get with the program....that my friends, includes a new coach.

Green Dozer · November 9, 2008

You are on the money my friend. Did you see the Tech game va OSU.....Tech looks like a BSC no one to me...remember just a few years ago we could play with these guys...even win. Now we can't whip our own ass with a leather strap.....we are soooooo far behind in every aspect of our football program....terrible.....was watching the UNT southern kentucky (is that their name ?) game. They are just finishing a 50 Million dollar renovation of their stadium....we are 3 years away from being in a new stadium...hope admin doesn't cheap out on the stadium....a real fear here.....we have to quit jacking around and get with the program....that my friends, includes a new coach.

also you forgot to mention that the alumni need to donate $$$$$$$$$$$$$. We cannot continue to throw nickels and dimes at this thing, while everybody else (i.e. Texas Tech) throws dollars. It takes a lot of work off the field just just as it does on the field. I am not talking about the people on this board, I know many of you give what you can. I am talking about those out there who should take a hell'uva lot more pride in their school. Lets face it folks, we can talk about land grants ,oil royalties at Tx, A&M, etc being unfair and all. But the fact is, take that kind of stuff away, and they still have alumni who have enough pride to support their school's athletic program. Somewhere, somehow, there was no pride instilled many years ago, and though improved somewhat, it has not changed. Its not all coaches and players.