Important Game Tonight

[LongJim]

Couple of observations. First, WF is well-coached, and they got good and consistent line and QB play last night.

* Baylor's team speed is improving. They have some decent skill players, just not enough of them. The frosh QB is a stud, but he will need more tools. The Bears are young. Give them another year and they will win more than they lose.

* WF dominated the LOS and had the advantage in team speed and depth. Game over.

* Baylor's special teams generally sucked. WF's were decent to good.

* Briles is a past Texas HS coaches assn. president. That is a huge recruiting bonus.

* Baylor is working on new facilities and the alums have deep pockets and care marginally more about the program than UH did.

* Briles can build a private school version of Leach's Wing and Sling success in Waco if he starts winning some games, because he is starting to get some athletes in place.

[Censored by Laurie]

How is Kirby Freeman playing? Didnt he just transfer at the end of last season?

[Eagle1855]

I forget, did Baylor totally money whip Briles?

Yes.

[Green P1]

Yes.

Any idea on how much they threw at him? I guess if I really cared I could just look it up myself. Yet......

[Eagle1855]

Any idea on how much they threw at him? I guess if I really cared I could just look it up myself. Yet......

$1.8MM (doubling what he made at UH) for 7 years... that makes the decision pretty easy if you ask me.

[Green Mean]

If given the invite, would you like North Texas to accept an invitation to join the Big 12? According to your statement, we should be ruling in the Belt than take a place in the Big 12 if offered.

I agree....being in a BCS conference in this day and age is priceless. I would rather have NT in the Big 12 or any BCS conference and consistently suck then have NT be in a Non BCS conference and be consistent winners. Being in a BCS conference gives you the most chances and opportunity to get to the top.

[emmitt01]

I agree....being in a BCS conference in this day and age is priceless. I would rather have NT in the Big 12 or any BCS conference and consistently suck then have NT be in a Non BCS conference and be consistent winners. Being in a BCS conference gives you the most chances and opportunity to get to the top.

Not to be nitpicky but don't your last two sentences directly contradict eachother. If your preference is "sucking" in a BCS conference (at least over consistently winning in a non BCS conference) wouldn't the chances of "getting to the top" be just about slim to nil? And wouldn't being a consistent winner (ala Hawaii or Boise) in a non BCS conference get you to the "top" faster than sucking in a BCS conference?

I'm not in any way suggesting that our ceiling should be ruling the Sun Belt but I think aspiring to be a Baylor or Duke of the world is equally fruitless.

Edited August 29, 2008 by emmitt01

[emmitt01]

Might be a bad move on his part, but I bet Jim Grobe probably didn't think he was making a bad move when he went to coach a dormat Wake Forest team years ago.

I think we're talking apples and oranges. In the ACC Jim Grobe has to hope for FSU and possibly Miami or Maryland to fall off a little and he's got a chance. In the Big XII Art Briles has gotta hope that UT, OU, Tech, aTm, Nebraska, Ok St, and Mizzou all fall off fairly significantly before he can say he's legitimately looking at a championship contender. Short of all of these teams coming down a peg or two he's just paying lip service to Baylor's alumni.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

How is Kirby Freeman playing? Didnt he just transfer at the end of last season?

--- I believe that fifth year students can transfer and play immediately. He red-shirted one year. That is another danger of red-shirting a kid.

---I agree with Emmitt.... A lot of folks here would prefer to be in a more recognized conference but being a constant bottom feeder is no fun either. I expect that if you aked a TCU Fan if they prefer being successful in their conference over being pummeled every week in the Big-XII they like where they are.

RE: Baylor ...careful what you ask for .... you may get it. ...... they did and they are getting shelled regularly. A losing mind-set is hard to turn around... they expect to lose. We don't have that, at least in conference games. We have been successful lately , just not the past three years. At this point our success is all about defense.... stop some people and we can win.

Edited August 29, 2008 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[KingDL1]

Not to be nitpicky but don't your last two sentences directly contradict eachother. If your preference is "sucking" in a BCS conference (at least over consistently winning in a non BCS conference) wouldn't the chances of "getting to the top" be just about slim to nil? And wouldn't being a consistent winner (ala Hawaii or Boise) in a non BCS conference get you to the "top" faster than sucking in a BCS conference?

I'm not in any way suggesting that our ceiling should be ruling the Sun Belt but I think aspiring to be a Baylor or Duke of the world is equally fruitless.

There is more money and exposure in a BCS auto bid conference that is for sure. The teams you would play at home would bring in big crowds, I don't think a school as big as UNT would be on the bottom for long. Telling a recruit he can play in the Big 12 vs the Sun Belt is a pretty big difference.

Plus then we could win all our OOC games against teams from the Belt.

I would take a BCS conference in a heartbeat.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

There is more money and exposure in a BCS auto bid conference that is for sure. The teams you would play at home would bring in big crowds, I don't think a school as big as UNT would be on the bottom for long. Telling a recruit he can play in the Big 12 vs the Sun Belt is a pretty big difference.

I would take a BCS conference in a heartbeat.

---I do agree with you, also.. our size and being a state university would make us very different that Baylor or TCU... It might take a while but we would climb to the middle at least. With that kind of schedule and being on the edge of a huge city, our attendence would rapidly climb, as would fan interest and quality of recruits.

----Let's get after KSU and shut down their offense. ............. If we do that, we can win.

Edited August 29, 2008 by SCREAMING EAGLE-66

[Green Mean]

Not to be nitpicky but don't your last two sentences directly contradict eachother. If your preference is "sucking" in a BCS conference (at least over consistently winning in a non BCS conference) wouldn't the chances of "getting to the top" be just about slim to nil? And wouldn't being a consistent winner (ala Hawaii or Boise) in a non BCS conference get you to the "top" faster than sucking in a BCS conference?

I'm not in any way suggesting that our ceiling should be ruling the Sun Belt but I think aspiring to be a Baylor or Duke of the world is equally fruitless.

Perhaps I said it the wrong way....what I meant to say that by being in the BCS group you will have a lot of opportunities in turning your program around and be a power in the conference. Even in a BCS conference, you are always going to have bottom feeders. But then again wasnt Kansas one? The fact that they were able to compile 10-11 wins was enough for them to get respect and they played in a BCS bowl and they had a chance to go to the championship game if they just were able to beat Mizzou and then try to be OU. You can go undefeated in a Non BCS conference and chances are you wont have a shot for playing in the championship because there typically just isnt any respect for Non BCS conferences. For every Boise States there are 10 Buffalos. Just like KingDL1 said, you just get a lot more attention, fans, exposure, money, etc by playing in a BCS conference. I will gladly take being a bottom feeder in those conferences. At that point its up to the administrations to see if they can change that.

Edited August 29, 2008 by Green Mean

[GoMeanGreen1999]

I think we're talking apples and oranges. In the ACC Jim Grobe has to hope for FSU and possibly Miami or Maryland to fall off a little and he's got a chance. In the Big XII Art Briles has gotta hope that UT, OU, Tech, aTm, Nebraska, Ok St, and Mizzou all fall off fairly significantly before he can say he's legitimately looking at a championship contender. Short of all of these teams coming down a peg or two he's just paying lip service to Baylor's alumni.

When I get some time this weekend, I will go back and look it up, but when Grobe took over at Wake years ago, I suspect he is much the same situation as Briles is at Baylor. Right now I would say that Nebraska, AtM and OSU are no different as many of the ACC teams currently. That leaves UT, OU, Mizzou and Tech as big competitors in the Big 12.

But I would take being in the Big 12 or any BCS conference anyday than I would where we are now or Conf USA.

Edited August 29, 2008 by GoMeanGreen1999

[Quoner]

When I get some time this weekend, I will go back and look it up, but when Grobe took over at Wake years ago, I suspect he is much the same situation as Briles is at Baylor. Right now I would say that Nebraska, AtM and OSU are no different as many of the ACC teams currently. That leaves UT, OU, Mizzou and Tech as big competitors in the Big 12.

But I would take being in the Big 12 or any BCS conference anyday than I would where we are now or Conf USA.

Don't forget the ACC see also has Virginia Tech, Clemson, and a traditionally 8-9 win BC team.

[GoMeanGreen1999]

Don't forget the ACC see also has Virginia Tech, Clemson, and a traditionally 8-9 win BC team.

Good point.

Still love that avitar you use.

[Tramp96]

-Briles and Jones have had success at the highest level of college football as head coaches

You consider Houston and Hawaii the "highest level of college football"?? If that were the case, why would they leave those schools to coach Baylor and SMU???

[Eagle1855]

You consider Houston and Hawaii the "highest level of college football"??

yeah Chris Petersen thinks that's crazy talk.

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

You consider Houston and Hawaii the "highest level of college football"?? If that were the case, why would they leave those schools to coach Baylor and SMU???

They are Division I-A (or whatever it's called now) schools. That's different than coaching Div II or II or NAIA or high school. And, Jones took his non-BCS school to a BCS game. If there are better paying bowls or more reputable bowls than the Sugar Bowl, please name them.

The why leave question is obvious - money.

Jones got more from SMU, even though he basically made a lateral move conference wise.

Briles' program at Baylor gets Big 12 bowl money even when he has losing seasons. I think Baylor's BCS payout last year was in the neighborhood of $3 million. And, all they had to do was sit on their coaches and watch the bowl games to earn it. It wasn't that way at Houston in C-USA. The Big 12 gives Briles alot more exposure nationally as well. Finally, it's closer to his West Texas roots than Houston was.

That being said, it was good to see him lose. If Baylor takes off at all, they simply add to the $3 million in BCS money they get anyway for sucking. I think all of the bowl games the Big 12 are tied into get at least $1 million per school. Then lump the BCS money into that...well...it's just better for us if Baylor not rise up and start having bowl seasons.

As far as Robert Griffin, he kind of reminded me of Tech's old Zebbie Lethridge - good runner, fair passer, but not a great "touch passer" (i.e., he doesn't really know how to control the ball speed when he throws it).

[Tramp96]

He got his ass torn about in that BCS game, and he didn't do non-BCS teams any favors in the process.

I wasn't totally disagreeing with the original post I was referencing other than that one comment. Houston and Hawaii should never be considered the highest level of college football. Briles really only had one or two good seasons at UH to begin with, and they still never cracked the Top 30. Both teams played in relatively weak conferences.

[Eagle1855]

I wasn't totally disagreeing with the original post I was referencing other than that one comment. Houston and Hawaii should never be considered the highest level of college football. Briles really only had one or two good seasons at UH to begin with, and they still never cracked the Top 30. Both teams played in relatively weak conferences.

To be fair, those two good seasons were the last two he was there. Briles built that program to what it is today.

As for Griffin, I agree on the touch thing, but maybe that can be taught? It was, after all, his first college game and Wake's defense is better than average. He did throw one pass that I thought could have been a touchdown that was dead on. Just dropped it in there. I guess the 'flashes' would excite me if I were into Baylor football.

[emmitt01]

And, all they had to do was sit on their coaches and watch the bowl games to earn it.

Geez. I know Baylor hasn't been particulary successful lately but smothering your coach seems a bit harsh.

[GreenAlums]

Anybody get a link to the clip of the Wake Forest #59 absolutely murdering the Baylor punt reciever? Man, what a hit!

[Travis]

Anybody get a link to the clip of the Wake Forest #59 absolutely murdering the Baylor punt reciever? Man, what a hit!

You mean, "what a CHEAP hit!"

[GreenAlums]

You mean, "what a CHEAP hit!"

I don't know, #59 was going about 200 mph and the Baylor kids calls a pretty weak fair catch. I don't think #59 could have stopped or moved at all. He got a penalty for hitting after a fair catch. I don't think it was helment first. But....it looked like it hurt!! I'm glad he got up!