My 1 Fear With A Student Referendum

emmitt01 · July 27, 2008

When we tried this before in 02 the fee failed, in my opinion, for one big reason...the "against" crowd spread a whole lot of misinformation about what the athletice department was doing and how much would be asked of the students. I can only hope that the athletic department is ready to go out and "beat the pavement" to reach as many students as possible...and initiative isn't one of the strong points that I've seen. How many students who live in dorms will hear the misinformation from their friends and not attend the G.A.'s or go into the union to see the displays outlining the plan? How many students will come onto campus during the week only go to class and will get their information from the "newspaper" the Daily?

I'm just concerned.

woody82986 · July 27, 2008

When we tried this before in 02 the fee failed, in my opinion, for one big reason...the "against" crowd spread a whole lot of misinformation about what the athletice department was doing and how much would be asked of the students. I can only hope that the athletic department is ready to go out and "beat the pavement" to reach as many students as possible...and initiative isn't one of the strong points that I've seen. How many students who live in dorms will hear the misinformation from their friends and not attend the G.A.'s or go into the union to see the displays outlining the plan? How many students will come onto campus during the week only go to class and will get their information from the "newspaper" the Daily?
I'm just concerned.

"Control the information... control the mob."

Chrisattsu · July 27, 2008

Just do what Texas State did. Get a student body president who is all for it. Then get him to use his student body connections to wander around campus with laptops "encouraging" people to vote.

Problem solved.

If you catch the "against" people off guard, they will not have time to prepare and the only mis-information being presented will come from you.

Edited July 27, 2008 by Chrisattsu

woody82986 · July 27, 2008

Just do what Texas State did. Get a student body president who is all for it. Then get him to use his student body connections to wander around campus with laptops "encouraging" people to vote.
Problem solved.
If you catch the "against" people off guard, they will not have time to prepare and the only mis-information being presented will come from you.

Jeff is already on board with it.

bstnsportsfan3 · July 27, 2008

When we tried this before in 02 the fee failed, in my opinion, for one big reason...the "against" crowd spread a whole lot of misinformation about what the athletice department was doing and how much would be asked of the students. I can only hope that the athletic department is ready to go out and "beat the pavement" to reach as many students as possible...and initiative isn't one of the strong points that I've seen. How many students who live in dorms will hear the misinformation from their friends and not attend the G.A.'s or go into the union to see the displays outlining the plan? How many students will come onto campus during the week only go to class and will get their information from the "newspaper" the Daily?
I'm just concerned.

Believe Me...being a part of housing...i can tell you that housing is 110% behind athletics and will support the new stadium....residents will support it as we are the majority of the students that go to the games since were already on campus!

UNTflyer · July 27, 2008

Jeff is absolutely behind this initiative. There are already plans to market the stadium referendum. I think Rick V learned a lot from the failed referendum in '02.

Go_UTA · July 28, 2008

Just do what Texas State did. Get a student body president who is all for it. Then get him to use his student body connections to wander around campus with laptops "encouraging" people to vote.
Problem solved.
If you catch the "against" people off guard, they will not have time to prepare and the only mis-information being presented will come from you.

I think that's right. Seems like everything passes the student vote when the student congress president is working for it.

Zeke · July 28, 2008

The President in '02 was VERY serious about getting a stadium as well.

Go_UTA · July 28, 2008

The President in '02 was VERY serious about getting a stadium as well.

Well, okay. So much for that theory.

I'm a bit surprised, though.

ADLER · July 28, 2008

Jeff is absolutely behind this initiative. There are already plans to market the stadium referendum. I think Rick V learned a lot from the failed referendum in '02.

Is Jeff capable of doing what the Student Presidents at Texas State and Texas-San Antonio have acheived? Those schools already have stadiums (although Texas State will have to expand theirs), and their student contributions are going to be capped at $300.00 and $240.00 per student per semester respectively. That's more than three times what the current contribution is at North Texas. Considering that those schools also have enrollments in the 30,000 range, their budgets are going to be much larger than North Texas. Those schools are planning for success.

Stretch the increase increments out as far as necessary, but set them to eventually match the per student contribution of our competition. If the other schools are planning $20 per credit hour by 2013, try to have the same advantage for North Texas by 2016.

good_ken · July 28, 2008

When we tried this before in 02 the fee failed, in my opinion, for one big reason...the "against" crowd spread a whole lot of misinformation about what the athletice department was doing and how much would be asked of the students. I can only hope that the athletic department is ready to go out and "beat the pavement" to reach as many students as possible...and initiative isn't one of the strong points that I've seen. How many students who live in dorms will hear the misinformation from their friends and not attend the G.A.'s or go into the union to see the displays outlining the plan? How many students will come onto campus during the week only go to class and will get their information from the "newspaper" the Daily?
I'm just concerned.

There are few times that the power of a message board can really make a difference; but I think finding volunteers to help with this would be something we should be able to do (since the Talons can't/won't).

I think this would be like when someone (I belive you Emmit) organized a drive to hang the football posters around Denton a few years ago. We should be able to provide RV and Co with people to hand out flyers, man booths etc.

ADLER · July 28, 2008

I think that's right. Seems like everything passes the student vote when the student congress president is working for it.

In the mid 1980's UTA raised student fees just enough to get a football stadium built but there was not a sufficient increase for the athletic programs.

How did that work out?

UNTflyer · July 28, 2008

Stretch the increase increments out as far as necessary, but set them to eventually match the per student contribution of our competition. If the other schools are planning $20 per credit hour by 2013, try to have the same advantage for North Texas by 2016.

Facebook doesn't allow polls in group pages, but I posted your numbers and asked the members to reply with the level of increase they would most likely support.

A. $1-4/hr

B. $5-9/hr

C. $10-13/hr

D. $14/hr (state max)

NT80 · July 28, 2008

In the mid 1980's UTA raised student fees just enough to get a football stadium built but there was not a sufficient increase for the athletic programs.
How did that work out?

When UTA dropped football the plan also was to funnel and keep the existing funding to build a nationally recognized basketball program with new arena. Didn't happen and the money went elsewhere.

Always ask for more than you need.

GoMeanGreen1999 · July 28, 2008

There are few times that the power of a message board can really make a difference; but I think finding volunteers to help with this would be something we should be able to do (since the Talons can't/won't).
I think this would be like when someone (I belive you Emmit) organized a drive to hang the football posters around Denton a few years ago. We should be able to provide RV and Co with people to hand out flyers, man booths etc.

I sure don't have a lot of free time, but I would be willing to stand on campus to greet the students for the first week or two at different times when I could, to hand out flyers or whatever. If we could find 50 people that would be willing to do that at different times all over the campus leading up to the vote, I have to believe it would help.

ADLER · July 28, 2008

Facebook doesn't allow polls in group pages, but I posted your numbers and asked the members to reply with the level of increase they would most likely support.
A. $1-4/hr
B. $5-9/hr
C. $10-13/hr
D. $14/hr (state max)

I hate to say this but uninformed customers are always going to choose the least expensive option.

Did you explain that $4 an hour means that North Texas may get a stadium built, but that the home team that plays in it will still be getting it's ass kicked almost every weekend, and North Texas will have to continue to sell 'bodybag games' just to make budget. What a bargain!

But at a moderate increase, which over a very extended time will eventually equal per-student contributions at the other emerging universities in Texas will guarantee that North Texas has the financial ability to be successful.

The time has come for North Texas to start dominating all those public schools that are half it's size and all the tiny privates. It is time to start kicking ass. That is what's expected every year at other schools but absolute athletic insignificance has been tolerated at North Texas for far too long. Only then will fans and alumni support the program. (What has attendance been like for the past 25 years in the Fabulous Super Pit?)

UNTflyer · July 28, 2008

I hate to say this but uninformed customers are always going to choose the least expensive option. Did you explain that $4 an hour means that North Texas may get a stadium built, but that the home team that plays in it will still be getting it's ass kicked almost every weekend, and North Texas will have to continue to sell 'bodybag games' just to make budget. What a bargain!

The least expensive option is all we need to finance the stadium. And I don't necessarily think that it means our teams will continue to suffer. Our problems on the field stem from recruiting, which has suffered because of piss poor facilities and mediocre support for years. I think the stadium will be a big boost for recruiting. I am absolutely confident that the new stadium will increase ticket sales, and hopefully at a time when Dodge has us on top of the SBC. And I wouldn't be surprised if minimum donations for premium seats will increase to $750-1000.

ADLER · July 28, 2008

The least expensive option is all we need to finance the stadium. And I don't necessarily think that it means our teams will continue to suffer. Our problems on the field stem from recruiting, which has suffered because of piss poor facilities and mediocre support for years. I think the stadium will be a big boost for recruiting. I am absolutely confident that the new stadium will increase ticket sales, and hopefully at a time when Dodge has us on top of the SBC. And I wouldn't be surprised if minimum donations for premium seats will increase to $750-1000.

Has that been the case with our basketball team that plays in a very nice 10,000 seat arena? Or have our two most successful teams in the last quarter of a century both lost to UTA which recruits players to a stage at Texas Hall?

North Texas does need facilities, that's a given. But the inability to adequately fund the teams that play in those facilities will insure that people will continue to not want to watch them.

Please do whatever you can to get the athletics fee raised $2 per hour for the next 7 years. It's a relatively painless increase for current students, and future students will be aware of the fees before enrolling. Increased athletic success will enhance their college experience and the value of their education. The costs of the UNT education will still be a bargain, but the school will have a winning image.

2008-2009...$6 per credit hour

2009-2010...$8 per credit hour

2010-2011...$10 per credit hour

2011-2012...$12 per credit hour

2012-2013...$14 per credit hour

2013-2014...$16 per credit hour

2014-2015...$18 per credit hour

2015-2016...$20 per credit hour

That way North Texas will have eventually caught up to contribution levels that UTSA and Texas State students had been giving since 2012. In 2015-2016 North Texas students will still be contributing less per semester than other Sun Bely students already pay.

Edited July 28, 2008 by ADLER

GoMeanGreen1999 · July 28, 2008

Do we know when the students will vote?

Go_UTA · July 28, 2008

In the mid 1980's UTA raised student fees just enough to get a football stadium built but there was not a sufficient increase for the athletic programs.
How did that work out?

The stadium, which was constructed in the late 1970s and opened for the 1980 f-ball season, was not paid by student fees. I don't know what they used back in that day, but it didn't require a fee or any type of student vote. President Witt (now pres of the Univ of Alabama) and our students instituted our first specific athletic fee in the mid 1990s. It is not as large as some of the fees that have been added or are now being contemplated by other universities more lately. But, it is an athletics fee and gives our athletic department a dependable source of revenue that isn't going away or won't be slashed by some committee. I believe there ia an inflation component, too, which allows for some gradual increases.

GabeGMG · July 28, 2008

If you guys are so concerned about the vote (maybe you should be) why don't you all re-enroll in the university and sign up for a 1-hour or 3-hour online course? Consider it a donation to the school, and an opportunity to let yourself vote on the issue =)

Sadly most students that I'm friends with don't want to pay the extra fee either because they think "UNT sucks at football, we don't need a new stadium" or "Why would I want to spend extra money when I'll be gone before the stadium is built?" Yes, stupid excuses to not vote for the stadium...lets just hope people like this don't vote at all =)

ADLER · July 28, 2008

If you guys are so concerned about the vote (maybe you should be) why don't you all re-enroll in the university and sign up for a 1-hour or 3-hour online course? Consider it a donation to the school, and an opportunity to let yourself vote on the issue =)
Sadly most students that I'm friends with don't want to pay the extra fee either because they think "UNT sucks at football, we don't need a new stadium" or "Why would I want to spend extra money when I'll be gone before the stadium is built?" Yes, stupid excuses to not vote for the stadium...lets just hope people like this don't vote at all =)

One day two women brought a baby to Solomon. Each woman said the baby was her child. Solomon said, "Cut the baby in half and give half of the baby to each woman." "NO!" screamed the real mother, "Give her the baby. Do not kill him." Then Solomon knew who the real mother was because of the way she loved the baby. He gave the baby to its real mother.

There are times when it's easy to define who cares about the well-being of the university, and who does not.

GabeGMG · July 28, 2008

Are you trying to say I don't care about the well-being? or the students? The latter unfortunately is correct in many cases.

UNTflyer · July 28, 2008

Do we know when the students will vote?

Sometime this fall.

NT80 · July 28, 2008

If you guys are so concerned about the vote (maybe you should be) why don't you all re-enroll in the university and sign up for a 1-hour or 3-hour online course? Consider it a donation to the school, and an opportunity to let yourself vote on the issue =)
Sadly most students that I'm friends with don't want to pay the extra fee either because they think "UNT sucks at football, we don't need a new stadium" or "Why would I want to spend extra money when I'll be gone before the stadium is built?" Yes, stupid excuses to not vote for the stadium...lets just hope people like this don't vote at all =)

Yes, I am greatly concerned! I am concerned that the future funding for a new football stadium (and in reality the future viability of the program) falls into the hands of 18-22 year olds voting about it. While us alums have basically no say, unless we have $30 million in our wallet, we must sit by and hope the legislation is phrased just right so it doesn't upset the anti-fans and hope it's enough funding for a real stadium and not just another version of Fouts. Call me concerned? YES~!