Athletics Fees

MeanMag · July 27, 2008

In looking at the enrollment numbers, I was shocked that FIU claims 38,000 students. I call B.S. on that one.

It's actually true. FIU's enrollment is no joke...

FirefightnRick · July 27, 2008

Can you name the first home game that South Florida ever won against a Division 1A team? It was 2001 against North Texas.

And wasn't this when their football coaches were also working out of temporary trailers for their offices?

Rick

ADLER · July 27, 2008

It's actually true. FIU's enrollment is no joke...

And they are trying to use their large enrollment to their advantage, just as South Florida and Central Florida have, UTSA and Texas State plan to, and what I have been requesting so many at North Texas to do.

There are costs involved, but the costs of not doing it are much higher.

And Jeff Kline, if you read this, you know what needs to be done, and it's not the proposed token increase.

UNTflyer · July 27, 2008

Here's what will really make you sick

UT-Austin

Total athletics revenue: $89 million

Total from students fees: $1.6 million

Michigan

Total athletics revenue: $78 million

Total from students fees: $0

Edited July 27, 2008 by UNTflyer

UNTflyer · July 27, 2008

And Jeff Kline, if you read this, you know what needs to be done, and it's not the proposed token increase.

You know, this database has really opened my eyes regarding fees. I am really surprised how many of these big programs receive little to nothing in student fees.

Auburn: $900k

Indiana: $1 mil

Ohio State: $0

Texas A&M: $0

Wisconsin: $0

Washington: $0

Of course, these are hugely popular programs with booster club bank rolls that dwarf our entire budget.

DeepGreen · July 27, 2008

You know, this database has really opened my eyes regarding fees. I am really surprised how many of these big programs receive little to nothing in student fees.
Auburn: $900k
Indiana: $1 mil
Ohio State: $0
Texas A&M: $0
Wisconsin: $0
Washington: $0
Of course, these are hugely popular programs with booster club bank rolls that dwarf our entire budget.

I can tell you that A & M charges their students for home game season tickets (football). A year ago it was $175(I believe). Students can also purchase a complete sports pass for all athletic events.

ADLER · July 27, 2008

You know, this database has really opened my eyes regarding fees. I am really surprised how many of these big programs receive little to nothing in student fees.
Auburn: $900k
Indiana: $1 mil
Ohio State: $0
Texas A&M: $0
Wisconsin: $0
Washington: $0
Of course, these are hugely popular programs with booster club bank rolls that dwarf our entire budget.

Thank you for pointing that out. It's a clear illustration of schools that actually build a successful athletic program do not remain dependant on student fees indefinitely. Other sources; donations, sponsorships, concessions, suite revenue, and especially revenue from increased demand for tickets can make the university totally independent of student fees. At most schools with successful athletic programs, the students are eventually offered an optional athletics package and the mandatory fee disappears.

All of the schools listed above have athletic programs that not only generate huge amounts of alumni involvement for their respective universities, but those athletic programs are also able to contribute large sums of money to the general scholarship funds.

Being in the position of those schools is the ultimate goal.

North Texas played Florida State 30 years ago in what was then considered a 'big' game for Florida State. Florida State coach Bobby Bowden, then in only his third season, dug out a small piece of the turf at Fouts Field and brought it back to Tallahassee to commemorate the important victory as a 'turf game'. Florida State then made the necessary commitments to athletics while North Texas did not.

North Texas played South Florida 7 years ago in what was then considered a 'big' game for South Florida. It was the first victory ever for South Florida over a Division 1-A team. South Florida then made the necessary commitments to athletics while North Texas did not.

Now we are watching as one of North Texas' current contemporaries, Florida International who most have described recently as laughable, is making the commitment.

And to take a brief look into the future, please read this article about Texas State University who is also making the necessary commitment.

Click HERE and read this article

“I am very proud of our students for their support of this initiative,” said Texas State President Denise M. Trauth. “It shows they are excited about the future of athletics at Texas State and in the continuing progress of the university. The Associated Student Government did an excellent job of promoting this measure and we are thankful for that organization’s effort and their pride in the university.”
The five-year increase in the student athletic fee will eventually double the fall 2008 fee of $10 per semester credit hour to $20 per semester credit hour in 2013.
Reagan Pugh, president of Texas State’s Associated Student Government, said, “While it might seem that we voted on an athletic fee increase, what we really did was make one more step in the direction of bettering our university as a whole.”

DallasGreen · July 28, 2008

Thank you for pointing that out. It's a clear illustration of schools that actually build a successful athletic program do not remain dependant on student fees indefinitely. Other sources; donations, sponsorships, concessions, suite revenue, and especially revenue from increased demand for tickets can make the university totally independent of student fees. At most schools with successful athletic programs, the students are eventually offered an optional athletics package and the mandatory fee disappears.
All of the schools listed above have athletic programs that not only generate huge amounts of alumni involvement for their respective universities, but those athletic programs are also able to contribute large sums of money to the general scholarship funds.
Being in the position of those schools is the ultimate goal.
North Texas played Florida State 30 years ago in what was then considered a 'big' game for Florida State. Florida State coach Bobby Bowden, then in only his third season, dug out a small piece of the turf at Fouts Field and brought it back to Tallahassee to commemorate the important victory as a 'turf game'. Florida State then made the necessary commitments to athletics while North Texas did not.
North Texas played South Florida 7 years ago in what was then considered a 'big' game for South Florida. It was the first victory ever for South Florida over a Division 1-A team. South Florida then made the necessary commitments to athletics while North Texas did not.
Now we are watching as one of North Texas' current contemporaries, Florida International who most have described recently as laughable, is making the commitment.
And to take a brief look into the future, please read this article about Texas State University who is also making the necessary commitment.
Click HERE and read this article

Don't forget to add that FIU,that laughable team, kicked NT's butt in the last game it played !!!

GoMeanGreen1999 · July 28, 2008

I can tell you that A & M charges their students for home game season tickets (football). A year ago it was $175(I believe). Students can also purchase a complete sports pass for all athletic events.

Years ago, I was around (in college) a lot of students from many of the bigger programs (Arkansas, UT, A & M, TCU) and they all said that they had to buy their tickets to the athletic events at their school. That was 10 years ago, and they couldn't believe our UNT student ID got us in to athletic events for free.

Chrisattsu · July 28, 2008

You know, this database has really opened my eyes regarding fees. I am really surprised how many of these big programs receive little to nothing in student fees.
Auburn: $900k
Indiana: $1 mil
Ohio State: $0
Texas A&M: $0
Wisconsin: $0
Washington: $0
Of course, these are hugely popular programs with booster club bank rolls that dwarf our entire budget.

Yeah, but to be fair many programs build on the backs of their students-

Texas Tech- $2.7M (my friend at Tech said that students get into the stadium for free when they show their id)

Boise- $2.4M

Michigan State- $3.0M

UCLA- $2.3M

Cal- $1.9M

Houston- $3.5M

North Carolina- $2.4

Florida- $2.4

Quoner · July 28, 2008

Years ago, I was around (in college) a lot of students from many of the bigger programs (Arkansas, UT, A & M, TCU) and they all said that they had to buy their tickets to the athletic events at their school. That was 10 years ago, and they couldn't believe our UNT student ID got us in to athletic events for free.

Yup - your football only pass at A&M was around $325 a few years ago and then an all-sports pass was a few hundred more. Then you have to camp out on your pull-day to get in line with your friends. If you bring a non-student with a ticket, you have to spend more money on a non-student pass with the student ticket. But hey - no fees and you still have the option to not spend on it if you don't want to.

GoMeanGreen1999 · July 28, 2008

Is there a feature on GMG where I can receive a notification when someone posts about football? For example, if someone starts a thread regarding defensive line depth, I receive an email alert me to check GMG. And if it is a stadium or student fee thread, I don't get a notice.
I figure that way I only have to check the board once every six weeks or so.

Well isn't there like 6 weeks until our first game? You could just not check back until the first game, and probably be fine.

Quoner · July 28, 2008

Based on all the red spots, you must be a hell of a playmaker.

wardly · July 29, 2008

student athletic fees should be an indiciator as to the interest/support for athletics from the student body. if so, then ours is very low, which begs the question, " who are we trying to build a new stadium for?" it appears that the students don't want it, and the alumni won't pay for it. appears to be a formula for failure.

UNTLifer · July 29, 2008

student athletic fees should be an indiciator as to the interest/support for athletics from the student body. if so, then ours is very low, which begs the question, " who are we trying to build a new stadium for?" it appears that the students don't want it, and the alumni won't pay for it. appears to be a formula for failure.

During my years as a student, I don't ever recall being asked to vote on an athletic's fee, or any fee for that matter. I just paid them and didn't ask questions. I can tell you that I would have voted for an increase because I understood how it would benefit the university as a whole during my time there and for years to come. NT can either be a big version of UTA by having students that go there, don't create an attachement to the school and graduate to never be heard from again, or it can continue to build school spirit, provide facilities, both academic and athletic, that show it is serious about being a flagship university.

More than half of the schools that people are aware of have had this awareness created by a successful athletic program or an affiliation with a large successful conference. And to those that state that you sacrifice one for the other, academics or athletics, when you choose how to invest in a university, I have one question, "How does Stanford routinely win the Director's Cup for athletic success while maintaining their academic standing?" It can be done and NT must do it or become another UTA.

A small investment in a student fee and the decision of the administration to support athletics will bring the donors out of the woodwork. It is amazing what a successful athletic's programs does to the attitude of the those connected to the university or the athletic team. Case in point, look at the attitude around Dallas when the Cowboys are successful versus when they are not successful? Think the Metroplex would host a Super Bowl in without the new Jerry World? The economic impact of hosting this event benefits the entire Metroplex, not just the Cowboys, and provides a window to the world on the benefits of the DFW area. You don't think economic developers don't jump on the chance to sell DFW during a Super Bowl? This is what can happen to NT when new facilities are developed allowing big name programs to come to Denton, allowing networks to broadcast from our campus without all of the challenges that Fouts presents and when potential student athletes see the committment to excellence NT has towards all of its programs.

Athletic events bring alumni back to campus. I live in Houston now and am only on campus for football games in the Fall. Without them, I would rarely set foot on campus for an extended period of time. Tailgating allows me to catch up with professors and old friends, see the new development on campus and reminds me that reinvesting in my university is the right thing to do. Take away sporting events and you take away many alumni's incentive to come to Denton. Create a successful program with top facilities and you make the incentive all that much greater. A small increase in student fees today will cultivate large alumni donations in the future. Count on it.

DallasGreen · July 29, 2008

During my years as a student, I don't ever recall being asked to vote on an athletic's fee, or any fee for that matter. I just paid them and didn't ask questions. I can tell you that I would have voted for an increase because I understood how it would benefit the university as a whole during my time there and for years to come. NT can either be a big version of UTA by having students that go there, don't create an attachement to the school and graduate to never be heard from again, or it can continue to build school spirit, provide facilities, both academic and athletic, that show it is serious about being a flagship university.
More than half of the schools that people are aware of have had this awareness created by a successful athletic program or an affiliation with a large successful conference. And to those that state that you sacrifice one for the other, academics or athletics, when you choose how to invest in a university, I have one question, "How does Stanford routinely win the Director's Cup for athletic success while maintaining their academic standing?" It can be done and NT must do it or become another UTA.
A small investment in a student fee and the decision of the administration to support athletics will bring the donors out of the woodwork. It is amazing what a successful athletic's programs does to the attitude of the those connected to the university or the athletic team. Case in point, look at the attitude around Dallas when the Cowboys are successful versus when they are not successful? Think the Metroplex would host a Super Bowl in without the new Jerry World? The economic impact of hosting this event benefits the entire Metroplex, not just the Cowboys, and provides a window to the world on the benefits of the DFW area. You don't think economic developers don't jump on the chance to sell DFW during a Super Bowl? This is what can happen to NT when new facilities are developed allowing big name programs to come to Denton, allowing networks to broadcast from our campus without all of the challenges that Fouts presents and when potential student athletes see the committment to excellence NT has towards all of its programs.
Athletic events bring alumni back to campus. I live in Houston now and am only on campus for football games in the Fall. Without them, I would rarely set foot on campus for an extended period of time. Tailgating allows me to catch up with professors and old friends, see the new development on campus and reminds me that reinvesting in my university is the right thing to do. Take away sporting events and you take away many alumni's incentive to come to Denton. Create a successful program with top facilities and you make the incentive all that much greater. A small increase in student fees today will cultivate large alumni donations in the future. Count on it.

Great post--sums up the entire situation very nicely.

ADLER · July 29, 2008

Why can't North Texas be like this? (Yes, Click Here)

It can.

That school was not even in Division 1 until 1997. They played in relative obscurity and drew vey few fans.

North Texas has more potential than just about any school in the country to build a winning program. But we all know what 'potential' means.

It's not just about a stadium, North Texas needs to seize the opportunity to make a name for itself.

FirefightnRick · July 31, 2008

Their fee passed with only..."the POSSIBLE addition of a football program".

:blink:

Rick

ADLER · July 31, 2008

Here's a video that UTSA used prior to the refernedum that raised their student athletic fees from $10 per credit hour to $20.

You be the judge as to if they have a concrete plan as to where they want to go, and a method to get there.

UTSA Athletics Fee Referendum Video (click here)

"A budget of $18.5 million is the bare minimum required to field successful programs at the mid-major level"

Here's a copy of Q&A: UTSA athletics fee student referendum which was posted in UTSA Today, the student paper.

Q&A: UTSA Athletics Fee Student Referendum (click here)

On Sept. 11 and 12, current UTSA students can vote on a student referendum to increase athletic fees. Increased fees would be used to take Roadrunner Athletics to the next level of NCAA competition. (The student referendum has since passed and been approved)

Possible improvements include new athletic facilities, the addition of football and a move to a new conference.

The referendum would authorize increasing athletics fees over the next several years from a current maximum of $120 per semester to a maximum of $240 per semester. Each student now pays $10 per hour for the first 12 credit hours each semester. Athletics fees are charged only on 12 hours per semester; therefore, the fee currently is capped at $120 per semester. If the student referendum passes, athletics fees would increase over five years to no more than $20 per hour.

Q. What conference is UTSA moving to?

A. The Division 1A conferences that may be attainable by UTSA during the next 10 years are the Sun Belt Conference, Western Athletic Conference (WAC) and Conference USA. Conference USA is the most prestigious and attractive with nearby opponents Houston, Rice, SMU, UTEP, Tulsa and Tulane in its western division.

Q. How much would students pay for football tickets?

A. The Athletics Department expects that students would be admitted to football games free with their student IDs. Even though it is likely UTSA would plans to play its home football games in the Alamodome, Athletics would plan to admit students to games at no charge as a result of paying athletics fees. (And according to the UTSA paper, Bexar County and the City of San Antonio are suggesting free use of the Alamodome as incentive for the university to start a football program.)

Q. Who would UTSA play in football?

A. If UTSA moved into a new conference, it would play that conference's member schools such as Houston, Rice, SMU and UTEP in Conference USA.

Q. Why do students have to pay athletic fees if they don't go to the games?

A. The athletics fee is similar to the library, medical services, University Center, Recreation Center and other fees. All students pay to cover the costs of these services whether they use them or not. In return for paying athletics fees, the UTSA Athletics Department makes three promises to students -- to provide fun, affordable entertainment; build pride and tradition in UTSA and increase equity in a UTSA degree. Students receive benefits from these promises while in school and after graduation even if they don't attend athletics events.

And after the student referendum there was this: Bexar County provides $50 million for UTSA sports complex

Which passed on May 10 of this year:

Venue Prop 2 Amateur Athletic Facilities

(WITH 622 OF 622 PRECINCTS COUNTED)

FOR (a favor) . . . . . . . . . 41,002

AGAINST (en contra) . . . . . . . 16,170

The facilities are scheduled to be completed by 2012.

It doesn't take the Hubble Telescope to detect the big Whooosh! coming.

NT80 · July 31, 2008

Q. Who would UTSA play in football?
A. If UTSA moved into a new conference, it would play that conference's member schools such as Houston, Rice, SMU and UTEP in Conference USA.

Very clever of UTSA to mention possibly playing in CUSA to help the vote.

Although they are in the Southland Conference now and would have to apply and be accepted for a move up, they have no desire to be there for football and host Sam Houston, SFA, McNeese, Texas State, et al.

UNT should have the same type campaign and mention known schools as future conference opponents. Something like:

"If UNT moved into a new conference, it would play that conference's member schools such as Baylor, Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, Oklahoma in the Big 12."

That would get the "yes" vote flowing!

Edited July 31, 2008 by NT80

ADLER · August 1, 2008

Very clever of UTSA to mention possibly playing in CUSA to help the vote.
Although they are in the Southland Conference now and would have to apply and be accepted for a move up, they have no desire to be there for football and host Sam Houston, SFA, McNeese, Texas State, et al.
UNT should have the same type campaign and mention known schools as future conference opponents. Something like:
"If UNT moved into a new conference, it would play that conference's member schools such as Baylor, Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, Oklahoma in the Big 12."
That would get the "yes" vote flowing!

In 1997 new North Texas basketball coach Vic Trilli was determined to get UNT into the then new Conference USA.

CUSA didn't give North Texas any consideration because North Texas had no commitment.

Upstart program South Florida leapfrogged North Texas and quickly gained CUSA membership because they made the necessary commitment. Prior to 1998 South Florida didn't even have any football. South Florida has since left CUSA for the Big East. National rankings and bowl games have been the result.

Central Florida followed a similar path to CUSA. Look what they've accomplished in the last few years. They too aspire to join the BCS Big East.

Should North Texas take these two newbies seriously? If a spot in CUSA were to become available in 2013 who do you think they would want, a historically bad North Texas team with no historical commitment, or a new school with much larger budget, plays in the Alamodome, and that can deliver a new market?

If you say North Texas then you haven't followed this program long enough.