Tulsa World - Cusa Rumored To Lose Ecu, Memphis

June 5, 2008

Remember, 4 of the 9 schools in the old Southwest Conference were private and the conference did ok for a long while. In fact, before Tech and Houston came in, the private schools were the majority for a long time.

untjim1995 · June 5, 2008

I just love these threads. We aren't even mentioned anywhere in any of the CUSA expansion articles or on any of the CUSA boards, we still are no closer to a new stadium than we were last time realignment came around (so we have a color brochure now, and?), our attendance still isn't blowing the doors off of anyone....yet somehow here we are trying to call our shot.
What, pray tell, prevents the Big East IF they expand from taking UCF, Memphis and ECU...and CUSA from filling in the gaps with Troy, WKU, or someone else not named North Texas? Our potential? Has it not dawned on anyone that our "45,000 students by whatever date" or "billions of alums in the North Texas region" just screams to other conferences "they've got all the resources to get it done...and they just aint gettin it done."?

This is the best post I have read on this site in a long time concerning our place in the Division-1 FCS football. If the scenario plays out concerning the Big East splitting, what you would have is the 8 that currently play football forming their own league--then gobbling up 4 others to get a conference championship game for the revenue that would generate. Those 4 would include immediately Memphis, UCF, and ECU. The 4th team would be A.) Notre Dame--big dream, but could happen B.) Marshall--name recognition, good geographical presence, although could get blocked by WVU (ala SMU vs UNT) C.) a big MAC school--Central Michigan perhaps, which draws well and gets the Motor City Bowl with them. CUSA then has to replace 3 or 4 teams--which would mean WKU, MTSU, La Tech, and probably FAU--all within their footprint of being southern oriented and programs that have succeeded in the past in several revenue sports (i.e. football, mens and womens hoops, and baseball). Trust me, with SMU in CUSA we WILL NOT be there. It just ain't gonna happen--we have no facilities, no money, and frankly, poor leadership that won't install a student fee.

MeanMag · June 6, 2008

Does this get us a whole lot more than we have now? Yes there are some slightly bigger names but without strong conference leadership to get more bowl games, TV time etc what would we really have. Taking existing bowl games is fine but trying to add more won't be a good situation. Unless C-USA goes away to form a new conference I don't think it will be any different than the Sun Belt.

The teams are more appealing to me than anyone else in our conference now.

UNTflyer · June 6, 2008

I'd have to say the Kibbie Dome is the worst football stadium in Div-IA.

Daddy Dumpsalot · June 6, 2008

Our Athletic Director should be watching closely. Also the UNT Admins

Our athletic director is watching new job openings closely. I asked him about his thoughts in changing conferences and his response was that he wants to stay in the SBC and ride the wave and doesn't see the CUSA as a better choice for UNT.

I also think he had been drinking....heavily.

LoveMG · June 6, 2008

I asked him about his thoughts in changing conferences and his response was that he wants to stay in the SBC and ride the wave and doesn't see the CUSA as a better choice for UNT.

i can't believe any unt supporter would rather have unt in the sbc than cusa. 6 bowls vs. 1 and closer opponents. his statement if true makes no sense. order therapy.

untphd · June 6, 2008

i can't believe any unt supporter would rather have unt in the sbc than cusa. 6 bowls vs. 1 and closer opponents. his statement if true makes no sense. order therapy.

Agree

DeepGreen · June 6, 2008

This is the best post I have read on this site in a long time concerning our place in the Division-1 FCS football. If the scenario plays out concerning the Big East splitting, what you would have is the 8 that currently play football forming their own league--then gobbling up 4 others to get a conference championship game for the revenue that would generate. Those 4 would include immediately Memphis, UCF, and ECU. The 4th team would be A.) Notre Dame--big dream, but could happen B.) Marshall--name recognition, good geographical presence, although could get blocked by WVU (ala SMU vs UNT) C.) a big MAC school--Central Michigan perhaps, which draws well and gets the Motor City Bowl with them. CUSA then has to replace 3 or 4 teams--which would mean WKU, MTSU, La Tech, and probably FAU--all within their footprint of being southern oriented and programs that have succeeded in the past in several revenue sports (i.e. football, mens and womens hoops, and baseball). Trust me, with SMU in CUSA we WILL NOT be there. It just ain't gonna happen--we have no facilities, no money, and frankly, poor leadership that won't install a student fee.

Along with emmitt01's post, excellent post here too. The last sentence says it all. You can see what others are doing to move up from FCS to FBS. Plus our SBC counterparts are improving facilities(football stadiums) and passing us by as we speak. Troy, Western Ky, FIU. Freaking FIU is building a new stadium for crying out loud! Does this bother anyone besides me? :blink:

Edited June 6, 2008 by DeepGreen

GoMeanGreen1999 · June 6, 2008

Our athletic director is watching new job openings closely. I asked him about his thoughts in changing conferences and his response was that he wants to stay in the SBC and ride the wave and doesn't see the CUSA as a better choice for UNT.

On second thought, if he really made this statement to another person, we have no shot at CUSA and he knows it, so he makes it sound like the Belt is where he wants UNT to be. Otherwise, that statement makes no sense.

Edited June 6, 2008 by GoMeanGreen1999

GoMeanGreen1999 · June 6, 2008

Freaking FIU is building a new stadium for crying out loud! Does this bother anyone besides me?

Doesn't bother me in the least. Any D1 team that builds a stadium for 18k people is in the WRONG division - I am not sure if 18k doesn't deserve DII status.

buff64 · June 6, 2008

One major factor in UNT joining CUSA would be that it would ensure at least 4 intrastate games each year, SMU, Rice, Houston and UTEP. Increased attemdance means more $ , would help new stadium becom reality.

June 6, 2008

On second thought, if he really made this statement to another person, we have no shot at CUSA and he knows it, so he makes it sound like the Belt is where he wants UNT to be. Otherwise, that statement makes no sense.

Are you people insane? You really took that comment seriously? Did you not pay attention to who said it?

As someone who actually does talk to Rick, I can assume you this is incorrect. I have, in fact, heard him discussing the very scenarios were have been discussing on this board such as conference realignment, CUSA break-up, and new conference creation.

UNTflyer · June 6, 2008

Are you people insane? You really took that comment seriously? Did you not pay attention to who said it?
As someone who actually does talk to Rick, I can assume you this is incorrect. I have, in fact, heard him discussing the very scenarios were have been discussing on this board such as conference realignment, CUSA break-up, and new conference creation.

It doesn't matter which conference we're in, what matters is the caliber and draw of our opponents. One of our biggest problems at UNT is that nobody cares that we are playing Louisiana-Monroe. Hell, I know people in Dallas who didn't even know UNT was Div-IA because of the teams we play.

C-USA, Big East, MWC... it doesn't matter. We need to be in a conference where we regularly play recognizable teams (don't even THINK about the WAC). And when South Alabama, Western Kentucky, Texas State and Lamar come to play football in the Sun Belt, perception of the conference will only get worse.

This is why we can't dick around with debate about a 45,000 seat stadium. We can't afford it, but a new expandable 30k+ stadium will be an asset when a conference comes calling. We can point to our 32,000 seat stadium and say, "We can have it at 45k in 18 months." THAT is why we should start off with a small new stadium. We have to have something to show when the time comes.

GoMeanGreen1999 · June 6, 2008

THAT is why we should start off with a small new stadium.

All the more reason why we should just build it right now with 20k - that way we can get it up faster and have it there, and then add on to it.

June 6, 2008

If RickV says that we want out of the SBC without anything firm in the way of an alternative, we'd draw and quarter him. Did you really expect him to say anything negative about the SBC?....especially as long as we are a member.

Since I have no clue as to what CUSA might do should they lose two major members, it's hard to understand his comment about CUSA.

Is CUSA stable? I'm not sure that they are simply because they are so far-flung. If ECU should leave CUSA, it would greatly affect any atttempted realignment of the eastern division. Marshall and UCF would be the only true eastern teams in the conference. Maybe UAB is also to a certain extent but they are not a force to be reckoned with in football. So would the conference simply try to replace any eastern team that leaves? I don't know. The pickings are slim. Do they try to move an FCS team up (i.e. Appalachian State)? Do they try to supplement it (or them) with a couple of eastern Sun Belt teams? Or, do the western teams simply say that we've had enough of trying to appease the east and we'll just form our own more regionalized conference? Again, I'm clueless but I lean toward the latter.

We don't know our status with Banowski and CUSA. Have we been told there is no way that you'd ever be voted in or have we been told that we'd be considered but don't make waves until the proper time? Maybe our stadium issue has a bearing on CUSA membership.

There are simply too many unknowns about our situation to castigate our athletic director for remarks that could be taken out of context. He can't let on every bit of information that he knows. He has to have a poker face for a situation as volatile as this. If I thought that he really wants to turn down any possibility of aligning with CUSA schools (in whatever form) then I'd be at the front of the gauntlet line but I really don't think that's the case.

Edited June 6, 2008 by GrayEagleOne

UNTflyer · June 6, 2008

All the more reason why we should just build it right now with 20k

Hopefully that was a typo. But yes, we should start off with the expandable 30k stadium. if C-USA offers an invite, we can expand to be in the top half of the conference in terms of capacity.

GoMeanGreen1999 · June 6, 2008

Hopefully that was a typo. But yes, we should start off with the expandable 30k stadium. if C-USA offers an invite, we can expand to be in the top half of the conference in terms of capacity.

Nope, it wasn't a typo - I just figured if we had the money now to start the stadium and get it built, because that seems to be the most important item right now - getting it built, and we are still shy some money for the 30k, why not just build it at 20k and then add on? I mean why not? That way we would have our new stadium, we would have 2k more than FIU's new stadium, and then if we have more demand than 20k, we just add on. That is what most want to do with the 30k one, so just start it now and build it at 20k. Just get it built.

Edited June 6, 2008 by GoMeanGreen1999

Green Mean · June 6, 2008

If this giant university is only building a 30K stadium because they dont have enough money for a bigger one then we really should not be building a stadium. Its just that simple. Frankly I dont want a new SWC unless that is our cap in NT football. I say lets get some GARGANTUAN BALLS and shoot for something higher such as the Big East. Obviously the Big East may have NO interest in us but why not try? Why not have a good presentation and shoot for it? Its not impossible.

GoMeanGreen1999 · June 6, 2008

If this giant university is only building a 30K stadium because they dont have enough money for a bigger one then we really should not be building a stadium. Its just that simple. Frankly I dont want a new SWC unless that is our cap in NT football. I say lets get some GARGANTUAN BALLS and shoot for something higher such as the Big East. Obviously the Big East may have NO interest in us but why not try? Why not have a good presentation and shoot for it? Its not impossible.

I am actually starting to believe that many UNT fans are starting to accept what many in the upper large schools have been saying for years about schools like UNT - "they just need to accept the reality of where they are." That is about the only thing that answers my question of why 30k is large enough.

Stan R · June 6, 2008

I am actually starting to believe that many UNT fans are starting to accept what many in the upper large schools have been saying for years about schools like UNT - "they just need to accept the reality of where they are." That is about the only thing that answers my question of why 30k is large enough.

Thats an oversimplification. We all want to have the 50K seat stadium - filled with people. And when we get our 30K seat stadium built in the next 4 years :lol: , and we start packing it to capacity - I'm all for spending another 60 million to expand it to seat 50K. This is just a disagreement about the way to get to 50K.

untjim1995 · June 6, 2008

One major factor in UNT joining CUSA would be that it would ensure at least 4 intrastate games each year, SMU, Rice, Houston and UTEP. Increased attemdance means more $ , would help new stadium becom reality.

I think that the real question is whether any of these schools want to be in a conference with us. We know SMU doesn't, but what about UH, and UTEP? We fit in the same boat as them institutionally--large, public universities that serve a large metro area. Sometimes, I think if UNT had the leaders to pull it off, I would discuss forming a conference with UTEP, UH, Texas State, MTSU, La Tech, NMSU, ULL, Arkansas State, Southern Miss, UAB, MTSU, and Troy. All are public schools, would make regional travel a strong possibility, and would match similar goals for the future for all of us. Yes, the conference would still stretch from Las Cruces to Nashville, but a west/east division could be a nice conference.

Edited June 6, 2008 by untjim1995

KAjunRaider · June 7, 2008

This is the best post I have read on this site in a long time concerning our place in the Division-1 FCS football. If the scenario plays out concerning the Big East splitting, what you would have is the 8 that currently play football forming their own league--then gobbling up 4 others to get a conference championship game for the revenue that would generate. Those 4 would include immediately Memphis, UCF, and ECU. The 4th team would be A.) Notre Dame--big dream, but could happen B.) Marshall--name recognition, good geographical presence, although could get blocked by WVU (ala SMU vs UNT) C.) a big MAC school--Central Michigan perhaps, which draws well and gets the Motor City Bowl with them. CUSA then has to replace 3 or 4 teams--which would mean WKU, MTSU, La Tech, and probably FAU--all within their footprint of being southern oriented and programs that have succeeded in the past in several revenue sports (i.e. football, mens and womens hoops, and baseball). Trust me, with SMU in CUSA we WILL NOT be there. It just ain't gonna happen--we have no facilities, no money, and frankly, poor leadership that won't install a student fee.

I have heard that IF and WHEN the Big East adds 4 teams (after the split from the hoops schools) that they will be looking at programs who, along with decent football and men's hoops, bring good women's sports and baseball.

NT80 · June 8, 2008

I think that the real question is whether any of these schools want to be in a conference with us. We know SMU doesn't, but what about UH, and UTEP? We fit in the same boat as them institutionally--large, public universities that serve a large metro area. Sometimes, I think if UNT had the leaders to pull it off, I would discuss forming a conference with UTEP, UH, Texas State, MTSU, La Tech, NMSU, ULL, Arkansas State, Southern Miss, UAB, MTSU, and Troy. All are public schools, would make regional travel a strong possibility, and would match similar goals for the future for all of us. Yes, the conference would still stretch from Las Cruces to Nashville, but a west/east division could be a nice conference.

Is there really a rift in conferences between public schools vs. privates? I don't hear this as a problem in the Big12 or MWC. I think the Big East issue is mostly all-sports schools vs basketball only schools which just happen to also be private catholic schools. I believe SMUt hates us because we are a public school in their territory but I don't think we get the same hate from TCU or Baylor.

Edited June 8, 2008 by NT80

DallasGreen · June 8, 2008

Is there really a rift in conferences between public schools vs. privates? I don't hear this as a problem in the Big12 or MWC. I think the Big East issue is mostly all-sports schools vs basketball only schools which just happen to also be private catholic schools. I believe SMUt hates us because we are a public school in their territory but I don't think we get the same hate from TCU or Baylor.

Agreed there is a pure hate relationship with SMU, but theirs is more by refusing to acknowledge that NT is even a player on the college scene. Rolling over when we play them only reenforces this public image, and now with June Jones why do they want to even entertain the idea of lowering their vision for their programs by playing us? Our leaders either need to step up to the plate with a D-! athletic budget or get back to the Southland like they are now funding for.

UNTflyer · June 8, 2008

Agreed there is a pure hate relationship with SMU, but theirs is more by refusing to acknowledge that NT is even a player on the college scene. Rolling over when we play them only reenforces this public image...

When have we ever rolled over? Whipped them in 2006, and lost a very competitive game in 2007.